Gran Turismo Sport - Master Track List

[RadishTM]

Posted info this in the general GT Sport media thread at the beginning of the month but it got buried as it's very active. I think it's an important piece of info, as it was from the international FIA journal and shows where PD could be taking the franchise, in relation to their track lists -

From the FiA magazin
“They are using very impressive, very complex methods to digitize the circuits,” he says. “They use photos from helicopters, GPS, Differential GPS and laser scans to build a 3D circuit. It is the kind of technology F1 teams usually use with their simulators.”
http://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/auto8.pdf

This was an interesting tidbit from the same article from Yamauchi -

“In recreating a real circuit we take an immense amount of photographs and survey data to produce a precise representation of the tracks. But we didn’t know the reason for the shape of the run-off areas, or things like why the kerbs are shaped a certain way and the regulations behind it,” he says. “Through this communication with the FIA we were able to understand everything about the safety standards behind these elements, and I think now if we design new imaginary permanent circuits we can build tracks that will fulfill the FIA’s safety standards.”

Possibly why there are more imaginary tracks than real world tracks in GT Sport, in terms of being creative as well as licensing? The article also states La Sarthe, Silverstone and Spa-Francorchamps need a small amount of work to be homologated by the FIA, maybe that's why we haven't seen them so far in GT Sport or the beta? Hopefully will be sorted by release date, doesn't make sense for those tracks to be DLC.

To add onto this, it's quite possible that PD may be updating their original, fantasy tracks in previous GT games to meet FIA's safety requirements. Seattle Circuit as an example, which was briefly shown at Copper Box Arena, then disappeared.

 

[fatkid]

Posted info this in the general GT Sport media thread at the beginning of the month but it got buried as it's very active. I think it's an important piece of info, as it was from the international FIA journal and shows where PD could be taking the franchise, in relation to their track lists -



To add onto this, it's quite possible that PD may be updating their original, fantasy tracks in previous GT games to meet FIA's safety requirements. Seattle Circuit as an example, which was briefly shown at Copper Box Arena, then disappeared.

Or could just easily mean that the fantasy tracks that aren't included are scrapped altogether, as they didn't have to conform to any safety rules when they were created. Or they make FIA and or Hermann Tilke like updated virtual tracks. Did Hockenhiem Ring, Silverstone and other historic tracks alot of good.

The fact still stands. No matter what excuse given or faith shown, the first GT into the PS4's almost 4 years of life, and we are left with the least amount tracks in 16 and a half years and by two other titles that are released a few weeks before it.

PD had games with a host of FIA approved tracks: they were called GT5 and GT6.

 

[cjr3559]

So tired of Brands Hatch and Willow Springs. BH seems to be in every game plus it's not one of my favorites to begin with. Horse Theif Mile should be nice to try but Big Willow is just boring.

Would have been nice to see an updated Circuit de la Sierra from GT6. These rest of the tracks in GTS are fine I guess. Hopefully Mt. Panorama should be improved from GT6 with more detail and less frame dropping in the tight sections.

 

[TS050]

The list is weak by market standards.

Everything, short of Mario Kart has a better track list.

You're acting like Mario Kart doesn't have the greatest track list this generation

 

[civicgsir]

You said GT5 & GT6 "sucked" I remember because of your post in this thread
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/what-will-you-be-buying.357712/page-2#post-11889460

Yet you still bought a PS4 for the next GT. I guess they couldn't of been that bad...

Should have said it better, but the waiting for content is what sucked. Years between and then still waiting. I mean I'm glad to have had them, as I am a fan, but from a seller/buyer perspective. Could have been a better experience.

Received the PS4 as a gift. Would have purchased one for GTS before the delay, because like I said, fan of the series.

Having my experience with these PC games however, and I've found GT isnt the end-all, be-all after all.

The main reasons for going the PC route of these games was because I could still use a G25, and I could see what FH3 & Forza were about without having to get an XBOX.

None of which would have happened if GTS released on time, and it wasnt a thing for the PS4 to support PS3 wheels.

 

[SAFFY]

Agreed and thinking back to what information Kaz has given about future DLC.
We won't have to wait like GT5, after release we should see a "steady stream" of content "at some point"
I would imagine Spa wouldn't be an unreasonable assumption, along with Tsukuba.

Right now, I'm in no hurry to pre-order. Quite honestly, the reasons are stacked up against doing so. I think I will delay my purchase until I know what to expect than to dive in with a sense of uncertainty.

 

[cutmeamango]

Just a few things IF FIA's circuit licensing for the game is still a thing (which I'm not sure it is anymore):

* FIA doesn't own any tracks, they submit licenses to say tracks conform to their safety standards so they can participate in competitions regulated by them. Tracks, which are mostly privately owned, have to pay for the review and subsequent license.
- Digital certifications are separate from "real life" licenses.
- Licenses run for 3 years. That means: whatever was valid in 2013, was valid til 2016. And while they may still be valid in 2017, they would require relicensing. If a 2013 track doesn't meet new safety standards in 2016 for whichever grade they are pursuing, they would have to be reworked (and relicensed).

