Gay Marriage

[Zrow]

Okay, Swift. Here's one for you.

If you don't think that people should be able to get married because they are homosexuals, do you support the freedom to practice other religions? Wouldn't that be you knowingly letting them go to hell? Isn't that your argument against gay marriage?

 

[HondaKid86]

This is not about oppressing people. It's about love. I love you too much to knowingly let you or anyone else go to hell. So I will do all in my power to help you to find God.

Would you make Christianity the official religion of America?

Would you force people to practice Christianity by law?

Please say yes, so I can more thoroughly and efficiently discount your twisted logic.

 

[HondaKid86]

If you don't think that people should be able to get married because they are homosexuals, do you support the freedom to practice other religions?

Exactly the point I was attempting to make.

Here's a tip, people: if someone insinuates that their religion is the only right religion, that they have an obligation to spread it to all mankind, and that all who fail to practice it are hellbound, you can probably write off just about everything they say between "hello" and "goodbye".

 

[Zrow]

Would you force people to practice Christianity by law?

This, right here, is what it effectively does. It forces religion onto people.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

My life, whatever it is, DOES NOT AFFECT YOUR MORALITY, unless we drag the butterfly back into it. BUT YOUR MORALITY AFFECTS MY LIFE.

How can my morality affect your life, but not the other way around? So your morality only affects you, but our morality affects everyone else. Just out of curiousity, does this have anything to do with "victimless crimes"?

This, right here, is what it effectively does. It forces religion onto people.

You don't have to be religious to think gay marriage should be illegal. I know plenty of atheists that think gay marriage should illegal.

 

[Swift]

Why don't people have the right to be gay? It's a free country.

Because it's not a basic right to life. But you know what. you guys are seriouisly amazing.

I mean, in the creation thread, I get slammed and plastered. Over here, I mention the word "sin" and everyone goes nutz.

Don't oppress me with your beliefs. Ha, right. With the Jim crow laws they were oppresive and didn't have anything to do with religion.

It's so funny. People want to change the way they live and then automatically demand acceptance from everyone. Man, that's a trip. If you're born black, white, asian or whatever. That doesn't matter, why? Because unless you're Micheal Jackson, you don't have a choice in your skin color. But you do choose to be gay. That's my issue. And I'm glad that there are some people in our gov't that realize it is NOT a victimless situation. I'm going to do some research and get back to this thread in a bit.

ZROW and Hondakid, No I wouldn't want christianity to be the "national" religion. Also, when I meet people in other religions, I do what I can to pursuade them to come to the truth.

I'm guessing you guys are gay. And you think I'm somekind of homophic guy that would beat a homosexual within an inch of his life. Well, nope. I'm not. Homosexuallity is wrong. But how can I help you get to heaven if I beat you up? doesn't really work. So, you can stop thinking that now.

 

[Zrow]

How can my morality affect your life, but not the other way around? So your morality only affects you, but our morality affects everyone else. Just out of curiousity, does this have anything to do with "victimless crimes"?

I'll tell you how: you are the one attempting to place restrictions based on your morality. He, on the other hand, is not.

 

[Duke]

you can probably write off just about everything they say between "hello" and "goodbye".

At this point, it would be everything between "hell..." and "OW! ****!" if some of them were within arm's reach. And I intensely dislike offensive violence. I think I need to leave this thread, too.

I tried, guys, but as you know better than I, some mountains are just too damn dense to move.

 

[Ten]

Our morality states that anyone is free to do anything they want, to the capacity that is does no one any harm or forces them to change their lifestyle.

Yours states that we're all going to hell and the government is right behind you telling us we can't do what you can do.

 

[Ten]

Because it's not a basic right to life..

SO NOW YOU WRITE THE THE LAWS OF THE UNIVERSE?

No, pal, YOU are seriously amazing.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

I'll tell you how: you are the one attempting to place restrictions based on your morality. He, on the other hand, is not.

Yes he is. He is restricting me based on his morality. You don't see it that way because you agree with him.

 

[Zrow]

Because it's not a basic right to life. But you know what. you guys are seriouisly amazing.

I mean, in the creation thread, I get slammed and plastered. Over here, I mention the word "sin" and everyone goes nutz.

Don't oppress me with your beliefs. Ha, right. With the Jim crow laws they were oppresive and didn't have anything to do with religion.

It's so funny. People want to change the way they live and then automatically demand acceptance from everyone. Man, that's a trip. If you're born black, white, asian or whatever. That doesn't matter, why? Because unless you're Micheal Jackson, you don't have a choice in your skin color. But you do choose to be gay. That's my issue. And I'm glad that there are some people in our gov't that realize it is NOT a victimless situation. I'm going to do some research and get back to this thread in a bit.

