Gran Turismo 7: How Trial Mountain Has Changed

[BCrljen]

Let's hope Grindelwald will be included in the GT7 it was only featured in GT2...some great memories running this great track

 

[CoolJetta3]

Gone will be the days of clipping that apex just right to get airborne and landing perfectly on the opposite side of the track. They better leave my baby Deep Forest alone! That one has the other classic final air chicane.

In the words of Spice Adams, "Aww man, they messing with a classic!"

 

[SebiGT89]

Now it can let +20 cars. It's just a little bit longer. (A LOT, but in the straights) no big deal. Any way, we have to wait.

 

[karelpipa]

with the almost launch of the GT7, the bad thing is the loss of interest in the previous game, and with the new PlayStation coming, the other model will start to become obsolete.
and devaluation will occur, and the new console will come to almost 5 thousand reais in Brazil!

Why its so expensive in Brazil?

 

[Ramosis]

Why its so expensive in Brazil?

Brazilian Real is a weak currency nowadays, and astonishing import taxes (last one to protect nacional industry, supposedly).

 

[SebiGT89]

Why its so expensive in Brazil?

And in Argentina? Let me get straight to it. I earn 240 u$d per month... So I have to save at least 3 months of work to afford a ps5 + GT7...

 

[Nowax]

Why its so expensive in Brazil?

South America is practically screwed up, the only way you can buy cheap, is whether going to Chile, Paraguay, or just another country outside South America, like USA, or even Europe.

 

[BrunusCL82]

Why its so expensive in Brazil?

The true? There were 30 years of widespread corruption. Very high tax burden to supply the holes in public coffers and the public debt.

 

[WheelmanSteve]

What's with that final chicane? Who let that rat-bast__ Tilke in?

 

[FPV MIC]

You may be correct, but the first part of the chicane in your picture looks to be more gentle a corner than what is depicted on the track map.

That picture is all we have to go on at this point in regards to the run off, and as I alluded to, it's early days and we won't know for sure until the track is released. I don't think it would be too hard for PD to make enough run off there, especially in the reverse direction.

 

[Ramosis]

The true? There were 30 years of widespread corruption. Very high tax burden to supply the holes in public coffers and the public debt.

Well... Since you mentioned that, this is what explains why Brazilian Real is a weak currency, and real need of the high taxes.

 

[Grand Prix]

The old final chicane gave a nice feeling when you nailed it and ended up gaining loads of time on the main straight, and I can't remember any crazy crashes there, maybe I had good company to race with in GT5-GT6. That said, I don't think I'll miss it too much. However, I feel they could have replaced it with something more interesting than a slow chicane.

The S curves after the first tunnel, the loop with the yellow stripes, and the S curves after that were the best part of Trial Mountain anyway. As long as they didn't mess up the flow of those sections too much it should be fine.

I'll miss the deciduous tree canopy on the back straight for photo mode.

 

[cleanLX]

I didn't read all the posts.
One of the most effective skills in racing is linking successive turns to build speed, and/or alter entry/exit on your opponent... flow if you will... now we have 2 heavy breaking zones... formula for single line racing and puntzville.
Sorry to be a Debbie-Downer.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I didn't read all the posts.
One of the most effective skills in racing is linking successive turns to build speed, and/or alter entry/exit on your opponent... flow if you will... now we have 2 heavy breaking zones... formula for single line racing and puntzville.
Sorry to be a Debbie-Downer.

To add to this, chicanes are the devil's work IMO and have no place on a fantasy track and really suck when they cut and paste them onto real race tracks. Running sim or race laps on a track like Zandvoort is pure pleasure. Running laps on Monza is pure boredom. There are only three real corners on Monza! It's shameful to put chicanes on fantasy tracks when they have all the freedom in the world to do as they please. Tight hairpins also slow cars down. Tight 90 degree bends can do the same.

 

[Grand Prix]

To add to this, chicanes are the devil's work IMO and have no place on a fantasy track and really suck when they cut and paste them onto real race tracks. Running sim or race laps on a track like Zandvoort is pure pleasure. Running laps on Monza is pure boredom. There are only three real corners on Monza! It's shameful to put chicanes on fantasy tracks when they have all the freedom in the world to do as they please. Tight hairpins also slow cars down. Tight 90 degree bends can do the same.

Agreed. It's not like they need to worry about space or infrastructure constraints on a fantasy track, but some people have been conditioned to like slow chicanes I guess. Lots of different things they could have put there other than a slow chicane.

 

[ScottPuss20]

To add to this, chicanes are the devil's work IMO and have no place on a fantasy track and really suck when they cut and paste them onto real race tracks. Running sim or race laps on a track like Zandvoort is pure pleasure. Running laps on Monza is pure boredom. There are only three real corners on Monza! It's shameful to put chicanes on fantasy tracks when they have all the freedom in the world to do as they please. Tight hairpins also slow cars down. Tight 90 degree bends can do the same.

