For those that object to GTS or GT7 having Std Cars, what is your reason?

[Spagetti69]

If they bother to implement damage how would that work with old assets?

If they bother.

 

[05XR8]

The same way they did in GT5... but, with more POWER!

 

[SlipZtrEm]

If the smeary, oil-painting mess that was GT5's damage returns alongside Standards, I foresee plenty of (deserved) dirt being flung PD-wards. To wit:

Come to think of it, there's no reason for the Range Stormer to return. It's arguably more relevant for PD to model any of the RR Sports that came after that preview, either the Disco-based first gen or the current one (perhaps even the SVR).

 

[FoRiZon]

I also hate how numerous standard cars taillight is just plain bad.

 

[CSLACR]

I also hate how numerous standard cars taillight is just plain bad.

View attachment 526758

Looks like semi-premium detailing gone wrong, imagine that.
It appears to revert to "standard" lights when the brake lights turn on.

 

[Lucas]

My issue with standard cars is the nomenclature. Is it nitpicky? Of course not. The "Premium Car" moniker didn't appear out of thin air. It was thought beforehand. Because it is one thing to say "200 PREMIUM CARS and 800 Standard Cars" as opposed to "200 Standard Cars and 800 cars from GT4".

It's embarrasing how PD refuses to acknowledge that Premium Cars have nothing Premium going on for them. They are the standard of this generation, while 80% of the bloated car list belongs to the PS2.

Not to mention the pressure is not the same when you have a car list of 200 cars as opposed to a car list of 1000 cars. The latter allows you to work at your leisure and do as you please within certain limits, while the former will definitely put some needed stress on PD to work towards creating a better Gran Turismo game.

 

[05XR8]

Nah, Std cars are not included in new GT games. Std cars ARE the original cars in the game. Only the fully rendered "Premium" cars have been added. Joy to the optimists here because, PD not only kept some of their "classic" GT franchise cars, they actually added new cars in each new game.

So, don't take it to heart how PD dare to have such "classic" rendered cars from 20years ago. Just think, there doesn't need to be a separate mode to enjoy them. We can choose them at will in each game. How good is that?!

It's amazing how many fully rendered cars PD have churned out in 20 years. Simply amazing!

 

[glassjaw]

If the smeary, oil-painting mess that was GT5's damage returns alongside Standards, I foresee plenty of (deserved) dirt being flung PD-wards. To wit:

View attachment 526079

Come to think of it, there's no reason for the Range Stormer to return. It's arguably more relevant for PD to model any of the RR Sports that came after that preview, either the Disco-based first gen or the current one (perhaps even the SVR).

I amazingly forgot how awful damage modelling was in GT5 1.0, especially with standard cars. It's even sadder because I remember an interview where Kaz said he wouldn't want to attempt damage until it could be done properly with next-gen hardware, better than any game currently on the market. And this was during the post-GT4 days. Good thing all the extra power of the PS3 went into making cars melt in unique and wildly unrealistic ways. Really gave Turn 10 and Codies a run for their money.

 

[Lucas]

Just look here. What's so ugly about having semi premiums in the game? These three doesn't look too bad.

Yes, I touched them up by gently brushing over three or so areas. But still. They do look good, don't they? (Yes the Levin is far behind on both pics but it doesn't look bad)

I'm probably in the 1% that thinks this, but: give me cars of this level of detail (plus cockpit) any day of the week over "WE MODELED THE ENGINE BAY THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN SEE". Hell, I'm fine if all cars have this level of detail even if there's no cockpit, leave that for later if you will.

Diminishing returns happen when PD focuses so much on graphics that the rest of the game is a mess. ^ That level of detail is enough for me and I really like it. Granted, I'm no graphics whore and I grew up playing GT2 and GT4.

I know this comment goes against my earlier statement, but PD will never, ever, make every standard in GT a Premium car. The best we can hope is that we are asked in GTPlanet which cars we would like to see Premiunized (if they haven't done so already, they'll never will) or see every standard car brought to that level of detail.

Moreover, performance > eyecandy. Imagine seeing ACTUAL races with more than 16/8 cars at all time, I'm talking 40 cars lineups, you know, what actually matters in a racing game over "I can see the brand name on the headlights".

Also, people seem to focus too much on the cars, but when I played GT6 a month ago, the first thing that struck me was how UGLY the entire environment looked like. I'm talking trees, grass, the textures overall were disgusting.

 

[glassjaw]

Diminishing returns happen when PD focuses so much on graphics that the rest of the game is a mess. ^ That level of detail is enough for me and I really like it. Granted, I'm no graphics whore and I grew up playing GT2 and GT4.

