Forza 4 VS GT5 (read the first post before you contribute)

[HBK]

They probably will be coming out with another version in a couple of years. I guess because PD felt they had shipped an incomplete product, they owed it to its fans. Even so, I know of no other game that has put out as many improvement and features and over such a long time.

OFP had free content added (guns, vehicles and missions) for about 18 months if I remember right. More recently, X3TC (pretty much like the whole X series) had free content (ships, sectors, and "plots", as they call them) added for about two years.

And I won't even talk about the numerous PC games that are patched for fixes and improvements for about two years (generally until the next game in the series comes out).

Edit : Oh, and it's a good thing GT5 is patched. It's just the least PD can do.

 

[Imari]

They could have stopped at patch 1.02 and moved on, promising to get it right on GT6 and they still would have sold 5 million copies of GT5 as well as sold GT6 like hot cakes. There are many games in the same state or worse released, haven't seen any put out release after release, for free, to do the drastic changes done like PD did. Do you know a game that has?

Yes and no. Yes, it's great that they are supporting the game for as long as they are. No, they couldn't really have stopped because a lot of those patches were adding features that were described on official materials (the box, the manual) that weren't in the released game. Not releasing those patches could have been very damaging to the franchise.

Strictly speaking, they've still got a couple of big feature adds (leaderboards and matchmaking) to get up to where the game should have been at release.

 

[Scaff]

They could have stopped at patch 1.02 and moved on, promising to get it right on GT6 and they still would have sold 5 million copies of GT5 as well as sold GT6 like hot cakes. There are many games in the same state or worse released, haven't seen any put out release after release, for free, to do the drastic changes done like PD did. Do you know a game that has?

In addition to the ones already mentioned you can also add in MAG, SOCOM and BF:BC2 to the list as well.

All had a significant amount of content added to them (both free and chargeable) post release, and in all cases it continued for a good year after release.

SOCOM and GT5 are however similar in more ways that just post go-live support, in both cases a large amount of the post go-live support was to fix issues that should never have occurred in the first place.


Scaff

 

[Vaxxtx]

OFP had free content added (guns, vehicles and missions) for about 18 months if I remember right. More recently, X3TC (pretty much like the whole X series) had free content (ships, sectors, and "plots", as they call them) added for about two years.
And I won't even talk about the numerous PC games that are patched for fixes and improvements for about two years (generally until the next game in the series comes out).

Edit : Oh, and it's a good thing GT5 is patched. It's just the least PD can do.

A bit off topic, but I forgot about all the content they added to the X series. Besides just player mods, they have kept that series going for a looong time. I rememebr getting it in '05 and playing it on and off until last year. I just got the latest newletter from Egosoft with the even more new stuff added. I have to boot that one up again!

 

[slick1ru2]

In addition to the ones already mentioned you can also add in MAG, SOCOM and BF:BC2 to the list as well.

All had a significant amount of content added to them (both free and chargeable) post release, and in all cases it continued for a good year after release.

SOCOM and GT5 are however similar in more ways that just post go-live support, in both cases a large amount of the post go-live support was to fix issues that should never have occurred in the first place.


Scaff

Mag had DLC you paid for. The changes after release pretty much involved getting the game ready for the content you paid for. SOCOM? If you mean Confrontation, the patch that took a year to fix broken features and added a few small things from previous games, because Sony turned the game over to a company that had only done a PSP game before, is kinda like what PD has done, sorta. Slant Six decided not to release the important updates that would make the game easier to play and did a giant patch that took a year to code and test. Stupid. And I don't know of any totally new features. Like if they had put out the respawn version of the game like SOCOM 4 into that game, it would like what PD has done. PD was putting out patches monthly that sometimes added totally free things like Seasonal Events or racing uniforms or online car dealership. But SOCOM Confrontation didn't release any totally new things over that year did they? They just did a patch to fix what was broken. If PD had done only that, they would have stopped putting out patches 6 months ago. BFBC2 was different too. But they didn't release any totally new content. They released their full game, every map with every mode, in timed releases. They didn't put in totally new content. Its like ok, this map that initially was only Rush mode, this week we are releasing it in Conquest mode, kinda like PD saying this no weather map now has weather. Now if DICE had said, OK, we are introducing a totally new mode with entirely new equipment and maps... FOR FREE that would be more like what PD is doing. Also with BFBC2 you had to pay for those maps if you didn't have the Limited Edition or whatever it was called, those maps were if you paid for that extra Elite or Limited membership or bought the game at initial release. If BFBC2 Vietnam came out for free, sure, that would have been closer to what PD has done. But that was premium content.

