Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[Samus]

I agree to a point that realistic racing games have reached a peak in where they can make huge leaps. From the PS1 days there was huge ways to go but now we've got very realistic looking cars and tracks, we've got realistic (enough) driving physics, once you're on the track there isn't that much left you can do whilst also keeping things realistic. Basically the only things are brilliant implementations of weather, night, damage and sounds.

I don't see any further big leaps or killer apps but I think where we're going to see innovation in this genre is what happens before you get to the track, what makes the racing worthwhile. I mean look at football games, they've been largely the same once the whistle blows for years because they similarly are restricted by the realistic aims. So they instead tried to innovate off the field, I don't play them so I can't comment in detail but I've seen all the Ultimate Team content and stuff like that.

I aren't going to say I have the ideas for great features in realistic racing games but I do believe there are ideas out there, we've not run totally dry.

As for GTS, I'm afraid I doubt we're going to have any significant news to talk about until early next year at best. Clearly this game is not in a promo phase anymore.

 

[nocturnalgrey]

Will be interesting to see how many copies FH3 sells in relation to the 'racing genre going down the pan' theory...

I believe that unless something dramatically changes with the sim type genre it eventually will.

 

[jm79]

Basically the only things are brilliant implementations of weather, night, damage and sounds.

But these are huge things no?

I instantly bought Driveclub after seeing the rain effects alone. And driving games will always be worth getting new hardware for, purely because visual/sound/physics improvements are so bloody fundamental. Much more so than with soccer games, for example.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Yeah, gaming is an expensive hobby. Although, at this point, we should all be used to that I don't even want to add up the amount of money I've spent on video games, consoles, and peripherals over my lifetime.

Yeah, I'm not going to do that either...

Still, gaming, even with basic racing peripherals like a mid-range wheel/pedal set, is pretty cheap in terms of hobbies.

I agree to a point that realistic racing games have reached a peak in where they can make huge leaps. From the PS1 days there was huge ways to go but now we've got very realistic looking cars and tracks, we've got realistic (enough) driving physics, once you're on the track there isn't that much left you can do whilst also keeping things realistic. Basically the only things are brilliant implementations of weather, night, damage and sounds.

I don't see any further big leaps or killer apps but I think where we're going to see innovation in this genre is what happens before you get to the track, what makes the racing worthwhile. I mean look at football games, they've been largely the same once the whistle blows for years because they similarly are restricted by the realistic aims. So they instead tried to innovate off the field, I don't play them so I can't comment in detail but I've seen all the Ultimate Team content and stuff like that.

I aren't going to say I have the ideas for great features in realistic racing games but I do believe there are ideas out there, we've not run totally dry.

As for GTS, I'm afraid I doubt we're going to have any significant news to talk about until early next year at best. Clearly this game is not in a promo phase anymore.

On a similar note, I think the off-track stuff is ripe for expanding on in the genre. Assetto Corsa's utterly barren surroundings made me think about it; imagine a dynamic crowd that swelled and dwindled based on your success? Imagine if this were tied to some sort of promotional, extra-credits feature?

The Data Logger feature from PD is a very cool way to bridge the gap between digital and real, and I think it's very far ahead of its time. The problem with it currently is that its appeal is so niche — it covers what, two or three cars and a handful of tracks — that it's all but invisible to the average person.

If a deal were struck with the big series around the world to run the device during big race events, and players could challenge the pros they're watching, it'd be a huge draw IMO. The Blancpain series is a prime example: take this past weekend's results (shameless plug). Imagine if an event were held in GT Sport concurrently with the team's qualifying, and players were given extra incentives to match or even beat the team's times.

Regardless of how accurate the physics are, and if the lap time is truly representative of what happens on track, and blah blah technical stuff blah blah, I feel like that would hook players. The hardcore folks — you know, the ones that join websites dedicated to video games — will always quibble about the finer points, but I think that would take a backseat to the spectacle of it all.

That all being said, I expect FH3 to be the biggest racing game of the year, even if it isn't incredibly realistic. It's close enough for most, and it's certainly the most polished entry in the genre this year. I think people just want *fun*, and that's available by the bucket-load in the game.

But these are huge things no?

I instantly bought Driveclub after seeing the rain effects alone. And driving games will always be worth getting new hardware for, purely because visual/sound/physics improvements are so bloody fundamental. Much more so than with soccer games, for example.

