Gran Turismo 7 Physics

[Voodoovaj]

It's not a physics issue though. It's that you and others are not pleased with how PD is managing gameplay with a controller.

People - please understand the difference.


On another note. I love that the new TT is a traditional front engined RWD road car. This will put the physics to the test for all to see given how much slip and oversteer such a combo will allow.

IMO so far so good. Epically beautiful driving from the top times.

Did I say it was physics? Yes, I know this is a physics thread, but steering does play into the physics.

Comparing against my own friends list in GTS to GT7, I am 4 SECONDS a lap slower in this week's Sardegna race compared to people I am normally on par with (or faster than) in GTS.

Not being able to turn the car is a pretty valid reason for not playing a racing game.

You can build an entire rig for 1 k

I could also mortgage the house and go buy a real Porsche GT3RS, but those solutions are likewise frivolous. Don't get me wrong, if the cost of a nice rig floats your boat, have at it. It's not my cup of tea, especially after 25 years of happily playing with a controller.

 

[Galvston]

The new Logitech G PRO seems to enhance this game a lot, going by reviews from Boosted Media, Random Callsign and Jordan from this site.

It costs 1K the wheel plus the pedals around 350$ so it's a BUCK, but it seems to make GT7 much better FFB-wise. I would love to try it

 

[BigSarj]

The new Logitech G PRO seems to enhance this game a lot, going by reviews from Boosted Media, Random Callsign and Jordan from this site.

It costs 1K the wheel plus the pedals around 350$ so it's a BUCK, but it seems to make GT7 much better FFB-wise. I would love to try it

But the pedals aren't getting the very best of reviews. It does seem like it would be fun, though. A part of me wishes PD would improve the FFB so I wouldn't be wanting more.

I wonder if competitors will work on developing their own type of TrueForce.

 

[Galvston]

But the pedals aren't getting the very best of reviews. It does seem like it would be fun, though. A part of me wishes PD would improve the FFB so I wouldn't be wanting more.

I wonder if competitors will work on developing their own type of TrueForce.

I've seen it. Pedals aren't the best out there. But I'm curious about why GT7 and ACC fit with the TrueForce API

 

[Monkey Man]

I think with the right (stiffer, 3rd-party maybe) bushes inserted, the brake pedal could be fantastic.

Time will tell, but I'm optimistic that it won't be as bad as some have made it out to be.

 

[Yard_Sale]

Only focusing on solo driving on a track is pretty limiting though. If that's your yardstick then you're not going to find that many people in the same boat as you.

Which is fine and why a lot of more casual players prefer a console. GT has always been a great entry into the world of sim racing because it's so simple to get into.

Absolutely, as long as you're fine with accepting an experience that is good but not great. GT7 does absolutely fine if you just want a big roster and lots of cars without much fuss, but it does that by not being particularly exceptional at it.

If you're happy with the quality of the experience you're getting from GT7 then cool. If you can't tell the difference between GT7 and the more advanced sims, so much the better for you. But some people can, and that's why they're considered to be better simulators. Just because I can't tell the difference between a $50 bottle of wine and a $1000 bottle of wine doesn't mean that I assume that they're both basically the same.

What’s the general consensus on the best way to sim race with PC? Triples? Single monitor? VR??

I’m not totally set on supplementing my console racing with PC yet. It really depends on the PSVR2 implementation on GT7, and if they de-nerf the FFB. My main reason for even entertaining the idea is my ongoing pursuit of realism. I’m realistically 6 months away from making the jump, but it’s never too early to really start educating myself on PC’s, titles and such.

 

[Scaff]

What’s the general consensus on the best way to sim race with PC? Triples? Single monitor? VR??

I’m not totally set on supplementing my console racing with PC yet. It really depends on the PSVR2 implementation on GT7, and if they de-nerf the FFB. My main reason for even entertaining the idea is my ongoing pursuit of realism. I’m realistically 6 months away from making the jump, but it’s never too early to really start educating myself on PC’s, titles and such.

