Gran Turismo 7 Update 1.52 Discussion Thread

[PuffelPizza]

There's also a hardtop ND version, the RF, that feels very PD-like to add.

It's in the infamous datamine.

 

[mynameis66]

I'm a novice sim racer, recently upgrading to a force feedback wheel, cockpit, and haptics. Before update 1.49/1.50, I used a controller, but the shift in feel pushed me to invest in better gear for more precision in steering and braking. I'm not an expert; just sharing my thoughts.

I find the new physics frustrating. Although update 1.50 wasn't perfect, it offered more realistic handling characteristics and ride dynamics. Tires, especially comfort and sport ones, were almost unusable, but racing tires were nearly perfect, and weren't as grippy as they were in 1.47, providing more gradual traction loss, requiring precise steering, throttle and brake control. The issue I had with 1.50, was that once the rear broke loose, and if you didn't catch it immediately, the momentum seemed too high, making recovery nearly impossible, leading to the car spinning ad infinitum.

Now, with 1.52, sports soft and racing tires on some cars stick too well to the road. It feels like the rear end is glued to the ground. When accelerating, the rear downforce loads the suspension, but under heavy braking, the front loads up while the rear feels as if it remains stuck to the ground, causing understeer. (I admit that this may be due to my inexperience and poor technique.)

Transitioning from off-track surfaces to the track has improved, but the grip on the track is excessively strong. If I spin on the grass and hit the track, the car quickly "locks" onto it, which reduces endless spins but feels abrupt and unnatural. I'm also frustrated by the return of snap oversteer. In addition, some cars flip during braking. This happens more with short-wheelbase vehicles, like the '09 Abarth on racing soft tires. I know that racing softs might be overkill for such a car, but they are essential for time trials where I need maximum grip. I hadn't encountered this problem before.

Overall, I'm finding the game less enjoyable. PD needs to stop making so many dramatic changes to the game's physics. I don't expect 1:1 translation from real life to a sim. But, I would at least like what I am feeling and my response s in-game to somewhat be analogous to what I would experience IRL.

I'm disappointed because for me, Gran Turismo provides an excellent sim racing experience. The car modeling, sound design, and attention to environmental details are fantastic, delivering, to me, an experience that I have not gotten from other sims.

Just curious but what do you mean by comfort and sports tyres were almost unusable on update 1.50 ? Ive never noticed this,maybe different driving styles,im not what you call fast,my lap time on Tokyo for example,were similair before and after the update.The only real issues I had were the iffy suspension settings on some cars but they seem better now,I also dont class GT7 as a sim,more a simcade,even though I hate that term.Just my opinion mind.

 

[GlamFM]

If I spin on the grass and hit the track, the car quickly "locks" onto it, which reduces endless spins but feels abrupt and unnatural.

I don't really notice anything you are describing, but this part I actually disagree with. So much so that I'm wondering if you maybe have some assists turned on without noticing it?

Anyway the big change from 1.50 to 1.52 that I do notice is the ABS now working and that change I do like a lot.

 

[Voodoovaj]

"Resetting and settling on suspension" IN the GTAuto brake caliper color selection does not mean it's broken, if this is the only evidence of "bouncing " you have, not seeing any proof that it bounces in any appreciable way during a race, I rest my case that you have not proven that GT7 is a broken game.
Case dismissed on lack of evidence.

Oh, sorry, I should have made it more clear that my post was sarcasm

I agree with your conclusion. Physics has changed and people need to adapt. I'm seeing minor annoyances at worst.

You may not want to argue with anyone, but your post is destined to trigger @Voodoovaj.

Seriously though, the suspension issues are causing me to play the game less. I’m finding myself choosing cars and circuits where I’m least likely to encounter the bug, so lately I’ve stopped driving the Nordschleife. Sad. PD is taking too long to address this.

You should have asked if the car was tuned before the physics updates or after. Also, there's a host of video of cars around the Nordschleife being launched into the air or rolling over from hitting the curbs, which are sizeable.

Any issue with handling that i have encountered has been a couple clicks away from disappearing altogether.

