Give us better sounds - PLEASE !!

[Johnnypenso]

pCARS and iRacing have superior sound samples. Which is but one element of the total sound, although most people are used to the colour of the accompanying stuff that they don't really notice it. Or their brains filter it out, fill in the gaps etc. It comes back to that moving pictures analogy, and how motion-blurred 24 Hz film doesn't actually look like reality (linear medium, though, so the comparison is superficial, in that interactive stuff is vastly more complex and difficult to make life-like).

It's always budget with you, isn't it?
To be somewhat less than humble, I've made "innovations" (the work has already been done if you know where to look) on practically no budget that most professional teams would never even be allowed to think about. The issue is attitude and approach (from the top), not money. Time could be better spent on a different approach.
It's interesting that the game that showed me where game sounds might be able to go is one that had no money for real engine sounds, so it made its own - they're not hi-fi, but the principles it uses are sound.

Budget makes the world go around my friend, but in this case I used the budget to highlight the fact that working on sounds just isn't a priority for PD. There is no technical hurdle to overcome, the money is obviously there to get the job done, the technical expertise is always available for the right price. All that is left is making the choice to do it, and PD has chosen not to. If PCars had said, "sorry blokes, we just don't have the money to do everything this time around, so we will focus on physics and graphics, sounds and customization will take a backseat", that's something I can live with. New game, no idea how well it will do, go for the biggest bang for the buck and hope it's good enough to generate some dough.

PD doesn't have that excuse.

 

[LeMansAid]

Budget makes the world go around my friend....

For me the issue is not necessarily budget or priorities. A company has a choice of hiring either audio competents, or audio visionaries. I am pretty sure that some of the things that Griffith is writing about would be achieved only by the visionary type. It's not just a matter of coughing up the dough. Visionaries come with risks though.

My brother is an elite audio editor and engineer. Together we have come up with a few processes, and one in particular, that I would never talk openly about but is completely revolutionary (nothing to do with broom brooms though). However, I am not sure that it would make sense to hire him/us to do audio for GT7 for example. A lot of times visionaries do a whole lot of thinking, and not so much doing. The risk may be too high, at least to put all one's eggs in that basket.

I would love to see the synthesis approach come to fruition, as it would be a complete game changer (literally). At the moment it seems that what we have in games is largely the same approach, with some games producing frequencies that get people's motors running so to speak. While some games, not so much. It's a very base level satiation thing though.

On a side note: A novel way to make GT5's sounds more impressive is to periodically play Test Drive on the C64.

 

[Golfman2]

GTs car sounds have always been terrible. Fact.

 

[Terronium-12]

Stop jumping from thread to thread posting nonsensical flamebait.

You're already close to being banned as it is. Fact.

 

[Golfman2]

Stop jumping from thread to thread posting nonsensical flamebait.

You're already close to being banned as it is. Fact.

Oops. Sorry i thought a forum is where you were allowed to post your views and opinions. Guess i didnt realise this was a 'dont upset GT fanboys' forum. Ah well....

 

[Chippy569]

Oops. Sorry i thought a forum is where you were allowed to post your views and opinions. Guess i didnt realise this was a 'dont upset GT fanboys' forum. Ah well....

GTs car sounds have always been terrible. Fact.

 

[Terronium-12]

Chippy... just don't even.

 

[TokoTurismo]

GTs car sounds have always been terrible. My opinion.

Fixed. That's YOUR opinion, not a fact. So don't act as if it is a fact because its not. 👎

 

[Griffith500]

Budget makes the world go around my friend, but in this case I used the budget to highlight the fact that working on sounds just isn't a priority for PD. There is no technical hurdle to overcome, the money is obviously there to get the job done, the technical expertise is always available for the right price. All that is left is making the choice to do it, and PD has chosen not to. If PCars had said, "sorry blokes, we just don't have the money to do everything this time around, so we will focus on physics and graphics, sounds and customization will take a backseat", that's something I can live with. New game, no idea how well it will do, go for the biggest bang for the buck and hope it's good enough to generate some dough.