Personally I run a combo of VR and a 55" single screen on PC, VR for the majority of titles and the single for the small number of titles that can't run on VR.

I also find it unlikely that GT7 will ever come close to the FFB of the majority of PC titles, they need to do far more that just de-nerf it, they've never even close to close to it previously.

 

[John_Marsten]

Personally I run a combo of VR and a 55" single screen on PC, VR for the majority of titles and the single for the small number of titles that can't run on VR.

I also find it unlikely that GT7 will ever come close to the FFB of the majority of PC titles, they need to do far more that just de-nerf it, they've never even close to close to it previously.

I pretty much do the exact same thing. I would love to try triples out.

 

[Yard_Sale]

Personally I run a combo of VR and a 55" single screen on PC, VR for the majority of titles and the single for the small number of titles that can't run on VR.

I also find it unlikely that GT7 will ever come close to the FFB of the majority of PC titles, they need to do far more that just de-nerf it, they've never even close to close to it previously.

Gotcha. My VR experience is only the very limited content GTS gave us with PSVR. But I could immediately see the potential. It also got pretty steamy inside the goggles too, but it wasn’t a deal breaker by a long shot.

I agree with you that a lot more needs to be done to GT7’s FFB then a simple De-nerf. It’s crazy how they seemingly clip their own signal compared to the likes of ACC on console.

My current setup that I’m still slowly unboxing and bolting together (the inevitable result of someone who has ADD, too many hobbies and not enough time) is an 80/20 rig with a 55” smack dab in front.

- fun fact, I’m still using my playseat challenge that I coincidentally modeled after one of your older YouTube videos. Didn’t realize for the longest time it was you 😂

….anyways, I race exclusively in cockpit view regardless of the title, but being able to have my “helmet” look through the corners (a la ACC and PC2 - I think) is baaaaaarely enough where I could do without triples. Maybe. Besides, it seems like most of the PC streamers that I know of use a single monitor. Maybe that’s just a necessary mechanism needed to stream - with the cameras and all. Idk.

Regardless, I’m willing to drop 3k into a complete setup. What’s a good VR set for sim racing cost? $700 I wot? Also, what titles don’t support VR? Now that I’m thinking of it, I think a setup similar to yours will be where I land, being that I’m still going to be playing GT7, and I’m assuming I’m not always going to want to be inside a headset. Those things can become sensory overload after a while.



Edit:

So it seems there’s a large discrepancy in prices for VR sets. The majority seem to be ~$500 with a couple being substantially more - which there’s no way I’m doing. Regardless, it’s cheaper than I thought, and seemingly cheaper than triples. @John_Marsten and @Scaff, what are long sessions like in vr sets? What’s the realistic max time you can go before needing to unplug for a few minutes.

Sorry for the brief hijack of this thread btw.

 

[F30clubman]

I agree with you that a lot more needs to be done to GT7’s FFB then a simple De-nerf. It’s crazy how they seemingly clip their own signal compared to the likes of ACC on console.

Agree. By coincidence I reinstalled AC (even not ACC) on my PS4 this week and tried the M3 E30 and F40 on Barcelona, combinations I know well in GT7. I think physics of AC and GT7 are close, but the FFB of AC feels much more realistic imo.

GT7 scores all its points on visuals, replays, ghost, and variety of cars and tracks, but its FFB is really miserable.

 

[dimedancing]

I've seen it. Pedals aren't the best out there. But I'm curious about why GT7 and ACC fit with the TrueForce API

Dunno about the Pro but with the G923 the trueforce implementation is great in GT7. It doesn’t so much process audio as it does use high-frequency vibrations to communicate level of grip. So when you’re accelerating, it vibrates slightly at lower revs to let you know the wheels are still connecting, and then once they hook up, the vibration smooths out. It also does something similar with lateral grip in corners. So it’s not just a gimmick; it actually provides useful information.

Then there’s the haptic feedback, which transmits shift clunks and the Tokyo expansion gaps, and that feels great (more immersive than useful, though).

Finally, there is a small amount of audio feedback, but it’s mostly on big, loud engines, and it’s pretty subtle.

