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COVID-19/Coronavirus Information and Support Thread (see OP for useful links)
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CDC study shows 74% of people infected in Massachusetts Covid outbreak were fully vaccinated
The CDC data published Friday was based on 469 cases of Covid associated with multiple summer events and large public gatherings in July in Massachusetts.
See also: Iceland, Israel...
Meanwhile, in Sweden:
Sweden: Despite Variants, No Lockdowns, No Daily Covid Deaths | The Daily Economy
"Thus the country the media loved to hate is reaping the best of all worlds: Few current cases and deaths, stronger economic growth than the lockdown c ...
www.aier.org
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UKMikey
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CDC study shows 74% of people infected in Massachusetts Covid outbreak were fully vaccinated
The CDC data published Friday was based on 469 cases of Covid associated with multiple summer events and large public gatherings in July in Massachusetts.www.cnbc.com
CNBC
Fact Check-COVID-19 cases in Iceland are not proof that vaccines are ineffective
Rising COVID-19 cases in Iceland are not proof that vaccines are a “failure”, despite claims made online.
www.reuters.com
Reuters
Science | AAAS
Science.org
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McLaren
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1, I think that headline around the Massachusetts thing came from a misunderstanding.
2, the Sweden article is written by a guy who wrote other articles such as "We should worry about a permanent Covidocracy" with the opening line, "Freedom once surrendered can be hell to claw back. That’s why I sympathize with those opposing even Covid-19 control measures that have some merit such as masks." And, "How to beat the permanent Covidocracy" with, "Many in government and public health would like the Covidocracy to continue indefinitely, perhaps forever." And here's one from his website, "The two horsemen of the apocalypse: Fauci and Redfield"
Yeah, I would suggest finding better sources than someone who quite clearly seems to be another Covid denier.
Edit*
Oh, here's a good article of his that aged well.
Guy has written for Townhall, National Review, & The American Spectator. Says enough about his agenda and baloney drivel.
2, the Sweden article is written by a guy who wrote other articles such as "We should worry about a permanent Covidocracy" with the opening line, "Freedom once surrendered can be hell to claw back. That’s why I sympathize with those opposing even Covid-19 control measures that have some merit such as masks." And, "How to beat the permanent Covidocracy" with, "Many in government and public health would like the Covidocracy to continue indefinitely, perhaps forever." And here's one from his website, "The two horsemen of the apocalypse: Fauci and Redfield"
Yeah, I would suggest finding better sources than someone who quite clearly seems to be another Covid denier.
Edit*
Oh, here's a good article of his that aged well.
Guy has written for Townhall, National Review, & The American Spectator. Says enough about his agenda and baloney drivel.
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My post wasn't meant to deny the vaccine's efficacy. Like I've said before, the fact that deaths are in serious decline since the vaccine's rollout is proof enough that they do a decent enough job at what they're intended for. I didn't need your response to see that. My comment you're quoting was in response to Whitestar's snarky rewording of one of my previous posts, saying you could get lucky and 'not pick it up at all' if vaccinated. My post he was quoting was describing my own personal weighing of risk vs reward in taking the vaccine vs letting myself deal with the virus without it.Fact Check-COVID-19 cases in Iceland are not proof that vaccines are ineffective
Rising COVID-19 cases in Iceland are not proof that vaccines are a “failure”, despite claims made online.
Science | AAAS
www.science.org
I just saw this, though, further hurting my confidence in the vaccine and the validity of its original FDA approval. I mean, if the boosters are being forced through approval, what's to say the FDA weren't pressured into approving the first two doses?
In a major blow to vaccine efforts, senior FDA leaders stepping down
Two of the FDA's most senior vaccine leaders are exiting from their positions, raising fresh questions about the Biden administration and the way that it's sidelined the FDA. Marion Gruber ...
endpts.com
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My mistrust in the vaccine is purely in the long-term data that we won't have for a while yet. Yes, there were clinical trials done to prove it works to protect you against this virus. That's all well and good, but too many people are walking away from the virus unscathed even without the vax, and I can't get past the fact that it did come out a bit too quickly for my liking, in making sure there are no bad long-term effects. Even under normal, non-emergency conditions, the drug industry doesn't have the greatest record there. I just can't get over hearing about people experiencing blood clots (this in even young people) and heart attacks after taking the vaccine, regardless of how few there are. That said, I don't see it as moving the goal posts: I mistrusted it before approval just for becoming available so quickly, and the quick FDA approval is just a bit of fuel for that. Whether you think they're "quacks" or not, there are enough medical experts who've made this stuff their life's work who are still on both sides of the argument. Especially when I couldn't even pretend to understand most virology jargon without taking more time than I have to properly educate myself on the subject, opinions of people who work low levels at a hospital aren't up there for me; they're just as susceptible to "misinformation!!!111!!" as most anyone else - it exists on both sides.