Sow what about people practicing other religions? I have a Jewish friend. According to you, she'll probably go to hell. She could choose not to follow the Jewish faith at any point.

Should her beliefs be legal?

 

[Zrow]

Yes he is. He is restricting me based on his morality. You don't see it that way because you agree with him.

He's not! He wants to remove restrictions! How is he restricting you?

 

[Duke]

How can my morality affect your life, but not the other way around?

It's incredibly simple. Follow closely.

Because MY morality PERMITS YOU to retain YOUR morality.

But YOUR morality FORCES ME to deny MY morality.

18 words. I even capitlaized the important ones to make them stronger.

 

[Sage]

So then ask yourself this, Sage. Why isn't the Libertarian party pushing HARD enough for gay marriage. Could it be that they're too busy removing restrictions on business?

Brian, you know that's a cheap shot. I shouldn't dignify it with a response, but I will:

1) We view Gay Marriage just as important as removing restrictions on businesses – both are violations of people's rights.
2) You don't hear about Libertarian activity because we have a 2-party system and a damn 2-party media – did you know that the Libertarian candidate for President was arrested a few weeks before the election, and not a single damn news station covered it? Every stupid mainstream media station in this nation is too far left or right to be objective and figure out what the hell's really happening.
3) Along the same lines, you hear about the Democrats pushing for gay marriage, because they're a much bigger party and get all of the friggin' media coverage.

There's no way you didn't already know all of this.

Anyway, it's a cheap shot because it's irrelevant to the actual issue of why government has this [expletive] law in the first place. Land of the free my ass.

 

[Swift]

SO NOW YOU WRITE THE THE LAWS OF THE UNIVERSE?

No, pal, YOU are seriously amazing.

Check yourself Ten. I know you a little bit. And you know that I'm not some homophobe. So stop actiing like it.

God wrote the laws of the universe. You know, the ones the scientists are still trying to figure out.

 

[HondaKid86]

Because it's not a basic right to life.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. The only full life for me involves being able to spend it with someone I love... in my situation, that happens to be a man. Liberty... the freedom to be gay without fear of oppression. The pursuit of happiness? Not having to live in denial or in secrecy.

Basic right to any meaningful life? You bet.

You DO NOT choose to be gay. I do NOT choose to be turned on by dudes instead of chicks. Dude, believe me, I do NOT choose that. If I could, I'd chooooooose to be turned on by a woman, so I could live a normal life with two and a half kids... thrill mom with a few grandchildren, maybe.

But alas, it's NOT a choice. Mr. Happy is only able to squirt dudes in the eye... he won't do it to chicks. It just WON'T happen. If you'll let me borrow your wife, I'd be glad to let her give it a whirl and get back to you with the results.

Until then, I'm not sure how my being gay has made you a "victim".

 

[MrktMkr1986]

He's not! He wants to remove restrictions! How is he restricting you?

Think about it. By telling me I have to do something or have to see something he is restricting me. You give freedom to one, you're restricting another.

Like Affirmative Action. Give freedom to the minorities, and take freedom from business... if you can't see that by giving freedom means taking freedom from someone else, you are intentionally ignoring it.

 

[Delirious]

is it possible for christians and homosexuals to not have conflict? can christians get along with homosexuals? i think this thread's title needs to be edited to Gay Marriage: The Christian's dispute

 

[Swift]

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. The only full life for me involves being able to spend it with someone I love... in my situation, that happens to be a man. Liberty... the freedom to be gay without fear of oppression. The pursuit of happiness? Not having to live in denial or in secrecy.

Basic right to any meaningful life? You bet.

You DO NOT choose to be gay. I do NOT choose to be turned on by dudes instead of chicks. Dude, believe me, I do NOT choose that. If I could, I'd chooooooose to be turned on by a woman, so I could live a normal life with two and a half kids... thrill mom with a few grandchildren, maybe.

But alas, it's NOT a choice. Mr. Happy is only able to squirt dudes in the eye... he won't do it to chicks. It just WON'T happen. If you'll let me borrow your wife, I'd be glad to let her give it a whirl and get back to you with the results.

Until then, I'm not sure how my being gay has made you a "victim".

LOL, well your first point would be under the "pursuit of happiness" not the "life" part. If you're going to use it as your discussion, do us all a favor and accurately convey your ideals.

And yeah, you did choose it. not sure when you did, but you did.