The only real downside is that the major forces are fairly weak, but the Pro should solve that. If I had the money, I wouldn’t hesitate; personally I love the FFB in GT7, and I suspect the wheel is a big part of it. The G923 gets dismissed in sim racing circles a lot, but from what reviews are saying about the Pro, a lot of it still applies to the cheaper model, minus the 11NM.

Although I did try the new ACC 1.8 update and didn’t like it as much; it feels gritty and noisy and vague to me, not as good a use of the trueforce API to my taste. It depends on what you’re used to, I guess, and six months of GT7 have really cemented it as my favourite FFB implementation.

 

[br1x]

Dunno about the Pro but with the G923 the trueforce implementation is great in GT7. It doesn’t so much process audio as it does use high-frequency vibrations to communicate level of grip. So when you’re accelerating, it vibrates slightly at lower revs to let you know the wheels are still connecting, and then once they hook up, the vibration smooths out. It also does something similar with lateral grip in corners. So it’s not just a gimmick; it actually provides useful information.

Then there’s the haptic feedback, which transmits shift clunks and the Tokyo expansion gaps, and that feels great (more immersive than useful, though).

Finally, there is a small amount of audio feedback, but it’s mostly on big, loud engines, and it’s pretty subtle.

The only real downside is that the major forces are fairly weak, but the Pro should solve that. If I had the money, I wouldn’t hesitate; personally I love the FFB in GT7, and I suspect the wheel is a big part of it. The G923 gets dismissed in sim racing circles a lot, but from what reviews are saying about the Pro, a lot of it still applies to the cheaper model, minus the 11NM.

Although I did try the new ACC 1.8 update and didn’t like it as much; it feels gritty and noisy and vague to me, not as good a use of the trueforce API to my taste. It depends on what you’re used to, I guess, and six months of GT7 have really cemented it as my favourite FFB implementation.

Judging from the reviews I have seen, the Trueforce of the Logitech Pro seems to be on another level entirely. Sadly the price is on another level as well compared to even the Fanatec DD pro and the (currently required for console use) pedals are extremely expensive as well while not being all that great. For a total of about 1500€ in my region, that package is pretty bad value for money in my opinion.

Hopefully the Thrustmaster DD wheel that is around the corner can deliver a much better priced package.

 

[Yard_Sale]

Judging from the reviews I have seen, the Trueforce of the Logitech Pro seems to be on another level entirely. Sadly the price is on another level as well compared to even the Fanatec DD pro and the (currently required for console use) pedals are extremely expensive as well while not being all that great. For a total of about 1500€ in my region, that package is pretty bad value for money in my opinion.

Hopefully the Thrustmaster DD wheel that is around the corner can deliver a much better priced package.

I’ll be curious to see what the aftermarket does with those pedals. They definitely seem to be the weak link. It seems like they knocked it out of the park with the base though. 11nm seems to be the sweet spot power-wise

 

[Scaff]

Gotcha. My VR experience is only the very limited content GTS gave us with PSVR. But I could immediately see the potential. It also got pretty steamy inside the goggles too, but it wasn’t a deal breaker by a long shot.

I agree with you that a lot more needs to be done to GT7’s FFB then a simple De-nerf. It’s crazy how they seemingly clip their own signal compared to the likes of ACC on console.

My current setup that I’m still slowly unboxing and bolting together (the inevitable result of someone who has ADD, too many hobbies and not enough time) is an 80/20 rig with a 55” smack dab in front.

- fun fact, I’m still using my playseat challenge that I coincidentally modeled after one of your older YouTube videos. Didn’t realize for the longest time it was you 😂

….anyways, I race exclusively in cockpit view regardless of the title, but being able to have my “helmet” look through the corners (a la ACC and PC2 - I think) is baaaaaarely enough where I could do without triples. Maybe. Besides, it seems like most of the PC streamers that I know of use a single monitor. Maybe that’s just a necessary mechanism needed to stream - with the cameras and all. Idk.

