Group 3 BoP Testing

[Tidgney]

Video will be tomorrow guys, had a bit of an unfortunate week in that I got a sore throat (Funnily enough that happened straight after my 35 minute highlight video on PCars2), which has now cleared. In addition I've had to change my wheel to my backup g29.... The T300 kept going off centre and was getting more and more violent with random and bad vibrations... Similar to the under steer vibration except I wasn't under steering and it would get worse throughout a session until it started going off centre. Unplug, plug back in and it's fine for another couple of laps then it would go off centre again.

While I am pretty sure I can be just as fast as with the T300, I'm trying to sort out a braking problem with the g29 pedal (70% press = 100% braking rather than 70%) and I need to get used to it . My plan is to quickly do a test at brands with one of the cars I've tested and get the same time as per the leaderboard so I know I'm up to speed.

I know there are some people on this forum with professional track experience -- has anyone actually driven the Ferrari 458 GT3 in real life? It seems implausible to me that the real car handles that poorly.

The 458 is the Gr.3 car I've had the most time with in GTS, and yet I still struggle with it, especially once tire wear sets in and exacerbates the problems @Tidgney mentioned in the video. It's an exciting car and a frightening car. BTW, the only way I've found to compensate for the 458's massive oversteer issues is to give it some forward brake bias. It still has snap oversteer issues, but with some forward brake bias its "normal" oversteer is tamed somewhat.

Ye that's literally what I'd recommend, -1 or even -2 to control the braking issue !

 

[Tidgney]

Hey Guys,

Latest video is now up and there should be 1 on the majority of the days this week as I'm off and not really doing much other than using my holidays up ! Nissan GTR and it comes in right at the bottom of the list. As I've changed my wheel I did do a test with the Porsche before hand at Brands and actually improved on it's optimum however that doesn't count for this as that is a secondary go. However that shows that the wheel change should have minimal impact.

Enjoy

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[james_L]

Hey Guys,

Latest video is now up and there should be 1 on the majority of the days this week as I'm off and not really doing much other than using my holidays up ! Nissan GTR and it comes in right at the bottom of the list. As I've changed my wheel I did do a test with the Porsche before hand at Brands and actually improved on it's optimum however that doesn't count for this as that is a secondary go. However that shows that the wheel change should have minimal impact.

Enjoy

​

Posted at 3am. Dedication to the spreadsheet.

 

[Tidgney]

Posted at 3am. Dedication to the spreadsheet.

Haha, well spotted !

I actually updated the spreadsheet again last night at 3am, but didn't want to stay up until 5am waiting for the release of the video! So here's the release of the video now for everyone (My sleep patterns a little messed up). Anyhow the NSX is kind of a fun car, although it is definitely struggling with something and I'm not sure what. I think potentially it struggles with acceleration (But it's hidden as you can maintain higher apex speeds) and also struggles a little on the braking. I enjoyed this car but I think it should be in the 24's not the 25's it's in at the moment!

​

 

[Mr616]

Haha, well spotted !

I actually updated the spreadsheet again last night at 3am, but didn't want to stay up until 5am waiting for the release of the video! So here's the release of the video now for everyone (My sleep patterns a little messed up). Anyhow the NSX is kind of a fun car, although it is definitely struggling with something and I'm not sure what. I think potentially it struggles with acceleration (But it's hidden as you can maintain higher apex speeds) and also struggles a little on the braking. I enjoyed this car but I think it should be in the 24's not the 25's it's in at the moment!

​

GTR vid was great, and jeez you said these would come thick n fast this week. I look forward to watch this NSX one after work

Top work as usual.

Many thanks

*I love the NSX but it just lacks outright pace/power in the mid range. Hard to put a finger on it.

 

[Touring Mars]

Great effort in putting these tests and videos together 👍

Coincidentally, I've been testing out stock Gr. 3 cars on Brands Hatch and now Suzuka too, albeit with a controller - I'm mightily impressed with your lap times and it is very noticable how much smoother you are with the wheel than I can manage with my controller! I found the 911 RSR and RCZ to be my two quickest cars so far, and I'm glad to see I'm not the only one struggling with the 458 Italia.

I haven't really followed the development of GT Sport until I bought the game just two weeks ago, so all of this BoP business is rather new to me, hence this thread is particularly interesting!

 

[NevilleNobody]

Any thoughts on the Viper from anyone? I am half decent around Bathurst and just get OWNED in that car, by D drivers no less.

 

[Alpha Cipher]

Any thoughts on the Viper from anyone? I am half decent around Bathurst and just get OWNED in that car, by D drivers no less.

@TheGeologist

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

Any thoughts on the Viper from anyone? I am half decent around Bathurst and just get OWNED in that car, by D drivers no less.

