Forza Motorsport 3

  • Thread starter RedOak
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tfujiwara


LOL, atleast their is some kind of consequence...
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You also wont have a certified lap if you cut corners. If your laps are not certified they will be lower on the leaderboards even if they have faster times. :sly:
I have been loving the F3 demo but never cared for the F2 demo at all.

So what are your drift scores so far?? I managed to get 12,000 with the Audi and the Ferrari.

If you dont know how to activate the drift scores just press LEFT on the D pad. It will keep track of points as you drift. Very similar to kudos in PGR. Not sure of my lap times without putting the F3 demo in again. Maybe 1:08 or 1:09 with the Audi? Not sure if that sounds right.
 
Jay
If the rims dig in or tyres fall into a rut/ditch at speed, then yes it will roll violently (as I said in my original post), but nothing in that video suggests that. Without a rut/ditch/mount of grass the tyres would have to roll (flex) so far plus a bump so the rim can contact the dirt, but on grass there simply isn't enough grip for tyres to flex that far.

Unless there is something in the grass we can't see.
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I see cars flip in grass without ruts in real races, and on TruTV in those craziest chases videos. In grass, on streets, you name it.
 
CAMAROBOY69
You also wont have a certified lap if you cut corners. If your laps are not certified they will be lower on the leaderboards even if they have faster times. :sly:
I have been loving the F3 demo but never cared for the F2 demo at all.

So what are your drift scores so far?? I managed to get 12,000 with the Audi and the Ferrari.

If you dont know how to activate the drift scores just press LEFT on the D pad. It will keep track of points as you drift. Very similar to kudos in PGR. Not sure of my lap times without putting the F3 demo in again. Maybe 1:08 or 1:09 with the Audi? Not sure if that sounds right.
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I havent played it yet nor PGR4. :ouch: I dont have Gold. I dont even want to play the demo. I never trusted demos. Just Waiting for the real thing. Its much more better for me.

edit; and their are lots of videos of people playing the demo on youtube. Just search for Forza 3(click search) then "Sort by:Newest". To see more.
for example: I just found this...
 
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phil-t
the weight transfer under acceleration/braking and track geometry seems very accurate
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What is all this weight transfer talks?

I drive fast enough in real life, sometimes too fast in my opinion, but I have no idea how you can feel weight transfer.

Sure you have more weight on certain wheel or wheels depending on corner type, but somehow the car is on the road, not on huge scales, and to be honest I have no idea what is the weight transfer at this particular moment, no clue.

I can guess based on G force, but can't feel
 
otago
What is all this weight transfer talks?

I drive fast enough in real life, sometimes too fast in my opinion, but I have no idea how you can feel weight transfer.

Sure you have more weight on certain wheel or wheels depending on corner type, but somehow the car is on the road, not on huge scales, and to be honest I have no idea what is the weight transfer at this particular moment, no clue.

I can guess based on G force, but can't feel
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Weight transfer refers to the effect of changing momentum and the relative support of weight on different areas of the car.

Example, heavy breaking shifts the weight of the car to the front, this loads up the front wheels and gives your front tires more traction. This allows them to turn where they might otherwise simply skid.

This also relieves the back end of weight making it easier for the rear wheels to lose grip.
 
otago
And how I supposed to feel this weight transfer seating inside the car?
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The same way you "feel" the acceleration, braking and cornering... you see visual cues that it's occuring and see reactions of the cars that are consistent with what weight transfer would do in those cirucmstances.

Example: Hard breaking left turn - you see the car compress the front right spring a lot, you develop oversteer and your back end gets squirly and slides out from under you.
 
Devedander
The same way you "feel" the acceleration, braking and cornering... you see visual cues that it's occuring and see reactions of the cars
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I don't drive SUV or track. My car has virtually zero body roll at any public road driving conditions so no visual clues
 
otago
I don't drive SUV or track. My car has virtually zero body roll at any public road driving conditions so no visual clues
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I don't get what you are asking... are you asking how to you determine that weight transfer is appropriate in the game, or are you asking me how would you actually feel weight transfer in real life?
 
The one thing that still kinda bothers me is how you really don't see that much body roll or weight transfer visually. For example, race the mini, and in the replay, change the car camera to the challenger up in front. Watch at how hard the car brakes and turns, but the car does not pitch and roll like how a 4000 lb (im guessing) car with a soft suspension setup should. You see the wheels bobbing up and down, but you do no the see that chassis lean and dip under hard braking and turning. It's weird. Im just talking visually, you feel the car do these things, but you don't see it the way you do in GT. Is it just me? What do you think.
 
