McLaren
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Forza Motorsport 3
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Well, there is one thing that can't be simulated in a game: Fear.
No matter how much we want to talk about how close we can maybe get to actual lap times on any track with any car, you're always going to end up being faster because you aren't feeling the actual car, knowing that you're inches away from death, and have the looming specter of mechanical failure at any given time.
So, no. I wouldn't expect lap times to ever be the same.
Most games end up with lap times under real life equivalents otago. It's a combination of factors, the accuracy of the physics model being one of them. Some of the factors that affect lap times:
The big one: No fear of Instant Death. Others include:
-No need to drive the car within itself, avoid wear and tear etc.
-No simulation of dirty track, most games don't simulate debris etc on the road surface.
-Poor simulation of power degradation. This could be through drivetrain losses, air temperature effects, etc.
-Less than faithful recreation of the differences between static and dynamic coefficients of friction. Often for playability the difference between these two states is reduced, meaning you can ride the edge harder.
Most of the people I see matching lap times with real life are doing it by swapping tyres in and out.
All that said, it would be nice if people using mismatching lap times (Tiddy) to prove a point could provide the actual lap times their relying on. Not doubting, I'd just like to see how far out they are. I'm with Kamkor on this, as long as the laps are in the right ballpark and consistent between cars within the game, I'd rather they get the feel right.
The big one: No fear of Instant Death. Others include:
-No need to drive the car within itself, avoid wear and tear etc.
-No simulation of dirty track, most games don't simulate debris etc on the road surface.
-Poor simulation of power degradation. This could be through drivetrain losses, air temperature effects, etc.
-Less than faithful recreation of the differences between static and dynamic coefficients of friction. Often for playability the difference between these two states is reduced, meaning you can ride the edge harder.
Most of the people I see matching lap times with real life are doing it by swapping tyres in and out.
All that said, it would be nice if people using mismatching lap times (Tiddy) to prove a point could provide the actual lap times their relying on. Not doubting, I'd just like to see how far out they are. I'm with Kamkor on this, as long as the laps are in the right ballpark and consistent between cars within the game, I'd rather they get the feel right.
It's a problem of your statement.
First we have to consider who is driving.
Journalists form car magazines like Clarkson, Motortrtend and so on are just average daily drivers, they can't handle sport cars, they even afraid to unleash it on straight line. Sometimes pro racers are invited for tests, but they drive so relaxing on videos that I doubt you can count it as a best lap time.
Best Motoring is completely untrustable and besides this they are far from being really fast.
Second, and even more important - what was the start. Difference between still start and hot lapping on Laguna Seca can easily hit 10 seconds.
There are some Nurburgring lap times which can be taken into account (which have all information like was it full lap or the short one), but besides Nurburgring there are no really any lap times you can trust
McLaren
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Obviously, you haven't grasped that many car magazine writers are actually very good drivers. And when they set lap times, they do not "relax".
Keiichi Tsuchiya, Manabu Orido, & Juichi Wakisaka are totally slow drivers. Omg, how these guys became the "Drift King" or winner of the 2002 & 2006 Super GT is beyond me.
Your narrow-minded brain obviously hasn't grasped that magazines are the only folks who can give us legit lap times on multiple courses, and that multiple automotive magazines are putting their cars in the hands of professionals.
Easy now McLaren... don't be too harsh...
Otago, Mclaren is dead right here mate.
First, your average motoring journalist has more training and experience in a wide range of cars than most people can hope to accumulate in their lives. The sheer amount of time they spend driving a variety of cars is remarkable.
Second, every motoring publication that I read uses at least one active professional race driver in any car comparison or benchmarking. They're usually the one putting down the quoted lap time.
Otago, Mclaren is dead right here mate.
First, your average motoring journalist has more training and experience in a wide range of cars than most people can hope to accumulate in their lives. The sheer amount of time they spend driving a variety of cars is remarkable.
Second, every motoring publication that I read uses at least one active professional race driver in any car comparison or benchmarking. They're usually the one putting down the quoted lap time.
Keiichi Tsuchiya, Manabu Orido, & Juichi Wakisaka are totally slow drivers. Omg, how these guys became the "Drift King" or winner of the 2002 & 2006 Super GT is beyond me.
"Drift King" you said? LOL
BestMotoring best time on Tsukuba is about 10 seconds behind the record, which is around 55 sec. Cars are around same, highly tuned Skylines if I'm not mistaken
Besides this they have completely wrong cars order, biased to Japanese in enormous amount. Which means they drive all other except JDM cars like Porsche, Ferrari e.t.c hitting brakes more often than throttle
Reading car magazines is good. You should start reading them as well to get some idea about car journalists, magazines and tests which they perform.
There are some decent drivers between journalists like Horst von Saurma, Autobild (took part in one or two seasons driving WTCC BMW 320, though still can't match factory drivers times). EVO magazine guys looks like pretty good drivers as well.
Motortrend and J.Clarkson - sorry, compare to any pro racer they can't drive at all
McLaren
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And that has anything to do with what? Or are you still saying Keiichi is slow?
Oh look, you found some lap times!
Maybe while you were doing so, all the cars above lap record for a production car are highly modified.
