Gran Turismo 6 general Physics Discussion(as well as video)

[Johnnypenso]

I tried the demo 370z without ABS and it felt like someone had thrown an anchor out the back.

Any turning applied, swapped me around. Very little brake movement either using a pedal btw.

Jury's out for me ATM. Without access to bias settings its impossible to tell.

I concur with Rido's statements about no ABS in the GTA demo. While I wouldn't call it easy by any stretch, ABS off even with 5/5 BB was way more intuitive than in GT5. You could feel the transition, hear it better too, and I would never, ever, ever use a 5/5 BB without ABS in GT5. Sure I'd prefer 3/1 or something like that, but the fact that it was even drivable for me with 5/5, bodes well for the full game in which I can tune BB to my liking. The potential is there, but without extensive no ABS experience like Rido has, it'll be difficult to see until the game is released.

While the physics have improved there are still too many problems.

First of all you can slide all you want and hold a good amount of speed. You should be scrubbing speed when you're sliding like that. This is incorrect and really, really needs to be fixed.

Second of all no torque steer. Floor the accelerator on a RWD car and it should be tail happy. Instead it accelerates in a perfectly straight line. Things like this must be fixed. It's silly to call a game a sim when it can't model these things accurately.

From a standing start where the engine dramatically overpowers the tire grip, yes, the car should have some torque steer. Far less likely to see it where the car is in motion and the tires grip is more closely matched to the engine output.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

From a standing start where the engine dramatically overpowers the tire grip, yes, the car should have some torque steer. Far less likely to see it where the car is in motion and the tires grip is more closely matched to the engine output.

It's still a fundamental part of a tire model, and to still not have torque steer even close to accurately portrayed is worrying. Of course, it could very well be different by the time the game is released - the GTA model feels very similar to GT5's tire model, so long as you avoid the new HUD placebo effect. In other words: "placeholder".

 

[Johnnypenso]

It's still a fundamental part of a tire model, and to still not have torque steer even close to accurately portrayed is worrying. Of course, it could very well be different by the time the game is released - the GTA model feels very similar to GT5's tire model, so long as you avoid the new HUD placebo effect. In other words: "placeholder".

Something in GT not accurately portrayed worries you? You do have sound on your game right?

 

[PepeMickey]

Honestly, the changes are so small that they could be added as a 500 mb patch to GT5. The body roll and suspension work are nothing but eye-candy.

 

[Crispy]

The body roll and suspension work are nothing but eye-candy.

The body roll and suspension is far more than silly eye-candy. While it may look nice and realistic, you can really feel the difference. Weight transfer is felt a lot more, and a lot better than it is in GT5.

 

[Sidebrowns]

Well we really don't know for sure that the BB was 5/5 for any of those cars. It did feel like it was but without even being able to pull up the RA menu it's not certani what the BB was just like any of the other tuning options.

 

[PepeMickey]

The body roll and suspension is far more than silly eye-candy. While it may look nice and realistic, you can really feel the difference. Weight transfer is felt a lot more, and a lot better than it is in GT5.

You don't "feel" those things, it's all visual.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Something in GT not accurately portrayed worries you? You do have sound on your game right?

At least with the bad sounds, I have the option to mute

 

[Exorcet]

You don't "feel" those things, it's all visual.

It's not visual. The Leaf destroys that notion. The reason why suspension looks good in GT6 is because the suspension calculations are good in GT6. Let go of the gas and the rear tires loose a bit of grip. But they still act silly because the tires themselves are GT5 like.

 

[sinbad]

I'm still not convinced by the body control of the Leaf, I think several things are seriously wrong there. I also really hope that any tyre update really drops the level of grip offered by road-pattern tyres, in fact all the tyres.

Here's a nice video with a Leaf in it anyway.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOIAk8TA6b4

 

[Exorcet]

I'm still not convinced by the body control of the Leaf, I think several things are seriously wrong there. I also really hope that any tyre update really drops the level of grip offered by road-pattern tyres, in fact all the tyres.

Here's a nice video with a Leaf in it anyway.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOIAk8TA6b4

How correct the new physics are is a different issue and something that's hard to pin down because of the tires, but I don't think any serious argument can be made for the new suspension model being purely visual. FF cars in GT have always been ridiculous. In GT5 they were slightly less ridiculous, but still drove on rails. GT6 finally fixed that to a degree.

 

[TorqueHappenS08]

How correct the new physics are is a different issue and something that's hard to pin down because of the tires, but I don't think any serious argument can be made for the new suspension model being purely visual. FF cars in GT have always been ridiculous. In GT5 they were slightly less ridiculous, but still drove on rails. GT6 finally fixed that to a degree.

Leaf has extremely exaggerated bodyroll,but it has to, i guess to get the point across better, but sometimes...it just feels too much like it's going to flip over.

This is how it should be

 

[Scaff]

Leaf has extremely exaggerated bodyroll,but it has to, i guess to get the point across better, but sometimes...it just feels too much like it's going to flip over.