PD doesn't have that excuse.

Sounds are a priority for PD right now. There is a huge technical hurdle to overcome that every other developer has been avoiding for 5 if not 10 years. You don't know that because you don't know what you're talking about - sorry to be harsh, but it's the truth. You should at least be able to admit that you don't know the full extent of the possibility space when it comes to sound synthesis (that's only what we have in games, it's not real sound, it's resynthesised in some way - even samples), and therefore shouldn't be making generalisations about it.

pCARS is derived from Shift 2; it's not really "new", which in the case of sound is probably half their problem! Sometimes it's easier to start from a clean slate.

This comes down to "good enough" or "should be better" for the industry as a whole. You speak of budget, but a budget is just a forecast, an extrapolation of current conditions, so you should always be careful when sticking with what's "good enough", it could catch you out just the same as pushing the boat out might.

Also, please don't abuse "blokes" like that again!

For me the issue is not necessarily budget or priorities. A company has a choice of hiring either audio competents, or audio visionaries. I am pretty sure that some of the things that Griffith is writing about would be achieved only by the visionary type. It's not just a matter of coughing up the dough. Visionaries come with risks though.

My brother is an elite audio editor and engineer. Together we have come up with a few processes, and one in particular, that I would never talk openly about but is completely revolutionary (nothing to do with broom brooms though). However, I am not sure that it would make sense to hire him/us to do audio for GT7 for example. A lot of times visionaries do a whole lot of thinking, and not so much doing. The risk may be too high, at least to put all one's eggs in that basket.

I would love to see the synthesis approach come to fruition, as it would be a complete game changer (literally). At the moment it seems that what we have in games is largely the same approach, with some games producing frequencies that get people's motors running so to speak. While some games, not so much. It's a very base level satiation thing though.

On a side note: A novel way to make GT5's sounds more impressive is to periodically play Test Drive on the C64.

The great thing is you don't actually need a true visionary at all, this stuff is already being done outside of games. Just borrow some technical staff from a different area of sound (I think you can guess which ones I mean, going by how the key staff are credited) and maybe set up a collaboration with some external company that specialises in it, for consultancy, effectively. I would love to be in a position to hire some specialists to do the things I know are possible, and they do every day already, just for a different end "product".

It would be too easy for the gaming industry to be too inward looking, to consider what they do the state of the art in every aspect. In one way it is, in that it's an interactive experience, but they really aren't looking at what is going on in the wider world in all areas of game development, to be able to capitalise on stuff that is entirely routine elsewhere, but apparently daunting here. But that's because the economics of game development are dominated by profit secured on the promise of an experience, not by the actual experience itself, and certainly not by a will to expand that experience in a meaningful way, because people stick with what's "good enough" in order to give the impression of minimising "risk". That will exists, of course, it just doesn't get a say.

What I'm saying is, all aspects of videogames should be treated in the way graphics are, because that is the only aspect that reinvents itself several times per "generation" (if you consider all platforms).

 

[Johnnypenso]

Sounds are a priority for PD right now. There is a huge technical hurdle to overcome that every other developer has been avoiding for 5 if not 10 years. You don't know that because you don't know what you're talking about - sorry to be harsh, but it's the truth. You should at least be able to admit that you don't know the full extent of the possibility space when it comes to sound synthesis (that's only what we have in games, it's not real sound, it's resynthesised in some way - even samples), and therefore shouldn't be making generalisations about it.

pCARS is derived from Shift 2; it's not really "new", which in the case of sound is probably half their problem! Sometimes it's easier to start from a clean slate.

This comes down to "good enough" or "should be better" for the industry as a whole. You speak of budget, but a budget is just a forecast, an extrapolation of current conditions, so you should always be careful when sticking with what's "good enough", it could catch you out just the same as pushing the boat out might.