Maybe it isn't "sad" that PD is not addressing it. Maybe there's nothing to address.

 

[TheAdmiester]

There are a few nagging things that I'd really love the "suspension bug deniers" to address:

- Why use footage (or worse, still images) of Gr. cars to discredit what people have explained is a bug that affects softer cars?

- If it's a skill issue, why do the infamously careful and conservative AI hop all over the place whenever they're driving the old Ferrari Mondial?

- If it's "simply how these old cars behave" then why didn't they do it before now? Was the game unrealistic before? But if it's realistic then why is there no footage of any old cars exhibiting the same behaviour at, say, Goodwood Revival events?

- If it's a skill issue, please explain how a stock Lancer Evo can pull a stoppie under braking

 

[Nielsen]

Physics has changed and people need to adapt. I'm seeing minor annoyances at worst.

It’s amazing how you seem to think PD is never going to tweak the suspension physics again and likely iron out these odd suspension wobbles.

 

[SuperSportX]

A positive i've noticed since the suspension tweaks is that cars that atleast for me were very unstable seem to perform fine now, the F40 when upgraded and the Corvette C6 when heavily modded randomly veered to the left or right under braking for the AI and the F40 used to be incredibly twitchy when I drove it myself. The C6 was the worst of the 2 as it even veered to the left on the Mulsanne straight during a custom race when driven by AI but the issues seem to be fixed now, though I have the cars running default suspensions since I recall reading somewhere on here that running cars with the racing suspension could sometimes cause it to be overly twitchy.

 

[Nielsen]

Supra​

Currently in the game: A70, A80, 2 GR Supras; also the FT-1 if you want to count it
DLC Count: 0

Notes: Similar to the 86, I think they've squeezed all of the juice that's currently there, but the moment there's something new I imagine PD will be on it quickly.

I think it’s very likely they’ll add another variant of the A70. The Supra 2.5GT Twin Turbo R ‘90 to be specific, being a staple from older GT titles. I believe it’s slightly faster than the 3.0GT Turbo A currently in GT7. It also comes with multiple colour options unlike the Turbo A, which is a rare homologation special.

Also, A60 Supra? The JDM version is called Celica XX, but it’s part of the Supra lineage. Standard car in GT6.

 

[Voodoovaj]

It’s amazing how you seem to think PD is never going to tweak the suspension physics again and likely iron out these odd suspension wobbles.

And THERE it is. It's a few oddities at worst.

Remember the BMW 3.0 CS at launch? undriveable because there rear snapped at the mere suggestion of a turn. Now, it's fantastic. Might there be additional alterations to the system? Maybe. But is what is occurring at the moment anything close to the 1.49 issue of cars launching into space? No. it's a minor annoyance, and it can be totally tuned out of every car.

I have managed to remove odd behaviors within 1 or 2 visits to the tuning menu.

 

[TheAdmiester]

And THERE it is. It's a few oddities at worst.

Remember the BMW 3.0 CS at launch? undriveable because there rear snapped at the mere suggestion of a turn. Now, it's fantastic. Might there be additional alterations to the system? Maybe. But is what is occurring at the moment anything close to the 1.49 issue of cars launching into space? No. it's a minor annoyance, and it can be totally tuned out of every car.

I have managed to remove odd behaviors within 1 or 2 visits to the tuning menu.

Being able to tune it out is not an excuse for it being present. A car not handling great in stock form is to be expected (although most cars in most games are fine stock) - a car flinging itself upwards and breaking the laws of physics when stock is not.

 

[JDMKING13]

There are a few nagging things that I'd really love the "suspension bug deniers" to address:

- Why use footage (or worse, still images) of Gr. cars to discredit what people have explained is a bug that affects softer cars?

- If it's a skill issue, why do the infamously careful and conservative AI hop all over the place whenever they're driving the old Ferrari Mondial?

- If it's "simply how these old cars behave" then why didn't they do it before now? Was the game unrealistic before? But if it's realistic then why is there no footage of any old cars exhibiting the same behaviour at, say, Goodwood Revival events?