Bogie 19th
I see cars flip in grass without ruts in real races, and on TruTV in those craziest chases videos. In grass, on streets, you name it.
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The tyres will have to be digging into the dirt for it to happen, wet soggy grass (muddy underlay) will do it, but not dry firm grass. For a car to roll something has to initiate it (on a Evo X atleast), flat dry grass (which is much more slippery than tarmac) isn't one of them.

If you have any videos of cars rolling in the same circumstance then please throw us a link. :)
 
That car should SLIDE not flip.. bit BS.. but i love it.. will it trun over on dry pavement where there is most friction?

Evos are made not to flip.. they are rally cars, they can slide on gravel, grass, snow, harsh conditions and wont flip unless you go really really fast and you hit a pot hole at those speeds.. the game over does it a bit.

Look how grass suppose to be very sloppery



And this guy is going SUPER high and still no flip, both pavement and grass and bumps.. no flip...





Evo X is not an SUV..
and that grass should be more slippery.
 
shawtyoner
The one thing that still kinda bothers me is how you really don't see that much body roll or weight transfer visually. For example, race the mini, and in the replay, change the car camera to the challenger up in front. Watch at how hard the car brakes and turns, but the car does not pitch and roll like how a 4000 lb (im guessing) car with a soft suspension setup should. You see the wheels bobbing up and down, but you do no the see that chassis lean and dip under hard braking and turning. It's weird. Im just talking visually, you feel the car do these things, but you don't see it the way you do in GT. Is it just me? What do you think.
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4000lb Mini? :lol: Its 2700lbs.
 
otago
I'm saying I'm not really sure how you can feel weight transfer in game or real life, so I'm asking what people mean saying "I feel weight transfer so much better in game X in comparison to game Y"
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Well in real life you feel it by... feeling it... basically when your weight shifts, the car is probably doinng the same. Slam on the brakes, and your body flys foward, the car is doing the same thing.

Every car with suspension has some body roll, so if you want to feel it, you may just have to pay more attention to it. It would probably be easier in an SUV or high truck.

As for in game, you don't feel it, but you see and experience the effects of it happening. For instance if you brake hard and your front tires bite more and you get oversteer, that's from weight transfer. If your car body rolls, it's from weight transfer.

Again, the same as you don't feel acceleration in a game, but you know it's happening, you don't feel weight transfer, but you can tell by the results when it's reasonably accurate.
 
Devedander
Every car with suspension has some body roll, so if you want to feel it, you may just have to pay more attention to it.
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If you push the car to extreme you will get some visible body roll, this is as far as you can get:

http://www.autoreview.ru/archive/2008/15/a5_335i_g37/pic/Perestavka/_A1V7073_1024.jpg

http://www.autoreview.ru/archive/2008/15/a5_335i_g37/pic/Perestavka/_MG_6592_1024.jpg

http://www.autoreview.ru/archive/2008/15/a5_335i_g37/pic/Perestavka/_A1V6352_1024.jpg

But on public roads you can't do it and body roll is near absent. Though I have a feeling that Forza still have a room for improvement, body roll in game looks like half of this BMW photo at best
 
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Body roll is a result of weight transfer and the point of your suspension, particularly the dampers, is to reduce the effect. Or "damp" it.

Unless the car is in constant motion, neither accelerating nor decelerating in any direction, the centre of mass (inertial mass) will be moving all the time. Yes, even on public roads under normal driving conditions.

Get a styrofoam/plastic cup, fill it with water, place it on your centre console and drive about. At the end of your journey, when it doesn't have any water left in it and is upside down in your passenger-side footwell, you'll have demonstrated weight transfer.


How do you detect it personally? By using specialised sensory organs called "equilibrioceptors" - your sense of balance - in your inner ear. They detect inertia. How do you detect it in games? Only with visual clues from how the body rolls, which is why games cannot simulate this accurately.
 
Jay
The tyres will have to be digging into the dirt for it to happen, wet soggy grass (muddy underlay) will do it, but not dry firm grass. For a car to roll something has to initiate it (on a Evo X atleast), flat dry grass (which is much more slippery than tarmac) isn't one of them.

If you have any videos of cars rolling in the same circumstance then please throw us a link. :)
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34th second http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m69P1wt5piw&feature=related

1:18 second: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXhtgX2ZG2Q

It's very doable on my local track, which makes going off very dangerous.

Ofcourse forza 3 doesn't simulate the surface being uneven visually etc. But that surface on forza 3 demo track doesn't look like perfect grass, so they do very good Approximation imo, and if you are unlucky enough, have enough speed, proper angle, then it will rollover. It also depends on a car in demo, mini is likely to rollover, evo too, but less. And in audi r8 or ferrari it's very hard. I haven't rolled those two like that actually.