I don't know about these other games mentioned. Releasing new models for a game for free is not what I am talking about. If you think if a game released new cars or guns or boats to be used in an existing game is the same as what PD is doing over the past year and foreseeable future, you missed the point. PD added major Changes and new features for free. Yeah and comparing a console game to a PC game doesn't really apply well either because you have games like Counter Strike, a community made mod that was picked up by the company and released. You don't see community based mods in console games. I would consider adding a new mission as the same as adding a new track to a racing game. Its not a totally new feature. Its more of the same with different surroundings. A new ship or car or gun is more of the same with a new piece of equipment, in the same game.


Regardless of all this. PD could have said, hey, Sony made us publish the game 2 years early, its on them, this is what you get. They could have patched some issues and moved to GT6. And the game would STILL sell 5 million copies (see below), it has that much of a following. And GT6 would have still been a best seller because it has that much of a following. They didn't have to add ANY new content or major features for over a year, they could have just fixed a couple of broken things and gone on to work on GT6. But as Kaz said in his holiday greetings this year, PD listens to its fans. And the game is still selling well a year later.

http://www.msxbox-world.com/features/article/913/gran-turismo-5-kills-forza-4-sales-but-why.html

Forza 4 first 8 weeks sales estimates:

Week 1 running total sales - 451,716
week 2 running total sales - 637,800
week 3 running total sales - 737,619
week 4 running total sales - 808,571
week 5 running total sales - 864,038
week 6 running total sales - 910,989
week 7 running total sales - 981,175
week 8 running total sales - 1,074,151

In comparison it took Forza 3 just five weeks to reach the 1 million mark. However, when compared to GT 5, the numbers are very different indeed.

GT 5 first 8 weeks sales estimates:

Week 1 running total sales - 1,916,892
week 2 running total sales - 2,504,635
week 3 running total sales - 3,037,386
week 4 running total sales - 3,526,765
week 5 running total sales - 3,988,649
week 6 running total sales - 4,234,395
week 7 running total sales - 4,373,785
week 8 running total sales - 4,471,137

=======================================================
Yes OLDSKOOLACURA the sound of the cars is good, its too good. Its like making all guns, including .22s sound like assault rifles. Its arcade like. Many, not all, of the cars in FM4 sound like a 70s muscle car or an Italian super car, no matter how many cylinders or what decade they are from.

========================================================


Thanks for the tip about finding cockpit view t.o.. I knew about the camera mode to the left, just not pushing A. You would think that would be a default mode.

 

[Luminis]

Regardless of all this. PD could have said, hey, Sony made us publish the game 2 years early, its on them, this is what you get. They could have patched some issues and moved to GT6. And the game would STILL sell 5 million copies (see below), it has that much of a following.

I won't even start to discuss the additional content, as PD still hasn't even included everything that was advertised on the back of the box. If you want to raise the question which companies support their games for over a year, I would like to raise the question which companies take more than a year after release to implement all the features that were advertised on the back of the game's box.

You keep acting as if PD is being generous. They're just fixing what they couldn't get done in time but still promised by printing it on the back of the box of their game. And they're not even done yet.

Also, yes, otherwise, you are right indeed: PD could slap a GT badge on a turd and it would probably still sell at least three million copies, or so.

Yes OLDSKOOLACURA the sound of the cars is good, its too good. Its like making all guns, including .22s sound like assault rifles. Its arcade like. Many, not all, of the cars in FM4 sound like a 70s muscle car or an Italian super car, no matter how many cylinders or what decade they are from.

And I suppose that's worse and more arcady than the vacuum cleaners that GT5 offers? I mean, that's not what you are trying to say, is it?

 

[Scaff]

Mag had DLC you paid for. The changes after release pretty much involved getting the game ready for the content you paid for.