Regardless, I’m willing to drop 3k into a complete setup. What’s a good VR set for sim racing cost? $700 I wot? Also, what titles don’t support VR? Now that I’m thinking of it, I think a setup similar to yours will be where I land, being that I’m still going to be playing GT7, and I’m assuming I’m not always going to want to be inside a headset. Those things can become sensory overload after a while.

The challenge was a great rig, loved mine and it did me well for years, I run a Quest 2 for VR, but for $700 your going to be able to step up from that. with triples you have to keep in mind that you GPU is having to do 3x the work, which is why a lot of people avoid them and have gone down the single/VR combo.

Agree. By coincidence I reinstalled AC (even not ACC) on my PS4 this week and tried the M3 E30 and F40 on Barcelona, combinations I know well in GT7. I think physics of AC and GT7 are close, but the FFB of AC feels much more realistic imo.

GT7 scores all its points on visuals, replays, ghost, and variety of cars and tracks, but its FFB is really miserable.

Nah GT7's still behind AC even on console, and if you ever move to PC it then loses out on just about all of your other areas as well.

Dunno about the Pro but with the G923 the trueforce implementation is great in GT7. It doesn’t so much process audio as it does use high-frequency vibrations to communicate level of grip. So when you’re accelerating, it vibrates slightly at lower revs to let you know the wheels are still connecting, and then once they hook up, the vibration smooths out. It also does something similar with lateral grip in corners. So it’s not just a gimmick; it actually provides useful information.

Then there’s the haptic feedback, which transmits shift clunks and the Tokyo expansion gaps, and that feels great (more immersive than useful, though).

Finally, there is a small amount of audio feedback, but it’s mostly on big, loud engines, and it’s pretty subtle.

The only real downside is that the major forces are fairly weak, but the Pro should solve that. If I had the money, I wouldn’t hesitate; personally I love the FFB in GT7, and I suspect the wheel is a big part of it. The G923 gets dismissed in sim racing circles a lot, but from what reviews are saying about the Pro, a lot of it still applies to the cheaper model, minus the 11NM.

Although I did try the new ACC 1.8 update and didn’t like it as much; it feels gritty and noisy and vague to me, not as good a use of the trueforce API to my taste. It depends on what you’re used to, I guess, and six months of GT7 have really cemented it as my favourite FFB implementation.

Trueforce is nothing more than limited tactile feedback, and it's not really doing anything that a tactile set-up can't already do (with fewer options and supporting fewer titles in many cases), as a 'freebie' on the G923 I can see its appeal, but having tried one a few times, it doesn't offer what a full tactile set-up does.

All working across 74 titles, supporting 4-point tactile feedback and providing subtle and in-your-face feedback as required.

 

[F30clubman]

Dunno about the Pro but with the G923 the trueforce implementation is great in GT7. It doesn’t so much process audio as it does use high-frequency vibrations to communicate level of grip. So when you’re accelerating, it vibrates slightly at lower revs to let you know the wheels are still connecting, and then once they hook up, the vibration smooths out. It also does something similar with lateral grip in corners. So it’s not just a gimmick; it actually provides useful information.

Then there’s the haptic feedback, which transmits shift clunks and the Tokyo expansion gaps, and that feels great (more immersive than useful, though).

Finally, there is a small amount of audio feedback, but it’s mostly on big, loud engines, and it’s pretty subtle.

I'm still using a G29, but you're convincing me to try the G923 here. (the Pro being too expensive).

Edit: that was before I read Scaffs reply ...

 

[Yard_Sale]

The challenge was a great rig, loved mine and it did me well for years, I run a Quest 2 for VR, but for $700 your going to be able to step up from that. with triples you have to keep in mind that you GPU is having to do 3x the work, which is why a lot of people avoid them and have gone down the single/VR combo.

Nah GT7's still behind AC even on console, and if you ever move to PC it then loses out on just about all of your other areas as well.

Trueforce is nothing more than limited tactile feedback, and it's not really doing anything that a tactile set-up can't already do (with fewer options and supporting fewer titles in many cases), as a 'freebie' on the G923 I can see its appeal, but having tried one a few times, it doesn't offer what a full tactile set-up does.