Also, please don't abuse "blokes" like that again!

Haha, there's no need to admit I know nothing about sound because I've never pretended to know anything about sound. All I've ever said was GT sounds like crap, other series with far less money sound much, much better. The problem with you tech guys is you can't see the forest for the trees. I'd be that 99.9% of fans would settle for the engine sound samples from other games over GT samples any day. Is it a technical revolution? No. Can they still work on a technical breakthrough while giving us better sounds in the meantime? Yes.

 

[LeMansAid]

Haha, there's no need to admit I know nothing about sound because I've never pretended to know anything about sound. All I've ever said was GT sounds like crap, other series with far less money sound much, much better. The problem with you tech guys is you can't see the forest for the trees. I'd be that 99.9% of fans would settle for the engine sound samples from other games over GT samples any day. Is it a technical revolution? No. Can they still work on a technical breakthrough while giving us better sounds in the meantime? Yes.

I agree with most of that. Despite a few far too obvious loops and such, the GT sound is quite competent, it just doesn't get the juices flowing.

It is bit strange that they don't just say, grab the best sounding recording of a particular car and steal the eq for it. There are programs that do a very good job of that. The experience I have that I would relate most to car sounds is distorted guitar recordings. Basically, I would expect that in both cases we would be talking about a primary note with it's resonant cousins, plus a whole of fuzz. That fuzz should be incredibly malleable if it is anything like a guitar sound. There are also programs where compensations can be dialed in for pitch shifting, to make higher and lower pitches sound natural. Just like Photoshop can be used to process frame by frame for moving images, I cannot see why the same sort of thing could not be used to adjust engine sounds in a progressive manner as the pitch changes.

I have no idea if my words and thoughts are ridiculous or not, and I have no illusions about my experience and abilities. I am just a guy who bumbles about , most often neanderthal-like, but occasionally hitting something unique or interesting. So, be kind experts.

 

[Griffith500]

Haha, there's no need to admit I know nothing about sound because I've never pretended to know anything about sound. All I've ever said was GT sounds like crap, other series with far less money sound much, much better. The problem with you tech guys is you can't see the forest for the trees. I'd be that 99.9% of fans would settle for the engine sound samples from other games over GT samples any day. Is it a technical revolution? No. Can they still work on a technical breakthrough while giving us better sounds in the meantime? Yes.

"You tech guys". Oh man.

I always consider the bigger picture, and I've said what you said myself, but still you bang your little drum about how 🤬 PD are, and how wonderful SMS are. Good for you, I guess. It's just not very interesting, though.

I prefer to keep my eyes open for what's coming, rather than dwell on what has already been (grudge, spite, overly emotional?). Also, 99.9% of "fans" won't "settle" for anything if they have nothing to compare it to! 💡

I find it interesting that you're not in the least bit curious as to what might be possible with a "technical revolution" (your words, not mine - this stuff already exists; I'd call it a cultural renaissance, personally - purely in the context of games development, of course). But, if you don't know anything about sound, why are you under the impression that your opinion on sound actually matters? Just curious.


LeMansAid: I believe Turn10 might look into something like you're describing, but I'd recommend going a few steps further than that for extra flexibility. You can do some interesting things with it, though - not necessarily all realistic, but that might not matter.
I had a working prototype that could take samples for a V8 and turn it into a V6 instead, all with the same overall "tone" as the original sound, for example. In theory it'd work in reverse, but I didn't have samples from a V6 to hand.

 

[RattijuoppoFIN]

"You tech guys". Oh man.

I always consider the bigger picture, and I've said what you said myself, but still you bang your little drum about how 🤬 PD are, and how wonderful SMS are. Good for you, I guess. It's just not very interesting, though.

Leave it be. For you to make a opinion of something doesn't make it a fact. The sound is bad in GT no matter how it is being implemented. There already is the technology to make decent sounding cars. PD simply didn't bother. Maybe they are preparing a new innovative technology for future but for the time being they have been cheaping out in the wrong place.