UKMikey
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It sounds like the long term effects of Covid in those who are fortunate enough to survive are more prevalent and more likely than those of the vaccine. At any rate, after 368 pages of this thread I've yet to hear convincing evidence to the contrary from medical experts - at any level.
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Barra333
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I read an article from Nat Geo that cited a scientist who said that in the history of vaccines, they are yet to have a side effect emerge more than 6 weeks after the shot was given.
And to the 'too quick' argument, the mRNA vaccine was well advanced as a flu vaccine, but the CEO of Biontech pivoted to make it for covid in January 2020.
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Anti-mask protests force 3 schools into lockdown
VANCOUVER, Wash. (AP) — Three schools in Vancouver, Washington, were placed in lockdown Friday after anti-mask protesters tried to access school ground.
apnews.com
Covidiocy is mental illness.
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Vaccines aren't drugs, still.
Vaccine side-effects are somewhere between instant and exceptionally short-term, because what goes into you is destroyed by your immune system. It is not an artificial chemical that interacts with cells and hangs around in the body until it is broken down through interactions, is metabolised, or is excreted in your urine/faeces.
How quickly is your liking for vaccine testing and approval? What, in your mind, qualifies as an appropriate length of time for vaccine testing?
Bear in mind for your answer that most vaccines take quite a while only because there's barely any funding for them due to the fact there's barely any economical case for creating them, not because they're horribly dangerous things that need fine tuning between appropriate therapeutic dosage (what makes them work) and toxicity (what makes them kill you), which is the case for drug trials.
They occur at a lower rate than they do from catching COVID. By entire orders of magnitude.
How long do you believe it would take you to become "properly" educated on virology?
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Anti-mask protests force 3 schools into lockdown
VANCOUVER, Wash. (AP) — Three schools in Vancouver, Washington, were placed in lockdown Friday after anti-mask protesters tried to access school ground.
Covidiocy is mental illness.
Jesus (literally)! She seems to be doing her best not to burst out laughing.
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Except Whitestar is absolutely correct - your chance of getting the infection when exposed to the virus is usefully reduced by vaccination (about 4x shortly after second dose, slowly declining to still greater than 2x after six months, for Pfizer). That is one aspect of efficacy. Another is that for vaccinated people who do catch it the most likely outcome is far fewer symptoms, if any, about on par with the common cold.
Yes, that level of protection isn't enough to achieve herd immunity (per your link about the Massachusetts event), but that has little to do with comparing relative risks of vaccination and COVID on a personal basis.
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I’ve sat through this video just out of curiosity.
The reason “societal factors” like school, are important for giving children vaccines, is that they are half as likely to get the virus if vaccinated. So they’re half as likely to pass it on to their parents, immune compromised grandparents or friends with pre existing health conditions. The societal factors significantly change the maths on health risk for the wider population.
As Famine mentioned above, vaccines don’t linger in your system like drugs do. That’s not how they work.
“If everyone was jumping off a cliff, would you?”- you mean like the myriad of conservative radio hosts and TV personality’s denying then dying of COVID? …or the countless anti-vaxxers eating horse dewormer because the vaccine took a while to be FDA approved? I’ll stay away from that cliff thanks.
“I fail to find media I can trust, which is ironic because I work in media.” - you fail to find media you agree with. Doesn’t make it untrustworthy or untrue.
“Let’s say that children face an identical risk from COVID & the vaccine”
- well, they don’t but anyway…
“If a child dies from COVID it’s random… if a child, just one child, dies of vaccine it’s due to medical intervention.”
It’s not random for a child to die from COVID. They need to be exposed, they need to catch it, become ill and sadly die. If the population is vaccinated half as many children will catch it in the first place, and those who do reduce their risk of dying immensely.
“This pandemic has been a boom time for those who like to tell other people what to do…”
“Speaking for myself I have no inclination to tell other people what to do.”
- We’ll ya certainly coulda fooled me on that one!