Look at the excuses flow, full of nothing but un-informed spew.
The top 6 production lap times for Tsukuba have all been done by Best Motoring.
Drivers so bad, they can produce favortism by less than a second! And the bias, wow! 3 out of the 6 cars JDM! Man, these guys are totally unfair!
You're telling us to read magazines, yet you can only bring up Clarkson & Motor Trend. Clarkson doesn't set the lap times for Top Gear, & Motor Trend tells us who does their lap times.
I think it's you who needs to read magazines. It should go great with some cereal....
It doesn't explain why there is no any Best Motoring lap records for tuned cars if they drove plenty of them on same track as well
I remember one Motortrend article about Ford GT where the guy said he was afraid to put throttle to the ground on straight lines. Easy to understand, but still say nothing about real lap times.
And I don't think this invited guy really explore the limits:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAb-zh_BVdc
It looks more like highway driving than hitting the edge while fighting for the first place in race
Just for information:
2007 17th Annual Revspeed Super Battle at Tsukuba Circuit
* 1st place- #13 M-Speed R34 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 55.23sec, Top Speed: 227.282 km/h)
* 2nd place- #1 Garage HRS SUN Auto Cyber Evo CT9A Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution (Best Lap: 55.864sec, Top Speed: 220.678 km/h)
* 3rd place- #22 Pro-Staff R Magic FD3S Mazda RX-7 (Best Lap: 55.947sec, Top Speed: 217.742 km/h)
* 4th place- #12 Nagisa Auto R34 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 56.510sec, Top Speed: 227.082 km/h)
* 5th place- #16 Kurumakobou Decide R33 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 56.630sec, Top Speed: 233.615 km/h)
* 6th place- #14 Garage Kagotani R34 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 56.833sec, Top Speed: 227.416 km/h)
* 7th place- #31 Autobacs ASM Honda S2000 (Best Lap: 57.398sec, Top Speed: 188.055 km/h)
* 8th place- #18 Best Motor Sports R32 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 57.422sec, Top Speed: 220.994 km/h)
* 9th place- #15 Hosaka Tuning Factory R33 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 57.504sec, Top Speed: 224.346 km/h)
* 10th place- #17 Keiyo Jiko R32 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 57.658sec, Top Speed: N/A)
* 11th place- #3 Jun Automechanics CT9A Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution (Best Lap: 57.824sec, Top Speed: 211.640 km/h)
* 12th place- #19 Auto Gallery Yokohama R32 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 58.081sec, Top Speed: 223.881 km/h)
* 13th place- #21 Garage Ito R32 Nissan Skyline GT-R (Best Lap: 58.282sec, Top Speed: 216.650 km/h)
* 14th place- #5 Varis CP9N Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution (Best Lap: 58.456sec, Top Speed: 211.102 km/h)
* 15th place- #4 Stillway CT9A Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution (Best Lap: 58.484sec, Top Speed: 204.468 km/h)
Best Motoring never could hit 1 minute border
I didn't read any description and completely unaware how they drove Laguna Seca. All that I know is that lap time for Porsche GT3 in Laguna Seca races usually slightly under 1:30
Fujimi Kaido in 720p with screenshots:
http://www.gamersyde.com/news_forza_3_fujimi_kaido_officially_revealed-8549_en.html
I know everything. The best lap time of Best Motoring on Tsukuba was 1:01.15 with 500 HP Nissan Nismo R34 Z-Tune
Though I agree with you that all this lap times are very debatable from different points of view
http://www.gamersyde.com/news_forza_3_fujimi_kaido_officially_revealed-8549_en.html
I know everything. The best lap time of Best Motoring on Tsukuba was 1:01.15 with 500 HP Nissan Nismo R34 Z-Tune
Though I agree with you that all this lap times are very debatable from different points of view
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DEMO ONLINE NOW : DOWNLOAD VIA THIS LINK ( at time of posting the demo is not visible in most stores, US and Germany for example, but downloadable via this link ! )
demo is on now : Click here to download to your xbox360 !!!
demo is on now : Click here to download to your xbox360 !!!
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McLaren
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OK enough, we have a demo now so at least we can get a bit of objectivity if you really want to carry on comparing (I don't, but whatever floats your boat).
Something a little less subjective: F333 time on silverstone = 1:24.6 - the real life 2007 Peugeot 908 on a pole lap managed a 1:30.9.
Make of that what you want, you're arguing about a 2 year old game.
Joey D
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Holy crap that demo is huge! I'll have to get it when I get home as it's 7 in the morning here and I still do have to go to work at some point.
Oh and I'm super excited about checking out the JCW Cooper. I finally saw a screen shot of it and it looks pretty good, appears to have the rally lights and everything on it.
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Demo! But it's pretty freakin' huge - 1.25GB 
MagpieRacer
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Looking forward to chucking the California round Camino in the demo. Should be good, nice they gave us a race car too
Alsojust counted up the number of layouts on the ForzaCentral track list andI counted around 75 so there is still 40 more layouts to be confirmed.
Alsojust counted up the number of layouts on the ForzaCentral track list andI counted around 75 so there is still 40 more layouts to be confirmed.
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