Fanatec Announcements: CSW V2 Reviews Out
- Thread starter Crispy
- 13,388 comments
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- 572
- 18603
- Intimidat3r421
Why is the CSR Elite discontinued on the North America Site?
http://us.fanatec.com/index.php?route=support/product&path=72&product_id=141#downloads
And why are the check marks for compatibility now Red X's....?
http://i.imgur.com/uItu6e2.png
It's also not available anymore on the wheel page:
http://us.fanatec.com/RacingWheels
http://us.fanatec.com/index.php?route=support/product&path=72&product_id=141#downloads
And why are the check marks for compatibility now Red X's....?
http://i.imgur.com/uItu6e2.png
It's also not available anymore on the wheel page:
http://us.fanatec.com/RacingWheels
- 1,603
- IN
- Eric_J2358
The numbers given for the OE motor RPM above are NOT correct. I tested two sets myself and under no load conditions @25.6VDC they run about 4200 RPM. With these numbers being incorrect, it draws into question whether the given torque figures are correct also. The motor designation is RS555PH, it looks like the poster above got hold of a data sheet for a different 555.
The performance characteristics of the RS555PH motors used in Fanatec wheels can easily be calculated by comparing the known values from a datasheet which can be obtained for a same class motor of different windings/poles. You need only fined the datasheet and use some simple maths. All other variables are likely to be the same, brushes, magnets, bushings. Match though and calculate.
This is not important though as those figures irrelevant in this case.
It seems more interesting that Fanatec has posted on this thread something that contradicts their earlier statements. These things are fun to watch sometimes.
You must actually make something that is better in order state that it is better. Apparently the 2 motor wheels are better than the one motor wheels. The 1 motor wheels are also better than the 2 motor wheels. Maybe they are better motors? No.. We know they are not.
Just a fly on wall! Entertaining
This is not important though as those figures irrelevant in this case.
It seems more interesting that Fanatec has posted on this thread something that contradicts their earlier statements. These things are fun to watch sometimes.
You must actually make something that is better in order state that it is better. Apparently the 2 motor wheels are better than the one motor wheels. The 1 motor wheels are also better than the 2 motor wheels. Maybe they are better motors? No.. We know they are not.
Just a fly on wall! Entertaining
- 577
- NC
Context matters. Is the two motor not as good as one larger one comment related to comparing a Logi-twin with a Fana-single? The Logi twin motors are smaller than the Fana-single motor. Later Fanatec came out with their current premium twin motor rigs which use two of the still-larger-than-Logi motors from the single motor F wheels. They did not go towards the smaller motors used by Logi.
Looking over some of the Wheel Check data from iRacing I see that they found that the single motor Fanatec GT3 was a bit stronger than both the twin motor G25 or G27. And about 10-20% weaker than a T500rs. Not sure on the Elite/CSW. I can see that my four FFB motor Elite objectively blows away the T500rs though ;-)
I'm sure we can figure out the context if that makes sense to people.
What makes less sense to me is all the Fana-Bashing™ going on. I do not think it is good for the forum or hobby or those who bash so much. Some folks deliberately open bash threads across multiple forums and post again and again and again. I have seen this several times in my limited time here since late last year. Again I don't think it is good for the sport or hobby to excessively bash. And it also can become a barrier to entry since some new companies might hesitate or existing ones hold back on possible new products. I saw a couple weeks back that some others shared the sentiments I've noted in this paragraph and were asking for moderator assistance.
Looking over some of the Wheel Check data from iRacing I see that they found that the single motor Fanatec GT3 was a bit stronger than both the twin motor G25 or G27. And about 10-20% weaker than a T500rs. Not sure on the Elite/CSW. I can see that my four FFB motor Elite objectively blows away the T500rs though ;-)
I'm sure we can figure out the context if that makes sense to people.
What makes less sense to me is all the Fana-Bashing™ going on. I do not think it is good for the forum or hobby or those who bash so much. Some folks deliberately open bash threads across multiple forums and post again and again and again. I have seen this several times in my limited time here since late last year. Again I don't think it is good for the sport or hobby to excessively bash. And it also can become a barrier to entry since some new companies might hesitate or existing ones hold back on possible new products. I saw a couple weeks back that some others shared the sentiments I've noted in this paragraph and were asking for moderator assistance.