An example: GT6 (and Sport) Brands Hatch is the 2012's version (time when they scanned it). GT's digital version was certified in 2014 by the FIA. Seemingly other than some (constant) changes in kerbs, the track remains unchanged (from googling news and recent videos). The real track renewed its license in 2015. GTS added currently present TECPROs.
Same goes for Mount Panorama and Suzuka for the certification part, haven't compared if they changed anything from GT6 to GTS or if there were considerable changes to the real life track (and surroundings).
The odd man out is Silverstone.

And perhaps an odd man in would be the Nurburgring Nordschleife, as it underwent plenty of safety revisions since 2012 and was relicensed in 2016. If we see an in-game update like we saw with Suzuka in 2018, then that would point to FIA Certification being a thing.

La Sarthe from GT6 is the same from GT5, or 2009, with some prop updates. One video and you'll see it has undergone big changes in the past 3 years alone, some safety related at request from FIA.

But interesting enough, Interlagos is the 2016 version (which had to undergo major changes due not complying with Grade A new needs like medical center in the tracks vicinity) with the renewed pit and run-off on the S.

Mind blowing that GT6 DLC tracks were not future proofed. Astonishing call really.

What is "future proofed" here?
The assets are simply not the same. The "source" is, for the real tracks: photographic references, scan data.

 

[Corsa]

Right now, I'm in no hurry to pre-order. Quite honestly, the reasons are stacked up against doing so. I think I will delay my purchase until I know what to expect than to dive in with a sense of uncertainty.

I'll pick it up on release day.
Mainly because I strive to platinum the racing titles and I want a head start on trophies.

 

[HarVee]

It'll be interesting to drive on the new fictional courses. Hard to get excited over the real tracks. These are all pretty much standard for racing games now. Overall this track list is pathetic, as the car list is too.

It was nice for PDI to do a GT3 and attempt to build the game from scratch, but they shouldn't have sacrificed tradition in the process of doing so. No Grand Valley? No Trial Mountain? Not even an improved version of the Midfield and Apricot Hill from GT6? ...Why bring those both back just to kill them off again?

 

[KamatsuKyoto]

Why Suzuka West is missing since GT5?

 

[Destroy321]

Why Suzuka West is missing since GT5?

Probably because pits are too small

 

[Johnnypenso]

I think there is a such thing as being disappointed in the quantity of tracks, while at the same time being excited about the tracks that are.

I think there is also such a thing as being disappointed in both the quantity and quality of the tracks as well. The fantasy tracks are flat and featureless for the most part and with the less than stellar FFB even the supposedly laser scanned tracks come across as somewhat lacklustre from much of the feedback I've read. One of the things that made AC so interesting in spite of its smallish track list was the variety of circuits, many rarely seen in sims, and the stellar work done in recreating the bumps and undulations present in all circuits that really allowed the stellar FFB to shine.

The shine of pretty graphics only last so long IMO.

 

[redrick]

Dirt tracks, NASCAR, phony cars on phony tracks. Gran Turismo is GT3, DTM, etc. on the famous tracks of real racing. A few extras for fun or to please a wide audience added on to the tracklists of GT5 and GT6 was fine, but this does not constitute a Real Racing Simulator and will take more than a few DLC packs to make it one. This is some arcade game masquerading as Gran Turismo.

I have no idea what people are talking about re "future proofed" or "source". PCars and Assetto Corsa have no problem bringing out the real thing at least so far as tracks are concerned.

 

[skazz]

. One of the things that made AC so interesting in spite of its smallish track list was the variety of circuits, many rarely seen in sims, and the stellar work done in recreating the bumps and undulations present in all circuits that really allowed the stellar FFB to shine.

Laser scans are also not just about faithful recreation of bumps: I find that what most separates a good hand crafted model from a laser scan are the cambers.

Tracks tend to flow much more logically with the correct cambers faithfully recreated out of the laser scan: I'd even go as far as to say that on many hand crafted models there are corners which are difficult to judge, whereas on a laser scan they just click and make sense.

 

[Vinylshark]

If my memory doesn't fail me, there never has been a track DLC for any GT game, so why do some of you keep thinking that there will be one for GT Sport?

 

[TheNuvolari]

If my memory doesn't fail me, there never has been a track DLC for any GT game, so why do some of you keep thinking that there will be one for GT Sport?

If I'm not mistaken, the Red Bull Ring was a part of a DLC in GT5.

 

[Tired Tyres]

If my memory doesn't fail me, there never has been a track DLC for any GT game, so why do some of you keep thinking that there will be one for GT Sport?