- If it's a skill issue, please explain how a stock Lancer Evo can pull a stoppie under braking

After the update the physics in my opinion came alive.. you can now feel everything when driving especially the suspension.. the cars react differently when hitting curbs/bumps… or going over dips vs before.. I love driving the cars in stock form… and usually downgrade the tires significantly. I use CH tires with the old Evos’s but I’m not having these issues I see you guys posting.. Not saying there is no issues but when I drive them they drive fine… granted they are old cars with not the best suspension so I don’t push them like I would with a new car or tuned car but they still drive fine imo.

 

[Nielsen]

And THERE it is. It's a few oddities at worst.

Few oddities? Some cars are currently undriveable. Stop downplaying the problem.

But is what is occurring at the moment anything close to the 1.49 issue of cars launching into space? No. it's a minor annoyance, and it can be totally tuned out of every car.

Closer to 1.49 than you realize. The suspension issues in version 1.52 originate from version 1.49. I’ve already told you this.

Tuned out? The beauty of driving a car in stock form is that you don’t have to tune it at all. So it’s not hard to recognize the presence of a serious problem when stock suspensions start acting really weird.

I have managed to remove odd behaviors within 1 or 2 visits to the tuning menu.

Good for you if you consider that a solution. Other people don’t.

 

[Voodoovaj]

Few oddities? Some cars are currently undriveable. Stop downplaying the problem.

Do you mean all the cars that were stated as being "undriveable" that I drive without issue? Or are there other "undriveable" cars. I haven't encountered said unicorns as of yet. Please let me know because I am genuinely interested in seeing this.

And, to be fair, this is par for the course with PD. The F40 was near undriveable in GT5 so I can see it happening.

Closer to 1.49 than you realize. The suspension issues in version 1.52 originate from version 1.49. I’ve already told you this.

A car with a slight annoyance is not the same as cars launching into space from a standstill. Don't be overly dramatic.

Tuned out? The beauty of driving a car in stock form is that you don’t have to tune it at all. So it’s not hard to recognize the presence of a serious problem when stock suspensions start acting really weird.

Again, I tried these broken cars of yours. In every case, it was bad driving. Braking too late, riding over curbs that you shouldn't be riding over, etc.

Good for you if you consider that a solution. Other people don’t.

You might not consider it a solution, but it is one, and it downgrades this bug from an A bug (game is unplayable) to a D bug (will not fix). Also, it's a game, and a system. No car has an actual "stock suspension" it merely has a default set up. Add the racing suspension, set it to the default settings, and tweak as needed for a DIY fix.

 

[lenny127]

The BMW M2 Competition is the first car I've noticed some very weird behavior, and I'm not sure what is causing the issue.
The Wheel/Driver animation with the hands on the wheel is turning the Wheel on its own and of course not just the wheel but also the car itself.
Going through a corner holding a steady angle with my Wheel, the game suddenly decides to steer on its own.
Yesterday I've driven a lot of cars around the Nordschleife and it happens at very different spots on the track.
Slow corners as well as faster corners, but the slower I drive or the less weight is on the suspension the less it happens but it still happens.
No matter if I put a stock suspension or sport suspension or no matter what tire compound.
It's just broken and definitely is a huge bug within the physics.
I don't know what exactly is causing it or if anyone else around here has noticed the same issue.
Would be interesting if some of you guys could test it too.

go run the replay and freeze it at the moment the wheel turns on its own, go take a picture outside ....and crouch down to either your left front or right front tire and I bet its tucked in the wheelwell making contact .....my e36 does that at the nordscheliffe from bottoming out on lateral and forward weight transfer ..... i adjusted frequency, body height etc and it cleared up

 

[TheAdmiester]

After the update the physics in my opinion came alive.. you can now feel everything when driving especially the suspension.. the cars react differently when hitting curbs/bumps… or going over dips vs before.. I love driving the cars in stock form… and usually downgrade the tires significantly. I use CH tires with the old Evos’s but I’m not having these issues I see you guys posting.. Not saying there is no issues but when I drive them they drive fine… granted they are old cars with not the best suspension so I don’t push them like I would with a new car or tuned car but they still drive fine imo.