- 4,182
- Ottawa
Agree, good point racerx, let us keep it above the belt. If we are to advance we have to stay constructive, if something is wrong, be to the point, precise and offer solution.
Thomas does not have to get wet in those thread, he gets my respect for not beeing afraid, knowing he might not be treated fairly. I have fanatec product, I will have more, not because they are perfect, I could probably not afford perfection anyway lol, but because they improve my sim experience. I wish they would be better, like all of us, like Thomas.
Let us keep working at getting a better sim experience by staying constructive and like some in this thread, creative.
Thomas does not have to get wet in those thread, he gets my respect for not beeing afraid, knowing he might not be treated fairly. I have fanatec product, I will have more, not because they are perfect, I could probably not afford perfection anyway lol, but because they improve my sim experience. I wish they would be better, like all of us, like Thomas.
Let us keep working at getting a better sim experience by staying constructive and like some in this thread, creative.
- 22
- Brazil
Despite the inconsistencies spoken by Thomas,problems late of with products announced in 2012, problems with product quality (I had problems with my accelerator CSPV2), despite all the problems I decided to buy and invest in the Fanatec CSW by a simple reason, they are dedicated to hardware simulation racing, while other companies products simsrace are secondary. I think every person who plays a simulator should see this.
The context necessary is in this topic already:
Fanatec on the blog: "We decided to use a single motor as this reduces mechanical resistance or the so called "cogging force"."
Fanatec here: "We have chosen the two smaller motors because they offer a much lower cogging force."
This context can be applied directly to their wheels, without looking at other wheels. The reasons for this are immediately apparent and has been talked about.
Why is talking about this bad? Why the apologist attitude? We have as much right to question things like this as we do to mod our hardwares. Fanatec has chosen to come and make statement which contradicts something else they have said. This is ok, because it is Fanatec?
You belittle people for pointing things out and call them "bashers" and run them off. It is ok to talk about how bad the motors in the wheels are to a degree that it fills pages with information about how to keep them cool, etc. If things were designed properly they would not be failing, not need extra cooling, extra bearings. They would not be losing force. People would not be spending many hours making modifications.
I am amazed and shocked. I came here to discuss interesting things not to be told what I can and can't discuss. People speak of internet mob. They speak of it regarding people that jump on things like contradicting statements by Fanatec and failing motors. They call it "FUD" What are those called that push people away? Those that try to do opposite by covering up things? It should be 50/50 and it is not.
It amazes me that it is ok to post for pages and pages about "fixing" wheels but there is nothing wrong with them. This does not make sense. Very frustrating.
Fanatec on the blog: "We decided to use a single motor as this reduces mechanical resistance or the so called "cogging force"."
Fanatec here: "We have chosen the two smaller motors because they offer a much lower cogging force."
This context can be applied directly to their wheels, without looking at other wheels. The reasons for this are immediately apparent and has been talked about.
Why is talking about this bad? Why the apologist attitude? We have as much right to question things like this as we do to mod our hardwares. Fanatec has chosen to come and make statement which contradicts something else they have said. This is ok, because it is Fanatec?
You belittle people for pointing things out and call them "bashers" and run them off. It is ok to talk about how bad the motors in the wheels are to a degree that it fills pages with information about how to keep them cool, etc. If things were designed properly they would not be failing, not need extra cooling, extra bearings. They would not be losing force. People would not be spending many hours making modifications.
I am amazed and shocked. I came here to discuss interesting things not to be told what I can and can't discuss. People speak of internet mob. They speak of it regarding people that jump on things like contradicting statements by Fanatec and failing motors. They call it "FUD" What are those called that push people away? Those that try to do opposite by covering up things? It should be 50/50 and it is not.
It amazes me that it is ok to post for pages and pages about "fixing" wheels but there is nothing wrong with them. This does not make sense. Very frustrating.
- 577
- NC
Lots of people like modding their equipment, I know I do. It's easy and rewarding and part of the fun of this hobby.
This is an announcement thread so it might be good to stay within its tone and history. If someone would like to create a new grievance thread they can certainly do so.