And it's not like it will rollover you automatically, people actually try on those videos, it's not so easy.

Plus in my opinion it is a big step up, even if it's not showed properly visually (car digging into the road side etc).

otago
I'm saying I'm not really sure how you can feel weight transfer in game or real life, so I'm asking what people mean saying "I feel weight transfer so much better in game X in comparison to game Y"
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You must be able to "feel" it in rl, if you want to learn to drift in real life.
 
Devedander
Weight transfer refers to the effect of changing momentum and the relative support of weight on different areas of the car.

Example, heavy breaking shifts the weight of the car to the front, this loads up the front wheels and gives your front tires more traction. This allows them to turn where they might otherwise simply skid.

This also relieves the back end of weight making it easier for the rear wheels to lose grip.
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That is correct up to a certain point, you can't simply load more and more weight onto the front tyres and keep getting more and more grip.

You are correct that as load increases so does grip, however this has its limit, once reached then grip levels will decrease (often rapidly) and understeer will dominate the cars balance.

Getting a car to roll simply due to load transfer is actually very difficult, unless the car has a naturally very high COG to begin with (such as an SUV, Truck, etc); and is only likely to occur if roll shifts the COG and or the Roll centre to a point well outside the cars wheelbase area while remaining at a good distance from the ground.

Put simply this is vitually impossiable for any form of semi-performance car, and certainly not an Evo X.


Edited to add -

It looks like a bit of backtracking on the part of T10, I seem to recall that they claimed that the same level of detail would be used for the players car at all times in-game, now looks like that position is being 'revised'.

Source - http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=224399
(Don't read the comments if you value your sanity)


Scaff
 
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Ohhhhhhh dear.

Che Chou
That said, when I play FM3, I do not think about how awful the graphics are or low in-game car models, etc. simply because the overall effect is that the game looks good. Can it look better? Yes, totally and I agree it is not perfect.
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Che Chou
First of all, at Turn 10, we don't bullshot -- which means everything you see here is real-time taken from in-game gameplay ... Naturally, the game will actually look better by the time it comes out later this fall. The reason why you might have mistaken these screenshots as faked, touched-up, or embellished art is because Forza 3 is an exceedingly gorgeous game.

There's really no bigger graphics junkie than myself at Turn 10 and I'm constantly surprised by just how insanely next generation the game looks from a visual standpoint.

Likewise, with the gameplay video, everything was captured in-game with no faked CG whatsoever. At Turn 10, we don't do bullshots.
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And he wonders why people are "vitriolic"?
 
I can appreciate that some people are upset that Forza doesn't look like the promo shots, but I personally think that people have been a little naive to believe that it would.

GT5 released some shots recently showing the 370Z on Route246 from the cockpit cam, but these are also pulling the same trick as the Forza shots; using the replay footage to (mis)represent the game as looking slightly better than it does. The higher LOD, supersampling and extra AA makes quite a big difference.

Nonetheless, I personally think Forza3 looks good, not as good as GT5 which has more believable lighting, but in no way do I find that Forza's graphics ruin my enjoyment of the game. Until I went through a few forums, I wasn't even aware it was such an issue to people.
 
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/tg...torsport/56940

I just saw the detailed video about the Storefront and I simply cant wait to use this new feature. Now if I want to create a vinyl that everyone likes I can just put it in there instead of applying it to specific cars, then trying to arrange the time in the Auction House.
I know for sure I will be re-making the Gone in 60 Seconds Eleanor Tribute cars along with all my other creations. At first I wasnt going to, but this is a perfect way to sell them with very little hassle. 👍
You can also sell tuning setups in there. So cool!!
 
DrTrouserPlank
I can appreciate that some people are upset that Forza doesn't look like the promo shots, but I personally think that people have been a little naive to believe that it would.

GT5 released some shots recently showing the 370Z on Route246 from the cockpit cam, but these are also pulling the same trick as the Forza shots; using the replay footage to (mis)represent the game as looking slightly better than it does. The higher LOD, supersampling and extra AA makes quite a big difference.
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Most people would agree with this. But there's something of a difference when a developer outright states this:

Che Chou
we don't bullshot -- which means everything you see here is real-time taken from in-game gameplay
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Of course they weren't, which most of us knew all along. He still plain up and lied.
 
Otago, what car do you drive that magically has no weight shift as you take a turn? Everyday cars will roll all over when you take a turn spiritedly. My Civic doesn't nearly as much though, but you still feel the weight shift (and your own weight following it).

shawtyoner
Not the Mini bro, the green Challenger at the front of the grid.
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Oh, ha. Looks like I skimmed through that sentence. ;)
 
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