I drove the Viper around Dragon Trail yesterday. Unfortunately, I'm not at Tidgney's level and that chicane is something I'm not good at but I think my optimal would be a high 37. In comparison, I tried the Corvette and it's more of a low 37.

Driving wise, it's one where one can use a higher gear if concerned about wheelspin. It seems to stick to the road good enough although I was less confident pointing it where I wanted it compared to the Vette. I was at least faster in the Viper than the SLS.

 

[AshenGraey]

Haha, well spotted !

I actually updated the spreadsheet again last night at 3am, but didn't want to stay up until 5am waiting for the release of the video! So here's the release of the video now for everyone (My sleep patterns a little messed up). Anyhow the NSX is kind of a fun car, although it is definitely struggling with something and I'm not sure what. I think potentially it struggles with acceleration (But it's hidden as you can maintain higher apex speeds) and also struggles a little on the braking. I enjoyed this car but I think it should be in the 24's not the 25's it's in at the moment!

​

Great work as usual. Many thanks for the review.

Your review of the NSX was almost exactly what I was expected of the car. I personally find it quite fun to drive because you can just throw it around to some extent and the car surprisingly behaves/responds quite well. However, as you said, it is lacking something and that something IMO is power. To me it feels overwhelmingly under powered. I like the car but I find it very challenging to put down consistent lap times.

 

[NevilleNobody]

Fwiw I always feel slow on straights, even tucked behind other cars I can't seem to catch people

 

[TheNorfolkDad]

I hope the NSX GR2 is an absolute beast, I would use the GR3 so much more if it didn’t have that, something, that’s holding it back

 

[Tidgney]

GTR vid was great, and jeez you said these would come thick n fast this week. I look forward to watch this NSX one after work

Top work as usual.

Many thanks

*I love the NSX but it just lacks outright pace/power in the mid range. Hard to put a finger on it.

Haha cheers, there should be lots this weekend once this big video has been uploaded (Will take a long time to upload this video).

Great effort in putting these tests and videos together 👍

Coincidentally, I've been testing out stock Gr. 3 cars on Brands Hatch and now Suzuka too, albeit with a controller - I'm mightily impressed with your lap times and it is very noticable how much smoother you are with the wheel than I can manage with my controller! I found the 911 RSR and RCZ to be my two quickest cars so far, and I'm glad to see I'm not the only one struggling with the 458 Italia.

I haven't really followed the development of GT Sport until I bought the game just two weeks ago, so all of this BoP business is rather new to me, hence this thread is particularly interesting!

Cheers ! The RCZ is the one car I'm not expecting to be as high as it was compared to the 911 prior to all of this. The 458 is insane the more I think about it !

Any thoughts on the Viper from anyone? I am half decent around Bathurst and just get OWNED in that car, by D drivers no less.

1 car I've never driven but I look forward to it .

I drove the Viper around Dragon Trail yesterday. Unfortunately, I'm not at Tidgney's level and that chicane is something I'm not good at but I think my optimal would be a high 37. In comparison, I tried the Corvette and it's more of a low 37.

Driving wise, it's one where one can use a higher gear if concerned about wheelspin. It seems to stick to the road good enough although I was less confident pointing it where I wanted it compared to the Vette. I was at least faster in the Viper than the SLS.

It's good everyone is putting some times into it as I'd like to hope some feedback will get to PD! Sounds like the SLS is a real struggle from what you've said so that will be interesting!

I hope the NSX GR2 is an absolute beast, I would use the GR3 so much more if it didn’t have that, something, that’s holding it back

I hope Gr2 is balanced, there's only 3 cars so the balancing should be very, very good in that class! I'd be disappointed if it isn't!

Great work as usual. Many thanks for the review.

Your review of the NSX was almost exactly what I was expected of the car. I personally find it quite fun to drive because you can just throw it around to some extent and the car surprisingly behaves/responds quite well. However, as you said, it is lacking something and that something IMO is power. To me it feels overwhelmingly under powered. I like the car but I find it very challenging to put down consistent lap times.

Fwiw I always feel slow on straights, even tucked behind other cars I can't seem to catch people

Cheers LordExia ! Yup appears to be power and PD have just upped the power as well. In terms of this BoP change (I think we're quite fortunate in that only its 1 car we tested although frustratingly the 1 car we did the other day) has changed, although it did change in the way we expected! What I'll do is while this large video is uploading is retest the NSX quickly as it's only 1 car with the new change and to see the difference. It'll actually be nice to see how much 1% power changes the times and give us a good indication what we have to do to potentially other cars to get the BoP right !

