Gran Turismo 6 coming to PS3

Well, as I fully understand your argument about the financial situation for Sony and PD. I really dont care about it. First party games are subsidized most of the time anyway to generate hardware sales.

And I just want the best experience I can get for my money. As a gamer I only have to think about playing and not about the financial state of the developer.

If they fail to get the money back that they invested, it is not our problem. With a release every 3 years they wouldnt have such a problem anymore. Invest everything in one time and money consuming product and bet that everything will go fine, can go very wrong.

It is just sad how PD think that they are still the leader in the business. They just lean back and work on some ridiculuss details. Loosing their view for the whole game.
Sorry but while you might not care about it, if your going to get involved in a discussion of this nature then its going to become part of that discussion, as its an integral part of it.

As for first party studios funding the development of flagship titles, that's 100% correct, but they also like to see a return on it, hence the two full titles per gen framework (this kind of thing is not just a coincidence). Sony will heavily fund the development of the first, the sales from which will cover that cost and the minor (in comparison) re-development needed for the next title in the same gen, that one the makes you the money.

Even 1st party titles need to make a return as while software may shift machines, for the first 2 -3 years (at least) those machines don't make you a penny (and often loose you money).


I am sorry, but you cant possibly think that they will release GT7 that soon...
Given that PD have had PS4 dev kits for around 2 years, that would make a 3 - 4 year dev time (roughly), which if the PS4 is as big a step in dev terms as Sony are saying would not be utterly unrealistic. Less time that it took between GT4 and GT5, but back closer to the intervals we had in the past (so its not as if PD can't turn titles around in that time - they have before).
 
I don't think in 1 year, but 1.5 - 2 years is possible. You're not thinking they're going to go 5 plus years again are you?

I think GT5 toke 5 years because of PS3. It was hard for them to take the full power of the ps3.

Now i saw some information that it is going to be much easyier to make a game for ps4.... so this could mean, that we are going to see new GT every 2-3 Years :P ??

sorry for my english

regards.
 
Given that PD have had PS4 dev kits for around 2 years, that would make a 3 - 4 year dev time (roughly), which if the PS4 is as big a step in dev terms as Sony are saying would not be utterly unrealistic. Less time that it took between GT4 and GT5, but back closer to the intervals we had in the past (so its not as if PD can't turn titles around in that time - they have before).

Well, what speaks against the idea that PD could have easily moved their engine to the PS4 in those 2 years. And content was already next-gen ready, when they created it for GT5. :)

We all speak about the long development time, but what is pd really doing during that time? Are they reasearching so much or is the creating of content that hard? While A-Spec in GT5 felt like a copy and paste job, I am quite curious about this.

Plus, I didnt mean that I dont care about your argument. It sound personal and that wasnt my intention.
 
Well, what speaks against the idea that PD could have easily moved their engine to the PS4 in those 2 years. And content was already next-gen ready, when they created it for GT5. :)

We all speak about the long development time, but what is pd really doing during that time? Are they reasearching so much or is the creating of content that hard? While A-Spec in GT5 felt like a copy and paste job, I am quite curious about this.

Plus, I didnt mean that I dont care about your argument. It sound personal and that wasnt my intention.

Nothing speaks against it at all, which is why I believe that we will see a GT on the PS4 a lot quicker than we did on the PS3.

None of that however changes the logic of releasing GT6 on the PS3, given that it would have no effect at all on PS4 sales, would tap into a 70+ million user base and make a massive amount of money.
 
...I am sorry, but you cant possibly think that they will release GT7 that soon...
I certainly do, for the reasons Scaff mentioned - it has also been discussed a number of times on this thread.

...Who here would not buy a PS4 with GT6? If you couldnt afford it right away, wouldnt it be on the top of your to get list? Im sure Sony knows that, and sees little reason to release it on PS3...Sony wants to win next gen...at this point, Sony will let the PS3 just ride off into the sunset. Time to focus on the future.
That first part may be true, I mean I would buy GT6 on the PS4 - however, Sony have already made a statement about their thinking on this. They recognise the need to ensure the PS4 continues to sell beyond the initial launch. Factories are more efficient if production stays at a constant, enabling them to keep experienced staff - if demand keeps rising and falling every few months, things become more difficult.

By the reasoning that GT6 will arrive on the PS3 - Drive Club will be there at launch for the PS4 and GT7 later on - they do think about this sort of stuff well in advance.