Sorry but that's not right

http://mag.wikia.com/wiki/Downloadable_Content

SOCOM? If you mean Confrontation, the patch that took a year to fix broken features and added a few small things from previous games, because Sony turned the game over to a company that had only done a PSP game before, is kinda like what PD has done, sorta. Slant Six decided not to release the important updates that would make the game easier to play and did a giant patch that took a year to code and test. Stupid. And I don't know of any totally new features. Like if they had put out the respawn version of the game like SOCOM 4 into that game, it would like what PD has done. PD was putting out patches monthly that sometimes added totally free things like Seasonal Events or racing uniforms or online car dealership. But SOCOM Confrontation didn't release any totally new things over that year did they? They just did a patch to fix what was broken. If PD had done only that, they would have stopped putting out patches 6 months ago.

Once again no.

SOCOM got at a bare minimum three separate major patches (1.30, 1.50 and 1.60) and a few extra ones in-between, yes they were all mainly aimed at getting the game to the initially advertised functionality.

BFBC2 was different too. But they didn't release any totally new content. They released their full game, every map with every mode, in timed releases. They didn't put in totally new content. Its like ok, this map that initially was only Rush mode, this week we are releasing it in Conquest mode, kinda like PD saying this no weather map now has weather. Now if DICE had said, OK, we are introducing a totally new mode with entirely new equipment and maps... FOR FREE that would be more like what PD is doing. Also with BFBC2 you had to pay for those maps if you didn't have the Limited Edition or whatever it was called, those maps were if you paid for that extra Elite or Limited membership or bought the game at initial release. If BFBC2 Vietnam came out for free, sure, that would have been closer to what PD has done. But that was premium content.

Apart from the maps not being the same for each game mode or the content needing to be paid fo you might be close to having a point here (the VIP pass you got with a new copy of the game allowed all that content to be downloaded without charge).



So I maintain (along with Burnout) that GT5 is not alone in long term support of a title with a mix of free and paid for content.

Regardless of all this. PD could have said, hey, Sony made us publish the game 2 years early, its on them, this is what you get. They could have patched some issues and moved to GT6. And the game would STILL sell 5 million copies (see below), it has that much of a following. And GT6 would have still been a best seller because it has that much of a following. They didn't have to add ANY new content or major features for over a year, they could have just fixed a couple of broken things and gone on to work on GT6. But as Kaz said in his holiday greetings this year, PD listens to its fans. And the game is still selling well a year later.

http://www.msxbox-world.com/features/article/913/gran-turismo-5-kills-forza-4-sales-but-why.html

Forza 4 first 8 weeks sales estimates:

Week 1 running total sales - 451,716
week 2 running total sales - 637,800
week 3 running total sales - 737,619
week 4 running total sales - 808,571
week 5 running total sales - 864,038
week 6 running total sales - 910,989
week 7 running total sales - 981,175
week 8 running total sales - 1,074,151

In comparison it took Forza 3 just five weeks to reach the 1 million mark. However, when compared to GT 5, the numbers are very different indeed.

GT 5 first 8 weeks sales estimates:

Week 1 running total sales - 1,916,892
week 2 running total sales - 2,504,635
week 3 running total sales - 3,037,386
week 4 running total sales - 3,526,765
week 5 running total sales - 3,988,649
week 6 running total sales - 4,234,395
week 7 running total sales - 4,373,785
week 8 running total sales - 4,471,137


Thanks for the tip about finding cockpit view t.o.. I knew about the camera mode to the left, just not pushing A. You would think that would be a default mode.

Please for the love of God don't try and use sales figures to prove anything other that sales numbers, they never have and never will be an indicator of quality or developers support.


Scaff

 

[Wolfe]

PD was putting out patches monthly that sometimes added totally free things like Seasonal Events or racing uniforms or online car dealership...

...PD added major Changes and new features for free.

Was there anything else, or are those three things about it? I don't play/own GT5 so I don't know.

Yes OLDSKOOLACURA the sound of the cars is good, its too good. Its like making all guns, including .22s sound like assault rifles. Its arcade like. Many, not all, of the cars in FM4 sound like a 70s muscle car or an Italian super car, no matter how many cylinders or what decade they are from.

It's not the most realistic, but how can it be more "arcade-like" than GT5's no-effort synthesized wheezing?

I've been one to point out FM4's exaggeration of engine audio, because I think balanced criticism is important. But each engine layout sounds like it should, and most (if not all) of the engines have clearly been recorded because you can still distinguish different engines of the same type.