While this large video is uploading I'll also be making a few car profiles so hopefully 3 or 4 once the large video is uploaded . The idea is to get all of these done (i.e. the initial tests) by the 8th May. I've got provisional dates for all the cars planned in so we'll see what happens .

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

It's good everyone is putting some times into it as I'd like to hope some feedback will get to PD! Sounds like the SLS is a real struggle from what you've said so that will be interesting!

Just to be clear, I was driving the '11 SLS so the newer one might be different.

The SLS has a sense of being stable and predictable. Gearing and power delivery helps me overcome the throttle issue somewhat since I can mash it in lower gears better than other cars. That said, handling feels stiff and I've had a lot of cars draft past me at Bathurst. It's possible I'm not getting all the speed I can off the SLS but given how I don't see many others using it, I suspect it's underpowered without excelling in another area to compensate.

In fairness, the SLS felt good enough at BB Raceway to win an FIA race against a few S class drivers. 3rd gear made launching off the first corner a simple affair without much worry about spinning out, even on old tires.

 

[Espial]

Hey Tidgney!

First and foremost, fantastic job man! I've been following this thread with great interest. Finally someone takes a systematic approach to the cars ingame. Hats off!

Have you thought about testing the new RC F Gr.3? It would be very interesting to see how it stacks up against it's arguably very good older brother.
I've heard it's even better but I haven't had the chance to test it yet.

 

[Tidgney]

Just to be clear, I was driving the '11 SLS so the newer one might be different.

The SLS has a sense of being stable and predictable. Gearing and power delivery helps me overcome the throttle issue somewhat since I can mash it in lower gears better than other cars. That said, handling feels stiff and I've had a lot of cars draft past me at Bathurst. It's possible I'm not getting all the speed I can off the SLS but given how I don't see many others using it, I suspect it's underpowered without excelling in another area to compensate.

In fairness, the SLS felt good enough at BB Raceway to win an FIA race against a few S class drivers. 3rd gear made launching off the first corner a simple affair without much worry about spinning out, even on old tires.

Was that the oval you were racing? As there's an issue with Ovals in that they use different BoP . I bet you're right though that it's under powered for some reason, it will definitely be interesting when it comes to testing it !

Hey Tidgney!

First and foremost, fantastic job man! I've been following this thread with great interest. Finally someone takes a systematic approach to the cars ingame. Hats off!

Have you thought about testing the new RC F Gr.3? It would be very interesting to see how it stacks up against it's arguably very good older brother.
I've heard it's even better but I haven't had the chance to test it yet.

Cheers for the kind compliments !

The new RC F will be added as it is a different car I think? Especially from what you've just said so it will be interesting to see! It is using the exact same BoP as the other car.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

Was that the oval you were racing? As there's an issue with Ovals in that they use different BoP . I bet you're right though that it's under powered for some reason, it will definitely be interesting when it comes to testing it.

Ah, yes. It believe BOP is different for ovals. Well, either the BOP favored the '11 SLS or I just had a better handle on the track.


Oh, and the BOP just changed with the recent update.

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/v1-15-bop-update.376683/

 

[Macboyilija]

@PirovacBoy: did you or did you not try a different GT3 car after these results ? And is your time even better ?

Very curious !

 

[Nuschel01]

@PirovacBoy: did you or did you not try a different GT3 car after these results ? And is your time even better ?

Very curious !

I guess he would rather race a sambabus against group 3 cars instead of any other group 3 car than the 458

 

[Voodoovaj]

GTR vid was great, and jeez you said these would come thick n fast this week. I look forward to watch this NSX one after work

Top work as usual.

Many thanks

*I love the NSX but it just lacks outright pace/power in the mid range. Hard to put a finger on it.

I find it just rotates too much. On my tuned version, I increased the rear extension damping to calm the rear.

 

[PirovacBoy]

@PirovacBoy: did you or did you not try a different GT3 car after these results ? And is your time even better ?

Very curious !

I did, I tried various Gr3s, and what I noticed immediately, the difference between MR and FR is huge.
For example Maggiore GP, My PB in the 458 is a 1:55:5, i tried the M6 and within 3 laps I managed to get a 1:55:2. Although i‘m very consistent in the 458 the M6 was way easier to handle and not so exhausting to drive on my limit. No comparison to the 458.