 

[FormulaKimball]

I'd be that 99.9% of fans would settle for the engine sound samples from other games over GT samples any day.

👍 And, I wouldn't bet on the likelihood that anyone would take the sounds from GT into other games if they could.

I get the feeling that maybe PD Hates Distortion. Because somehow that angry tone when you step on the gas is lost for nearly every engine sound in GT5 and GTA/GT6 demo. PD would be that producer that tells you your Marshall guitar tone is too harsh for the mainstream. Or merely tells you to change the Marshall for some cheap, crappy amp modelling processor.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Posted this on another thread, but the last half is about sound, so yeah :

Thanks, I'll give them a try.

Works in latest GT5 version 2.14, secret menu access required - I enabled secret menu after the update to 2.14.

The view angle do not work at course maker tracks ( tested at Toscana ) but works on all other tracks.


I use 100% screen angle ( default value for wide ), angle of screen curvature 0 degree, layout 3x1, monitor no 2, 16x9 aspect ratio enabled ( can be disabled - unchecked ), viewing angle Y at between 60 to 65 ( try both, see which one you like or any between ) - 65 makes it sits further back, the lower the value - the closer the cam. Enable temporal aliasing : on ( not sure if it helps with frame rate - the graphics looks the same to me )

Give these a try, I like it so far. For a good laugh, try 301 for view angle Y - the car will be in very awkward position

Also found a good settings for TV speakers audio or HDMI AVR surround on GT5 - select HDMI in XMB, tick 5.1 or 7.1 LPCM 192 KHz, in the game, go to audio options, select living room or small theatre, choose 4.1 Surround ( will make sound audible on stereo TV - somehow GT5 will allow output pseudo 4.1 on stereo ). Large theatre will make the sound mix too extreme.

Use Headphone, HDMI passthrough AV receiver or if your TV speakers are big, crank the volume - cockpit view engine sound will be lower than tires noises, but the rear view will give loud engine sounds I hear more variation in tire noises volume too, when nearing the limit, on the limit and when over the limit - they are more pronounced ( good for those who depend on the tire noise )

Hood cam sounds okay, chase cam is epic. The great thing about the 4.1 on LCPM 5.1 is when racing with other cars, now the other car sound will sound more life like, you can still hear yours and theirs will be awesome - heard a Ford GT and Lexus LFA next / in front of me - works like a charm on chase and hood - cockpit view will need volume boost - beware when changing cam.

Really have to try this, it will give that wilder sound mix - very nice on hood and chase cam, also good on cockpit/bumper cam. Also works to some extent on Dolby Digital/DTS multi channel output, not as good as LPCM 5.1 or my preferred 7.1 4.1 rocks !!

 

[Griffith500]

Leave it be. For you to make a opinion of something doesn't make it a fact. The sound is bad in GT no matter how it is being implemented. There already is the technology to make decent sounding cars. PD simply didn't bother. Maybe they are preparing a new innovative technology for future but for the time being they have been cheaping out in the wrong place.

I've never not said the samples are lacking in GT5. But you can continue to misrepresent me all you like. Also, for you to make an opinion of how PD are "cheaping out" does not make it fact.

👍 And, I wouldn't bet on the likelihood that anyone would take the sounds from GT into other games if they could.

I get the feeling that maybe PD Hates Distortion. Because somehow that angry tone when you step on the gas is lost for nearly every engine sound in GT5 and GTA/GT6 demo. PD would be that producer that tells you your Marshall guitar tone is too harsh for the mainstream. Or merely tells you to change the Marshall for some cheap, crappy amp modelling processor.

If all you want is the impression of a sound you imagine should come, or remember coming, from a car, through your Marshall amp, that's fine. But real cars don't sound like that. There are things that can be done without having to resort to artificial distortion (there's plenty of natural distortion that should be present, though) to artificially amp up the sound.

