Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[dimassa19]

lol

 

[Samus]

Maybe not behind, maybe stretched too thin to focus on gta for ps4 when they have gtsport to worry about. Get GTS out first, then worry about the academy stuff. It wasn't a PD employee so who can tell what they know.

Either way it's not good, is it? It's not like GTA is a huge workload, if they already have the core of the game running, and you would certainly hope they have, it's just a matter of creating the menus and the time trial events, and I can't see how that is any more time consuming on PS4 than it is on PS3.If employees are working on it for PS3 they're not working on the PS4 games.

If public playable code in the form of a beta wasn't due at around the same time I think you might have a point, but it is. PS4 playable GT is meant to arrive any time now, so why wouldn't GTA be implemented into that? I certainly don't buy that the FIA won't allow it, this is only the Beta, not the final game with the FIA events proper.

I already share that GT6 will have something new. And somehow its related to GTS.

What? You mean your theory they'll release GT6 2.0 at the same time as GT Sport?

 

[05XR8]

Thing is, wouldn't the PS4 sell more when GTS/GT_ drops? I and I'm sure many others, don't have a PS4 at the moment. I'm waiting to see how GTS/GT_ pan out. I do know I'd prefer GTA on PS4 but, by releasing GTA on PS4, there will be so many potential players left out of the experience.

 

[Samus]

Thing is, wouldn't the PS4 sell more when GTS/GT_ drops? I and I'm sure many others, don't have a PS4 at the moment. I'm waiting to see how GTS/GT_ pan out. I do know I'd prefer GTA on PS4 but, by releasing GTA on PS4, there will be so many potential players left out of the experience.

I don't think it'd be asking too much of players for the event to be on PS4 now, It's 2.5 years old with 40 million sales. I think anyone serious about actually winning GTA would have bought one by now, or would by one for the event. You could even look at it the other way, a heck of a lot of people will have sold/traded in their PS3 by now. It's nigh on 10 years old.

 

[dimassa19]

I don't think it'd be asking too much of players for the event to be on PS4 now, It's 2.5 years old with 40 million sales. I think anyone serious about actually winning GTA would have bought one by now, or would by one for the event. You could even look at it the other way, a heck of a lot of people will have sold/traded in their PS3 by now. It's nigh on 10 years old.

I agree. Good point.

 

[Nico_Ble99]

Anyone remember when we first saw this gif and we all thought GT6 will be a complete revolution in terms of physics ?

The only thing I remember is the innocent 13 year old me flipping out on our couch in front of the TV and screaming "OH IT'S GT6!"

 

[gtracedriver1]

GTA being on PS3 would be a bad sign. As others have said there is only one logical reason for that, and it's that PD are behind on PS4 development. What other reason would you have for hosting a 2016 competition on a console that is now otherwise totally unsupported by Sony in terms of new software? It's not like PS4 has been out a few months and they've not had time so are sticking to the old console, it's been out nearly 2.5 years. That they've seemingly not got anything ready and stable enough to be able to host a GTA is worrying.

Most games beta are released less than 6months and more like few months before release. The way I look at it they want to coincide with PSVR and the game will run smoothly. I am predicting 90fps in 4.5 and 60fps on PS4 easily.

 

[Samus]

Most games beta are released less than 6months and more like few months before release. The way I look at it they want to coincide with PSVR and the game will run smoothly. I am predicting 90fps in 4.5 and 60fps on PS4 easily.

What does that have to do with what I said? It doesn't matter what most betas do (Many of which are no such thing), the GT one was announced for release any time now. The fact they seemingly don't have a platform ready for GTA is worrying.

The French guy said something was to be announced in March and was scrapped. @sems4arsenal said GTA was originally meant to start in April but didn't. The dots seem simple to connect.

 

[gtracedriver1]

Because PD's performance on the PS3 was already a part of the discussion by a number of other members, including you!

Perhaps you would like to let me know which part of the AUP permits you to engage in an area of discussion, but also then allows you to seemingly try and bar others from that same area?

PD's performance on titles over the last decade is relevant for a number of reasons, first it provides us with an idea of the recent mindset and development choices they have made, its also gives us an idea of what they will target and what they have been willing to sacrifice to hit those targets (resolution over frame rate for example) and finally they have provided us with nothing else to work with.