Or Nurb GP, 458 i run 1:55:8 in the M6 i got a 1:55:6 which again I achieved within a few laps.
Suzuka my PB is 1:59:6
Brands GP my PB is 1:23:4
Dragon Trail my PB is 1:37:7
Interlagos my PB is 1:31:7
Bathurst my PB is 2:02:7
Monza my PB is 1:47:5 all driven in the 458,or with other words my Gap to the #1 times are in average 1-1.5 seconds slower. I‘m a bit faster in the M6, but to be honest i‘ll stay with the 458. I just love the way it drives.
The thing is that i‘m already used on all tracks in the 458 and know how to drive them. I learned it the hard way, believe me, I can’t count the times how often she threw me off the Saddle. But once it clicked, the moment i understood how to drive her it was just a pleasure. My general Conclusion is, the other Gr3s are easier to drive for me but I definitely enjoy the 458 much more.

I guess he would rather race a sambabus against group 3 cars instead of any other group 3 car than the 458

👍 Scary how good you already know me, I guess I shouldn’t post so much about my preferences here, hell, your worse than a Psychic

 

[GT_Alex74]

Well, the M6 is a particular beast out there, if you used another Gr.3 you might end up slower for now

 

[Mr616]

I find it just rotates too much. On my tuned version, I increased the rear extension damping to calm the rear.

It does, but I find keeping the tiniest bit of throttle input seems to stop the over rotation. I don't like tuning because it will alienate the feel of the car for Sport. I'd rather get accustom to the stock settings.

I've been driving the 458 Gr3 almost exclusively these past few weeks (up until today) so the NSX handles like a dream compared to it (I'm loving the 458 Gr3 & 4..... but NOT at Interlagos lol. Porsche for me there).

 

[PirovacBoy]

It does, but I find keeping the tiniest bit of throttle input seems to stop the over rotation. I don't like tuning because it will alienate the feel of the car for Sport. I'd rather get accustom to the stock settings.

I've been driving the 458 Gr3 almost exclusively these past few weeks (up until today) so the NSX handles like a dream compared to it (I'm loving the 458 Gr3 & 4..... but NOT at Interlagos lol. Porsche for me there).

I just did a Qualy Lap on Interlagos and managed a 1:31:502 on my first try, and no, no need to guess which Car I used, you already know it anyway

 

[Macboyilija]

Thanks for your long answer. In the end, its all about fun to us, not about going fastest.

 

[Venster]

458 GR3 is actually a decent car, it’s got superb traction and nearly as fast in it as the RSR. The key thing with the 458 is if you are too agreesive with downshifting it will oversteer for me at least! I still prefer the RSR but the 458 is a close second. I can run a 1.37.5 at DT in the RSR and a 1.37.9 in the 458 but haven’t driven it anywhere near as much as the RSR.

Everyone raves about the M6 but I can not drive it at all! Just can’t get used to it, it doesn’t help given I use cockpit view exclusively that it has like 3 metres of dash in front of you, horrible in that view!

 

[Tidgney]

Sorry for the delays with this guys, video explains it and also shows you the schedule of when the videos should be released ! As I've said in the past by the 11th May they should all be out!

 

[Tidgney]

Hey All,

Sorry for the delay! I now have a working wheel (Yay!) so the tests are now going to be coming thick and fast to get through them before the 11th May! There's a few days spare in between if I fall behind. Now if you saw the last video I did say this would be out yesterday but I had to take apart my Fanatec pedals as I feel the load cell affects the test to much so I've gone back to the 2 pedals for now and will use that after the BoP test is finished. To give you an idea I was struggling with trail braking but could brake later with the load cell, which is unfair in my mind for this test. Anyhow the Corvette is here, and it's a car that we have choices with in how we can complete a lap so enjoy ! Dodge will be later today (As it's early morning here) or tomorrow if you're US .

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In addition I'm not updating the spreadsheet as I'm going to make a google document with that information plus a little bit more which you can then access and view!

 

[Venster]

These videos are great, aside from the BOP info we are getting it’s really good info about the cars as well. Narrated really well, informative and clear.

Your times are awesome!

I don’t want to go off thread, but just a quick question if I can, wondering whether you find the slightly bigger rim size of the fanatec wheel better than the smaller Thrustmaster? I’m finding it difficult to be as smooth as I want with the T300 small rim size wondering if I changed to the bigger Ferrari rim it would help? Although you appear to be fast with any wheel!!

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

In case I hadn't said it already, these BOP tests are quite informative. They help me get better acclimated to each car and what I need to do to get the speed out of them.

I'm pretty sure you're aware of this already but there is one caveat to the comparision: it does not factor tire wear and fuel consumption. It could be just my driving style but so far, my times in MR cars are lower overall compared to FR cars when tire and fuel are on. That and matching times to your rivals isn't necessarily equal if your rival gains multiple seconds on you during a pit stop.

I know PD tries to adjust for this as well although I get the impression there's an imbalance in this department as well. For me, that combined with ideal lap times render certain cars even less competitive than they already are but that's difficult to quantify.