I don't know, we're entering the diminishing returns territory. Then again, no game has yet to pull off all of those together with consistent performance.

 

[queleuleu]

We are so patient with Poly because of old the amazing memories. But it's 2016 (2017!?) and you can't have so many flaws when you are one of the biggest first party studios. And I'm sure that driving a slow car should be fun with proper physics and engine collision.

 

[05XR8]

Kaz wants everyone to appreciate the autmobile. Remember the Coffee Break sessions? The large & small Test Circuits? Heavens, the Time Trials in Italy. Those are things that could have been expounded when GT6 dropped.

Someone mentioned do PCars have something fun like the Hooning Reliant. PCars have a few real life road ways, like the California Highway. In full and segmented. An awesome idea. Something GT had stopped doing.

FH3 are on a different level of making cars cool for future generations. Not everyone wants to be a race car driver. Some people don't want to leave the house. So, FH3 is making a community. Bringing cars from all over the world. Showing players all parts of the world. Funny, I learned about places of the world from watching Formula One as a child. Learned about different places in the USA from watching NASCAR and IndyCar and CanAm as a child.

People that wouldn't give an ats rass about cars, can at least understand how fun and diverse they are. GT had that, initially from GT1-4.
They almost got it with the Goodwood TT. Had the moon rover been driveable in the vastness of Willow Springs and at every track , who knows.

PD should continue to make GTS as a racer. As well as, make a standard GT came with acquiring a car, building and customising a car, sharing it, racing it, showing it, just plain driving it. T10 have made such a game and PD are missing the point by thinking too hard.

 

[Racer_BMW]

Hi everyone, I have been reading this thread since the GT Sport London event, so it's probably time to say something This may sound biased, but I have always loved GT more than any racing game. My first GT game was GT4 and without it I wouldn't care about cars as much as I do today. It made me a petrolhead. What makes GT so special, as many have mentioned before, is its variety. Hot hatches, Kei cars, supercars, LMPs, there's something for everyone. It also has the fun factor that comes from its gameplay and the quirks (coffee breaks, ridiculously slow and hilarious cars included for fun, and so much more. It has these quirks that other racing games don't. Games like PCars, or AC are very good, but I think they're a bit "serious" (I'm not looking to spark a GT VS PCars VS AC discussion).
As for GT Sport, I'm very excited about it. I like the car list and the tracks so far, and I am craving for news. The delay really is unfortunate, but I prefer to be patient and have an optimised game at launch rather than a rushed job. The graphics are amazing, but many aspects still need some work, and I have faith in PD.
I hope there's news soon

 

[Robbks]

Kaz wants everyone to appreciate the autmobile.

PD should continue to make GTS as a racer. As well as, make a standard GT came with acquiring a car, building and customising a car, sharing it, racing it, showing it, just plain driving it. T10 have made such a game and PD are missing the point by thinking too hard.

^^
This is something that I believe is what we will get from Kaz's "New Direction" of GT
I feel that GT:Sport Is his current vision to go along with his racing phase he's in at the moment,
but we will see other games come out in quick succession such as GT:Touring, which focuses on the "Sunday drive", "Cruising", "Show and shine" markets.

I feel that GT6 had become too large for it's own good, trying to please every section of the market,
Making a series of GT Games, based on the same architecture/ modelling/ physics, but with varying content will make players that don;t care about one or the other feel that they have been catered for directly.

 

[Samus]

but we will see other games come out in quick succession such as GT:Touring, which focuses on the "Sunday drive", "Cruising", "Show and shine" markets.

GT games? Quick succession?

All joking aside, I highly doubt that would be their plan. That would just saturate the market with a bunch of similar (to the casual eye) games and people wouldn't know which they want.

 

[Robbks]

All joking aside, I highly doubt that would be their plan. That would just saturate the market with a bunch of similar (to the casual eye) games and people wouldn't know which they want.

Well the feedback from so many people around here is that GT:S is not the game they want. So they won;t buy it.
But give them the other content and they'll buy that one instead.

Then you have the die-hards and those who will buy both because they have the GT Logo on it.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Well the feedback from so many people around here is that GT:S is not the game they want. So they won;t buy it.

The poll in this thread says otherwise. Most will buy it or are considering to buy it.