It's been a while since you've posted here!

 

[PlasticBleach]

The chicane at the end used to be great because of the speed of it, it challenged people, there were different lines and massive consequences for getting it wrong. The above just looks like a generic slow chicane, I hope to be proved wrong.

The extra length of the circuit is inevitable, no issue there.

If it stayed the way it was, someone who screws the corner up would absolutely ruin the race for everyone behind them and maybe even one or two ahead.

 

[GT235]

Why its so expensive in Brazil?

Imagine paying 800 Dollars (R$ 4.000) for a PS4, because the Receita Federal (The Brazilian IRS) put a tax amount as if the PS4 was like a luxury item (like perfumes and etc.) and at the time the PS4 cost 399 Dollars at launch in the final of 2013, and where does this tax money go? Well, the money hardly goes to the services that the Brazilian population needs, you don't know what happens internally in Brazil, discovering things that they don't want you to know. And a certain percentage of the population, who are so poor that they are still playing with a PS2 because they have no money to buy consoles of 8th and now 9th generation.

And also the answers from the users above complement my explanation.

And I apologize for this truth, sometimes the truth has to be told.

 

[RacerTed]

There was a monkey in the trees and a Loch Ness monster? I never saw either of them!

 

[Cap'n Jack]

However, I feel they could have replaced it with something more interesting than a slow chicane.

I was thinking about this too. My thought was that instead of the aforementioned slow chicane, we could have a section inspired by Surfers Paradise’s beachside chicane.

With barriers on the inside of the apexes, there would be no option to cut the corners and we’d still get a fast paced curb hopping section without cars flying off the side of a dirt mound.

But then I’m weird and love track sections like that and the old Singapore Sling.

 

[05XR8]

View attachment 930647

That looks like the barrier is very close to the inside of the 120-degree left before the rumble strip, but it leaves a full car-width on the inside, which you could cut. There's significant apron on the left, to allow for quite a wide angle into the 90-degree right.

The barrier to the right looks pretty close throughout, but it's just shy of the right-hand apex - maybe half a car-width - allowing for some cutting.

I like that corner. If the barrier at 14 is before the grass, it won't be as bad as T1 at Lago. Sure, players can hit the barrier or get punted into it, but getting on that grass at Lago, is the worse.

 

[AllMightyVTEC]

Let's hope Grindelwald will be included in the GT7 it was only featured in GT2...some great memories running this great track

I’m pretty sure Eiger Nordwand was the new Grindelwald

 

[KinLM]

It's a change made for Sport mode reasons. This punishes solo players to pander to the Sport mode brigade. It is unacceptable and shows that PD still doesn't get it about GT. They never learn.

Not trying to call you out but I am genuinely surprised at how angry some people are about these relatively minor changes.

1. The track is largely the same. The straights are longer and a few corners were reprofiled, but I have no doubt it will still “feel” like Trial Mountain.

2. I don’t see why it’s so negative that it’s been changed for Sport mode. This is what brought me into being comfortable racing online in GT. I know it’s the same for many others. I’ve had countless amazing races in Sport mode and it’s made me love the game in a whole new way and realize how stale the campaign mode (and single player in general) is and how bad the AI is.

Yes they could try and work on the latter two, but I prefer more time spent on Sport mode. I believe it’s inherently better for the age we live in.

Old Trial Mountain would’ve sucked in Sport mode. So if it’s between having terrible Sport mode races here/not having the track at all, and this version, I will happily take this version.

3. I think the inclusion of this legacy tracks implies PD *does* understand what we want, not the opposite. They understand that, even with decent new original circuits (in terms of visuals, race-ability, etc) fans still realllllly want the return of originals. They went out of their way to somewhat redesign this track strictly so it *can* make a useful return in this gen.

That, to me, shows they DO understand. Unlike T10, who has neglected nearly all of their classic tracks and alienated me and countless others from their games ever since Forza 5.

Obviously this is mostly opinion based, and I fully respect yours as well as everybody that is upset. But in my mind I think the outrage is a bit excessive. Nobody has even driven on it yet. The original track will always be the “correct” way in old games. Don’t let rose tinted glasses get in the way of progress and create stagnation.

 

[GTxForza]

Looks pretty nice, I hope other original track designs will revamp too.

 

[Stefan Clift]

Let’s be honest, the changes were coming and I’m all for it!

Polyphony want Gran Turismo to be realistic, and Trail Mountain has been around basically unchanged since 1997.

I’m pretty sure, compared to the F1 calendar, only Melbourne and Suzuka have lasted that long without major changes

It’s not very realistic to have LMP1 cars curb hopping over a grass bank on the final chicane, so I can totally understand the changes

 

[G.T.Ace]

Let’s be honest, the changes were coming and I’m all for it!