I'm not singling anyone out, please don't feel that way. I just find it curious that I have come across some that create threads across multiple forums plus social media all at once to actively Fana-Bash™ a company or product. There are a few people that seem to do that with Fanatec.
Maybe some here have not noticed this but being new to these forums I found it curious that some would bash in say Forum A. And then I notice 5 minutes later they started a new thread or added to an existing one in Forums B, C, and D. Later I see that they added to 911wheel and FB and other places I'm sure I did not come across. They sure must have a lot of time and apparently there may be an unstated agenda.
I mostly drive and mod as far as this hobby goes.
- 227
- Montreal
- SUPERNOVADAVE
- SUPERNOVADAVE
Racerx don`t you think it is time to start your own thread on what you have done with your wheel. im sure there are some who would follow it to see and hear what you have done or are going to do.
this thread has nothing to do with your mods - the op is Fanatecs announcements not Fanatec mods.
what you have done has already been done to wheels - it is old news to some. then you go on about some who like to bash Fanatec and then turn around and bash those that you say are bashing. im sure you can do better if you put your mind to it.
- 10,403
- GTP_Spag69
- spagetti69
Haven't been round these parts much but it is the same as when I left lol.
500 odd hundred pages are not all announcements and many have posted in this mega thread about general topic Fanatec stuff.
Have I missed a CSS announcement here?
Any news on next gen compatibility? Is Thomas allowed to talk about it? PS4 was officially revealed yesterday so I was wondering if any NDA were up.
Edit. Nova, good point.
500 odd hundred pages are not all announcements and many have posted in this mega thread about general topic Fanatec stuff.
Have I missed a CSS announcement here?
Any news on next gen compatibility? Is Thomas allowed to talk about it? PS4 was officially revealed yesterday so I was wondering if any NDA were up.
Edit. Nova, good point.
Carlos
Premium
- 6,453
- Netherlands
Today I was playing iRacing when suddenly my wheel dies. I think (hope) my power supply died of my CSR wheel. Ordered a new one online, couldn't find the right power supply in the city, only 19v and with too less amps. Let's hope it's the power supply..... Please let it be the power supply!!
- 4,182
- Ottawa
Via, please do not get frustrated, we are all going in the same direction, in the same boat
it is ok to signal anything, better to do it in a positive and constructive way, as it will intice a person to respond instead of starting a conflict.
As you mentioned in your post, context is important, the 2 comments, seemmingly contradictory, are also obviously about 2 different wheel at a different point in time,
we can conceive that a concept, like bigger motor can only go so far and then to go further it need to go to 2 motors. So fanatec put a bigger motor in their wheel, obviously because they think it is a better engeiniring decision, as they are trying to get more they realize they need 2 motor. Thomas is just stating what the intention behind the design was, intention do not always deliver the intended result, nothing wrong with that either.
Fanatec obviuosly went from one motor to 2 motor in their top of the line wheel.
It as already beeing proven that both work, I presently own a 2 motor design and I have to admit it has a lot of merrits, who knows next product might have 4 motors, watercooling or a big diesel engine,
who knows, it is beside the point.The point is we want the conversation not to stop, so beeing civile and respectfull seems to be a better way than trying to confuse the issue and going for the journalistic effect.
Only expressing an opinion, any one is free to act the way they think works best and express any opinion.
Here's how I look at it. Bare with me. LCD panels have been around for a long time, but the technology was so bad, we stuck with CRT monitors. CRT have (had) better resolution, refresh rate, colours, viewing angle, etc. But after around 21" inch screen, there starts to be limits (size wise). So we are back to LCD, and forced to improve the tech to match the standards of CRT. It's not flip flopping. It's discovering limitations.
The same could be said when you change motor designs.
Simply quoting Thomas and saying that's the full context, is just wrong. It's completely out of context, because they are completely different wheel (price wise). I'd never put a resistive touchscreen on a phone, and I'd never put a capacitive touchscreen on a nintendo ds. Neither tech is better than the other.
The same could be said when you change motor designs.
Simply quoting Thomas and saying that's the full context, is just wrong. It's completely out of context, because they are completely different wheel (price wise). I'd never put a resistive touchscreen on a phone, and I'd never put a capacitive touchscreen on a nintendo ds. Neither tech is better than the other.
Exactly, he said it in a general way. Can be interpreted in any way. To quote RacerXX; "how low is low?"
