Gran Turismo World Series (Manufacturers Cup Exhibition Season: Feb 5 - Feb 15)
- Thread starter stpatty
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- 1,724
- Australia
Dear PD,
We need to talk about heavy damage. The truth is, it’s not working. Whilst I can understand the theory behind it, in reality it does nothing to improve driving standards and just ends up ruining races randomly.
Whatever algorithm it is you’re using, it often penalizes the victim but not the perpetrator in a crash. Time and time again the punishment for pushing someone into a wall is that THEY get permanent damage and you get to drive away scot free. Worse, it actually incentivizes slower drivers to try and inflict damage on faster drivers.
Can I humbly request that you abandon this particular experiment and go back to light damage in GT1 to ensure races aren’t ruined by the lottery of chaotic insolence?
Yours,
Dredge.
We need to talk about heavy damage. The truth is, it’s not working. Whilst I can understand the theory behind it, in reality it does nothing to improve driving standards and just ends up ruining races randomly.
Whatever algorithm it is you’re using, it often penalizes the victim but not the perpetrator in a crash. Time and time again the punishment for pushing someone into a wall is that THEY get permanent damage and you get to drive away scot free. Worse, it actually incentivizes slower drivers to try and inflict damage on faster drivers.
Can I humbly request that you abandon this particular experiment and go back to light damage in GT1 to ensure races aren’t ruined by the lottery of chaotic insolence?
Yours,
Dredge.
I'm not having a dig at you and I totally understand the frustration, but other games do it.
Is it just a matter of the driving standards being better in other games (I'm thinking iRacing and ACC), or maybe it's GT7 damage system that it's too severe where a slight touch just makes the car too slow which combined with the slow races means it's race over?
- 1,322
- United Kingdom
- rodgers1
Bathurst going to be fun in the Ferrari. Going to be doing as much testing as possible for this.
My options so far are be fast and crash, then come last
Or
Be slow and safe, but still come last.
Over skyline the rear is just floating in mid air. Have no grip what so ever. What I don't understand is, what ever BOP PD have done to this car just makes it undriveable. I've driving the 458 Gr3 round Nordschleife with no issues and it set one of the quickest times in my Gr3 tests.
My options so far are be fast and crash, then come last
Or
Be slow and safe, but still come last.
Over skyline the rear is just floating in mid air. Have no grip what so ever. What I don't understand is, what ever BOP PD have done to this car just makes it undriveable. I've driving the 458 Gr3 round Nordschleife with no issues and it set one of the quickest times in my Gr3 tests.
- 3,121
- United Kingdom
It'll be the contact physics more than anything.
A crash in GT7 is weird. All your momentum gets shifted to the car you hit and they take the full brunt of the impact, it feels like there's no friction and there's no dissipation of energy. You can see what I mean if you just drive into a wall at full speed, your car stops dead but your wheels go crazy spinning on the spot because the car is just a brick of momentum with no kinetic energy loss.
As a result, the victim always gets off worse in GT7, because that's just what the physics leans to. ACC or iRacing don't necessarily have better driving standards but crash avoidance just works better because if you drive like an idiot and hit or divebomb into people, your cars get tangled up, they both lose momentum, they both take damage, and you both get punished for it, and that encourages people to not do it.
But if you divebomb someone or run them into a wall in GT7, they fly off into Narnia and die, and you drive off with a gained position
I was playing iRacing a couple of days ago and someone drove into the back of me on a high speed turn. They ran over the back of my car, ripping my rear wing off and ended up on my roof, both of us out the race.
If that happened in GT7, they'd get off unharmed learning nothing, and I'd be launched forward with about a 30mph boost and probably fly off the track.
.
- 1,724
- Australia
- 369
- Andover, Hampshire
- ElectricNaz
I agree in general. I've always thought that there could easily be an implementation of "if you're x speed above or below the recommended speed in the braking zone, then you get ghosted" so then they would go off / smash into a wall on their own (or someone driving properly behind them won't get brake tested and smash into them by mistake) Obviously still then allowing for "racing hard / push passing within reason"
The latter point from me, is I've suffered damage before because of drivers braking ridiculously early or on a straight and I haven't judged them doing so.