Sorry, but implying that most cars sound like a cross- or flat-plane V8 is a baseless Clarksonism. We are having fun with the vacuum cleaner jabs, but the sad thing is that it's not terribly far from the truth.

 

[slick1ru2]

Scaff, the only totally new Mag things you have to pay for.

Escalation

DLC Price: $9.99 USD

Release date: November 4, 2010.

Includes: Escalation (Game Mode), 3 new maps, 9 new guns, 3 new trophies, 4 new medals and 4 new ribbons.
InterdictionEdit

Main article: Interdiction

DLC Price: $4.99 USD

 

[Scaff]

Scaff, the only totally new Mag things you have to pay for.

The total free content from MAG:

Patch 1.06Edit

As of Patch 1.06, all download content that isn't a part of the Paid-DLC was made available for all players without the need for access to the PlayStation Store.


LegacyEdit

Below contains legacy information about the downloadable content before patch 1.06 was implemented.

This page contains a list of all of Zippers released download content for MAG and a description of what is in it.
Trooper PackEdit

The Trooper Pack was Zipper's first DLC pack for MAG. It was released to the PlayStation Store on March 25, 2010, however, it was not available until after your local PlayStation Store updated. In celebration of its release Zipper gave double experience points to all completed games from 1:00 AM PST March 25, 2010, to sometime March 28, 2010.
LMGEdit

The Trooper Pack released an updated version of the default LMG. They cost the same to equip as the default LMG and have slightly different colourways.

It provides these upgraded stats:

Valor: Slightly higher fire rate and stability
Raven: Slightly higher fire rate and stability

S.V.E.R.: Slightly higher fire rate and stability.

CamosEdit

There are two new camos trooper light, and trooper dark. Which resemble but are not entirely the same as 2 of each PMC already available Camo. List of the camos they resemble.
Trooper Light

Valor: Forest Camouflage
Raven: Monochrome 'Leaf' pattern camo
S.V.E.R.: Dust Camouflage

Trooper Dark

Valor: Urban Camos
Raven: Midnight Blue 'Leaf' pattern camo.
S.V.E.R.: Shadow Camouflage

FlashbangsEdit

Can otherwise be called flash grenades. A grenade thrown to flash/disorient all people in range, including teammates and the thrower. The length of the effect depends on the range the grenade hit the target.
Fast Attack PackEdit

Zipper Interactive released their new DLC on the 9th April. This DLC, named 'Fast Attack' includes 3 upgraded marksman rifles (1 for each PMC) and a new type of armour.
Marksman RiflesEdit

These rifles are upgraded variants of the 'Tier 1' sniper rifle. Along with a different colour scheme, each one has improved stopping power as well as a higher rate of fire, but comes at the cost of a bit of stability.

Valor: Higher Damage and Rate of Fire but less stability
SVER: Higher Damage and Rate of Fire but less stability
Raven: Higher Damage and Rate of Fire but less stability

ArmorEdit

Everybody also gets a new type of armor. Similar to the 'Enhanced Medium Armour', this armour is an improved version of the Light armor. It provides a little more protection without any speed reduction at all. It comes at the neat price of 400cc.

And aside from Racing suits and helmets what totally new content has GT5 had?

Seasonal events? Nope that's just the same cars and tracks in a different configuration (and how is that different from BF:BC2).

OCD? Nope that's just the same content presented in a different manner.

Yes GT5 has tweaked the physics, balancing and weather elements, but almost every game has physics and balancing patches these days.

The only 100% truly new content in GT5 that I can recall has come the way of paid for DLC.


Scaff

 

[slick1ru2]

This is what I mean. NO change from outside to inside in FM4

FM4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-uowcA8cyEI#t=441s

GT5

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-uowcA8cyEI#t=504s

The total free content from MAG:



And aside from Racing suits and helmets what totally new content has GT5 had?

Seasonal events? Nope that's just the same cars and tracks in a different configuration (and how is that different from BF:BC2).

OCD? Nope that's just the same content presented in a different manner.

Yes GT5 has tweaked the physics, balancing and weather elements, but almost every game has physics and balancing patches these days.

The only 100% truly new content in GT5 that I can recall has come the way of paid for DLC.


Scaff

A new gun or uniform is totally new content? Totally new? That is is like a new car. That isn't a new feature. The new features in Mag were premium DLC.