Just because it's a good idea to put the engine at the back of a ferrari, doesn't mean its a good idea to do in a porsche (god knows why they do it anway). Completely different car. Likewise, fanatec wheels have different belts and gear ratios, as well as the strength of the plastic base that holds it all together.
Understanding the limitation of $$$ goes a long way, mate.
Thomas's quote might have been an old method left over from the fanatec speedster days and the tech found its way into the porsche wheels. Maybe a new processor or better manufacturing standards allowed them to overcome old problems. Who knows. That's why I'm saying its out of context. New tech, new wheels, new standards(new doesn't always mean better). So maybe you're right and they do need to refresh the websites.
Just because it's a good idea to put the engine at the back of a ferrari, doesn't mean its a good idea to do in a porsche (god knows why they do it anway). Completely different car. Likewise, fanatec wheels have different belts and gear ratios, as well as the strength of the plastic base that holds it all together.
Understanding the limitation of $$$ goes a long way, mate.
Thomas's quote might have been an old method left over from the fanatec speedster days and the tech found its way into the porsche wheels. Maybe a new processor or better manufacturing standards allowed them to overcome old problems. Who knows. That's why I'm saying its out of context. New tech, new wheels, new standards(new doesn't always mean better). So maybe you're right and they do need to refresh the websites.
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Its just marketing. If fanatec opted to priorities torque and speed they would sing a different tune of course. They would perhaps also not release a 2 kg gt rim if so.
Cogging is an issue not that much for precision as for turn feel though so it depend what you feel is more important.
Cogging is an issue not that much for precision as for turn feel though so it depend what you feel is more important.
- 790
- Germany
I have checked back with our engineers and in fact the cogging force is not directly related to the amount of motors but the type of motor and other parameters. We need to change our FAQ.
The key statement of my post was that cogging force is more important than raw power and this statement is still true. We always try to reduce the cogging force as much as possible.
The key statement of my post was that cogging force is more important than raw power and this statement is still true. We always try to reduce the cogging force as much as possible.
- 8
- SaltCrockCuntry
G'day lads.
Perhaps you could offer the same suggestion for your mates regarding wheel issues/failures?
Postings since January 1, 2013, and in the spirit of "balance", posts reporting no issues to-date follow at end of quoted posts.
PG 411:
PG 412:
PG 414:
PG 417:
PG 419:
PG 423:
PG 425:
PG 429:
PG 433:
Pg. 440
And in the spirit of accurate reporting, posts for same period reporting no issues to-date (oldest wheel at time of postings are CSW beta wheels at 10 months)
PG 417:
PG 427:
Estimated wheel age, pg. 435:
Estimated Wheel Age, pg. 435:
Perhaps you could offer the same suggestion for your mates regarding wheel issues/failures?
Postings since January 1, 2013, and in the spirit of "balance", posts reporting no issues to-date follow at end of quoted posts.
PG 411:
PG 412:
PG 414:
PG 417:
PG 419:
Have any of you have belt slippage on their CSW or CSR Elite?
It seems like my belts are slipping no matter what.They got stretched and seem to have become smooth. There is still slip no matter how strong I adjust the tension of both belts. With the problem that you can't tighten them as strong as then the motor bearings will start to lock up under the stress of the load put on the axle.
That said I have this base since April last year (yes, still the beta wheel), so it says something about the life expectancy of the belts I suppose. Which would suck as you'd have to take apart the CSW to a great extend if you'd have to replace them. Or send the CSW to Fanatec ever 9 months to a year for repair because of a worn/smooth belt. Which wouldn't be something I would look forward to doing either.
Again, my base is still the Beta wheel base. So if no one else has issues with slippage in their final production wheels, then there is no cause for alarm.
Maybe some Loctite 8005 will help in this case? Which is a anti-slip belt dressing.
PG 423:
PG 425:
PG 429:
A few days ago I unplugged the CSW F1 rim to take some pictures of paddles that have both cracked on bending.
After that I plugged the rim on CSW. Now playing F1 2012, Project CARS the steering wheel controls start theirself without pushing them. So it happens that randomly the views change quickly, the sound and the microphone are muted/activated while i'm on teamspeak... in short, the buttons i had set on the steering wheel activate theirself randomly.