Also, that was a rather vulgar description. And since I have a fiancee', that's the only thing I've found personally offensive.

 

[Zrow]

Think about it. By telling me I have to do something or have to see something he is restricting me. You give freedom to one, you're restricting another.

Like Affirmative Action. Give freedom to the minorities, and take freedom from business... if you can't see that by giving freedom means taking freedom from someone else, you are intentionally ignoring it.

No... he's not telling you that you have to do anything. What is he telling you you have to do?

 

[MrktMkr1986]

No... he's not telling you that you have to do anything. What is he telling you you have to do?

Keep thinking.

 

[Sage]

Because it's not a basic right to life.

You said it again. I'm in utter shock, seriously. Why don't you tell me I don't have the right to be an atheist? Same difference at this point.

I mean, in the creation thread, I get slammed and plastered. Over here, I mention the word "sin" and everyone goes nutz.

NO!, don't you get it yet?! I could care less if you believe it's a sin – I care that you think the government should be guided by religion.

I'm guessing you guys are gay.

Ten and HondaKid are, which makes it even more amazing to me that you'd say what you're saying. You're saying that the government has the right to strip them of their rights because they like men instead of women. Unbelievable.

 

[HondaKid86]

Check yourself Ten. I know you a little bit. And you know that I'm not some homophobe. So stop actiing like it.

You're not a homophobe? LOL!

For what it's worth, you're so repulsive and backwards that I hope reading the phrase "Mr. Happy will squirt dudes in the eye" made you cringe.

From what I know about people that insist homosexuality is a choice, though, they're really just covering for their deeply-rooted desires.

After all, if you're so sure that a person has to choose to be gay or straight, that's probably a choice you've consciously made yourself -- isn't it?

That's okay, you don't have to answer truthfully -- the trial lies in your own conscience.

P.S. Yup, that's right... SQUIRT! In the eye.

 

[Zrow]

Keep thinking.

I give up. What's the answer?

 

[Delirious]

one more time people...the basic christian philosophy for most christians (excluding fanatics...and i think i can say swift and brian are not fanatics...and God help me if im a fanatic)

hate the sin, not the sinner
hate the homosexuality, not the homosexual

 

[Swift]

You're not a homophobe? LOL!

For what it's worth, you're so repulsive and backwards that I hope reading the phrase "Mr. Happy will squirt dudes in the eye" made you cringe.

From what I know about people that insist homosexuality is a choice, though, they're really just covering for their deeply-rooted desires.

After all, if you're so sure that a person has to choose to be gay or straight, that's probably a choice you've consciously made yourself -- isn't it?

That's okay, you don't have to answer truthfully -- the trial lies in your own conscience.

P.S. Yup, that's right... SQUIRT! In the eye.

Nice try my friend. And the sad part is that I DON'T find you repulsive. Confused, but not repulsive. Again, when have I ever said that I hate you or anything like that. Haven't done it.

About the conscience thing. That comes from two sources. the word of God and people that I know that chose to be gay. So, go ahead and work on that one for a while.

one more time people...the basic christian philosophy for most christians (excluding fanatics...and i think i can say swift and brian are not fanatics...and God help me if im a fanatic)

hate the sin, not the sinner
hate the homosexuality, not the homosexual

Yep, and that's what all these guys refuse to see.

 

[Duke]

Think about it. By telling me I have to do something or have to see something he is restricting me. You give freedom to one, you're restricting another.

Like Affirmative Action. Give freedom to the minorities, and take freedom from business... if you can't see that by giving freedom means taking freedom from someone else, you are intentionally ignoring it.

Brian - address this point:

MY morality PERMITS YOU to retain YOUR morality.

But YOUR morality FORCES ME to deny MY morality.

 

[Zrow]

Nice try my friend. And the sad part is that I DON'T find you repulsive. Confused, but not repulsive. Again, when have I ever said that I hate you or anything like that. Haven't done it.

About the conscience thing. That comes from two sources. the word of God and people that I know that chose to be gay. So, go ahead and work on that one for a while.

Swift: how are you on the separation of church and state?

 

[HondaKid86]

I offended you, eh? Well, for what it's worth, it was cheap talk -- I wouldn't let your wife pants me. Boobies kinda freak me out. Aside from that, even if she came back to you and told you that she did a hell of a number on me -- gave me all she had -- and that Mr. Happy didn't even twitch, you probably would STILL believe that being gay was a choice I consciously made.

Ya like this? The vulgar HK? So different from when I was 12, huh, oldbies? Well, the idealist-pacifist in me has died out. You want straight talk from the gay man? You've got it.