Modeling works perfectly well, by the way, in software at least. For your guitar amp to carry bespoke modeling hardware, it might get a tad pricey, and you'd be as well to buy the real thing...

As an aside, it's pretty ironic in the context of your post that I should be getting Rohde & Schwarz adverts (which is surely a strange choice for this site?).

 

[LeMansAid]

Griffith, I was really just musing stopgap wonderings.

RattijuoppoFIN, for you to state: "The sound is bad in GT no matter how it is being implemented." is stating opinion as fact. The very thing you were deriding Griffith500 for. That kind of thing seems to happen a lot around here.

Ridox2JZGTE, that is an odd set up. I cannot even imagine why someone would try that, and I am not even sure that I can follow your words effectively. Are you cancelling out surround channels?

Edit: Yeah Ridox, I can't really make sense of what you are saying. For one thing, HDMI passthrough usually refers to using no upscaling of the image by the receiver.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Ridox2JZGTE, that is an odd set up. I cannot even imagine why someone would try that, and I am not even sure that I can follow your words effectively. Are you cancelling out surround channels?

Nothing wrong with the setup, it won't break anything. The thing is, this trick works well on a tv, it basically puts GT5 to output pseudo 4.1 surround from 7.1 mix in stereo mode ( double downmix ), this will boost the overall dynamic somehow, fortunately for the better, give it a try to hear the result Go to XMB, set to HDMI out, 7.1 LPCM 192KHz, in GT5, choose small theatre, and 4.1 surround mode. Beware with chase cam loud engine/exhaust ! Connect a good headphone to your tv

 

[FormulaKimball]

If all you want is the impression of a sound you imagine should come, or remember coming, from a car, through your Marshall amp, that's fine. But real cars don't sound like that. There are things that can be done without having to resort to artificial distortion (there's plenty of natural distortion that should be present, though) to artificially amp up the sound.

Modeling works perfectly well, by the way, in software at least. For your guitar amp to carry bespoke modeling hardware, it might get a tad pricey, and you'd be as well to buy the real thing...

As an aside, it's pretty ironic in the context of your post that I should be getting Rohde & Schwarz adverts (which is surely a strange choice for this site?).

That's funny, creepy ads getting a little too personal The Marshall reference was just an analogy - I agree there's more than enough angry natural distortion when you put your foot down in most any real car. Perhaps something happens during the sound capture that weakens the feel of it, so some game developers artificially amp it back up (one could argue that some games go overboard with this, but I would argue for PD to do so would be preferable to the lukewarm sounds we currently deal with). Kaz would even say their recordings are "too accurate", I guess meaning "too isolated" so we don't get the tone of all the other parts of the car vibrating and contributing to the glorious noise we want to hear?

 

[Griffith500]

Griffith, I was really just musing stopgap wonderings.

Please feel free to! It's much better than the usual discourse around here. As I said, what you described is, in broad terms, where Turn10 were looking 6 months ago. Where they went with it we won't know for some time.

RattijuoppoFIN, for you to state: "The sound is bad in GT no matter how it is being implemented." is stating opinion as fact. The very thing you were deriding Griffith500 for. That kind of thing seems to happen a lot around here.

I'd say it was more the assertion that PD don't care. I know what that's like, though, as I've been caught out saying it about other developers.
As a point of contrast, and not entirely unrelated, Forza is one game where I think they've really let themselves down. FM2 had excellent sound, and they had to go all Hollywood for FM3 and removed any "customisation" FM2 had with the ability to change a car's sound; a real backward step (they should have just added a fuzz mode). I'm not singling T10 out, I just think their decision to remove avant-garde features like that is only indicative of what pandering to mainstream demands achieves: stagnation and sameness.
I believe quite passionately that GT should not follow suit, just to get "better" sounds - it should continue with the obvious direction it's taking (simulation) and see it through (and get better sounds as a result).

Ridox2JZGTE, that is an odd set up. I cannot even imagine why someone would try that, and I am not even sure that I can follow your words effectively. Are you cancelling out surround channels?