As for the last point, Sony have made a public statement that they will be supporting the PS3 and the devs who produce games for it until at least 2015.
 
Who here would not buy a PS4 with GT6? If you couldnt afford it right away, wouldnt it be on the top of your to get list? Im sure Sony knows that, and sees little reason to release it on PS3.
Me.

Until I know that PD have moved things on from GT5 then they do not automatically get a sale from me.

If its on the PS3 I am more likely to take a punt, but its not a launch day must at present. As for a GT on the PS4, well they have got to do a lot to convince me to buy a new machine as well, and affording one has zero to do with that.
 
you guys act like Gran Turismo is the only deciding factor in buying a new system lol is it really the only game you play?

also 1 GT6 sale on PS3 = about $40 at best for PD/Sony

1 GT6 sale for PS4 = about $540+ for PD/Sony if the system is around $500 bucks. think about it when you're talking about pushing more units on PS3, you would need to sell 15-20 times more games to even out in sales anyway.
 
Nothing speaks against it at all, which is why I believe that we will see a GT on the PS4 a lot quicker than we did on the PS3.

None of that however changes the logic of releasing GT6 on the PS3, given that it would have no effect at all on PS4 sales, would tap into a 70+ million user base and make a massive amount of money.

The big user base is surely a valid argument.

But the fact that they showed nothing at the last E3 or TGS ist the biggest reason for me to think that there is no PS3 release. PD and Sony have always showed us big trailers and gameplay 1+ year before the actual release.

My conclusion is, that it will be either a PS4 title or they show it this year and might realease it next year on one of the consoles. The only chance for a release this year, would be as a launch title for the PS4.
 
you guys act like Gran Turismo is the only deciding factor in buying a new system lol is it really the only game you play?
For some it is, for me its not, but choice of driving sim is the deciding factor for me and to date has sold Sony a PS2 and a PS3 to me.


also 1 GT6 sale on PS3 = about $40 at best for PD/Sony

1 GT6 sale for PS4 = about $540+ for PD/Sony if the system is around $500 bucks. think about it when you're talking about pushing more units on PS3, you would need to sell 15-20 times more games to even out in sales anyway.
So your claiming that without a GT title Sony are not going to be able to shift launch PS4s?

If Sony can't shift every PS4 they make for the first year without a GT title then they have a huge problem, the simply fact is that for the first year they don't need a GT title to shift machines, they need that further on down the line. As such they are still going to sell all they can make in the first year of the PS4 and potentially 9+ million copies of GT6 on the PS3.


The big user base is surely a valid argument.

But the fact that they showed nothing at the last E3 or TGS ist the biggest reason for me to think that there is no PS3 release. PD and Sony have always showed us big trailers and gameplay 1+ year before the actual release.

My conclusion is, that it will be either a PS4 title or they show it this year and might realease it next year on one of the consoles. The only chance for a release this year, would be as a launch title for the PS4.
Sony have said its a PS3 title and have not retracted that statement at all, add in that PD stated they would not make the same mistake they did last time with giving dates before they were 100% sure and I can see it happening this year.
 
Me.

Until I know that PD have moved things on from GT5 then they do not automatically get a sale from me.

If its on the PS3 I am more likely to take a punt, but its not a launch day must at present. As for a GT on the PS4, well they have got to do a lot to convince me to buy a new machine as well, and affording one has zero to do with that.

I am of the same mindset also.
 
So your claiming that without a GT title Sony are not going to be able to shift launch PS4s?

If Sony can't shift every PS4 they make for the first year without a GT title then they have a huge problem, the simply fact is that for the first year they don't need a GT title to shift machines, they need that further on down the line. As such they are still going to sell all they can make in the first year of the PS4 and potentially 9+ million copies of GT6 on the PS3.

And what about the people who trade on their PS3 for a PS4? (Where we can assume a fair amount will)

If half the people who do that own GT5 then half the potential GT6 PS3 sell automatically are gone aswell.

Are people who buy a PS4 and still own a PS3 likely to continue to buy PS3 games?

When I get my PS4 my PS3 will be moved into the bedroom to be used as a Blu-Ray player, my PS4 will be my front room gaming console so as much as I love the GT series I will miss GT6.

In practice what you say makes sense, however how many continued to buy PS2 games to play on the original 60Gb PS3?