Something like that in my head seems so simple to implement to put off the kamikaze race ruiners. But I'm not a game dev so who knows. They've probably already thought of that
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- 1,322
- United Kingdom
- rodgers1
Yeah the crash physics on this game are just stupid. Punting people is the biggest one. The amount of times I’ve seen the car that gets punted fly off the screen yet the punters car just stops dead.
I play a lot ACC off now, and the driving standards are just as bad as GT7. In public lobbies it’s shocking. As cars need setups and it’s not as user friendly (ie. Plug and play) the first lap has awful divebombs and crashes. 99% of my racing is done on racing leagues with ACC and similar groups of people. In the leagues we doing stewarding so it easier to manage, but also people respect each other a lot more. Everyone knows is ACC you make contact 90% of the time yourself and the other driver will end up at the back with damage. Where as GT7 I feel like people sacrifice a lot more an overtake knowing you come away with less punishment.
I’m not in GT1 leagues yet (1 more race then A rated) but I wish they would adjust the crash physics and damage model. It’s not fit purpose in my view
- 976
- Indiana USA
- tmsheehan
- ToroSports
For some it seems like poor driving\sportsmanship has always been this way and always will. I am watching the videos some of the good drivers put out on how to avoid these types of "gamers" but for me it is hard enough driving the car and to add watching the radar is an added requirement I often have a hard time doing.
- 671
- Canada
- moosethemooche78
There aren't a lot of strategy options for this next race at Bathurst, at least not for the VW Beetle in the 16-lap GT2/3 race. For me, it has just enough fuel to do 9 laps, which makes the only viable options 7/9, 8/8, and 9/7. From the testing that I've done so far, there doesn't seem any significant time difference between them, but I've only tested 8/8 and 9/7, not 7/8 yet. Don't expect it to be much different, though.
There is also the option to change tires. From what I can tell, there isn't any significant difference there, either. If I stay on the old tires to save time in the pits, I lose it all later in the race to poorer grip. I'd rather have the extra grip of fresh tires in the race, so I'm planning to change them.
There is also the option to change tires. From what I can tell, there isn't any significant difference there, either. If I stay on the old tires to save time in the pits, I lose it all later in the race to poorer grip. I'd rather have the extra grip of fresh tires in the race, so I'm planning to change them.
- 406
- United States
Just tried a custom race in the Audi Gr.3 - I have to do some minor short-shifting to stretch one stint to 10 laps to go 10/9/9. Like @Moose78 , I am at close to 50% tire wear, so no-brainer for me to swap tires while I am there. No way do I want to wrestle that audi down the mountain on near 0% tire!
I had a good week when we had bathurst on the daily, but that was genesis on softs, this is going to be different and a crb/no damage will be tough. And, why-oh-why is the longest race by far (~1 hour in gt1, + qual), one I am looking forward to, on wednesday?! Please, at the very least put the endurance races on saturday!
I had a good week when we had bathurst on the daily, but that was genesis on softs, this is going to be different and a crb/no damage will be tough. And, why-oh-why is the longest race by far (~1 hour in gt1, + qual), one I am looking forward to, on wednesday?! Please, at the very least put the endurance races on saturday!
GlockPants
Premium
- 1,104
- United States
- GlockPants
Just finished my first FP session at Bathurst. Always a humbling experience. Currently 5 seconds off P1. 😮💨
At least it seems like the wall contact doesn't just give out auto penalties.
At least it seems like the wall contact doesn't just give out auto penalties.
- 347
- United States
I'm actually shocked they put bathurst on weds instead of the garbage GR4 reverse layout of an original track.
- 3,465
- United States
I don't think they're thinking, so thinking they're thinking is an error in thinking.
