Grip bug thread

[zzz_pt]

I've taken the time to record the laps as I was requested to do so.

TRL_SENNNA lap


CRT_Daniiel lap



He's had the bug affecting him since November, at least that I'm aware of.

For sure that first lap is bugged. Very nocicible on his 3rd, 4th and 5th sector times. The car has grip where it shouldn't normally have.

I'm confused. So with the bug he was 1.6 faster or slower than you? Unless you are saying that you are equal drivers, comparing a bugged lap to a non bugged lap of different drivers doesn't give reliable data.

I'm comparing with his lap time before. He was around 1/ 1.5 seconds faster than me. Now is around 1.5 slower. That's consistent with the 3sec gap he mentioned. Also, as @Spurgy 777 said, that gap will vary depending on driver, car and track.

What we know for sure is that something is wrong. Doing a 2:23:9XX is simply impossible on today's daily. My optimal time is around 22:25:3XX. Over 1 sec difference is a lot.

 

[kubstar]

ya the hairpin...@1.25 is nice to see...full throttle outgoing with full right on wheel telemetry screen...such low to mid speed corners are the best ways for infected people to save time :> i did a 2.25.371 today with the M4 and its nice to see in comparison how hard the outgoing steering can be without spinning )...

 

[DriftMethod]

For sure that first lap is bugged. Very nocicible on his 3rd, 4th and 5th sector times. The car has grip where it shouldn't normally have.



I'm comparing with his lap time before. He was around 1/ 1.5 seconds faster than me. Now is around 1.5 slower. That's consistent with the 3sec gap he mentioned. Also, as @Spurgy 777 said, that gap will vary depending on driver, car and track.

What we know for sure is that something is wrong. Doing a 2:23:9XX is simply impossible on today's daily. My optimal time is around 22:25:3XX. Over 1 sec difference is a lot.

Thank you for the clarification.

I find all of this fascinating and really enjoy seeing everyone's contributions and comments.

My main question now is whether this bug is binary (have the bug or not) or is a variable that could be happening to everyone to different degrees.

Also, I'm just mentally preparing myself for the day this gets fixed and I'm suddenly 3 seconds slower than everyone else I was racing with.

 

[Z Crazy]

On the topic of braking and the purposed glitch, it's possible differences in lap time (1.6 vs. 3 or 4 sec.) could be down to the ABS setting. If the glitch gives an enormous amount of braking traction, it's possible to see someone who uses no ABS get the full benefit of the braking traction, while someone with a strong or mild ABS settings only receives a little benefit.

 

[JacksHerer]

For peace of mind, you can create a sub account on your ps4 if you don't already have one that hasn't been used, and run some laps against yourself.

 

[zzz_pt]

@kubstar that corner is probably the best spot to see it. He has no wheelspin whatsoever.

@Z Crazy Not using ABS only makes you brake earlier not later. I also think the no ABS setting is way too sensitive in GTS.

 

[GTPorsche]

Looking and listening to these laps , the main thing I notice is the replay above has no tyre screech / rumble sfx ect.

This has been consistent with all the bugged laps. I know I've got tire squeal reduced in my settings but I can audibly hear the tire squeal when I drive myself.

@GTPorsche if you saved the replay files, could you take pictures of tyre deformation through corners please ?

I can get pictures later, although I don't think it has any correlation to the bug.

On the topic of braking and the purposed glitch, it's possible differences in lap time (1.6 vs. 3 or 4 sec.) could be down to the ABS setting. If the glitch gives an enormous amount of braking traction, it's possible to see someone who uses no ABS get the full benefit of the braking traction, while someone with a strong or mild ABS settings only receives a little benefit.

It has nothing to do with ABS settings because anything less than default is a disadvantage.

 

[iFerrari]

It’s strange that people that know they have the bug are not coming forward.
This issue is gonna be fixed...
And they can leave this situation as someone that acknowledge the problem, and have the community’s support... or as “cheaters”.

Some people out there have something called ego, can't deal with that stuff even if they know it makes them look bad they still won't give a damn.

 

[Spurgy 777]

You very well may be correct, but unless we see Senna drive the same course, same tires, with the Megane, and see a 3 second difference, we can't make that conclusion yet.