I can't imagine to many did.
 
Sony have said its a PS3 title and have not retracted that statement at all, add in that PD stated they would not make the same mistake they did last time with giving dates before they were 100% sure and I can see it happening this year.

It was just the vice president of SCEE. And it was not an official announcement. Those guys are not the best informed, because the main business is still going on at the headquarters in Japan. They dont even give big information to the their europeen or american colleagues.

Well, let us look on the already known first party launch line up for the PS4:

inFAMOUS: Second Son
Killzone: Shadow Fall
Knack
Drive Club
The Witness (indie game)

Really spectacular...
And this should be the best and biggest launch line up of this playstation release?? I think that some games are still missing. Especially some games that make people buy the PS4.

The truth is that the casual gamer will be probably playing GTA 5 on their Xbox 360 or PS3 at the time the PS4 comes along. If that is all that Sony comes up with, they wont sell many consoles, trust me.

And when the next Xbox hits with some new gamer series and Forza 5, many will make the change. Plus the PC market for sims are getting more attractive with Assetto Corsa, Cars, rFactor 2 and so on.


Dont get me wrong, I would even buy GT6 for the PS3. It would come cheaper for me. But I dont see why Sony should'nt compete and lose many sales to the competition...
 
It was just the vice president of SCEE. And it was not an official announcement. Those guys are not the best informed, because the main business is still going on at the headquarters in Japan. They dont even give big information to the their europeen or american colleagues.

Well, let us look on the already known first party launch line up for the PS4:

inFAMOUS: Second Son
Killzone: Shadow Fall
Knack
Drive Club
The Witness (indie game)

Really spectacular...
And this should be the best and biggest launch line up of this playstation release?? I think that some games are still missing. Especially some games that make people buy the PS4.

The truth is that the casual gamer will be probably playing GTA 5 on their Xbox 360 or PS3 at the time the PS4 comes along. If that is all that Sony comes up with, they wont sell many consoles, trust me.

And when the next Xbox hits with some new gamer series and Forza 5, many will make the change. Plus the PC market for sims are getting more attractive with Assetto Corsa, Cars, rFactor 2 and so on.


Dont get me wrong, I would even buy GT6 for the PS3. It would come cheaper for me. But I dont see why Sony should'nt compete and lose many sales to the competition...

You are aware that Sony haven't actually detailed all of the launch titles for the PS4?

That was not the purpose of the PS4 launch session, that's what E3 is going to be for.

And as for the SCEE VP - if it wasn't then why has nothing been said to dismiss it. MS fired someone for leaking info recently (info that might not even be true).
 
If people are buying new consoles for only two or three games, then that console was a waste of money unless the games were absolutely brilliant. I understand the people who want it on PS3 because there aren't any PS4 games they want but that shouldn't hold back the people who want to but a PS4 and expect good games to come out on it.

Also from the same logic the pro-PS3 users have, why not make the game for the PS2 guys who never bought a PS3, they haven't had a new GT game in almost 10 years, it would benefit them since they would only have to pay around $40 for the game.
 
It was just the vice president of SCEE. And it was not an official announcement. Those guys are not the best informed, because the main business is still going on at the headquarters in Japan. They dont even give big information to the their europeen or american colleagues.

Senior Vice President actually.

It is the JOB of these people to give interviews and release information. They know what they can say and what they can't say, especially at the Senior level.

The audio recording shows that he meant to say it and it has NEVER been retracted. Especially not by the subsequent press release that only confirmed that PD have been working of GT6 since 2010.

That confirms GT6 for PS3 simple as that. You might not like that, and I might not like that, but it is the way of it.
 
Senior Vice President actually.

It is the JOB of these people to give interviews and release information. They know what they can say and what they can't say, especially at the Senior level.

The audio recording shows that he meant to say it and it has NEVER been retracted. Especially not by the subsequent press release that only confirmed that PD have been working of GT6 since 2010.

That confirms GT6 for PS3 simple as that. You might not like that, and I might not like that, but it is the way of it.

I'd have to agree there.
But what doesn't make sense is,why won't PD say anything about what platform(s) GT6 is on.
E3 seems obvious I suppose.
Denny saying its on PS3 is pretty solid confirmation considering he works for SONY and the fact he hasn't retracted the statement.
Also websites listing it for PS3 too,but perhaps that should be taken lightly.
But if Denny retracted his statement,doesn't that pretty much confirm,PS4/Vita or both?Making at least a PS3 release?
 
