Give us better sounds - PLEASE !!

[PepeMickey]

What I don't get is the "I'm not buying GT6 because of the sounds"... Does it matter that much? GT has never had realistic sounds, neither has Forza, they just sound, as Kazunori-San said "Sexier" and that's what people want. It's hardly a deal breaker like people are making out though.

It does matter that much to me but at the same time I'm not asking for perfection because it doesn't exist but to pretend that GT sounds are average or irrelevant is impossible to me, I just want GT to sound at least like everyone else, heck I just want PD to TRY for once.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Sounds are one of the core elements in the game and I'd be underexaggerating, if such a thing is possible, to say there is room for improvement. The sounds on most cars are not realistic and even those that sound ok, lack all the depth and character that goes along with motors running up and down through the gears on a racetrack. If I were in Kaz's shoes, this would be one of my top priorities at least for the iconic cars like the Yellowbirds, 74' Countach and a few dozen others, along with all the premiums and every new car to enter the series from now on. Apparently it's not a priority, which is disappointing, although there is always hope for GT6!!

 

[CorvetteConquer]

KY gets involved in so many other projects, that certain areas of PD's department are less emphasized: A.I., sound, etc. This can be proven in GT5's credits. There are simply very few people working in these areas.

And that's where all the frustration comes from, in my opinion; It comes from years of ignoring certain features while KY embarks on new missions. It's like a kid that just can't focus on one task...we know what we want (as gamers), but KY seems to want his own ideas and has his own visions for his own series.

 

[KWZX10]

There really someone out there that love cars and doesn't care for the sound of them? You know the answer.
It's a huge part of the experience and gt lacks on it, it's not about opinions here.

 

[R5]

There really someone out there that love cars and doesn't care for the sound of them? You know the answer.
It's a huge part of the experience and gt lacks on it, it's not about opinions here.

All I'm saying is it shouldn't be too much of an off put, I feel many are over exaggerating. I mean, the cars look great and there seem to be massive leaps forward from 5 to 6, but because of the sound, you won't buy it...? I see it as slightly pathetic to be honest, yes it's a part of the experience, and Kaz has admitted there is a problem. Anyway, lets just see from the demo, make your decisions and please, for the love of Glob, don't go into a decade long rant on how they're not as you wanted them...

 

[KWZX10]

All I'm saying is it shouldn't be too much of an off put, I feel many are over exaggerating. I mean, the cars look great and there seem to be massive leaps forward from 5 to 6, but because of the sound, you won't buy it...? I see it as slightly pathetic to be honest, yes it's a part of the experience, and Kaz has admitted there is a problem. Anyway, lets just see from the demo, make your decisions and please, for the love of Glob, don't go into a decade long rant on how they're not as you wanted them...

No no i'm not one of those who says that will not buy the game because of that problem, don't get me wrong, but i think it's a pity to have beautiful modeled cars with generic and ''boring'' sound, with a decent improvement on that side the game could be WAY better indeed, and the fact that we still play even if we know about this problem can't be an excuse for pd to continue on ignoring it.
We'll see in the demo, sure, i'm not expecting too much, and if they are still the way they are they absolutely HAVE to work on it for the next title.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The word I tried to spell...I could see that it was not right, but later it came to me the correct one will be "equation" - no l in it...(So Your è wrong too)

But the sound...I have nothing against PD to improve engine sound, BUT if they throw a lot of money in the "sound team" guys, and thereby can`t afford to solve other, according to me, way way way more important things, then it`s a pity....I find my "equation" serves well to pinpoint what I mean...

I was actually trying to help you out on the word...not make you seem stupid.

...trust me money isn't the issue heres they can afford sound and still have plenty for other aspects. Not sure why you think they are som rag tag group barely holding on.

 

[CoolColJ]

It varies, some of the sounds are not that bad
not too Dyson like

 

[CoolColJ]

I'm not sure that's entirely helpful.

The M5's sound, from the interior, is saturated with intake noise - this is true of many cars, but BMW / M-division seem to really like a bit of intake noise (as do I, and it seems to be the thing that's puts the fire in the belly of many M-car proponents).

Now, I shan't go into too much detail, but because of the unique firing order of the S85 (among production automotive V10s), the intake sound is pretty unique, and is very lumpy. This forms quite the contrast with the exhaust note.
An R8 V10, by comparison, sounds like it's gargling hammers because the firing order is more "balanced" (in terms of pulse spacing) against the intake configuration, so the lumpiness doesn't fall out as easily.

Because both engines are uneven firing (common crank pins, 90° bank angles), you get pairs of cylinders on each crank pin firing at intervals of 90°-630° (instead of 72°-648°, as in the LFA or original 5.0 Gallardo). This is the same as most cross-plane V8s (although one pair is 270°-450° in that case). So, on the intake side, it should sound like a US V8. A cursory glance at YouTube for all the cars I mentioned should be satisfactory, and you'd be doing well if you could distinguish between the intake note of the V10 R8 from that of the V8.

Gran Turismo has rarely (possibly only accidentally) ever included intake sound. PGR4 is the more realistic, in terms of interior sound. Unfortunately, its approach is probably infeasible for GT6.