Edit: Yeah Ridox, I can't really make sense of what you are saying. For one thing, HDMI passthrough usually refers to using no upscaling of the image by the receiver.

It seems like he's deliberately omitting the rear speakers / channels, which has been the cause for some people to complain about GT's sound (all it gives is the "engine" sound in the cockpit views, which is that whirry noise, and all exhaust in chase, or if you look behind in cockpit).

I'd personally recommend using Large Theatre, adjusting the volumes (music up, sfx etc. down) and using an external dynamic range compressor, i.e. level control, loudness, normalisation etc. on your receiver or TV (or PC). The software one GT uses is pretty primitive, as to do it properly it needs to be multi-band (which many "hardware" ones are).

That base high dynamic range in the mix is pretty avant garde, though, as it won't be in mainstream middleware for at least another year, and it was in GT5 and GT:HD. Headphones and straight "Large Theatre" is really something to behold, just don't turn it up too loud.

Whatever you do, use the speaker settings that match your hardware, unless you know exactly what is happening to the channels; i.e. true down- or up-mixing, as opposed to the extra channels being discarded or receving no data.
I'd also recommend a slight bass boost. GT doesn't use a phantom fundamental effect (which it should, as an option), so you need to introduce those harmonics to suggest the bass frequencies (on hardware that cannot reproduce bass) yourself by overdriving it a tiny bit - just be careful, as such distortion implies the drivers are approaching their excursion limit.


FormulaKimball: the main issue with GT's samples, since GT2, is that they're too short (by necessity for PS1, and PS2 - seemingly as a carry-over on PS3 whilst they make their new sounds). Shorter samples loop more obviously, so you have to use sections with less detail to avoid that. GT also only uses three samples per source in the rev range, which means they're overly stretched, especially in the higher register. Add to that an absence of sounds like intake (needs a separate source, more memory) and things start to add up. The inclusion of intake mods for GT5 got my nose twitching, but it seems they're not ready with their new sounds just yet...

 

[LeMansAid]

That's funny, creepy ads getting a little too personal The Marshall reference was just an analogy - I agree there's more than enough angry natural distortion when you put your foot down in most any real car. Perhaps something happens during the sound capture that weakens the feel of it, so some game developers artificially amp it back up (one could argue that some games go overboard with this, but I would argue for PD to do so would be preferable to the lukewarm sounds we currently deal with). Kaz would even say their recordings are "too accurate", I guess meaning "too isolated" so we don't get the tone of all the other parts of the car vibrating and contributing to the glorious noise we want to hear?

Sometimes there are "smokescreens" used in audio. I do wonder if the vacuum cleaner comment that is repeated ad nauseum can be attributed to an attempt to implement this approach. It's like when a picture is assembled digitally, and grain or a subtle texture is overlaid to marry the components together. It can create positive effects, and also hide potentially negative effects. It can also raise the quality of an image. A low resolution image with high resolution noise overlaid will to a degree give a lift to the perceived resolution. The "too accurate" line could come across as admitting guilt under the guise of a proclamation of greatness, but it could also be the reality.

None of this makes the sounds any more exciting, but I need something to prattle on about.

 

[RattijuoppoFIN]

We already do have confirmation that the sounds can be quite a bit better in competitions achievements. And there are many. So therefore I can state that this is a conscious choice from PD to not better there efforts. No matter of simulation or samples of whatever. The technology and expertise already exists so the problem is once again CHOICE.

 

[Griffith500]

We already do have confirmation that the sounds can be quite a bit better in competitions achievements. And there are many. So therefore I can state that this is a conscious choice from PD to not better there efforts. No matter of simulation or samples of whatever. The technology and expertise already exists so the problem is once again CHOICE.