If people are buying new consoles for only two or three games, then that console was a waste of money unless the games were absolutely brilliant. I understand the people who want it on PS3 because there aren't any PS4 games they want but that shouldn't hold back the people who want to but a PS4 and expect good games to come out on it.
Why would it be a waste of money?

You could have one person who buys 200 games for a console and plays them each for an average of 5 hours, and gets 1,000 hours of value out of it and another who buys 2 games for a console and plays them each for 500 hours, they also get 1,000 hours of value out of it. They have both got the same value regardless of the number of games bought.



Also from the same logic the pro-PS3 users have, why not make the game for the PS2 guys who never bought a PS3, they haven't had a new GT game in almost 10 years, it would benefit them since they would only have to pay around $40 for the game.
Not sure if your really serious on this, because the answer is so stunningly obvious its beyond belief.

Sony stopped working on the PS2 years ago and stopped making them last year. In the core market for the GT series the target market for PS2 owners in not there either, so they would not sell even close to enough to be worthwhile.
 
I think GT5 toke 5 years because of PS3. It was hard for them to take the full power of the ps3.

Now i saw some information that it is going to be much easyier to make a game for ps4.... so this could mean, that we are going to see new GT every 2-3 Years :P ??

sorry for my english

regards.

It took them 5 years because PD weren't focusing solely on GT5. They had GTHD, GT5P, and GT PSP along with a few demos like the GT Academy time trial. Even if limited, some resources went into the GT Academy. They also spent time on race car liveries, body kits for Nismo, car prototypes for Citroen, promo videos and tech displays for various car makers, were Sony's go to developer to promote and push display technologies like 4K and 3D, among more. Had PD been working on just GT5 after GT4 without any of the nonsense we would have gotten a much better GT5 game. The same is true for GT PSP. Hopefully for GT6 they aren't dealing with side projects and are focusing exclusively on GT6 only.
 
Really?

Does anyone really think PD will let Project Cars become the initial go to racing game on PS4?

Yes. I really don't think Kaz recognizes any game as competition on Play Station. I love PCars, but I don't expect that it won't outsell any of the Gran Turismo games. I DO expect Project Cars to be a better game regardless of which console GT6 is released for.
 
Yes. I really don't think Kaz recognizes any game as competition on Play Station. I love PCars, but I don't expect that it won't outsell any of the Gran Turismo games. I DO expect Project Cars to be a better game regardless of which console GT6 is released for.

PCars is more like a Racing-Simulator with (hopefully) very fast AI and some very interesting racing series. And that's what the hardcore Racers want. I expect it to be very good but I also don't think it is a competitor for Gran Turismo
 
It took them 5 years because PD weren't focusing solely on GT5. They had GTHD, GT5P, and GT PSP along with a few demos like the GT Academy time trial. Even if limited, some resources went into the GT Academy. They also spent time on race car liveries, body kits for Nismo, car prototypes for Citroen, promo videos and tech displays for various car makers, were Sony's go to developer to promote and push display technologies like 4K and 3D, among more. Had PD been working on just GT5 after GT4 without any of the nonsense we would have gotten a much better GT5 game. The same is true for GT PSP. Hopefully for GT6 they aren't dealing with side projects and are focusing exclusively on GT6 only.

This. That's why I really hope GT5 isn't getting the way of GT6's development, due to all the hybriding caused by the players and updating GT5 blah blah...

So far it's been about 2 years after GT5 was released. Release GT6 on November and that's 3 years of one GT game that was in development and finished.
 
i don't get why you would wait when you're going to buy the system anyway just like everyone else, the only reason i can understand is financial obligations...

The same reason I waited until 2010 to buy my PS3; I had no use for it otherwise.

I don't get why you would buy a new system right away if you weren't sold on the game lineup. Are you also the type that lines up for a new iPhone every year, even if the upgrades are utterly minimal compared to the existing generation? Consumerism for the sake of consumerism is a waste of money for me; I'll buy the system when the pros of ownership outweigh the cons.

and i'm not sure if you missed the memo, but devs hate the CELL processor with a passion, it had very little to do with its "massively increased power" and everything to do with how to utilize that power, which is also why every multi-platform game was natively developed on the 360 and ported to PS3. i'm sure you're aware the PS4 has done away with the CELL and moved on to a much more familiar platform for devs.