This is how it should be

Do you honestly expect two cars with utterly different drivetrains, weight distribution and COG to exhibit similar degrees of roll and heave?

The roll on the Leaf is not extremely exaggerated at all, its not perfect, but its certainly not massively wrong. That it feels like its going to flip over at times is what an unmodified car of this type pushed on a track does feel like.

 

[Tornado]

I see nothing exaggerated about the Leaf's body roll. It shouldn't have the suspension control of a Miata, because the Leaf is a crappy economy car (probably with better tires in the game than in real life in addition

 

[DawgCCCP]

Leaf has extremely exaggerated bodyroll,but it has to, i guess to get the point across better, but sometimes...it just feels too much like it's going to flip over.

This is how it should be

Totally agree with you!

Till now no sim on console has made physics more superior to enthusia

 

[Griffith500]

When you see that the Leaf weighs as much as the 370Z with a narrower track, higher rideheight etc., it kinda starts to make sense.
Then there's the fact that spring rates and damping will be tuned for comfort in a straight line, whilst a sports car will have some consideration for dynamic i.e. cornering behaviour, plus specific anti-roll measures.
Also there's the fictional tyres which are probably too grippy.

 

[Wolfe]

I don't think the degree of roll/squat/dive in the GTA demo is too extreme, but it looks weird as hell in action. Something about the rate or speed of compression/rebound and the way they're damped is screwed up. Maybe a bit slow, and a bit soft & squishy.

It certainly doesn't remind me of the way a real car rolls/squats/dives.

 

[Griffith500]

Yeah, there looks to be a lot of high frequency detail missing. It's always been the case in GT, though, and the demo is still an improvement. My guess would be it's the damping; they've perhaps not got a handle on that yet (it's possible Kaz tacitly admitted this when he said damping is really tricky.)

 

[Greyout]

It certainly doesn't remind me of the way a real car rolls/squats/dives.

I know this point has been brought up before, but very few of us have experience driving an ecobox at 10/10ths speed on a racetrack.

 

[ZoidFile]

I know this point has been brought up before, but very few of us have experience driving an ecobox at 10/10ths speed on a racetrack.

Well, there is always the Internet.

 

[Scaff]

I know this point has been brought up before, but very few of us have experience driving an ecobox at 10/10ths speed on a racetrack.

And some of us do.

 

[Stephanos82]

And some of us do.

Pic/video or it didn't happen

 

[G.T.Ace]

The car isn't pushed here, like we do it in the demo and it still moves a lot.
It seems to roll quite a bit in real life.

 

[phil_75]

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqUWmVlgLYk">YouTube Link</a>
The car isn't pushed here, like we do it in the demo and it still moves a lot.
It seems to roll quite a bit in real life.

It doesn't roll or move much at all compared to the demo!
What are you seeing?

 

[Griffith500]

Not quite as much roll, no, but the squatting is oddly familiar. I doubt the tyres are anything like equivalent, though - I bet that's the main reason for the extreme roll in the demo, relatively sticky tyres (the real Leaf would presumably have hard-ish compound tyres for obvious reasons, and the sidewalls are likely to be soft and springy).

 

[CoolColJ]

some of the most realistic looking crash and damage physics I've seen in a game yet - GT6 should be ashamed!


from 1min onwards

 

[Zer0]

some of the most realistic looking crash and damage physics I've seen in a game yet - GT6 should be ashamed!

Not just GT but any simulator in existence.

Car manufacturers would never allow that level of deformation in their cars. Real looking accidents will be always restricted to generic cars.

 

[VTi-DOHC]

I am disappointed in GT6's new physics, GT5's physics required far more finesse to get ultimate laptime, I will admit that the GT6 physics are fun and I like how you can chuck the car about and the suspension damping model is good, but when you see the quickest guys on GT Academy's laps you see them pulling the handbrake in the slow corners and doing invisible power slides to point the nose it just puts me off the game completely. Hope this will be rectified for the final game. Little wonder that in the academy finals they used GT5.

 

[carracerptp]

I am disappointed in GT6's new physics, GT5's physics required far more finesse to get ultimate laptime, I will admit that the GT6 physics are fun and I like how you can chuck the car about and the suspension damping model is good, but when you see the quickest guys on GT Academy's laps you see them pulling the handbrake in the slow corners and doing invisible power slides to point the nose it just puts me off the game completely. Hope this will be rectified for the final game. Little wonder that in the academy finals they used GT5.

It's actually "nearly" the same in GT5.

 

[05XR8]

I am disappointed in GT6's new physics, GT5's physics required far more finesse to get ultimate laptime, I will admit that the GT6 physics are fun and I like how you can chuck the car about and the suspension damping model is good, but when you see the quickest guys on GT Academy's laps you see them pulling the handbrake in the slow corners and doing invisible power slides to point the nose it just puts me off the game completely. Hope this will be rectified for the final game. Little wonder that in the academy finals they used GT5.

If you get the chance to watch Best Motoring videos, you will see some drivers using the handbrake in slow corners and slides to point the nose. These are drivers that race in Super GT, Le Mans, F3. It is realistic physics.