EDIT: M5 with unsilenced intakes - sounds a lot like a V8.

Interestingly enough, I was behind a M5 with a loud exhaust yesterday on the way back home
And the guy was giving it some stick on every traffic light launch, and it sounds quite strange. Quite a warbley lumpy sound, shades of Subaru flat four throb mixed in with low pitched wail of a Dodge Viper perhaps

Didn't sound like that video

 

[light driver]

Interestingly enough, I was behind a M5 with a loud exhaust yesterday on the way back home
And the guy was giving it some stick on every traffic light launch, and it sounds quite strange. Quite a warbley lumpy sound, shades of Subaru flat four throb mixed in with low pitched wail of a Dodge Viper perhaps

Didn't sound like that video

In other words: It sounded excactly like a....Vacuumcleaner???

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

It varies, some of the sounds are not that bad
not too Dyson like

Why does the V8 sound seem to become a rotary engine noise when the camera shifts off into the distance or around corners? It's as if the angle of the car or replay distorts the sound and you get the high pitched blender, vacuum like sound.

 

[fifomaniak]

That's called Doppler effect. From front there should be more intake sound, but that's the thing GT5 lacks. Exhaust sounds aren't bad in most cases (well, at least stock ones).

 

[CoolColJ]

In other words: It sounded excactly like a....Vacuumcleaner???

This sounds a little like it, that warble, gargling and lumpiness, just at higher revs than what I heard

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

That's called Doppler effect. From front there should be more intake sound, but that's the thing GT5 lacks. Exhaust sounds aren't bad in most cases (well, at least stock ones).

Thanks for the help 👍

I'm not a big sound technical guy and know any terms.

 

[diegorborges]

Please delete.

 

[diegorborges]

That's called Doppler effect. From front there should be more intake sound, but that's the thing GT5 lacks. Exhaust sounds aren't bad in most cases (well, at least stock ones).

Spot on. I think intake sounds are what GT needs most too...

Another example that some proper mixing may get better results: The user Dibbz @ NeoGAF did this video, mixing exterior and interior sounds... it's already better... just add intake noise and it would be miles better than what we have now IMHO.




And just for fun... they got vacuum cleaners too! LOL The game looks cool anyway.

 

[Flaco13]

 

[Griffith500]

Why does the V8 sound seem to become a rotary engine noise when the camera shifts off into the distance or around corners? It's as if the angle of the car or replay distorts the sound and you get the high pitched blender, vacuum like sound.

That's called Doppler effect. From front there should be more intake sound, but that's the thing GT5 lacks. Exhaust sounds aren't bad in most cases (well, at least stock ones).

I think it's the separate "engine" samples that play from wherever the engine is. It should also contain, in most cases, intake (variably mixed according to throttle position), but GT doesn't have intake sounds. That's a secondary point I was making with the BMW vids I posted before, intake sound is its own distinct source that should be modeled as such, assuming you remember to include it in the first place... (I think the mistake has just been carried forward, for the most part, as we know they've recorded at least a few cars "properly", but the samples still don't sound right - I guess they're going for consistency? "Standard" sounds all around!)

When the car approaches, the "engine" sound dominates - it's all mechanical and swishy, like it would be if you recorded close to the engine block.
As it departs, the exhaust comes in. Doppler is playing its part, too, but all Doppler does is a straight pitch shift, it cannot change the timbre.

Interestingly enough, I was behind a M5 with a loud exhaust yesterday on the way back home
And the guy was giving it some stick on every traffic light launch, and it sounds quite strange. Quite a warbley lumpy sound, shades of Subaru flat four throb mixed in with low pitched wail of a Dodge Viper perhaps

Didn't sound like that video

This sounds a little like it, that warble, gargling and lumpiness, just at higher revs than what I heard
www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOwk--G-EVk

The stock car has more intake noise than exhaust (typical pre-turbo BMW M), the ones I linked to had modified intakes, so they were louder. That one you posted has an open exhaust instead, so of course the focus is different.

Note that, at full throttle, especially at high revs, it's fairly smooth sounding (the exhaust is almost equal length), but at lower speeds and part throttle, that "lumpiness" comes in. There's a complicated set of reasons for that, and part of it is that, somehow, the intake configuration stamps its signature sound onto the exhaust - that lumpiness is effectively the same texture as the intake. A Viper typically has unequal length exhausts, so a certain amount of lumpiness is inherent at any engine speed, but still more so off-throttle (it also has a different firing order).

Additionally, the wave shapes coming out either end of the engine are very different (compression- vs. expansion waves, for starters), and the exhaust structure itself adds a lot of extra noise as it vibrates in sympathy (as does the intake, but there's generally less of it).


Those Miuras further emphasise the point. The carburettors are the dominant sound in the interior, but GT doesn't have intake sounds. Forza 4 does tend to accentuate the intake in its mix, except that it does so regardless of the viewing position.

 

[PepeMickey]

^^ What Griffith500 said...I think intake sound in GT would make 90% of the complaints go away.