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All working across 74 titles, supporting 4-point tactile feedback and providing subtle and in-your-face feedback as required.

Ugh, I knew about a year ago that I was going to eventually end up down the PC road, which means a whole new skill set to acquire. Looks like it’s time to start doing research. Thanks for the input

 

[Voodoovaj]

btw, steering input with the controller has been greatly improved in the new version

On Sardengna, I went from mid 56's to high 52's. It's still a problem because I have ot brake earlier than I like and it still takes more time than necessary to go to full lock, but it's better.

 

[dimedancing]

Trueforce is nothing more than limited tactile feedback, and it's not really doing anything that a tactile set-up can't already do (with fewer options and supporting fewer titles in many cases), as a 'freebie' on the G923 I can see its appeal, but having tried one a few times, it doesn't offer what a full tactile set-up does.


All working across 74 titles, supporting 4-point tactile feedback and providing subtle and in-your-face feedback as required.

Looks like an absolute nightmare to me. I don’t want to have 30 sliders to adjust; I want the developers to program the feedback they think is appropriate and for it to be plug and play. Of course the low-end G923 is not going to do what an expensive, complicated transducer setup does. It’s going to do a watered-down version of it that’s tuned for GT7 and works perfectly out of the box.

I’d rather get used to the developer’s idea of what good FFB is in their game than spend endless hours tweaking pages of settings. I realized that when Aris from Kunos mentioned in his How to FFB video that fewer options are better; I agree with him.

 

[Scaff]

Looks like an absolute nightmare to me. I don’t want to have 30 sliders to adjust; I want the developers to program the feedback they think is appropriate and for it to be plug and play. Of course the low-end G923 is not going to do what an expensive, complicated transducer setup does. It’s going to do a watered-down version of it that’s tuned for GT7 and works perfectly out of the box.

The amount of adjustment I've had to do for the majority of titles is zero, as long as the telemetry feed is good then the tactile experience will be good, the set-up allows for fine-tuning if you wish or the ability to switch off any elements you don't like. Nor do transducer set-ups need to be expensive, mine certainly wasn't.

I’d rather get used to the developer’s idea of what good FFB is in their game than spend endless hours tweaking pages of settings. I realized that when Aris from Kunos mentioned in his How to FFB video that fewer options are better; I agree with him.

As do I, but that relies on a number of things, the first is the FFB actually being good out of the box (AC's is excellent, GT7's is poor), the ironic thing is also the majority of PC users of AC will use Content Manager to fine-tune the FFB as well.

As I mentioned, if your getting the Trueforce as an effective freebie with the G293 great, but it has some serious limitations to its implementation, and this is based on experience with both that wheel and a standalone tactile set-up.

All of which is aside from the discussion that tactile isn't arguably FFB, not in the truest sense of feelings you would realistically get via a steering wheel in reality), a point Aris from Kunos also knows, as the kind of effects being discussed are canned in AC!

 

[dimedancing]

As do I, but that relies on a number of things, the first is the FFB actually being good out of the box (AC's is excellent, GT7's is poor),

Gotta agree to disagree, I guess, because I like the FFB in GT7 a lot; for me it feels more predictable and communicative than either AC game. I'm sure a big factor is just what you're used to, though. It's hard to switch to a different game where the same type of feedback might be used to communicate something different.

 

[Scaff]

Gotta agree to disagree, I guess, because I like the FFB in GT7 a lot; for me it feels more predictable and communicative than either AC game. I'm sure a big factor is just what you're used to, though. It's hard to switch to a different game where the same type of feedback might be used to communicate something different.

The issue I have work GT7 feedback is that it's simply not accurate to reality, just about any other title work as reality does, GT7 doesn't (in particular in regards to understeer). I can switch between AMS (either), RaceRoom, PC2, Rfactor 2, AC, ACC, etc without issue, they all approach FFB in a realistic manner, GT stand pretty much alone in how it approaches it (and it doesn't match reality, which is the benchmark).