Clearly Polyphony has a problem prioritizing areas they need to focus on when they're developing these games, there's no disputing that. And although I'm a nerd who really does appreciate the insane level of detail the team pours into these models, I agree with you. There's no point in focusing all your attention on building such incredibly detailed cars when the console you're working with can't even display a full grid of them on screen without sacrificing level of detail and, more importantly, framerate. The benchmark for premium cars was totally beyond the realm of what was necessary and pragmatic on PS3 (except in Photo Mode, where the extra detail could actually be noticed).

That said, I think the problem is two-fold. As I said, I love the accuracy of Polyphony's modelling. It sounds nitpicky, but it's one of the reasons I always felt they achieved a higher standard of quality compared to Turn 10. The other issue here is the expectation they've created among players that there will always be 1,000+ cars, and that none of those cars will ever be taken away from them. Which isn't simply an impediment to graphical progress, but advancements in gameplay as well because when your simulator has that many cars, it's impossible that they will all handle the way they should, and feel right, and be given the individual attention they need. So whenever I see a standard, I'm not just disappointed to see them looking a hell of a lot worse than premiums; it's also a blatant admission by Polyphony that this car doesn't matter, and you shouldn't expect anything remarkable about its representation in Gran Turismo.

 

[7HO]

I don't really care about the GT series of games at the moment because I don't think they are very good. I'm interested in GTSport because of the FIA competition announcement and I'm hoping it will have organised racing on par with iRacing although I do not hold high hopes that GTSport will be a very good simulator. I've been spoilt recently by iRacing but I also want iRacing to have competition so I am hoping GTSport is a departure from the numbered GT series and is more like iRacing. I'm looking for quality over quantity. When it comes to serious competition in a good simulation you really need to focus on a car and you really can't swap and change constantly and still perform at your best so there is no need for a massive number of cars, also I'm not personally interested in anything outside of a GT series (as in the Blancpain series and similar) using race cars not street cars. That is what I am hoping GTSport is, a realistic racing simulator without all the regular GT fluff and more like iRacing. I personally don't care what GT7 has if it is anything like the rest of the GT sereis of games because I have no interest in those so put standard cars in GT7, I don't care but only put premium race cars in GTSport and when I say premium I mean like Gran Turismo has never done before with realistic simulation.

 

[Lucas]

The other issue here is the expectation they've created among players that there will always be 1,000+ cars, and that none of those cars will ever be taken away from them. Which isn't simply an impediment to graphical progress, but advancements in gameplay as well because when your simulator has that many cars, it's impossible that they will all handle the way they should, and feel right, and be given the individual attention they need. So whenever I see a standard, I'm not just disappointed to see them looking a hell of a lot worse than premiums; it's also a blatant admission by Polyphony that this car doesn't matter, and you shouldn't expect anything remarkable about its representation in Gran Turismo.

This is the feeling I got the other day as well, after I was done writing that comment. Polyphony was never going to turn every standard car into a Premium car. I think those cars were just placeholders, a way to bump up the car list and nothing more. I really doubt PD will have PS2 cars in their next Gran Turismo title, so essentially, like you said, the standard cars don't matter. To me, it's like they said "here's a standard car, drive it if you want to, not like we expect you to".

 

[NLxAROSA]

I really wish we would drop the term 'standard' cars, as well as 'premium'. Premium is the standard. Standards are sub-standard, they always have been, despite how PD/Sony's marketing department spin it. GTHD and GT5P set the standard, then PD decided to introduce a sub-standard to pad the car count. No amount of marketing-spin can change that fact.

 

[ukfan758]

Can it be said for GT Sport that the "premium" cars from GT5 and GT6 can be called standard cars just like when Gran Turismo 4 cars came to GT5?

 

[CSLACR]

Can it be said for GT Sport that the "premium" cars from GT5 and GT6 can be called standard cars just like when Gran Turismo 4 cars came to GT5?

We don't know for sure if GTS will even contain cars from GT5 or 6 yet.

 

[05XR8]

Can it be said for GT Sport that the "premium" cars from GT5 and GT6 can be called standard cars just like when Gran Turismo 4 cars came to GT5?

We don't know for sure if GTS will even contain cars from GT5 or 6 yet.

Isn't the SLS in one of those GTS pics?

 

[CSLACR]

Isn't the SLS in one of those GTS pics?

Yes, but grain of salt.

 

[JackC8]

It's 2016 and there are plenty of other racing games on the market. When I'm used to playing other modern games and then I play GT and see those standard cars, my reaction is "This is pathetic, what is PD, some little indy developer?"

 

[TeamCZRRacing]

It's 2016 and there are plenty of other racing games on the market. When I'm used to playing other modern games and then I play GT and see those standard cars, my reaction is "This is pathetic, what is PD, some little indy developer?"

But what is your reaction when you see the premiums, many of which were made 6 years ago and are still of higher quality than many racing games on modern hardware?