Except this isn't a multi-platform; this is a company that has, arguably, some of the best knowledge of the CELL processor. And again, I re-iterate; a great many of GT5's problems have little to do with the console's performance, they were simply poor game design choices.

I personally think that we are still atleast 10 years away from getting really photorealistic real time graphics. The jump to next gen with the PS3 and Xbox 360 was something new. The development studios are now familiar with the creation of hd games. And with the PS4 beeing closer to a pc, we will see faster development. Some developer said that it only takes weeks to port a pc game to the PS4 now.

Oh, I think the same way as you on that. But I'm doubting there will be a huge jump in graphics quality between a hypothetical PS4 GT6 and PS3's GT5, at least with regards to model quality of things like the Premium cars, or the 'Ring.

I mean 8 GB RAM and a high end gpu/cpu are light years faster than the PS3. Will the game look 10 times better? Probably not, but I think that every part of the gameplay will benefit from the new system.

I don't, so long as PD insists on another clunky, poorly-designed UI that suffers from loading times at every turn, or a skimped-out single-player game, or silly paint chips, or making B-Spec 50% of said poorly-planned GT Mode...

The problem was that PGR 4, which was a fantastic game, came out at the wrong time. It was the release window of Halo 3 and some other really big games. More a problem of bad marketing than game quality. PGR 4 was superb!

And Drive Club may very well be; which is why sticking it alongside GT6 would be a bad idea! That said, I highly doubt PD would hit a release date target, anyways.

It is just a matter of the right time to put a game in the spotlight for the consumer. If GT6 would come out as the same time as drive club, you can be sure that it would fail, because everybody would just look a GT.

We agree on that, then 👍

A GT about a year or 18 months after the system's release? I see no problems with that.

you guys act like Gran Turismo is the only deciding factor in buying a new system lol is it really the only game you play?

No, but it's a large deciding factor - or rather, has been, in the past. I bought my PS3 years after the release: I wanted to play MGS4 and GTA4 badly, but I didn't feel the need to drop the cash on the system for just those two, with GT5 in development hell. When GT5 was finally given a release date (which, of course, got delayed), only then did I buy the system. I had no use for Blu-Ray, and had no experience of the new series available on the system (Uncharted, LBP). Quite frankly, I'm glad I waited, since I got a massively bigger hard-drive than available at launch, for a much cheaper price (infact, cheaper than retail, thanks to my system being a special event bundle).

also 1 GT6 sale on PS3 = about $40 at best for PD/Sony

1 GT6 sale for PS4 = about $540+ for PD/Sony if the system is around $500 bucks. think about it when you're talking about pushing more units on PS3, you would need to sell 15-20 times more games to even out in sales anyway.

So you think all the retailers that would be stocking the PS4 would be giving 100% of the system profits to Sony? Suddenly, your other posts start to make more sense...

It took them 5 years because PD weren't focusing solely on GT5. They had GTHD, GT5P, and GT PSP along with a few demos like the GT Academy time trial. Even if limited, some resources went into the GT Academy. They also spent time on race car liveries, body kits for Nismo, car prototypes for Citroen, promo videos and tech displays for various car makers, were Sony's go to developer to promote and push display technologies like 4K and 3D, among more. Had PD been working on just GT5 after GT4 without any of the nonsense we would have gotten a much better GT5 game. The same is true for GT PSP. Hopefully for GT6 they aren't dealing with side projects and are focusing exclusively on GT6 only.

GTHD and GT5P are arguably part of GT5's production; just because PD sees fit to package their (slow) progress up and sell the resultant demo off as a game doesn't mean they've chosen to delay getting the full GT5 themselves. GTPSP could have also been sourced out, as many of the portable versions of series do, but for whatever reason, that option wasn't utilized either.

I imagine, due to the nature of online gaming these days versus previous GT titles, that PD hasn't been able to work solely on GT6; they've (rather obviously, with this hybrid business) got to keep on top of GT5 updates, especially given the history of one update typically breaking another part of the game.
 
Yes. I really don't think Kaz recognizes any game as competition on Play Station. I love PCars, but I don't expect that it won't outsell any of the Gran Turismo games. I DO expect Project Cars to be a better game regardless of which console GT6 is released for.

Will you be disappointed if GT6 is better than PCars?
 
Back