On top of that its seriously lacking in detail, and owners shouldn't need to buy one of two specific wheels to get it added back in via a transducer.

 

[Galvston]

GT7 FFB may be poor, but TrueForce seems to fit right in with it, and make the experience better. That's from reviews of the G PRO DD wheel from logitech

 

[Scaff]

GT7 FFB may be poor, but TrueForce seems to fit right in with it, and make the experience better. That's from reviews of the G PRO DD wheel from logitech

As does a tactile setup, because that's what Trueforce is!

It's a small tactile puck inside the wheel.

 

[Beezer215]

Looks like an absolute nightmare to me. I don’t want to have 30 sliders to adjust; I want the developers to program the feedback they think is appropriate and for it to be plug and play. Of course the low-end G923 is not going to do what an expensive, complicated transducer setup does. It’s going to do a watered-down version of it that’s tuned for GT7 and works perfectly out of the box.

I’d rather get used to the developer’s idea of what good FFB is in their game than spend endless hours tweaking pages of settings. I realized that when Aris from Kunos mentioned in his How to FFB video that fewer options are better; I agree with him.

Quite the opposite of a nightmare and just necessary usable features on what you'd expect in a higher end wheel.
You'd rather get used to what a developers idea of what FFB is? For a whole market of wheels that exist from different manufactures? For a whole genre of Sim titles who have different developers with different interpretations on different sim/physics engines? How does that make anything better when if you're jumping from rF2 to AMS2 to ACC and you want to turn FX down in one or have more damping in say rF2 than in ACC?
If you want to enjoy plug and play, like something more of a game, like GT7 you already mentioned, and that's good enough for you, so be it, but if others are spending 1000 on a base, they're going to want features.
You can save the different settings in all these major sims and the wheel base anyways so it's mostly a set one time and then forget. Or the occasional fine tune here or there.

 

[FerrariF40]

So has FFB now improved, or not ?

 

[ScottPuss20]

The steering wheels seem ridiculously complex to tune and set up compared to a controller.

 

[Scaff]

The steering wheels seem ridiculously complex to tune and set up compared to a controller.

Not really (and if you're referring to what I posted earlier - that's an optional set-up for tactile units, not wheels).

However devs have a massive advantage with controllers in two ways, the first is that (for consoles) they are a fixed and known piece of hardware, you don't have to account for example, for models that have differing torque outputs or rotation ranges. The second is that for a lot of titles controllers have a mass of unremovable assists that are often required, such as non-linear steering mapping (titles that have offered 1:1 steering mapping such as Richard Burns Rally are almost uncontrollable with a controller).

At the end of the day, it's a trade-off.

Controllers are literally plug-and-play, but they blanket your input with assists that unquestionably put a barrier between you and the physics engine of the title, by how much will vary, but it's always going to exist.

Wheels are near plug-and-play, and for some titles will require close to no tweaking, but they may need it and more importantly, most titles allow it, allowing for more granular control and more importantly 1:1 mapping of the input to the physics engine.

Now the above is mainly true, however, some titles will buck that trend, Project Cars had poor controller implementation until the third title, and GT as a series has never got FFB right, not just in terms of the level of detail possible, but how it actually works in regard to reality.

 

[Yard_Sale]

Not really (and if you're referring to what I posted earlier - that's an optional set-up for tactile units, not wheels).

However devs have a massive advantage with controllers in two ways, the first is that (for consoles) they are a fixed and known piece of hardware, you don't have to account for example, for models that have differing torque outputs or rotation ranges. The second is that for a lot of titles controllers have a mass of unremovable assists that are often required, such as non-linear steering mapping (titles that have offered 1:1 steering mapping such as Richard Burns Rally are almost uncontrollable with a controller).

At the end of the day, it's a trade-off.

Controllers are literally plug-and-play, but they blanket your input with assists that unquestionably put a barrier between you and the physics engine of the title, by how much will vary, but it's always going to exist.

Wheels are near plug-and-play, and for some titles will require close to no tweaking, but they may need it and more importantly, most titles allow it, allowing for more granular control and more importantly 1:1 mapping of the input to the physics engine.