If you want to see all the added content for GT5, try here. https://www.gtplanet.net/

 

[Luminis]

This is what I mean. NO change from outside to inside in FM4

I think we all understood that from the get-go. There's just one little problem here: GT5's sounds are awful in both views, anyways. So, whether Forza's sounds change or not, it's still ahead of GT5's vacuum cleaner-esque sounds.

 

[Scaff]

A new gun or uniform is totally new content.

And that has been included in MAG updates.

See you have edited, so that's nice and easy...

http://mag.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_Updates

...how about adding in a total stat tracking server system and an entire economy to the game? Would that class as functionality enough for you to start with?

If you want to see all the added content for GT5, try here. https://www.gtplanet.net/

I joined GT Planet over eight years ago, I've over 10,000 posts on the site, wrote tuning guides for GT that cover over 120 pages and am also a Super Mod on GTP as well.

I'm more than aware of how to find content on the site and more than aware of what has and has not been included in GT5.


Scaff

Oh and please don't double post

 

[slick1ru2]

I think we all understood that from the get-go. There's just one little problem here: GT5's sounds are awful in both views, anyways. So, whether Forza's sounds change or not, it's still ahead of GT5's vacuum cleaner-esque sounds.

I have yet to hear transmission whine in FM4 either, have heard that in GT5.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-uowcA8cyEI#t=426s

And that has been included in MAG updates.



I joined GT Planet over eight years ago, I've over 10,000 posts on the site, wrote tuning guides for GT that cover over 120 pages and am also a Super Mod on GTP as well.

I'm more than aware of how to find content on the site and more than aware of what has and has not been included in GT5.


Scaff

Oh and please don't double post

You should tell your fellow writers on GT Planet to stop lying to us then. Start with Jordan, the site administrator. These are his words to describe 2.02, not mine. That is just from the past month, I am not going back a year, but that is not the first time I have seen those words used to describe updates to GT5 on GT Planet.

https://www.gtplanet.net/gran-turismo-5-update-2-02-brings-many-changes-available-now/

Major Changes and New Features

Wheels can now be changed on Standard cars.
Downloadable contents can now be shared by multiple users with the Family Upgrade.
(See Polyphony’s complete FAQ for more details.)
Cars purchased through DLC will now appear in the Car Dealerships. You can purchase additional versions of the same vehicles within the game using earned race credits.
A copy button has been added to the lower left of the settings screen. A settings sheet saved in either A/B/C can now be copied to A, B or C.

I've already note to Jordan about how some of the mods are anal about double posting. Please add a user delete function. I could have fixed my last accidental double post myself.

 

[Luminis]

I have yet to hear transmission whine in FM4 either, have heard that in GT5.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-uowcA8cyEI#t=426s

Now, try and tell me that GT5 matches this with a straiight face. The cars that do sound somewhat decent in GT5 can be counted on one hand, if that. The only car that I actually know of that sounds good is the 787B.

 

[slick1ru2]

Now, try and tell me that GT5 matches this with a straiight face. The cars that do sound somewhat decent in GT5 can be counted on one hand, if that. The only car that I actually know of that sounds good is the 787B.

Didn't say it matches it. What I am saying is that both are wrong. FM4 doesn't have transmission sounds or any change in in sound inside the cockpit. GT5 needs to make theirs sound more realistic. Neither are perfect. But since one can get some of it right, and the other get the rest of it right, both should be able to get it all right.

 

[Scaff]

Didn't say it matches it. What I am saying is that both are wrong. FM4 doesn't have transmission sounds or any change in in sound inside the cockpit. GT5 needs to make theirs sound more realistic. Neither are perfect. But since one can get some of it right, and the other get the rest of it right, both should be able to get it all right.

No one is claiming that FM4 is 100% accurate (so please stop suggesting that is the case).

What we are saying in that FM4 is a lot closer to that 100% right than GT5 is.


Scaff

 

[slick1ru2]

No one is claiming that FM4 is 100% accurate (so please stop suggesting that is the case).

What we are saying in that FM4 is a lot closer to that 100% right than GT5 is.


Scaff

Totally debatable. Passing car sounds in GT5 seem more real to me also, when in cockpit mode. I mean the sound of the car coming up behind and past you is very accurate in GT5, for what you hear, a car muffled slightly due to you being in your car, and direction and overall effect. Now, they seem to have added wind noise, at least on offline, that I have not noticed before. Does FM4 have wind noise?