Assumption about the effect of this bug on various cars based on individual vehicle dynamics may not be a sound strategy to define the operation of this bug. For clarity, we should refrain from judgements about disparities in lap times and focus on collecting data that removes ambiguities.

Could RA1784 and TRL_SENNNA perhaps do some test laps in various cars to benchmark if the bug has consistent or varying effects?

It's perfectly reasonable to predict how this bug will affect different cars based on what we know. The main benefit of the bug is increased traction and the Megane suffers more from lack of traction than the M4, therefore it is safe prediction that the M4 would benefit less from the bug.

I've also already seen videos where Senna has been 2-3 seconds faster in the Megane at shorter tracks, so there is no reason to believe he wouldn't be able to got more than 1.6 seconds faster on a 2:25 lap. If we still had a driver with the bug that was willing to cooperate that would be great for testing this, but unfortunately we don't right now so drawing reasonable conclusions from the evidence we have is about as good as it gets, and is something I'm fairly good at.

On the topic of braking and the purposed glitch, it's possible differences in lap time (1.6 vs. 3 or 4 sec.) could be down to the ABS setting. If the glitch gives an enormous amount of braking traction, it's possible to see someone who uses no ABS get the full benefit of the braking traction, while someone with a strong or mild ABS settings only receives a little benefit.

They both had ABS on.

 

[JacksHerer]

I assume RA has made new progress since delete and wouldn't want to try going back to the USB save file to be tester again?

 

[Spurgy 777]

I assume RA has made new progress since delete and wouldn't want to try going back to the USB save file to be tester again?

Guessing he could back up his current save and switch between the two? Not sure if that is possible.

 

[RA1784]

Guessing he could back up his current save and switch between the two? Not sure if that is possible

Im just happy i have this behind me. But i could give it a try if a test is absolutely necessary.

 

[DriftMethod]

For peace of mind, you can create a sub account on your ps4 if you don't already have one that hasn't been used, and run some laps against yourself.

But what if I get faster?
I mentioned everyone might need a second account earlier, but until there's a fix, I still will have some doubt in my mind about the physics equality.

It's perfectly reasonable to predict how this bug will affect different cars based on what we know. The main benefit of the bug is increased traction and the Megane suffers more from lack of traction than the M4, therefore it is safe prediction that the M4 would benefit less from the bug.

I've also already seen videos where Senna has been 2-3 seconds faster in the Megane at shorter tracks, so there is no reason to believe he wouldn't be able to got more than 1.6 seconds faster on a 2:25 lap. If we still had a driver with the bug that was willing to cooperate that would be great for testing this, but unfortunately we don't right now so drawing reasonable conclusions from the evidence we have is about as good as it gets, and is something I'm fairly good at.

More data equals better conclusions. I now have more confidence in your analysis.

 

[JacksHerer]

It would be probable that the server sync won't allow it. And RA would be back to nothing.

Best to get Senna or someone else to be tester, I guess senna already is if he keeps doing times on both profiles.

 

[Spurgy 777]

More data equals better conclusions. I now have more confidence in your analysis.

Definitely, it's also worth bearing in mind that people with this bug are effectively if not literally driving with a different physics model so to expect the BoP, which is hard enough to get right as it is, would hold up under those conditions allowing the cars to still be relatively the same pace is unreasonable.

 

[UGA95]

I've watched a couple of GordoAssassins's replays now. It's pretty comical how bad his racing line is and the lap times he's putting down. He's the most obvious to me.

 

[Tou2istTrophy]

Does this bug have any affect on campaign/Circuit experience or offline? Or is it strictly in sport mode?

Also, we now know that it doesn't have anything to do with custom wheels (because Sennna has a stock livery).

 

[GT_Alex74]

Offline has been tested, bug was still in effect. And custom wheels were out of the question from the start.

 

[Tou2istTrophy]

Offline has been tested, bug was still in effect. And custom wheels were out of the question from the start.

I would have thought if that's the case there would be a greater variation of times in driving School and Circuit experience leaderboards (given that it would stand out over a small distance), but it all seems pretty standard over there (aside from the occasional grass or wall ride). Maybe there's only very few people who really have this?

 

[dabz343]

It's perfectly reasonable to predict how this bug will affect different cars based on what we know. The main benefit of the bug is increased traction and the Megane suffers more from lack of traction than the M4, therefore it is safe prediction that the M4 would benefit less from the bug.