It would be nice if that were actually true, but its unfortunately easily shown to not be the case.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-vs-gran-turismo-6



As you can see even from the snapshot on that youtube clip its hitting 38fps in 1080p (which again is not a true 1080p), that's a full 10fps lower than you claimed it hit as a minimum and almost half the maximum framerate and at one point hits as low as 32fps. The only time in that video 60fps gets hit regularly is using bumper cam (sorry anyone who likes a cockpit view) in the sunshine. To quote the DF analysis.

"
Unfortunately, the 60fps target is regularly missed, resulting in screen-tear and image judder far more often than we'd like.

Tearing remains an issue with GT6 but manifests itself somewhat differently than in GT5, necessitating a rewrite of the tear detection algorithms in our performance tools. The overall effect is less distracting than in GT5 but still far from optimal - the visual impact of the tearing is not as noticeable to the human eye, but there's a definite "wobble" in the presentation when frame-rate dips below 60fps."





I disagree and quite frankly based on the last ten years development have little faith in the direction they head for, as arguably GT6 could have hit a solid 60fps had PD opted for 720p over 1080p and done so without framerate drops and tearing. Given that many opted to run GT5 and GT6 at 720p to make it bearable does make me wonder why they never did this.



Not officially, but that developers are providing consistent matching information with regard to spec, dev kit time-lines and development goals; that Sony are not then dismissing is as close to confirmation as we are going to get.



Its either real, or multiple developers are all talking (the exact same) nonsense, with no denial from Sony.


Two things here. Console manufacturers has historically failed when they have attempted to split hardware into two 'versions' in the past, Sony need to be very careful with this. Secondly a better gross margin in the Neo is a big 'if' at present, given that the spec seen (from multiple sources) indicates that the AMD GPU could be based on the upcoming Polaris, which would not be the 'cheap', profit focused option.

If you are comparing PS3 then SMS and Codemasters did much worst job. NFS shift2 is pretty much a broken game due to input lag. Codemasters too had gone for 30fps and some early version were much worst. Although from my experience F1 2012 was better than F1 2013. I read very bad things about F1 2011. For a PS3 with a split ram and gimped gpu GT5 and GT6 is IMO a technical achievement. I do not think other devs could do. Since GTS will be releasing on PS4 and we have already seen SMS, Codemasters nearly achieve it. This makes me very confident with Polyphony. I cannot imagine them doing any worst than SMS, Codemasters

What does that have to do with what I said? It doesn't matter what most betas do (Many of which are no such thing), the GT one was announced for release any time now. The fact they seemingly don't have a platform ready for GTA is worrying.

The French guy said something was to be announced in March and was scrapped. @sems4arsenal said GTA was originally meant to start in April but didn't. The dots seem simple to connect.

There is a excellent chance GTS will be released this year. Beta not releasing is not a worry IMO. They are probably doing like GT6. Give details just before E3 and release the game in November

 

[05XR8]

I don't think it'd be asking too much of players for the event to be on PS4 now, It's 2.5 years old with 40 million sales. I think anyone serious about actually winning GTA would have bought one by now, or would by one for the event. You could even look at it the other way, a heck of a lot of people will have sold/traded in their PS3 by now. It's nigh on 10 years old.

For sure. Once the announcement was made for GTS, people went out and bought a PS4. Now, those that traded up and sold their PS3s will be . I have no clue as to what PD are doing... with anything...

 

[Samus]

There is a excellent chance GTS will be released this year. Beta not releasing is not a worry IMO. They are probably doing like GT6. Give details just before E3 and release the game in November

You don't think it's a worry that a previously announced milestone in the games development may not be on schedule? That GT Academy may have been impacted and delayed because of it? Stack that on top of the fact next to nothing of the game has been seen, the six months of silence and fiven the history of the company involved this is a huge cause for worry from where I'm looking.

 

[trustjab]

Either way it's not good, is it? It's not like GTA is a huge workload, if they already have the core of the game running, and you would certainly hope they have, it's just a matter of creating the menus and the time trial events, and I can't see how that is any more time consuming on PS4 than it is on PS3.If employees are working on it for PS3 they're not working on the PS4 games.

If public playable code in the form of a beta wasn't due at around the same time I think you might have a point, but it is. PS4 playable GT is meant to arrive any time now, so why wouldn't GTA be implemented into that? I certainly don't buy that the FIA won't allow it, this is only the Beta, not the final game with the FIA events proper.