 

[Luminis]

What we are saying in that FM4 is a lot closer to that 100% right than GT5 is.


Scaff

Precisely, and I don't know what's so hard to understand about that. Aside from intentionally avoiding that point, that is.

Totally debatable. Passing car sounds in GT5 seem more real to me also, when in cockpit mode. I mean the sound of the car coming up behind and past you is very accurate in GT5, for what you hear and direction and overall effect.

So, what about:

• Engine sounds
• Crash sounds
• Tyre squeal
• Supercharger and turbocharger whine
• Blow off valve sounds
• And even the audible feedback you get when putting a wheel off the track

And, well, personally, I'd consider the engine sounds to be the most important because, you know, you hear them all the time.

 

[slick1ru2]

Precisely, and I don't know what's so hard to understand about that. Aside from intentionally avoiding that point, that is.

So, what about:

• Engine sounds
• Crash sounds
• Tyre squal
• Supercharger and turbocharger whine
• Blow off valve sounds
• And even the audible feedback you get when putting a wheel off the track

And I don't understand why its so hard to understand that no one said either is 100% accurate, but its debatable on which is better because its not cut and dry at all.

And GT5 has:

Wind sounds, that go away while drafting and low speed.

Accurate passing sounds, muffled car engine you can tell is coming to your rear, side and past you

Transmission whine. Talk to anyone who races, that is much of what you hear in the car.

Change in muffler signature when the muffler is changed. No changes at all in FM4, huge ones in GT5

I can hear turbo chargers kicking in much better in GT5 than FM4. Don't know how realistic it is. If its not, I will just use the excuse people use for FM4. I can hear it clearer and louder, its better.

 

[Luminis]

If its not, I will just use the excuse people use for FM4. I can hear it clearer and louder, its better.

I think you are stilling missing the point (or intentionally missing it): Nobidy's saying that that makes FM4's sounds better. All we're saying is that despite that, GT5's sounds manage to be far worse. That's all.

This, for example:



No matter how much it changes upon entering the cockpit, it's plain wrong.

 

[slick1ru2]

I think you are stilling missing the point (or intentionally missing it): Nobidy's saying that that makes FM4's sounds better. All we're saying is that despite that, GT5's sounds manage to be far worse. That's all.

Are you a politician or a lawyer? We aren't saying that one is better, we are saying the other is worse? Considering that many race in cockpit mode, and if you watch racing the transmission is a large, huge percentage of what you normally hear in many cars, and one has that and the other doesn't how is that worse?

 

[UKMikey]

Because the engine sound is a larger percentage of what we listen to than the transmission sound, maybe? I dunno, everyone's entitled to their opinions but to me bugfixes =/= additional content. And I'm not sure how because a fairly accurate car sound is too loud this is somehow worse or even on a par with a game which sounds like someone hoovering a carpet badly.

 

[imported_FuzzyFassbender]

One thing FM is lacking..Monza. seriously..EVERY other console title has it

Yes, everyone has their favorites. I find Monza very boring so the exclusion is not an issue with me. I too would like to see Bathhurst - very challenging. Almost impossible to please everyone...

That's for sure.

In Forza, switching an Evo's stock exhaust to a race exhaust makes the car go from sounding like a stock Evo to a slightly louder stock Evo.

In GT, switching an Evo's stock exhaust to a race exhaust makes the car go from sounding like a Hoover to a slightly louder Dyson.

LOL!

 

[Wolfe]

Transmission whine. Talk to anyone who races, that is much of what you hear in the car.

The Race Transmission adds it. Like other things, it's muffled; I think it's only loud on "actual" racecars from the car list. Some cars have more prominent turbo noise; my 800hp R32 GT-R does for sure, but not my 850hp Supra RZ...who knows why. Wind noise is present but quiet. If you don't believe me, drive with "Manual w/Clutch" and coast at high speed -- it starts around 50mph. Messing around, I noticed Bernese Alps even has ambient wind whistle (VERY quiet).

We could go over several audio details that often get missed...