Spa in GT5 and Red Bull Ring, then there was Motegi and Midfield. Mix of DLC cost and free.

 

[fatkid]

If my memory doesn't fail me, there never has been a track DLC for any GT game, so why do some of you keep thinking that there will be one for GT Sport?

GT5 also had dlc tracks of Route X, Autumn Ring and Kart Space. Only problem was they arrived late into GT5's life, as frustrating as that was, along the ones mentioned by Nuvolari, they were tremendous fun and reasonably priced. BUT, GT5 also a large and interesting track list to begin with to keep me enticed for so long, before the dlc and major updates arrived, for all it's shortcomings.

 

[Scaff]

Posted info this in the general GT Sport media thread at the beginning of the month but it got buried as it's very active. I think it's an important piece of info, as it was from the international FIA journal and shows where PD could be taking the franchise, in relation to their track lists -



To add onto this, it's quite possible that PD may be updating their original, fantasy tracks in previous GT games to meet FIA's safety requirements. Seattle Circuit as an example, which was briefly shown at Copper Box Arena, then disappeared.

Um, the main new fantasy tracks from the beta would not meet FIA standard for run-offs, so I'm going to take that with a massive pinch of salt.

 

[azeeza]

For me there re numerous reasons for the few number, choice, or fantasy track beside time developpement

 

[Scaff]

For me there re numerous reasons for the few number, choice, or fantasy track beside time developpement

Care to share?

 

[azeeza]

Care to share?

Beside the lack of track number and real track or time developpement
GT is adressed to young and newbie driver too, remember when you start with GT, we don't go jump directly on Nurburgring or Technical track, but you can say ' But is esport, competition ' Yup if you want competition, let prepare their skill first but it s GT and when we look at GT, it s one of the game who have good school driving academy, so not so bad for new drivers. And don't forget, you guys have skill and used to sim games, you can be disappointed by that but we re not Alone, and GT is not only focus on ''good drivers'' or veteran
Second, the few tracks, for the first cycle, it better to concentrate people on the few tracks, let them used to and perfom better on skill, to have a good matchmaking and behaviour on Sport mode. Because it s good to have plenty of tracks, but if it dispatched players, and drivers are not good trained for the specific event track, it s not that good. While this cycle, new tracks will arrive and have an another rotation for event
Third, for fantasy track, it can be for having a fresh new original track, a reboot, some point about FIA, yeah but motorsport is universal, even it doesn't have tha approval from FIA, it doesn't make a track less track or less motorsport, so if it s Lemans, Laguna Seca, or an unknown circuit from your local, it s still the same, asphalt, pit line, corner etc..and it how it unite for the championship on GT Sport, and make an proper identity, not so bad after all
That s how i see it, on the positive side or the concept, some track miss me for the launch, but it s not like it s a closed game, new arrival are awaited

 

[j0nny0093]

Certain Gt tracks are easy to drive on, like High Speed Ring, Autumn Ring Mini or Grand Valley East.
I don't blame PD for creating new original tracks but I prefeer old ones; also, I would like to see old real ovals instead of fake ones (Daytona, Indianapolis, Super Speedway etc).

Speaking about real tracks, I think it's not correct to say that FIA doesn't give GT license's for their tracks : if you think about it , every racing game has a lot of tracks GT had in past ( Nurb, Monza, Silverstone, Laguna Seca, Red Bull Ring, Spa etc ).
I can understand that some tracks aren't in their real form ( like Montecarlo or Suzuka on Project Cars) but honestly I don't think FIA didn't give GT permission, considering partnership between them.

 

[Scaff]

Beside the lack of track number and real track or time developpement
GT is adressed to young and newbie driver too, remember when you start with GT, we don't go jump directly on Nurburgring or Technical track, but you can say ' But is esport, competition ' Yup if you want competition, let prepare their skill first but it s GT and when we look at GT, it s one of the game who have good school driving academy, so not so bad for new drivers. And don't forget, you guys have skill and used to sim games, you can be disappointed by that but we re not Alone, and GT is not only focus on ''good drivers'' or veteran
Second, the few tracks, for the first cycle, it better to concentrate people on the few tracks, let them used to and perfom better on skill, to have a good matchmaking and behaviour on Sport mode. Because it s good to have plenty of tracks, but if it dispatched players, and drivers are not good trained for the specific event track, it s not that good. While this cycle, new tracks will arrive and have an another rotation for event
Third, for fantasy track, it can be for having a fresh new original track, a reboot, some point about FIA, yeah but motorsport is universal, even it doesn't have tha approval from FIA, it doesn't make a track less track or less motorsport, so if it s Lemans, Laguna Seca, or an unknown circuit from your local, it s still the same, asphalt, pit line, corner etc..and it how it unite for the championship on GT Sport, and make an proper identity, not so bad after all
That s how i see it, on the positive side or the concept, some track miss me for the launch, but it s not like it s a closed game, new arrival are awaited

So they have deliberately avoided lots of tracks to make its accessable for those new to the series.