What? You mean your theory they'll release GT6 2.0 at the same time as GT Sport?

I think you're putting a little too much stock into an off-hand recalled comment on the Nismo stream. Who made that comment? What does that person know of GTA?

It's like people posting these facebook replies. Wonder, where's the value in those comments in your opinion? Is it going both ways and you equally trust both these sources? It can't be trust in something that just shines either a negative or positive light on GT's future.

For all we know, this comment on the live stream was ill informed. The "on ps3 for now" could mean the latest gt academy installment. Which is on the ps3. And if they're saying "for now" is true (if they're that knowledgable) then it could be exactly what I said. They're stretched too thin.

You even say that if they're working on it (GTA) for ps3 they aren't for ps4. That'd be even more favorable to my suggestion. Who knows how they allot and assign their staff. On top of that, gtsport is supposed to be a departure from the norm of GT. So just slapping on some GTA badge might not cut it if the theme of 'change' stays true for the whole of GT, including GTA. Just my hunch.

 

[Samus]

I think you're putting a little too much stock into an off-hand recalled comment on the Nismo stream. Who made that comment? What does that person know of GTA?

It's like people posting these facebook replies. Wonder, where's the value in those comments in your opinion? Is it going both ways and you equally trust both these sources? It can't be trust in something that just shines either a negative or positive light on GT's future.

There is quite the difference between definitively stating something and saying something vague. Yes, that answer wasn't a wholly definitive "It's on PS3, end of" but said it is now, so clearly a decision has been made at some point to work on it for PS3.

Yes, for the few things the GT FB has stated definitely I believe (Albeit with a grain of salt since they're so easy to fake), I don't however put any stock in the 'we're thinking about it' and 'maybe' type answers.

The "on ps3 for now" could mean the latest gt academy installment. Which is on the ps3.

Not entirely sure what you're saying here. What else would it mean?

You even say that if they're working on it (GTA) for ps3 they aren't for ps4. That'd be even more favorable to my suggestion.

What I meant was if people are working on assets or whatever for the PS3 game that is people not working on the PS4 game at all. So if they're stretched thin, why would they be putting people to work on PS3 stuff? Surely it would make more sense to be doing that same work on the PS4 codebase? Why wouldn't you, if it was possible? PS3 is a dead format, no big studios are developing new games for it, you surely wouldn't be working with it if you didn't have to.

Again, GT on PS4 is supposed to be playable by the public any time now, if they're on time. They should have something to base GTA off for PS4, as the did with the GT6 demo in 2013. That they're working on it for PS3 to me suggests they don't.

Who knows how they allot and assign their staff. On top of that, gtsport is supposed to be a departure from the norm of GT. So just slapping on some GTA badge might not cut it if the theme of 'change' stays true for the whole of GT, including GTA. Just my hunch.

GTA fits far more into the new theme of motorsport and racing than it ever did in the 'old' GT formula. I don't think anyone is going to suggest a competition of that kind is out of place in a motorsports driven game. Plus it could be bundled together for ease but completely separate once you load the game.

 

[Soundtrack]

GTA being on PS3 would be a bad sign. As others have said there is only one logical reason for that, and it's that PD are behind on PS4 development. What other reason would you have for hosting a 2016 competition on a console that is now otherwise totally unsupported by Sony in terms of new software? It's not like PS4 has been out a few months and they've not had time so are sticking to the old console, it's been out nearly 2.5 years. That they've seemingly not got anything ready and stable enough to be able to host a GTA is worrying.

There could be a few reasons for GTA to run on PS3 though. The selection being mainly based on leaderboard results; a new large scale untested engine is by nature more open to being abused in one way or another. Another potential hinder could also be wheel support, with many PS3 users having opted for the Gran Turismo developed DFGT and other promoted logitech wheels. Don’t know how many pad users have successfully made it into the finals but this could be a factor.

North Africa had reportedly a new format for the early selections in the form of live events (circumventing the above); organizing these in every participating region may be a cause of trouble/delay too.

 

[Samus]

There could be a few reasons for GTA to run on PS3 though. The selection being mainly based on leaderboard results; a new large scale untested engine is by nature more open to being abused in one way or another. Another potential hinder could also be wheel support, with many PS3 users having opted for the Gran Turismo developed DFGT and other promoted logitech wheels. Don’t know how many pad users have successfully made it into the finals but this could be a factor.