• Brake pad squeal on upgraded brakes (GT5 maybe, FM4 nope)
• Mazda RX car upshift beeper (GT5 maybe, FM4 nope)
• Noticeable and audible shift to VTEC on aggressive Hondas (FM4 does this actually, does GT5?)
• Valvetrain clatter at idle on cars that do it; authentic idle noises in general (FM4 seems hit-or-miss)

Every one of those was in Enthusia, and I'm pretty sure every single car got recorded. Some of the Subarus even produce a high-RPM whistle that comes from an imperfect fit on the intake filter box, not the turbo (I know because my Legacy does it), and the Mk.1 Prius features a pedestrian warning siren that activates when coasting at parking lot speeds (no joke).

However, on- and off-throttle differences were underpronounced in some cars, the engine audio was "flat" enough that most reviewers thought it was simply generic, and every turbocharged car got the same set of turbo noises, at the same volume.

The point is, no game is perfect. Both FM4 and GT5 have areas that could use improvement -- FM4 obviously needs to tone the engines down, which we've been saying all along. But most people would not consider them to be on equal footing. If you do, then the rest of us disagree.

 

[Scaff]

You should tell your fellow writers on GT Planet to stop lying to us then. Start with Jordan, the site administrator. These are his words to describe 2.02, not mine. That is just from the past month, I am not going back a year, but that is not the first time I have seen those words used to describe updates to GT5 on GT Planet.

https://www.gtplanet.net/gran-turismo-5-update-2-02-brings-many-changes-available-now/

The staff are allowed to disagree with each other you know.

It is however a straw man argument, given that the point up for debate was that no other games had been treated to as much post go-live support as GT5 has been, that has been countered by both Burnout and MAG at the very least.

Seriously are you going to flag wave for being able to change the wheels on standard cars a full year after the game came out as a major, game changing feature? You might, I don't and despite my status as a member of staff both here and on GT Planet, that is a position I am fully entitled to hold. Those are not mutually exclusive positions, but simply differences of opinions.

I've already note to Jordan about how some of the mods are anal about double posting. Please add a user delete function. I could have fixed my last accidental double post myself.

And you would certainly have been directed to this by Jordan then.....

“Double posting” occurs when a user makes two consecutive posts, one after another. If this is done for no apparent reason, or if the posts are unimportant, “double posting” is looked down upon and may result in a warning or infraction for “spam”. You can edit any of your forum posts on GTPlanet at any time, and this is generally the best option to take if you have more to add to the discussion. However, it is not expressly forbidden, and can be useful in many cases. For example, if a reasonable amount of time has passed or you have significant information to add to the topic, present it in a new post so that others, including thread subscribers, are made aware of the update.

Source - https://www.gtplanet.net/faq/#double_posting

And given that It was a polite request on my part I would strongly advice you park the attitude.


Scaff

 

[omgitsbees]

FM4 doesn't have transmission sounds or any change in in sound inside the cockpit.

Something is wrong with your sound system or T.V. if you believe this.

 

[Luminis]

Are you a politician or a lawyer? We aren't saying that one is better, we are saying the other is worse? Considering that many race in cockpit mode, and if you watch racing the transmission is a large, huge percentage of what you normally hear in many cars, and one has that and the other doesn't how is that worse?

I'm neither, but did you read what I wrote?

What I said was that Forza isn't better because it is louder in the cockpit than it should be, I said that it's better despite being louder in the cockpit than it should be.

Because, frankly, unmuffled car sounds > muffled vacuum cleaner sounds. Muffling a completely wrong sound doesn't make it any more fitting, does it?

 

[imported_FuzzyFassbender]

I can sum up my assessment of the sound debate like this... If I hear racing game sounds, without seeing or knowing what is producing those sounds, I can without a doubt tell when the sounds are coming from a PS3 running GT5. Those sounds (GT5) are very unique, and not in a good way. I'll take Shift 2, GTR2, GT Legends, Race On, rFactor, C.A.R.S., Dirt, Grid, Race On, Forza, and many others over GT5.

 

[t.o.]

I can sum up my assessment of the sound debate like this... If I hear racing game sounds, without seeing or knowing what is producing those sounds, I can without a doubt tell when the sounds are coming from a PS3 running GT5. Those sounds (GT5) are very unique, and not in a good way. I'll take Shift 2, GTR2, GT Legends, Race On, rFactor, C.A.R.S., Dirt, Grid, Race On, Forza, and many others over GT5.

What's sad is some sounds are so bad I'd take a sample of a kid going "VROOOM VROOOM" over some GT5 sounds.