It might seem logical in your mind, but it's just nonsense. What's correct is that they're choosing to do it differently. There's nothing to show for that choice yet (which is not to say it's not working; I expect it is, just not on PS3, which is all we have at the moment.) But I guess you won't take anyone's word for it; not mine (fair enough), not Kaz's - not even your own ears' (once the new sounds are revealed), I bet!

But since you don't have anything interesting to contribute to the discussion, maybe you should leave it be?

 

[RattijuoppoFIN]

So are you saying that perhaps examples in Simbins RRE or Pcars or even Rfactor are inferior in sound to GT? As I said, competitors are leaving PD in to the sound cloud dust. Logical, not nonsense - even if you have a different opinion about your industry love child.

 

[Wankelhead]

I'm sorry to say but this is going nowhere. People are just bringing back the same points from previous pages and this discussion is going in loops.
Everyone is just stating opinions instead of facts. Shouldn't we just wait for GT6 and then, with some more foundation to our words, discuss this more properly, instead of attacking each other and a game that isn't out yet?

 

[RattijuoppoFIN]

I agree. If mister sound specialist and all would agree to not bloat all this speculation and to wait for the final game to implement verdict, I will as well.

 

[TokoTurismo]

I'm sorry to say but this is going nowhere. People are just bringing back the same points from previous pages and this discussion is going in loops.
Everyone is just stating opinions instead of facts. Shouldn't we just wait for GT6 and then, with some more foundation to our words, discuss this more properly, instead of attacking each other and a game that isn't out yet?

Yeah I will also tell that to those who say "GT will never get good sounds" and try stating it if it's a fact, which it ISN'T... So I too am waiting until the full game releases.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I agree. If mister sound specialist and all would agree to not bloat all this speculation and to wait for the final game to implement verdict, I will as well.

The fundamental difference here is what could be vs. what is. What is, sucks at the moment. We've been waiting for what could be for 15 years. It may come with GT6, it may not, no one knows at this point. If it does, great. If not, it's the same old same old for another few years. PD and Kaz don't exactly have a great track record in fulfilling promises so it is quite easy to remain highly skeptical.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

It seems like he's deliberately omitting the rear speakers / channels, which has been the cause for some people to complain about GT's sound (all it gives is the "engine" sound in the cockpit views, which is that whirry noise, and all exhaust in chase, or if you look behind in cockpit).

I'd personally recommend using Large Theatre, adjusting the volumes (music up, sfx etc. down) and using an external dynamic range compressor, i.e. level control, loudness, normalisation etc. on your receiver or TV (or PC). The software one GT uses is pretty primitive, as to do it properly it needs to be multi-band (which many "hardware" ones are).

That base high dynamic range in the mix is pretty avant garde, though, as it won't be in mainstream middleware for at least another year, and it was in GT5 and GT:HD. Headphones and straight "Large Theatre" is really something to behold, just don't turn it up too loud.

Whatever you do, use the speaker settings that match your hardware, unless you know exactly what is happening to the channels; i.e. true down- or up-mixing, as opposed to the extra channels being discarded or receving no data.
I'd also recommend a slight bass boost. GT doesn't use a phantom fundamental effect (which it should, as an option), so you need to introduce those harmonics to suggest the bass frequencies (on hardware that cannot reproduce bass) yourself by overdriving it a tiny bit - just be careful, as such distortion implies the drivers are approaching their excursion limit.

You're right Griffith, I got the idea after knowing one GTP member having difficulties listening to what the tires are doing driving in 2013 GTA. If you have 2013 GTA demo, you can hear the differences in sound compared to GT5 tuned GT Academy 370z with the same 4.1 TV trick - yep, removing the channels . The chase cam and cockpit cam in particular sounds different although both are the same car. It may be new sample or different sound engine on 2013 GTA demo. Personally I find the 2013 GTA demo have better engine/exhaust sound and sound engine.

 

[PepeMickey]

The sound samples used in GTA 2013 are exactly the same as in GT5 and that is a fact. I may not know much about sound and such but I can recognize what my ears are hearing.