I do agree that on the cars that work fine the physics are improved, but the fact that it's made some cars nigh undriveable is something that definitely needs addressing. The Evos' issues are more apparently the grippier their tires, so downgrading to CH likely doesn't have enough grip to trigger it.

 

[Nielsen]

Do you mean all the cars that were stated as being "undriveable" that I drive without issue?

Yes. Anyway, you don’t drive them without issue. You just fail to provoke the physics issues.

Or are there other "undriveable" cars. I haven't encountered said unicorns as of yet. Please let me know because I am genuinely interested in seeing this.

Probably.

And, to be fair, this is par for the course with PD. The F40 was near undriveable in GT5 so I can see it happening.

I don’t know why you are saying this. Irrelevant.

A car with a slight annoyance is not the same as cars launching into space from a standstill. Don't be overly dramatic.

Both issues are related. Pointing this out is dramatic? The only dramatic thing I see in this discussion is your ongoing urge to deny the existence of a problem that is obvious to anyone but you.

Again, I tried these broken cars of yours. In every case, it was bad driving. Braking too late, riding over curbs that you shouldn't be riding over, etc.

I’m not experincing any suspension issues related to late braking. What’s the issue there?

Whether you should ride over kerbs or not is irrelevant. What matters is what happens with the suspension physics when you do ride over them, and that’s where some cars begin to wobble or jump excessively since the introduction of the “new physics”. The problem has been pointed out by several people, so you have no reason to continue arguing against it.

No car has an actual "stock suspension" it merely has a default set up. Add the racing suspension, set it to the default settings, and tweak as needed for a DIY fix.

It doesn’t matter what words you use to describe it. Call it stock, default or whatever. What matters is that cars are supposed to work as intended by the developers, and right now there are several examples of this not being the case.

I do agree that on the cars that work fine the physics are improved…

I disagree if we are solely talking suspension physics. Not every car acts outright broken, but since update 1.49 there is too much bouncing back and forth with the suspension physics. The old physics did a better job simulating realistic suspension stiffness.

 

[JDMKING13]

I do agree that on the cars that work fine the physics are improved, but the fact that it's made some cars nigh undriveable is something that definitely needs addressing. The Evos' issues are more apparently the grippier their tires, so downgrading to CH likely doesn't have enough grip to trigger it.

You’re using upgraded tires on the stock suspension? What tires are you using I can see really sticky tires SM/SS stressing out the stock suspension on old Evo’s even the 8,9,10. Anything over a SH tires might stress out the suspension… Granted the cars shouldn’t get crazy like I saw in the videos, stock wise I drive the Evo 8,9,10 with CM/CS so agin I’m not running into these problems.

 

[TheAdmiester]

You’re using upgraded tires on the stock suspension? What tires are you using I can see really sticky tires SM/SS stressing out the stock suspension on old Evo’s even the 8,9,10. Anything over a SH tires might stress out the suspension… Granted the cars shouldn’t get crazy like I saw in the videos, stock wise I drive the Evo 8,9,10 with CM/CS so agin I’m not running into these problems.

No, I never said anything about upgraded tires, I said CH is a downgrade, as in from stock. These issues happen to completely stock cars. The newer Evos aren't quite as bad as the 4/5/6 but they still absolutely exhibit the same issues.

And even if that was the case - it never happened with stock, sports, or even race tires before this patch. Not my clip but watch this:


The car is compressing downwards from the slight convex part it passes over, and going uphill, and yet the rear springs up. Not even in a particularly quick "reboundy" way either, it's almost like an invisible hook is lifting it by the rear. It doesn't matter which tires it's running on - cars simply do not do this.

 

[JDMKING13]

No, I never said anything about upgraded tires, I said CH is a downgrade, as in from stock. These issues happen to completely stock cars. The newer Evos aren't quite as bad as the 4/5/6 but they still absolutely exhibit the same issues.