 

[R.S]

This is V8 supercars in iRacing. Sounds exactly as real, like a racing car - not a lifeless plastic video game.
One of the biggest selling racing games ever should have quality like this, anything less is stupidity and laziness.

Turn up your speakers!

 

[PepeMickey]

This is V8 supercars in iRacing. Sounds exactly as real, like a racing car - not a lifeless plastic video game.
One of the biggest selling racing games ever should have quality like this, anything less is stupidity and laziness.

Turn up your speakers!
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhot0PAiyYw">YouTube Link</a>

There's a reason why GT is such a success and that is because it's cheap and accesible. Yes an improvement is a must but you can't really ask for top of the line features because that just wouldn't work with a 60 dollars price tag. The profit they make from their games is irrelevant if they still need to abide by the rules of being a console franchise.

Perhaps paying more for a top of the line Gran Turismo is acceptable for us but it isn't for the casuals and other developers, it wouldn't look good. Soon enough you would have other developers trying to push the price limit arguing that their work is far more valuable than others and such.

In the end, if you are looking for the best that technology can offer look elsewhere, consoles are meant to be accesible so don't expect GT to be at the same level as PC simulators, at least not now.

 

[Johnnypenso]

This is V8 supercars in iRacing. Sounds exactly as real, like a racing car - not a lifeless plastic video game.
One of the biggest selling racing games ever should have quality like this, anything less is stupidity and laziness.

Turn up your speakers!

Can't imagine it sounding much better than that:tup:👍

 

[R.S]

There's a reason why GT is such a success and that is because it's cheap and accesible. Yes an improvement is a must but you can't really ask for top of the line features because that just wouldn't work with a 60 dollars price tag.

GT5 sells 10 million, iRacing sells 40 thousand. Money is not an issue, it's about taste, effort and development targets. It's not all much more complex it's just a different style, GT5 sounds are completely lifeless by design.
Even NFSU2 did better IMO (bar the overdone blowoff sounds)

There is no excuse for poor lifeless sound, sound is cheap (processor wise).

Someone should put that iRacing V8's on Kaz's twitter.

 

[R5]

Someone should put that iRacing V8's on Kaz's twitter.

He's not been active in a while. Think he might be #BoredOfIt. (Sorry. Had to)

 

[CoolColJ]

iRacing's supercar V8 doesn't quite have enough bass even then, the real things are thunderous!
It must be due the mic used to capture the sound. Something all devs should compensate for...

And that's something running on dyno vs real load on track is also different again

 

[Raitziger]

Every car guy can very easily recognize different engine types from games like PGR, Forza, and NFS. But with GT series they have trouble doing this. It is not about how well and real technically sounds have been made but end result with GT is very bad. Even very minor titles like Driv3r san andreas has better sounds than game that calls itself the ultimate driving simulator. More pressure from press is needed to point out this major short coming of the game!

 

[humpus]

There's a reason why GT is such a success and that is because it's cheap and accesible. Yes an improvement is a must but you can't really ask for top of the line features because that just wouldn't work with a 60 dollars price tag.

I can't believe the means some people are going through to defend or justify the crappy sounds of the GT series. PD recorded the sound for almost every car, they were just doing it wrong. With the same amount of time, they could have recorded proper sounds. The cars were not recorded under load and that is why we are stuck with vacuum cleaner sounds.

If any GT game were a PC title, a small team of modders could have improved half the sounds (some cars are too exclusive to find) in less than a year. Without any expensive resources.

 

[Nattefrost]

There's a reason why GT is such a success and that is because it's cheap and accesible. Yes an improvement is a must but you can't really ask for top of the line features because that just wouldn't work with a 60 dollars price tag. The profit they make from their games is irrelevant if they still need to abide by the rules of being a console franchise.

Perhaps paying more for a top of the line Gran Turismo is acceptable for us but it isn't for the casuals and other developers, it wouldn't look good. Soon enough you would have other developers trying to push the price limit arguing that their work is far more valuable than others and such.

In the end, if you are looking for the best that technology can offer look elsewhere, consoles are meant to be accesible so don't expect GT to be at the same level as PC simulators, at least not now.

What an absurd post. Gran Turismo is one of the biggest franchises out there and we can't expect it to be at the same level as PC simulators that cost the same amount of money, sell less and are developed with far less resources? All while GT is calling itself the real driving simulator and Kaz claims he wants his game to reflect real life driving? There are simply no excuses for this. And if anyone wants to use the car count as an argument for why they can't get accurate sounds on all cars, then the answer is they shouldn't include that many cars. Get the base quality right first, then increase the numbers.

 

[Samus]

There's a reason why GT is such a success and that is because it's cheap and accesible. Yes an improvement is a must but you can't really ask for top of the line features because that just wouldn't work with a 60 dollars price tag. The profit they make from their games is irrelevant if they still need to abide by the rules of being a console franchise.

Cheap? GT5 had a budget of 60 million dollars+. Most developers can only dream of a budget that size.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Cheap? GT5 had a budget of 60 million dollars+. Most developers can only dream of a budget that size.