F.I.T.T. - Clueless Classic Shootout (It's over. Thanks Everyone :D)

[Ridox2JZGTE]

OMG, my Camaro Z28 RM'69 entry has lost massive PP, previously 596PP now is mere 535PP

 

[iainoflo85]

I think like Johnny said the handling wouldn't have changed, just the PP.

I'll finish off my testing and post the results if this is still the case.

 

[VTiRoj]

Changes to PP are dramatic and widesweeping. A Roadster NC I was driving last night at 400PP needed nearly another 40HP today to get back to 400PP. It's at 230HP now!!! Same with the GT12.

It's a game changer that's for sure..but I feel sorry for the tuners that have to go back once again and adjust all their tunes, but at least it's just changing PP not driving characteristics.👍

I assume we're going to go with what we have for this contest so far and not make any changes until the next one?

I'm glad all my PP-limited tunes are shootout or seasonal cars. No point adjusting them.

 

[XDesperado67]

Just completed the update.
My Challenger is at 608PP now so not to drastic a change there.
The M3 GTR Race Car from the upper class of the last shootout is down to 618PP so again not a large change, but my Altezza Touring Car that I pulled 2nd overall in has dropped all the way to 447PP...Dare say it would be much faster with an extra 53PP...

As for this shootout I suggest we complete it with the posted tunes.👍👍

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I like PP reduction on some cars, now they can be more competitive at certain PP level racing. I saw some of my cars now losing from 20 to 40 PP, 500PP online racing should be interesting now.

 

[krenkme]

Yes. The shootout will go on as planned. The cars were tuned and posted before PD went nutso on the pp system. So carry on as if everything is normal... aside from me that is

 

[trackripper123]

Oh god, adjustments to our tunes in our garages for all of us. >.<

I feel really quite sorry for people like Praiano and the Clueless team, they must have near a hundred tunes that need adjusting.

And some people are saying "at least the driving characteristic's not changed", well, to crank the PP back up, the HP will increase, and that's definitely going to change the feel of the car, no?

 

[wildheart90]

I think what they meant whas the physics didnt change therefore adjustments to the suspension, lsd, etc. are not needed. Therefore all tunes will behave exactly the same as before the update, just with a bit less pp.

 

[VTiRoj]

Also not every car has been effected, so Praiano, Clueless and everyone else with huge rosters of tunes won't have to adjust hundreds of cars. 👍

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

To get back to it's original PP before changes, the car would need more power or more aero or less weight, which means handling changes, which means changes to everything else.

 

[Johnnypenso]

To get back to it's original PP before changes, the car would need more power or more aero or less weight, which means handling changes, which means changes to everything else.

For the cars with small PP adjustments like 5-10, likely no adjustment need be made to anything except to add power/reduce weight. But some are 50+PP different and will obviously need adjusting in major ways. It's a game changer for sure.

On a positive note, I think they actually moved in the right direction. The slower cars went up, many of them way up and it should make these shootouts a lot closer with a wider range of vehicles in the hunt for top spot...hopefully!!

 

[XDesperado67]

@Johnnypenso not so sure about that. The Camaro RM was already a faster car than the Challenger on a PP level yet it has had its PP changed drastically while the Challenger hasn't seen much change.

Also my Altezza was very close in times with the S2Ks in the last shootout, don't you think it might have blitzed the field with an extra 53PP to play with compared with the 8 or so that's been reported for the S2Ks?
Makes me really wonder at the formulas that PD is using to generate PP and how it seems to be getting applied so inconsistently to the cars in the game.
There are a bunch of cars in my garage that have little or no change to their PP and then others that have had immense changes...some to the point that they can no longer run in the PP classes they did before...even if they were fairly competitive at those PP.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

One of my favorite GT500 car, Yellowhat YMS Supra, has shaved quite a few PP, now it maxed out at 601PP, it became competitive at Motegi TT, was struggling at low 1:51, with mere 545HP and less than max aero, hefty ballast. Now it can run max aero, 650+HP, minimum ballast, weight only 1100kg, and easy 1:49 ..... I love my Supra.

 

[Johnnypenso]

@Johnnypenso not so sure about that. The Camaro RM was already a faster car than the Challenger on a PP level yet it has had its PP changed drastically while the Challenger hasn't seen much change.

Also my Altezza was very close in times with the S2Ks in the last shootout, don't you think it might have blitzed the field with an extra 53PP to play with compared with the 8 or so that's been reported for the S2Ks?
Makes me really wonder at the formulas that PD is using to generate PP and how it seems to be getting applied so inconsistently to the cars in the game.
There are a bunch of cars in my garage that have little or no change to their PP and then others that have had immense changes...some to the point that they can no longer run in the PP classes they did before...even if they were fairly competitive at those PP.