The rest of the video is basically pleading for emotion, and more pleading for emotion. Take emotion out of it. It’s not about your feelings, or the feelings of those you’re trying to pander too.
It’s about health and well-being of the population, which can be measured using numbers and statistics. if 2+2=4, no amount of emotion can change that.
The reason “societal factors” like school, are important for giving children vaccines, is that they are half as likely to get the virus if vaccinated. So they’re half as likely to pass it on to their parents, immune compromised grandparents or friends with pre existing health conditions. The societal factors significantly change the maths on health risk for the wider population.
As Famine mentioned above, vaccines don’t linger in your system like drugs do. That’s not how they work.
“If everyone was jumping off a cliff, would you?”- you mean like the myriad of conservative radio hosts and TV personality’s denying then dying of COVID? …or the countless anti-vaxxers eating horse dewormer because the vaccine took a while to be FDA approved? I’ll stay away from that cliff thanks.
“I fail to find media I can trust, which is ironic because I work in media.” - you fail to find media you agree with. Doesn’t make it untrustworthy or untrue.
“Let’s say that children face an identical risk from COVID & the vaccine”
- well, they don’t but anyway…
“If a child dies from COVID it’s random… if a child, just one child, dies of vaccine it’s due to medical intervention.”
It’s not random for a child to die from COVID. They need to be exposed, they need to catch it, become ill and sadly die. If the population is vaccinated half as many children will catch it in the first place, and those who do reduce their risk of dying immensely.
“This pandemic has been a boom time for those who like to tell other people what to do…”
“Speaking for myself I have no inclination to tell other people what to do.”
- We’ll ya certainly coulda fooled me on that one!
The rest of the video is basically pleading for emotion, and more pleading for emotion. Take emotion out of it. It’s not about your feelings, or the feelings of those you’re trying to pander too.
It’s about health and well-being of the population, which can be measured using numbers and statistics. if 2+2=4, no amount of emotion can change that.
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And...
A false implication that schools, by setting up vaccination areas, will be vaccinating kids without parental consent. They won't.
A false implication that vaccinating kids being of debatable worth validates any of his previous 'hesitancy'. It doesn't. Actually it would falsify it even further - if it's not worth it 12-15 year olds but is for older kids, what does that imply for his 54 year old hairy ass?!
It's not random for anyone to die of covid when a choice has been made not to take the vaccine. That's the choice - take the vaccine or not, and face whatever consequences either way. There is no "I didn't choose this" route; no blame free option.
A false implication that schools, by setting up vaccination areas, will be vaccinating kids without parental consent. They won't.
A false implication that vaccinating kids being of debatable worth validates any of his previous 'hesitancy'. It doesn't. Actually it would falsify it even further - if it's not worth it 12-15 year olds but is for older kids, what does that imply for his 54 year old hairy ass?!
It's not random for anyone to die of covid when a choice has been made not to take the vaccine. That's the choice - take the vaccine or not, and face whatever consequences either way. There is no "I didn't choose this" route; no blame free option.
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Dotini
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The Washington Post reports on how the assessment by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence (ODNI) has played an interesting role in affecting the shift in elite attitudes on the origins of COVID-19.
"Last Friday, the ODNI issued an unclassified summary of its assessment of the origins of covid-19. It was even shorter than its UFO assessment. Mostly, the assessment simply reifies the current lack of consensus. Anyone looking for clarity will not find it in the sentence, “After examining all available intelligence reporting and other information, though, the [intelligence community] remains divided on the most likely origin of covid-19.” Four intelligence agencies lean toward the natural origins story, one agency thinks it came from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, and three other agencies could not even form an internal consensus. Most of these assessments were made with low confidence."
"Last Friday, the ODNI issued an unclassified summary of its assessment of the origins of covid-19. It was even shorter than its UFO assessment. Mostly, the assessment simply reifies the current lack of consensus. Anyone looking for clarity will not find it in the sentence, “After examining all available intelligence reporting and other information, though, the [intelligence community] remains divided on the most likely origin of covid-19.” Four intelligence agencies lean toward the natural origins story, one agency thinks it came from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, and three other agencies could not even form an internal consensus. Most of these assessments were made with low confidence."
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UKMikey
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No statistics "prove" anything beyond doubt but this study strongly suggests the above to me:
Coronavirus vaccines cut risk of long Covid, study finds
The study adds to growing evidence that vaccination helps protect against Covid in a number of ways.
www.bbc.co.uk
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