And even if that was the case - it never happened with stock, sports, or even race tires before this patch. Not my clip but watch this:


The car is compressing downwards from the slight convex part it passes over, and going uphill, and yet the rear springs up. Not even in a particularly quick "reboundy" way either, it's almost like an invisible hook is lifting it by the rear. It doesn't matter which tires it's running on - cars simply do not do this.

Not for nothing.. you showed me a clip with no information on the screen… is that car stock or tuned.. he went into that turn super hot and upset the suspension hitting the top of the hill I understand what you’re saying but it’s not you driving… and there is no setting or race information. It’s just a clip of some bad driving.

 

[Nebuc72]

Not for nothing.. you showed me a clip with no information on the screen… is that car stock or tuned.. he went into that turn super hot. I understand what you’re saying but it’s not you driving… and there is no setting or race information. It’s just a clip of some bad driving.

It's my clip lol, you can see me make the corner? That's literally just how you take that turn, it's uphill so you scrub off speed super quick.
I don't know how that's bad driving aside from using it as a crux to ignore the fact there's a problem. The car is on pure stock suspension with Sports Medium tyres.
There is nothing unusual done to make it 'do' this, the cars suspension can just do this post 1.49 and it hasn't been fully fixed.

 

[Johnny Caisse]

No, I never said anything about upgraded tires, I said CH is a downgrade, as in from stock. These issues happen to completely stock cars. The newer Evos aren't quite as bad as the 4/5/6 but they still absolutely exhibit the same issues.

And even if that was the case - it never happened with stock, sports, or even race tires before this patch. Not my clip but watch this:


The car is compressing downwards from the slight convex part it passes over, and going uphill, and yet the rear springs up. Not even in a particularly quick "reboundy" way either, it's almost like an invisible hook is lifting it by the rear. It doesn't matter which tires it's running on - cars simply do not do this.

I concur, I've had that with a lot of cars going at slow speeds, with Sports Hard, heck even Comfort Softs. Never had that in GT7 before 1.52, last time I can remember that was in 2013 with the Alfa MiTo with a stock suspension.

Never been scared to fully brake with a stock suspension even on Sportscars. I don't wanna end up getting a frontwards tumble.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Not for nothing.. you showed me a clip with no information on the screen… is that car stock or tuned.. he went into that turn super hot and upset the suspension hitting the top of the hill I understand what you’re saying but it’s not you driving… and there is no setting or race information. It’s just a clip of some bad driving.

That is a car braking uphill. Cars do not do that.

 

[JDMKING13]

It's my clip lol, you can see me make the corner? That's literally just how you take that turn, it's uphill so you scrub off speed super quick.
I don't know how that's bad driving aside from using it as a crux to ignore the fact there's a problem. The car is on pure stock suspension with Sports Medium tyres.
There is nothing unusual done to make it 'do' this, the cars suspension can just do this post 1.49 and it hasn't been fully fixed.

Again super sticky track tires on a stock Suspension Evo.. granted the car handles great but it’s not a race car.. your driving the car as if it was a race car that can take a line in that matter. Also did you add power to the car? It doesn’t sound stock at all. And why not put the setting so people can see your throttle inputs and braking?

I love Eiger and done plenty of test there.. granted I don’t drive with super sticky tires either or would I take that line, but the car doesn’t feel as bad as you guys are making them out. I’ve seen the crazy video and the cars acting weird so I get what you are saying..

 

[TheAdmiester]

Again super sticky track tires on a stock Suspension Evo.. granted the car handles great but it’s not a race car.. your driving the car as if it was a race car that can take a line in that matter. Also did you add power to the car? It doesn’t sound stock at all. And why not put the setting so people can see your throttle inputs and braking?

I love Eiger and done plenty of test there.. granted I don’t drive with super sticky tires either or would I take that line, but the car doesn’t feel as bad as you guys are making them out. I’ve seen the crazy video and the cars acting weird so I get what you are saying..

Cars that are completely stock do this. I wish people would stop blaming it on the driving or the car's setup. Cars simply do not do this under braking in real life, it's a bug, end of discussion.