- 347
- United States
- 3,465
- United States
Out of the pot and into the fire. There is a very low likelihood I'll be touching Bathurst on Wed.
- 4,552
- Australia
Most of the fastest players in Oceania are doing ACC leagues rather than GTWS exhibition series (read: GTWS is not engaging enoigh on its own merit). If PD cares about this kind of stuff (I suspect they dont) they should really think about making GTWS less stale, because heavy damage isn't it.
Have an exhibition season with a road car or something - there should be no reason that we had weeks of no active GTWS season.
Have an exhibition season with a road car or something - there should be no reason that we had weeks of no active GTWS season.
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- 417
- Germany
- Interemptor-1313
- Interemptor
I missed the first 2 races so I'll HAVE to race Bathurst. Could punch myself for missing the Deep Forrest race because I usually don't do well on Mount Panorama 💀 Gonna be a pain with the AMG
- 2,433
- The failed experiment entitled “California”.
I put in about 10 minutes of FP and I’m at a 2:04.3 I reckon. I can get another 1/2 second out of that, but if I can keep my race pace in the 2:04’s I’ll be happy
Edit:
I did the recent Bathurst TT in my 458, so it didn’t take long for me to get up to pace. The key in any GR.3 MR car at Bathurst (besides the “fake news” MR 650s and RSR)
…is to keep a bit of throttle input as you descend the mountain. And also, do your best to kind of go around the dipper if possible
Edit:
I did the recent Bathurst TT in my 458, so it didn’t take long for me to get up to pace. The key in any GR.3 MR car at Bathurst (besides the “fake news” MR 650s and RSR)
…is to keep a bit of throttle input as you descend the mountain. And also, do your best to kind of go around the dipper if possible
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- 406
- United States
Cool. I have no chance! Fun, nonetheless. Good luck everyone.
Curious - did you sign a manu after the first race? After the first race, there was only two and it was the gtpers. There is also a Canadian who puts up a top five in the audi, I've been using his ghost on both races so far, but he hasn't shown up in the standings yet. I thought if you were doing free practice, you should be in the standings? I'm confused.
- 140
- Germany
Here's my short race report: GT. 2, all drivers B/B rated
Race 1: Not much to tell, had a very bad Qualifying (second to last). During the race my wheel lost connection to my PS4. Until i figured out which plug i had to pull, half a lap was done. I ended up 12th (second to last).
Race 2: Better Qualifying this time with P9. At the start of the race a missed a shift and the guy behind me closed the gap until the 1st hairpin. Short before the braking zone he hit me hard enough that i lost the car and crashed into the wall. That ment last place and for a short moment i thought i quite the race. But i decided to go on, despite more than 7s to the car in front of me.
From there on it was my best race so far. No spinning or wall contacts and some bad luck of other drivers lead me up to 8th place.
I changed tyres after 11 laps from soft to medium on my Cayman. In the last lap i passed a viper, which was serving a penalty in the long tunnel. But in the next tunnel i looked to long in the rearview mirror and missed the breaking point, so the Viper passed me and i was back on P8.
In the end i'm quite happy with that. Still a lot to learn (don't look in that stupid mirror, fool!), but i really enjoy online racing.
The next race in Bathurst makes me quite a bit nervous. I did 30+ laps training yesterday. I'm far from the pace of the guys on the leaderboard and in about half of the laps, i used my car as a paintbrush to decorate the walls in that bloody downhill section. I can't imagine how to do 16 laps in a race without crashing on that track!
Congrats to all of you who made it on the podium! Well done!
Race 1: Not much to tell, had a very bad Qualifying (second to last). During the race my wheel lost connection to my PS4. Until i figured out which plug i had to pull, half a lap was done. I ended up 12th (second to last).
Race 2: Better Qualifying this time with P9. At the start of the race a missed a shift and the guy behind me closed the gap until the 1st hairpin. Short before the braking zone he hit me hard enough that i lost the car and crashed into the wall. That ment last place and for a short moment i thought i quite the race. But i decided to go on, despite more than 7s to the car in front of me.