North Africa had reportedly a new format for the early selections in the form of live events (circumventing the above); organizing these in every participating region may be a cause of trouble/delay too.

True but again, the PS4 didn't come out last week. They've had ample time to test these systems, IIRC the original GTA ran inside GT5 Prologue, and that was on 'new' hardware only two years old at the time. Wheels is a fair point but it seems highly unlikely things are going to change, GTA is going to move to PS4 eventually and these people are going to need a new wheel, might as well be now.

That could be a reason for the delay, sure, but it wouldn't explain the usage of PS3. We're nearly 2.5 years into the life cycle of PS4. PS3 should not be on the table for a first-party developer.

 

[Scaff]

If you are comparing PS3 then SMS and Codemasters did much worst job. NFS shift2 is pretty much a broken game due to input lag. Codemasters too had gone for 30fps and some early version were much worst. Although from my experience F1 2012 was better than F1 2013. I read very bad things about F1 2011.

I wasn't.

I was talking about PD's track record of development on the PS3, a conversation you attempted to shut down with some inaccurate claims.

For a PS3 with a split ram and gimped gpu GT5 and GT6 is IMO a technical achievement. I do not think other devs could do.

I disagree, given that PD has access to the PS3 (and PS4 for that matter) as a first party dev with a studio head on the SCE board they has access far higher than any other dev making a racing title.

PD chose to focus on the design areas they did and as such butted heads with the limitations of the platform, I personally thing that other (third party devs) took a far more pragmatic route and ended up with titles that didn't suffer as much from the technical limits as GT5 and to a lesser degree GT6 did.

Since GTS will be releasing on PS4 and we have already seen SMS, Codemasters nearly achieve it. This makes me very confident with Polyphony. I cannot imagine them doing any worst than SMS, Codemasters

I can.

Let me be blunt, PD will have had access to the PS4 long before any 3rd party dev and will potentially have had input on it as a platform, yet three years since launch (and potentially five to six since PD first knew of the PS4) down the line we still have a single, non game play, video from PD. While from SMS and Codemasters we have a released and supported game that has been out for nearly a year and a game that hits 60fps and 1080 that has been ported over from the PC in less than a year (while development on the PC version was ongoing)!

They are already doing worse than both SMS and Codemaster (and arguably Milestone and KS).

There is a excellent chance GTS will be released this year. Beta not releasing is not a worry IMO. They are probably doing like GT6. Give details just before E3 and release the game in November

So PD dropping a feature before GTS even releases (the beta) is a good sign?

Do you not remember what state GT6 released in when PD tried that approach, or is waiting two years for all of the features that were promised for launch a measure of success in your view?

 

[Zlork]

GTS Beta will serve primarily to test servers or others.

They have never mentionned GT Academy.

Remember that Nissan was in full restructuring. They weren't sure for GT Academy this year.

 

[Samus]

GTS Beta will serve primarily to test servers or others.

Source?

They weren't sure for GT Academy this year.

We weren't sure. What is there to suggest they weren't?

 

[Zlork]

Source?

We weren't sure. What is there to suggest they weren't?

> https://www.gtplanet.net/darren-cox-leaves-nissan-whats-the-future-for-gt-academy/

 

[jm79]

> https://www.gtplanet.net/darren-cox-leaves-nissan-whats-the-future-for-gt-academy/

Your message from the GT fb about a pre-June announcement of some kind is the most promising thing since the original trailer. Seems a lot more substantial than this slightly off the cuff Nismo thing, anyhow.

The future of Playstation and GT is all a bit messy right now - it would be good to have some clarity.

 

[SebiGT89]

What? You mean your theory they'll release GT6 2.0 at the same time as GT Sport?

I hope it could be GT6 2.0... but my point is, we already know that GT6 is going to get a new update, why they don´t launched it then? '' I '' think that it´s related to GTS somehow. Could be mistaken of course.

 

[05XR8]

The future of Playstation and GT is all a bit messy right now - it would be good to have some clarity.

This is why all this flipping back and forth with PS3 and PS4, is just silly. What does one do but wait? If Nissan have pulled support from GTA, has BMW stepped in? I asked such a question in another thread.