 

[Nebuc72]

Again super sticky track tires on a stock Suspension Evo.. granted the car handles great but it’s not a race car.. your driving the car as if it was a race car that can take a line in that matter. Also did you add power to the car? It doesn’t sound stock at all. And why not put the setting so people can see your throttle inputs and braking?

I love Eiger and done plenty of test there.. granted I don’t drive with super sticky tires either or would I take that line, but the car doesn’t feel as bad as you guys are making them out. I’ve seen the crazy video and the cars acting weird so I get what you are saying..

It's on Sports tyres mate. It comes with Sports Hards, it's not much of a step up. It has a Sports exhaust and some aero, hence the sound, but that's it.

You can put 98% of other cars in the game on Sports tyres and they won't start getting abducted by aliens. I don't understand why this is such a controversial fact for some people. The physics are better but they don't always work at high compression levels.

I also don't know what throttle/brake inputs would do to change anything here. There isn't a special throttle and brake combination that causes cars to take off in normal circumstances. You would see me brake for a turn, as that is all I did.



Just an addendum, I just tested it on Sports Hards and it still happens, so... not much more to add really. It's almost like it's an issue with the suspension.

 

[JDMKING13]

It's on Sports tyres mate. It comes with Sports Hards, it's not much of a step up. It has a Sports exhaust and some aero, hence the sound, but that's it.

You can put 98% of other cars in the game on Sports tyres and they won't start getting abducted by aliens. I don't understand why this is such a controversial fact for some people. The physics are better but they don't always work at high compression levels.

I also don't know what throttle/brake inputs would do to change anything here. There isn't a special throttle and brake combination that causes cars to take off in normal circumstances. You would see me brake for a turn, as that is all I did.

So again the car has more power.. stickier tires… some aero but stock suspension. You’re driving the car all out and shock the suspension on the top of the hill which we all can clearly see.. and that’s when things get sketchy as they should. You feel the car should act as you describe a race car would be.. planted? I feel seeing throttle steering and braking inputs plays a huge role when judging driving, but that’s just me it’s all good! It’s no problem we will just have to go our own ways on this lol it’s all good.👍

 

[AlexWilmot]

 

[TheAdmiester]

So again the car has more power.. stickier tires… some aero but stock suspension. You’re driving the car all out and shock the suspension on the top of the hill which we all can clearly see.. and that’s when things get sketchy as they should. You feel the car should act as you describe a race car would be.. planted? I feel seeing throttle steering and braking inputs plays a huge role when judging driving, but that’s just me it’s all good! It’s no problem we will just have to go our own ways on this lol it’s all good.👍

Please show me footage of any Evo springing up its rear end in real life

 

[Nebuc72]

So again the car has more power.. stickier tires… some aero but stock suspension. You’re driving the car all out and shock the suspension on the top of the hill which we all can clearly see.. and that’s when things get sketchy as they should. You feel the car should act as you describe a race car would be.. planted? I feel seeing throttle steering and braking inputs plays a huge role when judging driving, but that’s just me it’s all good! It’s no problem we will just have to go our own ways on this lol it’s all good.👍

Dude I have no qualms about a car getting sketchy when it's overloaded. I also added as a note that it happens on Sports Hard tyres too, but that was an edit so fair enough if you didn't see that.

I do not think an increase of twenty horsepower should be enough to elicit such a reaction in a normal driving situation, such as braking for an uphill corner, but even assuming that it is this should cause the car to bottom out or lose traction, not decide that the compression of the car going uphill needs to be converted into immediate rebound and cause it to spring into the air.

The latter is the issue that we are trying to point out with the current physics iteration. High levels of compression are incorrectly transferred into excessive rebound in normal situations rather than being bled out as it would in any other situation, in games or otherwise.

 

[JDMKING13]

Well I did a quick lap with a complete STOCK Evo9 with just SH tires on it. I normally would use CS but that’s what it comes equipped with. I use T-GT-II with clutch and 7speed shifter. The drive seemed normal to me.

Two different angles…