Now the above is mainly true, however, some titles will buck that trend, Project Cars had poor controller implementation until the third title, and GT as a series has never got FFB right, not just in terms of the level of detail possible, but how it actually works in regard to reality.

I know you’re mainly a PC guy, but from what you know, is the built-in transducers within the Logitech wheel base pulling information from the FFB coding? Or is it pulling information from the very limited “sound options” that PD gives us; in terms of their adjustable sound levels of:

Engine noise
Transmission
Tire Squeal
Opponents engine noise

I’ve read online how there’s round-about ways of getting a transducer to work in GT7 via the audio port in the DS5. From what time be gathered, the only information that you’ll get conveyed to you by a transducer in GT7, will based on the aforementioned parameters, with probably rumble strips and the like thrown in.

Just trying to figure out if Logitech’s implementation is pulling different data.












… on a related note, I think this whole Fanatec-PD partnership has been one big missed opportunity. I would have for sure thought that Fanatec and PD would have developed GT7 licensed peripherals such as button boxes, dashes, transducers ect. If anything to take advantage of the built in customer base by the virtue of being the official wheel. Then secondly, I would think that relationship would justify the R&D costs of creating said peripherals under the “Fanatec” umbrella, effectively covering every corner of the Sim Racing equipment market.

Of course we all expected better FFB implementation from a Fanatec-PD partnership. Maybe we’ll get there. But it’s probably wishful thinking at this point.

 

[Scaff]

I know you’re mainly a PC guy, but from what you know, is the built-in transducers within the Logitech wheel base pulling information from the FFB coding? Or is it pulling information from the very limited “sound options” that PD gives us; in terms of their adjustable sound levels of:

Engine noise
Transmission
Tire Squeal
Opponents engine noise

I’ve read online how there’s round-about ways of getting a transducer to work in GT7 via the audio port in the DS5. From what time be gathered, the only information that you’ll get conveyed to you by a transducer in GT7, will based on the aforementioned parameters, with probably rumble strips and the like thrown in.

Just trying to figure out if Logitech’s implementation is pulling different data.












… on a related note, I think this whole Fanatec-PD partnership has been one big missed opportunity. I would have for sure thought that Fanatec and PD would have developed GT7 licensed peripherals such as button boxes, dashes, transducers ect. If anything to take advantage of the built in customer base by the virtue of being the official wheel. Then secondly, I would think that relationship would justify the R&D costs of creating said peripherals under the “Fanatec” umbrella, effectively covering every corner of the Sim Racing equipment market.

Of course we all expected better FFB implementation from a Fanatec-PD partnership. Maybe we’ll get there. But it’s probably wishful thinking at this point.

You can run a transducer either via audio, which is what I used to do for console, I just split the sub-woofer audio out of my AV receiver and fed it into an amp designed for transducers (in my case a Reckhorn 2.1, designed for AV use - but works well with sim rigs). Audio gives you compatibility with every title, but it does limit what can be fed to it, so your not going to get slip info from the wheels for example.

To get full use out of a transducer you need to run it from the titles telemetry via UDP, it is possible to do this from console, but the number of titles that support it is limited, as you will see from the linked list, PC compatibility is far, far greater than console when it comes to telemetry based outputs, and you will still need a laptop or PC to obtain the UDP feed and then talk to your transducer via an amp.

I don't know how the Logitech system works, but to a large degree, it doesn't really matter, as you need a system running at least 2 transducers (and distance between them to feel slip well via such a system. As an example, I run three, two either side of my pedal base to get left/right feeds and a larger one for overall effects, and a bigger low-end kick from jump landings, collisions, etc

 

[FrankieStail]

Whilst the thrustmaster tgt wheels do run a transducer, the true force Logitech wheels do not use any other hardware other than a different motor driver that ups the ffb signal to 4000hz.

Hardware differences aside they work to produce similar end results in that they produce a tactile feedback, although a multi transducer physics driven system will of course produce much better results.

For my money at least on console, the most cost effective way to get similar results is to use something like a buttkicker.