 

[sems4arsenal]

I could honestly come up with so many events that are fun, heck if they had a decent damage model they could give us a figure 8, why not also have proper drag races?, improving dirt physics will make Rally a lot more fun.

This is with about 5 seconds of thinking, PD can do sooo much to improve the "fun" levels it really doesn't require much thought.

Edit: 5 more seconds of thinking, endurance NASCAR racing, stock car racing around an oval like the one I did in GTacademy, a dedicated drifting event with tandem action.

 

[queleuleu]

I imagine Poly must feel the pressure with the reviews of FH3 (an arcade game about cars like GT) and the previews of GTSport. There is now almost zero hype for GTSport but if Poly comes back in a few months with something different, more modern, I will buy it. For now, it's just an HD version of GT6 with less cars/features/tracks.

 

[GTEFGHA]

I imagine Poly must feel the pressure with the reviews of FH3 (an arcade game about cars like GT) and the previews of GTSport. There is now almost zero hype for GTSport but if Poly comes back in a few months with something different, more modern, I will buy it. For now, it's just an HD version of GT6 with less cars/features/tracks.

They don't feel anything, they exist in their own bubble

 

[queleuleu]

They don't feel anything, they exist in their own bubble

That's the problem^^

 

[jm79]

I imagine Poly must feel the pressure with the reviews of FH3 (an arcade game about cars like GT) and the previews of GTSport. There is now almost zero hype for GTSport but if Poly comes back in a few months with something different, more modern, I will buy it. For now, it's just an HD version of GT6 with less cars/features/tracks.

Come on, they're nothing alike, those games...

 

[FoRiZon]

By the time Gran Turismo 8 comes out, I probably die of old age or cancer.

 

[Imari]

Come on, they're nothing alike, those games...

Yes. Nothing alike. Except for featuring cars. And racing. And pretty graphics. And modifications. And fun.

This attitude is exactly why Polyphony doesn't pay any attention to all the other games that have new and great things to offer, because they're all nothing alike.

The point is not whether they're alike. It's whether there's something you can learn to make your own game better. There are probably things that could be learned from GTA V and Overwatch and DotA that Polyphony could modify and include into their games if they wanted.

 

[lancia delta hf]

In a driving/racing game, no, unless I find it fun. Otherwise what is the point? What did you enjoy about driving the Schwimmwagen around TGTT, for example? I mean, driving this kind of Rover on the moon I might've found fun:

But the moon rover itself? No, I took no enjoyment from that whatsoever, it was just frustrating and dull.

I still shake my head at the inclusion of the moon buggy and Kaz worrying about a star or two being in the wrong place. Way to dedicate sources.

I agree to a point that realistic racing games have reached a peak in where they can make huge leaps. From the PS1 days there was huge ways to go but now we've got very realistic looking cars and tracks, we've got realistic (enough) driving physics, once you're on the track there isn't that much left you can do whilst also keeping things realistic. Basically the only things are brilliant implementations of weather, night, damage and sounds.

I don't see any further big leaps or killer apps but I think where we're going to see innovation in this genre is what happens before you get to the track, what makes the racing worthwhile. I mean look at football games, they've been largely the same once the whistle blows for years because they similarly are restricted by the realistic aims. So they instead tried to innovate off the field, I don't play them so I can't comment in detail but I've seen all the Ultimate Team content and stuff like that.

I aren't going to say I have the ideas for great features in realistic racing games but I do believe there are ideas out there, we've not run totally dry.

As for GTS, I'm afraid I doubt we're going to have any significant news to talk about until early next year at best. Clearly this game is not in a promo phase anymore.

True. but regarding football games, they're just lazily churning out the cash cow. Why do we still not have muddy pitches, water logged pitches, bumpy and seasonal worn pitches, strong wind during games? Kick off had all of these things in the 90s.

 

[Brend]

True. but regarding football games, they're just lazily churning out the cash cow. water logged pitches, bumpy and seasonal worn pitches, .

For what it's worth - PES 2017 has these three.

The racing genre is getting backed up against the wall ever since realism become the focus of every title. That shouldn't be the case in my opinion, variation is king.

 

[Lillex]

 

[Samus]

Yes. Nothing alike. Except for featuring cars. And racing. And pretty graphics. And modifications. And fun.