I tried to push harder the rim in place, and this seemed to alleviate the problem for a while but then starts again.
Has anyone had this problem? What could it be? I noticed that the two middle pins of the quick release are lower than the other, is this normal?
Another problem is that, despite a correct calibration procedure, with the steering wheel that is positioned regularly at 0 degrees in the drivers panel when centered, when you turn on the wheel it stop at about 7-8 degrees on the right after auto-calibration.
Firmware and drivers are updated
I'm obviously preparing a pics-video documentations for fanatec support
PG 433:
Thomas I want to ask you this in public:
When your GT2-w-V2 pedals package arrived, within 24 hours the GT2 stopped turning on with the power button. Then it worked again. Then it stopped again. What should I think Thomas? And this was approx. 10-14 days ago. Understand that I really want the Elite ..but these (motor issues Logiforce asked about), and the rest, led me to buy a t500rs. The Thrustmaster can be returned within 30 days, no worries. I have 25 days left. Will you work with me to get a (damn) Elite thats reliable?
For sure, if you can help, and if all goes well, I will be happy to forget my recent bad fanatec experiences. If you PM me I will arange to do whatever it takes. The webstore price for the Elite has gone up since my problems began ..so thats one area you can help me with. I want to send you my money- I just want a decent reliability 'from the box' and not promises of customer service. Ok? Please PM me. The t500 is fine, of course, but your design has my passion in it
THANK YOU
Pg. 440
And in the spirit of accurate reporting, posts for same period reporting no issues to-date (oldest wheel at time of postings are CSW beta wheels at 10 months)
PG 417:
Estimated wheel age 10 Months.
PG 427:
Estimated wheel age, pg. 435:
Estimated Wheel Age, pg. 435:
well ive had mine for 3 months(November 12) & have had no issues yet
Made in reply to above quote, wheel age estimated at 3 months.
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LogiForce
Premium
- 4,078
- Groningen, Netherlands
- LogiForce86
- LogiForce
I am here to announce a dedicated thread about broken gear and customer support experiences...
- The broken Fanatec devices & Customer Support discussion thread: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=274653
- The broken Fanatec devices & Customer Support discussion thread: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=274653
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- 3,082
- Allen, Texas
- crispychicken49
- crispychicken49
Those that wish to show their mods to their wheels feel free to post a small showcase in here!
As well as small problems you have encountered. (Not due to broken parts) Of course though keep the things like broken motors and other things in the Customer Support section, it will probably speed up response times quiet a bit. 👍 Remember, always have fun and I'll be here to post up the next line of announcements!
As well as small problems you have encountered. (Not due to broken parts) Of course though keep the things like broken motors and other things in the Customer Support section, it will probably speed up response times quiet a bit. 👍 Remember, always have fun and I'll be here to post up the next line of announcements!
- 1,138
- United States
- alefin
Did "premium service" get added to Fanatec North America? There's a graphic on the site http://us.fanatec.com/index.php?route=common/home (it's the second auto-loading one), but I have no idea how to add/activate it.
It seems news about CSS have slowly started to emerge.
CSS Feature preview #1
Submitted by Thomas on Wed, 03/06/2013 - 09:42.
The testing of our ClubSport shifter is going well so it is time to announce the features.
The first function we want to show is the mounting on cockpits.
All four sides have t-slots which allow the insert of t-slot nuts at any position.
You can mount the shifters on all sides but also on the bottom.
This makes mounting extremely flexible.
CSS Feature preview #1
Submitted by Thomas on Wed, 03/06/2013 - 09:42.
The testing of our ClubSport shifter is going well so it is time to announce the features.
The first function we want to show is the mounting on cockpits.
All four sides have t-slots which allow the insert of t-slot nuts at any position.
You can mount the shifters on all sides but also on the bottom.
This makes mounting extremely flexible.
LogiForce
Premium
- 4,078
- Groningen, Netherlands
- LogiForce86
- LogiForce
I hope they add extra T-nuts and bolts for those who would want to mount it on multiple sides, to make the shifter wobble free on their rigs.
Say you would want to sink the shifter into your home build center console, you'd want to secure it all around. So just for occasions like that you'd want some extra mounting equipment in the package.
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