 

[Johnnypenso]

But what is your reaction when you see the premiums, many of which were made 6 years ago and are still of higher quality than many racing games on modern hardware?

The existence of premiums doesn't change the fact that 2/3 of the cars in the game belong in a game from a decade ago.

 

[ImaRobot]

But what is your reaction when you see the premiums, many of which were made 6 years ago and are still of higher quality than many racing games on modern hardware?

Nothing, They are where they belong. They where over-produced, and likely could have done with little changing for future titles and it would still be fine for today's standards. If everyone decided they wanted to make something that is going to tax heavily on an out of date system then that is on them, but for the most part people make compromises. While PDs models are definitely beautiful, these other developers don't even look that far off in comparison. They are all good(whether you're talking about Forza, DC, or even Pcars.)

 

[TeamCZRRacing]

The existence of premiums doesn't change the fact that 2/3 of the cars in the game belong in a game from a decade ago.

If there's one reason I don't visit the GT6 subforum (or really any GT subforum) anymore, it's because of your overt cynicism and refusal to see anything good with GT. Whenever I post about something I like here - whether it's something you agree with or not - you always come along to burst my bubble.

If you don't like the things I have to say, please put me on your ignore list. I'll be doing the same to you.

Nothing, They are where they belong. They where over-produced, and likely could have done with little changing for future titles and it would still be fine for today's standards. If everyone decided they wanted to make something that is going to tax heavily on an out of date system then that is on them, but for the most part people make compromises. While PDs models are definitely beautiful, these other developers don't even look that far off in comparison. They are all good(whether you're talking about Forza, DC, or even Pcars.)

My point is that a) these models looked as good as models from most modern racing games when they were made over half a decade ago, and b) if you don't like standards, just ignore them.

 

[ImaRobot]

My point is that a) these models looked as good as models from most modern racing games when they were made over half a decade ago, and b) if you don't like standards, just ignore them.

And like I hinted at, that's because they don't seem to know how to set a limit for themselves. Outright beauty over performance is something they choose do to, and it's drawbacks are glaringly obvious. Where as these other developers seem to have performance in mind, not as an afterthought. These other developers also keep the same consistency throughout the whole roster not just 33% of it. I would 100% of the time take the method that any of these other developers have taken, as car modeling is at a point that it doesn't even matter how much more you put into it, there are hardly going to be differences to the naked eye.

 

[Samus]

But what is your reaction when you see the premiums, many of which were made 6 years ago and are still of higher quality than many racing games on modern hardware?

The date they were made is not important, it's only the quality they are in. If they had somehow modeled cars to premium detail in 2004 then sure, I don't see why there would be a negative reaction to them being on PS4. Nobody is saying the standards suck solely because of their age, it's primarily because of their quality.

 

[Johnnypenso]

If there's one reason I don't visit the GT6 subforum (or really any GT subforum) anymore, it's because of your overt cynicism and refusal to see anything good with GT. Whenever I post about something I like here - whether it's something you agree with or not - you always come along to burst my bubble.

If you don't like the things I have to say, please put me on your ignore list. I'll be doing the same to you.

My point is that a) these models looked as good as models from most modern racing games when they were made over half a decade ago, and b) if you don't like standards, just ignore them.

If you only want a limited range of answers that confirm your feelings don't ask open ended questions.

 

[Lucas]

But what is your reaction when you see the premiums, many of which were made 6 years ago and are still of higher quality than many racing games on modern hardware?

I feel sad PD really thought that level of quality was really necessary instead of updating the standard cars for a PS3 game. Some call that "dedication, love, extremely quality". I call it "lack of priorities, pointless detail". Especially when cars of less quality = larger grids and proper racing.

That is my honest opinion. The best racing I've ever had was not in Gran Turismo 5 or Gran Turismo 6. It was in TOCA.

 

[TRL_Andromeda]

Because it is embarrasing (and completely unacceptable) that a car that is rendered like this:

Is allowed to exist in a 2016 game.

 

[Tornado]

That car doesn't exist in a 2016 game. It didn't even exist in the 2010 game since they fixed it in 2011.

 

[05XR8]

The best racing I've ever had...was in TOCA.

Amen.
I remember starting that disc in my Playstation. Seeing that intro. Watching the car flip and thinking, "oh, my Lord". How the cars looked in game play, for the time, may have been 16bit but, the game play was great. Cockpit view, with the screen tilt, going around fast corners at Knockhill in the rain. That is and was a "real" racing game.

 

[CSLACR]

But what is your reaction when you see the premiums, many of which were made 6 years ago and are still of higher quality than many racing games on modern hardware?

The premiums made 6 years ago show, and they don't compare to any PS4 game I've seen.
Cars modeled for GT6 however, looked better even on PS3, and are supposed to have been made for the PS4 LoD.