If that's the case they have done it in the most cackhanded way possible.

Silverstone, Bathurst, Willow Springs and the 'ring don't meet that criteria at all, yet with the smaller track count they are a higher percentage of the track list now.

Limits on the complexity of tracks for new comers can be managed much better than by simply not including them!

Limiting the use of more complex tracks to licence levels would for example be a much better way about it.

 

[azeeza]

So they have deliberately avoided lots of tracks to make its accessable for those new to the series.

If that's the case they have done it in the most cackhanded way possible.

Silverstone, Bathurst, Willow Springs and the 'ring don't meet that criteria at all, yet with the smaller track count they are a higher percentage of the track list now.

Limits on the complexity of tracks for new comers can be managed much better than by simply not including them!

Limiting the use of more complex tracks to licence levels would for example be a much better way about it.

Deliberate ? Maybe not, it could be the time developpement too
But they kept on mind with new drivers (7-77)

Reading you, all you want is contents or more complex tracks, but if it is limited with a track counts, there are enough complex tracks, and balanced track for enjoying all kind of drivers
And i don't understand why you said '' better than not including them'' ?

It s not about license or else to keep the babies learning on baby tracks and let the more complex one to the veterans, if you want more complex track, it remains less kind of others tracks, less 'oval' less ''rally stage'', if you keep on mind the number 17

 

[ArnoFR]

Track list goes along with Car list.
Light content to get some DLC soon and some updates...
Look how GTA Online started a few years ago and what was added since...this is huge.

Btw, I would have love to see Monaco, Spa and even Seattle (Tourist Trophy )

 

[Scaff]

Deliberate ? Maybe not, it could be the time developpement too
But they kept on mind with new drivers (7-77)

Reading you, all you want is contents or more complex tracks, but if it is limited with a track counts, there are enough complex tracks, and balanced track for enjoying all kind of drivers
And i don't understand why you said '' better than not including them'' ?

It s not about license or else to keep the babies learning on baby tracks and let the more complex one to the veterans, if you want more complex track, it remains less kind of others tracks, less 'oval' less ''rally stage'', if you keep on mind the number 17

Your entire argument comes across as the limit on tracks is not really down to time, but as much (if not more) a desire to only offer a limited number of tracks to keep it simple for newcomers.

My point is that if that was the case a good number of the tracks are an odd choice.

From my point of view I don't think that any track should be locked away from anyone, nor should PD make that choice for anyone either; however if that's what they wanted to do (as you infered) then via licence or having to complete the driving standards mission(s) for the track would be a better way about it.

In all honesty however, your argument comes across as an attempt to defend what is a very small and poor track list for the amount of time they have been working on it.

Oh and sorry to be pedantic, they are not rally stages, at best they are a 'lite' version of a rally cross track.

 

[fatkid]

So the excuse being given is that the small track list is there to entice the noobs and GT Sport isn't aimed at the experienced simcade or sim racer. Riiiight..

 

[HellzFire]

I mean, this tracklist is very underwhelming.

We must be getting at least more 17 tracks tru dlc right?

And the DLC must be free for the lack of content people are getting for a 60 usd priced game surely.

 

[azeeza]

Your entire argument comes across as the limit on tracks is not really down to time, but as much (if not more) a desire to only offer a limited number of tracks to keep it simple for newcomers.

My point is that if that was the case a good number of the tracks are an odd choice.

From my point of view I don't think that any track should be locked away from anyone, nor should PD make that choice for anyone either; however if that's what they wanted to do (as you infered) then via licence or having to complete the driving standards mission(s) for the track would be a better way about it.

In all honesty however, your argument comes across as an attempt to defend what is a very small and poor track list for the amount of time they have been working on it.

Oh and sorry to be pedantic, they are not rally stages, at best they are a 'lite' version of a rally cross track.

Not my entire argument, i wrote it on purpose at the beginning 'beside the time developpement' so other reason than that

I don't think they lock cause they try to cover the different kind of track, in compensation it lets less contain on each type

I don't try to defend them but i tried to understand why this choice, this initial design, and it suit it on the better and positive way for them than just saying their choice is 'crap' . And I don't like some track too, same but i m saying that I m not Alone to play the game. When you go online ( GT5/6), they re many type of race that people express their game, and it doesn't mean you like them all. So same here, maybe it s a bad choice to include these baby tracks, but it could be a good choice for others. We have all preference on style of driving, tracks etc
For the quantity, they set at 17 tracks on their planning at the beginning so, no words on that other than what i wrote for the Sport mode aspect

Sure, we cant disagree with the lack of track or their choice, that s why i wrote it in the first sentence of the first comment

Whatever we call it lol it s still a different kind of circuit, so it take slots.