This attitude is exactly why Polyphony doesn't pay any attention to all the other games that have new and great things to offer, because they're all nothing alike.

The point is not whether they're alike. It's whether there's something you can learn to make your own game better. There are probably things that could be learned from GTA V and Overwatch and DotA that Polyphony could modify and include into their games if they wanted.

Well, Kaz does take inspiration. From Bad Piggies and other mobile games.

Do you guys ever look for inspiration outside of the racing genre, or draw inspiration from places aside from other racing games?

KY: “I think so, because I love my iPad and my iPad games – I play a lot of those! I think Bad Piggies is a really cool game!"

Hence the 3 star system in GT6.

 

[Ameer67]

View attachment 588033

This email came to you?

 

[Samus]

It's obviously an error, for one no game actually releases on Dec 31st after the holiday sales, it's just a placeholder date for the entire year and two, it's not 2017.

 

[Godarm]

By the time Gran Turismo 8 comes out, I probably die of old age or cancer.

nah, why curse yourself over a game?
By the time Gran Turismo 8 comes out, your great grandson will be playing it with you

 

[jm79]

Yes. Nothing alike. Except for featuring cars. And racing. And pretty graphics. And modifications. And fun.

This attitude is exactly why Polyphony doesn't pay any attention to all the other games that have new and great things to offer, because they're all nothing alike.

The point is not whether they're alike. It's whether there's something you can learn to make your own game better. There are probably things that could be learned from GTA V and Overwatch and DotA that Polyphony could modify and include into their games if they wanted.

In my opinion, FH3 and GT are nothing alike at all.

And screw trying to ape everything else all the time, it's why videogames can be so predictable and generic.
I like idiosyncrasies and eccentricity, and some guy making games occasionally thinking who cares, and doing his own thing.

The approach is just as valid. You're never going to please everyone all the time.

To mildly paraphrase @Brend, variety.

 

[Johnnypenso]

In my opinion, FH3 and GT are nothing alike at all.

And screw trying to ape everything else all the time, it's why videogames can be so predictable and generic.
I like idiosyncrasies and eccentricity, and some guy making games occasionally thinking who cares, and doing his own thing.

The approach is just as valid. You're never going to please everyone all the time.

To mildly paraphrase @Brend, variety.

I don't think anyone is asking for GTS to mimic FH3, they are simply comparing and contrasting the different direction each franchise takes in making their game fun and to what extent they succeed. I think PD's design choices are fair game for discussion don't you?

 

[Samus]

I like idiosyncrasies and eccentricity, and some guy making games occasionally thinking who cares, and doing his own thing.

That only works if what he comes up with is good. I don't understand why you would celebrate someone purely because they came up with something quirky and left-field. Anyone can do that. "In GT Sport you can race against a hippo on salt flats". See, I just did.

You said yourself you didn't find the moon rover thing fun, so why would you want someone to keep coming up with things like that?

 

[jm79]

That only works if what he comes up with is good. I don't understand why you would celebrate someone purely because they came up with something quirky and left-field. Anyone can do that. "In GT Sport you can race against a hippo on salt flats". See, I just did.

You said yourself you didn't find the moon rover thing fun, so why would you want someone to keep coming up with things like that?

Actually, I said I liked that. In my opinion (do I have to keep saying this, @Johnnypenso ?) you need room for auteur types in creative fields who give less of a ****, for the general health of the whole field, whatever it might be. Movies, games, whatever

 

[Samus]

Actually, I said I liked that. In my opinion (do I have to keep saying this, @Johnnypenso ?) you need room for auteur types in creative fields who give less of a ****, for the general health of the whole field, whatever it might be. Movies, games, whatever

Ok, you said it was "crap gameplay". I agree that we don't want game makers copying each other and just making clones but on the other hand that doesn't mean you shouldn't be looking to others for inspiration and ideas. It doesn't mean you copy those ideas verbose, it means you use them to form your own idea. I mean Forza is a perfect idea of that, they undoubtedly started with GT as their base idea but then over time they turned it into their own creation, with their own ideas. One of those ideas spawned an entire spin-off franchise.

Like I said, anyone can come up with their own unique, off the wall ideas and visions. It's for naught if those ideas fall flat in doing what they set out to. The moon rover is gameplay in a video game, it's failed if it's "crap" no matter how unique it may be.