Are things so shook up with GTA that, PD have to change things up? Licencing? Did they have to restructure the trials? I don't know.

 

[Nexus]

I hope it could be GT6 2.0... but my point is, we already know that GT6 is going to get a new update, why they don´t launched it then? '' I '' think that it´s related to GTS somehow. Could be mistaken of course.

Pretty sure GT6 has been abandoned, otherwise the new Vision GT's would have been released ages ago.

 

[Scaff]

What does one do but wait?

Play the ever increasing number of alternate sims that are around and see what PD end up doing.

I for one am in a win / win situation, if PD do something good with GTS then it joins all my other titles, and if they don't I not exactly going to be stuck with sims to get involved with.

Its simply not the same market place is was back in the days of the PS3 and we now have an increasing range of alternative across a range of platforms, my worry for PD is that they haven't taken that on board.

 

[Soundtrack]

True but again, the PS4 didn't come out last week. They've had ample time to test these systems, IIRC the original GTA ran inside GT5 Prologue, and that was on 'new' hardware only two years old at the time. Wheels is a fair point but it seems highly unlikely things are going to change, GTA is going to move to PS4 eventually and these people are going to need a new wheel, might as well be now.

That could be a reason for the delay, sure, but it wouldn't explain the usage of PS3. We're nearly 2.5 years into the life cycle of PS4. PS3 should not be on the table for a first-party developer.

A GTA return from PS4 to the PS3 may be the result of the difficulty/incapacity to run live events in every participating region. These events are now confirmed as delayed. Maybe this is what the initial plan was. This could arguably explain Cyril Drevet outburst as he could have been told GT Sport would debut via GT Academy in March and him stating not having seen the game (his claim in the podcast)...

Just a theory.

 

[SebiGT89]

Pretty sure GT6 has been abandoned, otherwise the new Vision GT's would have been released ages ago.

It hasn't (fb answer):

We´re very happy to work with FIA so we´re traying to make everybody happy. It´s not only them
, we have a lot of others parties to negotiate with, so it takes time. Once more details are finalised (hopefully soon)we´ll make new announcements for GT Sport and GT6

 

[Nexus]

It hasn't (fb answer):

We´re very happy to work with FIA so we´re traying to make everybody happy. It´s not only them
, we have a lot of others parties to negotiate with, so it takes time. Once more details are finalised (hopefully soon)we´ll make new announcements for GT Sport and GT6

Maybe the Vision GT's will be coming to GT6 after all. Anyway, I doubt that any more major updates will be coming to the game.

 

[Johnnypenso]

That's literally the textbook version of the definition of a beta, which, by the way, doesn't say anything about testing servers.

> https://www.gtplanet.net/darren-cox-leaves-nissan-whats-the-future-for-gt-academy/

Can you point out where in that article anyone from Nissan is quoted as saying they are uncertain about GTA for this year?

 

[avens]

> https://www.gtplanet.net/darren-cox-leaves-nissan-whats-the-future-for-gt-academy/

None of those has any mention about your claim of that the "GTS Beta will serve primarily to test servers or others.", nor about that "They weren't sure for GT Academy this year."

The first quote in particular not only doesn't include information about the beta serving primarily for testing servers (I really don't know how you can interpret that phrase like that when there's no info about it), but actually expressly contradicts your claim. The meaning of "Taking feedback that will help us shaping the final version of GT Sport when it'll be released" is the opposite of just testing the servers, because taking feedback and applying it to the game takes tons of time and isn't something trivial to the core content, both unlike testing servers.

The second quote is from an article about an employee leaving NISMO. Unrelated, and again it has no information that can lead anyone to believe that somebody at either PD or Nissan wasn't sure of GT Academy 2016 happening or not.

 

[avens]

About GT Academy being still on the PS3, I think it makes sense because when running a live competition it is advisable to use the software that is proven to work.

If PD were to right now create a GT Academy spínoff for the PS4 that would mean using the unfinished beta of GT Sport. Quite an awful choice for something that has to work flawlessly all the time.

That's why GT Academy being on the PS3 instead of on the PS4 tells us nothing about the schedule of GT Sport. In early 2016 that's the wise choice of an event organizer.

If that remains to be the case by 2017 then that could lead us to believe PD is behind schedule. Reason is GT Sport could and should be the replacement software for GT Academy altogether, as the latter won't be needed.