I've also already seen videos where Senna has been 2-3 seconds faster in the Megane at shorter tracks, so there is no reason to believe he wouldn't be able to got more than 1.6 seconds faster on a 2:25 lap. If we still had a driver with the bug that was willing to cooperate that would be great for testing this, but unfortunately we don't right now so drawing reasonable conclusions from the evidence we have is about as good as it gets, and is something I'm fairly good at.

I concur the bug seems to affect overall traction, but how it plays out in the 4 phases of cornering (initial braking, trail braking/initial turn in, mid corner, and exit) are still subject to deeper analysis. I agree with your assertion that traction at exit for the Megane is the weak point in it's chassis, thus this bug is negating this weakness. But concluding that the M4 benefits less from this bug is a grey area and perhaps wise not to jump to that conclusion just yet.

I don't doubt your ability to draw conclusions from your experience. But perhaps for the sake of clarity, since this thread will reach PD someday, we error on the side of caution.

 

[RA1784]

Does this bug have any affect on campaign/Circuit experience or offline? Or is it strictly in sport mode?

Bug confirmed in time trials (also offline), daily races and public lobbys. Other race modes havent been tested. We were focused on the location of the bug after we found out that there is no bug on 2nd account.

 

[Nando deBem]

Bug confirmed in time trials (also offline), daily races and public lobbys. Other race modes havent been tested. We were focused on the location of the bug after we found out that there is no bug on 2nd account.

What about circuit experience?

 

[RA1784]

What about circuit experience?

Cant answer this. I spent overall maybe 3 minutes in there

 

[Nando deBem]

Cant answer this. I spent overall maybe 3 minutes in there

I’m worried about the Canadian championship that’s gonna start using Circuit Experience as qualifying event.

 

[Tou2istTrophy]

I’m worried about the Canadian championship that’s gonna start using Circuit Experience as qualifying event.

I personally haven't seen anything susupicious enough in circuit experiences yet (aside from foreseeable grass and wallriding), but for sure this bug would affect those competing for the Alonso challenge. Imagine if someone drove cleanly enough to not be noticeable with that bug and won it... joining Fernando Alonso's team and winning the cash prizes.

 

[BigDawg_1281]

@RA1784, I'm curious if you tested tire wear. I was wondering if the wear was at the same rate.

 

[XtremePhoto]

Im just happy i have this behind me. But i could give it a try if a test is absolutely necessary.

I hope you still have your saved files with the bug. When the bug is cleared, you should be able to use that save to keep your progress you made.
I registered to this site just to say that you are 100% a class act. You were attacked a little bit and accused of cheating, but you helped all of us who enjoy this game!

As an aside, I’m not an experienced racer, but I do think a lot of the speculation about this bug is focusing on real-world physics. The problem with that is that as a software issue, it could be something in the code that is turning cars into slot cars that is not explainable with real world analogies.

 

[MadMax]

Speaking of Driving School , there are some obvious cases where people have times not normally reachable.

Driving School #8 for example in the Roadster @ Brands Hatch GP

My time is 13.075

the top 10 are:
12.900
12.976
13.024
13.044
13.065
and 5x 13.066

Thus the top 4 times are very suspicious

And #21

17.990 - Again , Impossible time?
18.160
18.187
18.205
18.285

#24 Likely glitched times and/or grip bug
38.498 S/S driver
38.593
42.464
42.778
43.066
43.620
43.675
43.742 - My time

#25 Top 2 are Impossible times
15.856
16.152
17.066
17.103
and so on

#35 Impossible times
12.978
13.028
14.809
and so on

 

[RA1784]

@RA1784, I'm curious if you tested tire wear. I was wondering if the wear was at the same rate.

Yes tire wear existed and i felt less grip after some laps. But a 1.54.9 on Nürburgring GP in lap 4 with tire wear 7x was still possible
(Happend in a sport mode practice lobby with bop on and locked setup)

 

[BigDawg_1281]

Yes tire wear existed and i felt less grip after some laps. But a 1.54.9 on Nürburgring GP in lap 4 with tire wear 7x was still possible

I was thinking maybe a tire compound bug of some sort. It doesn't seem that's it, if they weren't falling off quickly.

It seems it is almost the difference between pre and post patch 1.06? if I remember correctly. Where everyone got faster by around 2 secs with the physics changes.