Polyphony want Gran Turismo to be realistic, and Trail Mountain has been around basically unchanged since 1997.

I’m pretty sure, compared to the F1 calendar, only Melbourne and Suzuka have lasted that long without major changes

It’s not very realistic to have LMP1 cars curb hopping over a grass bank on the final chicane, so I can totally understand the changes

I actually wanted it to be more realistic since GT3.

 

[Samus]

Polyphony want Gran Turismo to be realistic

But based on what they've shown us so far, it's really not any more realistic than before. There are still exposed rockfaces on the exit of corners and no barriers around much of the track. Sure, it's early days and things can change but it's not like any of the fictional GTS tracks are particularly realistic either in terms of safety.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Not trying to call you out but I am genuinely surprised at how angry some people are about these relatively minor changes.

1. The track is largely the same. The straights are longer and a few corners were reprofiled, but I have no doubt it will still “feel” like Trial Mountain.

2. I don’t see why it’s so negative that it’s been changed for Sport mode. This is what brought me into being comfortable racing online in GT. I know it’s the same for many others. I’ve had countless amazing races in Sport mode and it’s made me love the game in a whole new way and realize how stale the campaign mode (and single player in general) is and how bad the AI is.

Yes they could try and work on the latter two, but I prefer more time spent on Sport mode. I believe it’s inherently better for the age we live in.

Old Trial Mountain would’ve sucked in Sport mode. So if it’s between having terrible Sport mode races here/not having the track at all, and this version, I will happily take this version.

3. I think the inclusion of this legacy tracks implies PD *does* understand what we want, not the opposite. They understand that, even with decent new original circuits (in terms of visuals, race-ability, etc) fans still realllllly want the return of originals. They went out of their way to somewhat redesign this track strictly so it *can* make a useful return in this gen.

That, to me, shows they DO understand. Unlike T10, who has neglected nearly all of their classic tracks and alienated me and countless others from their games ever since Forza 5.

Obviously this is mostly opinion based, and I fully respect yours as well as everybody that is upset. But in my mind I think the outrage is a bit excessive. Nobody has even driven on it yet. The original track will always be the “correct” way in old games. Don’t let rose tinted glasses get in the way of progress and create stagnation.

I'm not angry about it. Just annoyed. Yes the track does look largely the same but they added a whole mile to the track and why? Online racing. That shows the total lack of understanding what the majority want. Sport mode isn't for everybody. If it is for you then good for you, but it is not for me. Making totally unnecessary changes like this is bad for everyone else. The take up of the Trophy you have to get to do any online racing in GTS is 33.7% You only have to watch a pair of two minute videos to get it.... Gaming itself, for most, is a hobby to be enjoyed after work or after you've done your homework, not the sweatfest of competitive online competition that eSports represent. Making changes like this for a minority is just not a good idea overall.

Every year GameFAQ runs a poll on online vs offline importance. The results haven't changed much at all over the years.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/2234-how-important-is-it-that-a-game-you-buy-has-online-play

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/4483-how-important-is-it-that-a-game-you-buy-has-online-play

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/5478-if-you-could-only-play-single-player-or-multiplayer-games

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/6012-if-you-could-only-play-single-player-or-multiplayer-games

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/6339-how-important-is-it-that-a-game-you-buy-has-online-play

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/6827-if-you-could-only-play-single-player-or-multiplayer-games

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/7005-how-important-is-it-that-a-game-you-buy-has-online-play

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/7704-if-you-could-only-play-single-player-or-multiplayer-games

The results are conclusive of one fact. The majority of the player base wants one thing and the developer thinks they want a different thing. That is why I think PD doesn't understand their own game anymore. Kaz was surprised by people at esport events choosing to play the earlier games and admitted to forgetting about them. Understandable as his focus has to be on what he is developing at the time so it is easy to lose sight of what put you in that position in the first place.

I've heard the rose tint argument before on the Destiny 2 forum when players say D1 was better than D2. I have to point out that both D1 and D2 sit next to each other on my PS4 so no. There are no rose tints involved. Likewise my PS3 is still in full use thanks to a lack of backwards compatibility. The rose tint argument is nonexistent.

It's good to see this much activity after just one demo. I hope it won't be too long before we see more. Final judgement can wait until the game is out.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Yes the track does look largely the same but they added a whole mile to the track and why? Online racing. That shows the total lack of understanding what the majority want.

I think you're conflating two things here, I don't care about sport mode, that doesn't mean I want the track to be identical to what it was 23 years ago.

Making totally unnecessary changes like this is bad for everyone else

Why is it bad for everyone else?

 

[Tired Tyres]

I think you're conflating two things here, I don't care about sport mode, that doesn't mean I want the track to be identical to what it was 23 years ago.



Why is it bad for everyone else?

As in everyone else who doesn't like it.