I appreciate my statement could be interpreted with multiple sentiments, just to be clear; no offence to, or derision of FrzGT was intended. Personally, from the few PM's I've exchanged with Frz previously, and from some of his previous posting habits, I believe my sentiment was justified.. and to be clear on that too, I believe he needs to break the vicious circle of Stress, frustration and indecision, that is having this negative influence on his life/behavior/health - and I think the way to do that is by focusing on one single thing, no matter how small, and trying to change it.
In 20+ years of depression, anxiety, taking chunks out of myself and drinking my problems away, not once did a doctor advise me to do nothing and hope it goes away on it's own - so I'll apologise if any of my opinions or statements come across as inappropriate or insensitive, but I do firmly believe in trying to motivate change, rather then enabling self-pity.
Fair enough, apologies for coming across as a bit of a smug know it all, I wasn't aware of the history between yourself and Frz in which context you clearly know better so my comment isn't really appropriate.
The intention was to draw attention to the difference between 'feeling depressed' and general 'self pity' like you say, and actual depression. Because it is a mental illness, those that don't suffer with it can only assume that the sufferer's mind works just the same way theirs does. If they're having a really hard day, they just get on with it, they pick themselves up, think of something positive, whatever they do to manage their feelings and keep on functioning.
It sounds harsh but, at least in my opinion, that isn't depression. That is feeling down, stressed etc. and I'd agree with you that in those situations your advice is spot on, break it down into little chunks and just try and take a step in the right direction, face one of those little bits head on and try to overcome them, keep your chin up, try to put it in context etc.
From the best of my understanding and reading on the subject (a subject which isn't well understood by 'science' either, so what chance do we have?!), actual depression is an illness. It isn't a choice, you can't choose to be positive, to just ignore it and get on with your day. It's like telling someone with cancer to just cheer up, others have it worse, you'll be fine. It won't fix it, and the effects of well meaning comments can have very different impacts on the person suffering.
Personally it's only been in the last 12 months or so where I've become even slightly capable of some actual empathy, actually thinking about things properly from someone else's point of view, and not just thinking that I understand and know better and that my opinion is right. It sounds a simple thing to change, but actually you can't help but think the way you do, you think you're right else you wouldn't think it!
Your post touched on this for me, as I felt as you appeared to (my mistake there!), that it's a result of negative thoughts, a lack of self esteem and simple things like you've said and plenty of love and encouragement and training your brain to think differently could help someone overcome depression, because to me, depression was what I thought it was, and that's what would 'solve' it.
What upset me was once I actually made the effort to not just assume I understood but researched and read about what people say etc. I realised how wrong I had been and how harmful the things I had thought had been.
Hence wanting to share this tiny bit of 'wisdom' (about the only bit I've picked up so far!)
As I'm on a roll, I guess I might as well continue and elaborate on what I mean. This assumption that depression can be 'fixed' in the way I thought meant that I too would try to encourage positivity in the face of the emotions being felt, and countless other little traps that you think are helpful but that really aren't.
There are so many common things people say to be helpful and supporting that are actually damaging:
Cheer up, some people have it far worse -
All this does is make the person feel guilty for being depressed. They know other people have it worse, and yet their illness makes them feel the way they do. This statement basically says "your feelings of sadness are unreasonable, you're wrong to feel the way you do and I'm dismissing your feelings because they're wrong"
Look on the brightside, cheer up etc. -
This shows the person that you think they're in control of their feelings. You think that they're choosing to feel like this, and that they should be able to just snap out of it. After all, you can, so why can't they? They must be a failure, and a lesser person than everyone else.
I know just how you feel, I was depressed last Tuesday, but then I went out and had a great time -
Again, this shows a lack of understanding, you don't know how they feel, you've not listened to what they've said, and again, they're clearly just a worse person than you, because you're able to go out and have fun, so clearly they're failing.
Stop feeling sorry for yourself -
Similar to above, you think they're in control and choosing to feel this way. Furthermore, they should feel guilty for being how they are, their feelings aren't justified, they're just a bad / self absorbed person.
I know they're silly examples, but for me it was a real eye opener that the things people can say thinking they're being helpful or empathising just aren't interpreted that way if someone has depression. It's a difficult situation because from the outside, it's probably impossible to tell the difference between someone who is playing up and somebody who is actually suffering.
For example, sometimes someone with depression can't face getting out of bed. This is a really difficult thing for an observer to empathise with, because for most people, it's very similar to how we feel, isn't it? That we don't want to get up, go to school / work whatever it is. But we do, and we get on with it.
If someone is just lazy, they can easily just say they're depressed, they can't face getting up, and everyone is supposed to just accept that? No, we're skeptical, and depression gets a bad name, it's treated as something people make up because they're feeling sorry for themselves or they're lazy etc. etc.
But genuinely, some times, they actually, truly, can't do it. It's not a matter of will power, it isn't a choice. They want to get out of bed, they want to get on with their lives, to do what everyone else does, be 'normal' but they actually really can't face it. It can be a hugely debilitating illness that can make a real mess of someone's life. And they know this, and they can't do anything about it.
A silly analogy that struck me last year was at Le Mans. My partner and I were sat on the steps of the main grandstand towards the last couple of hours of the race. It gets really busy and people arrive hours in advance to get a spot on the pit straight ready for the end of the 24hours. Anyway, heading towards the steps was a young boy in a wheelchair and (I presume) his father. They got to the steps and the boy is able to vaguely support his own weight, but needs his father to balance and together they manage to climb the steps. As I'm just sat there, I hop up and get the boy's wheelchair and carry it up the steps for them, don't even think about it, it's a gesture anyone would do to try and help a fellow human being.
The thing is though, my partner has a similarly debilitating illness. She needs help and support to do things we all take for granted, like the boy climbing the stairs. Except her illness is with her brain. Nobody can see it. Nobody offers to help, or makes special allowances for her condition or expects her to not be capable of certain things, because her illness is invisible. Worse than that, the validity of it is questioned and her symptoms are just dismissed as flaws in her character, even by those closest to her.
I thought I was being supportive, but I wasn't helping at all. Even now, understanding things better, I still get it wrong at times and realise with hindsight that I was looking at it from my point of view and not listening or understanding, but I'm trying, and I'm not going to stop trying to improve