It's a major shakeup no doubt...no idea where this will end up. I think we're basically starting over in terms of PP. But it sure will spice things up in the next shootout!!! I say a street car/pp limited shootout next...wide open!!!

 

[XDesperado67]

It's a major shakeup no doubt...no idea where this will end up. I think we're basically starting over in terms of PP. But it sure will spice things up in the next shootout!!! I say a street car/pp limited shootout next...wide open!!!

Agreed that next shootout should feature street cars built to a PP limit...would give us a chance to start sorting out the new top cars.
500-505PP might be an interesting target to start with. Before that was all about the 111R, now?

 

[Johnnypenso]

Agreed that next shootout should feature street cars built to a PP limit...would give us a chance to start sorting out the new top cars.
500-505PP might be an interesting target to start with. Before that was all about the 111R, now?

And given the non-adjustments to the FF's I'd leave them out of the competition and try and focus on the best of the best in street cars. 500PP is about right...largest group of cars possible I think. A good medium sized track so power is not so much of an advantage, but big enough that it matters.

 

[praiano63]

Agreed that next shootout should feature street cars built to a PP limit...would give us a chance to start sorting out the new top cars.
500-505PP might be an interesting target to start with. Before that was all about the 111R, now?

111R , LFA and other top cars stay the same. Nissan superGT low a few , i think they will compete with NSX again.
But the weider HSV will gain some more HP , why? don't ask me!!

 

[Theo777]

This update rolls around and appears to have a large impact on tuning. I am now kind of glad I had a really busy weekend and have not started testing any of the tunes yet. I really hope that it did not interfere with the physics engine and how these tunes perform at GP/D!

 

[CSLACR]

My Camaro is only 539PP now FTW.

 

[XDesperado67]

My Camaro is only 539PP now FTW.

Yeah the Camaro was already the faster muscle car RM and gets a massive drop in its PP while the Challenger only changed by 7 PP.
PD Facepalm Fail.👎👎

 

[macdog54]

This update rolls around and appears to have a large impact on tuning. I am now kind of glad I had a really busy weekend and have not started testing any of the tunes yet. I really hope that it did not interfere with the physics engine and how these tunes perform at GP/D!

I've been testing a few of these cars and have just re-tested yours after the update 608pp v 615pp and went from 1.31.277 to 1.30.630 so go figure.

 

[macdog54]

I've been testing a few of these cars and have just re-tested yours after the update 608pp v 615pp and went from 1.31.277 to 1.30.630 . Tried later on at 614 pp and couldn't improve so it must have been my inconsistent driving.:

 

[Motor City Hami]

I think we should think about letting people make adjustments to meet the new PP limit. Has more biffa tested yet? The Camaro and Charger really had no chance against the 2D before. It would be interesting to see how the new PP levels compare.

My Jag didn't change. Did the Ferrari or the 2D change?

 

[krenkme]

I think we should think about letting people make adjustments to meet the new PP limit. Has more biffa tested yet? The Camaro and Charger really had no chance against the 2D before. It would be interesting to see how the new PP levels compare.

My Jag didn't change. Did the Ferrari or the 2D change?

The Ferrari and 2D did not change.

As for the Dodge and Chevy - believe me, I would love to see some American muscle run with the top, but in risk of opening a can of worms (why do they get more time? We should all get more time to tune, I would have picked that car if I knew this would happen, can I change my car to one of those now, ect.), they should be tested as posted/tuned... that is unless everyone thinks (and testers are okay with) they should be able to.

What does everyone think?

- I am behind on links. Sorry. I will get them in about 7 hours.

-if anyone was still interested in the Honda exclusive shootout, someone else will have to run it. I'm done after this one

 

[CyKosis1973]

Whilst it looks like the PP has changed for some cars, surely their weight and power have remained unchanged..?? Poor timing as this has turned out to be, if the cars have remained unchanged in terms of weight and power, just carry on as is.

Looks like I'm going to have to log on tonight, to see what the hell is what...

{Cy}

 

[Motor City Hami]

I was thinking no suspension or Lsd changes, just power, aero and transmission adjustment.

 

[ugabugaz]

Test as posted. No adjustments. My stance on the matter.

 

[Onboy123]

^^

Same as him.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Test as posted. No adjustments. My stance on the matter.

^^

Same as him.

For the most part I agree, let's get through this and see what happens on the other side. I take back everything I said earlier about making future shootouts more interesting because I think PD widened the performance gap at fixed PP levels, not shrunk it. 👎👎 I have no idea what to do from here.

 

[Onboy123]

Hmm&#8230;well, for the next one&#8230;we should do a "find the new king of ---PP" one. So for 500PP, we could have Supras vs Carltons vs Corvettes (seeing a trend here&#8230;FR, huge engines, fairly heavy) and then the odd Jag or something on say&#8230;Trial Mountain.

We should probably move this discussion over to the main thread, and wait impatiently for the results, actually.