From there on it was my best race so far. No spinning or wall contacts and some bad luck of other drivers lead me up to 8th place.
I changed tyres after 11 laps from soft to medium on my Cayman. In the last lap i passed a viper, which was serving a penalty in the long tunnel. But in the next tunnel i looked to long in the rearview mirror and missed the breaking point, so the Viper passed me and i was back on P8.
In the end i'm quite happy with that. Still a lot to learn (don't look in that stupid mirror, fool!), but i really enjoy online racing.
The next race in Bathurst makes me quite a bit nervous. I did 30+ laps training yesterday. I'm far from the pace of the guys on the leaderboard and in about half of the laps, i used my car as a paintbrush to decorate the walls in that bloody downhill section. I can't imagine how to do 16 laps in a race without crashing on that track!
Congrats to all of you who made it on the podium! Well done!
- 369
- Andover, Hampshire
- ElectricNaz
Pre-race training done.
I'm being cautious at this early stage and will work on pure pace later (hitting 2.05s in free practice) but lapping pretty consistently in the low 2.06s with no drop off at all over a stint, fuel predicted to last 8.4 laps so an 8/8 it is for this one. Will definitely change tyres, as front right is about 40% gone by lap 8. Learned my lesson from the weekend too, I've actually practiced my pit entry lol.
I definitely found this easier to manage in TC 3 as the Genesis on hard tyres is a bit squirrely going up the hill and coming out of the slow corners (world of difference from the time trial a few weeks back), interestingly I got quite a bit of success staying in TC2 for sectors 1, 2 and 4, but being in TC3 for the downhill mountain sector 3. Didn't really impact laptimes massively but was so much nicer to drive and will probably save me damage and lap time in the long runs!
I'm being cautious at this early stage and will work on pure pace later (hitting 2.05s in free practice) but lapping pretty consistently in the low 2.06s with no drop off at all over a stint, fuel predicted to last 8.4 laps so an 8/8 it is for this one. Will definitely change tyres, as front right is about 40% gone by lap 8. Learned my lesson from the weekend too, I've actually practiced my pit entry lol.
I definitely found this easier to manage in TC 3 as the Genesis on hard tyres is a bit squirrely going up the hill and coming out of the slow corners (world of difference from the time trial a few weeks back), interestingly I got quite a bit of success staying in TC2 for sectors 1, 2 and 4, but being in TC3 for the downhill mountain sector 3. Didn't really impact laptimes massively but was so much nicer to drive and will probably save me damage and lap time in the long runs!
- 671
- Canada
- moosethemooche78
I don't know how those drivers do it. It is all I can do to get a lap under 2:06. I've mostly been doing offline custom races and lobbies for practice so far, but I managed to squeeze a quick Free Practice session in this morning. Best time was 2:05.7, a few tenths off of @GlockPants. I don't expect it will improve much before Wednesday.
If last season's race at Bathurst taught me anything, it is that you can get a decent result at this track even if you don't have the greatest pace. The track is so unforgiving. Tap a wall on the way up or down the hill and you can easily lose a full second on your lap -- even without the wall collision penalties. Edit: If you can get around the track cleanly, you are bound to pick up some positions.
My goal for practice is learning to consistently get around the track without making any costly mistakes, so I can take advantage when drivers ahead push too hard and take themselves out. Easier said than done, of course.
Same for the VW Beetle. I've been using TC 2, which seems to be enough to tame the back end on that car.
Is that true? Does anybody here know? I see a fair number of drivers in the standings who have zero points for all the rounds so far.
Example (the last one, obviously):
Do you actually have to participate? It looks to me like you might show up in the standings after you have signed and an event has completed.
Not that it matters at all, but I'm curious how these drivers are showing up with zero points. Are they quitting out of races or do they just not participate in the first place?
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- 3,697
- London, ON
- A_Mindful_Place
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