GT6 News Discussion

[ProjectWHaT]

I wonder how large PD's car modelling team is?

Go to the credits section of the game or their website

 

[Siren]

I'm seeing all this talk about february updates and this and that about February...but what about the end of January update ? Why is there no word about this ? or is it pushed to February ?

 

[sparkytooth]

As of GT5, PD had 49 people dedicated to the dark art of car modelling with 5 car modelling directors and one technical supporter.

According to Kaz, one car's modelling job belongs to one individual and also according to PD, each machine takes 6 months to fully complete.

I'm no mathematical genius but I interpret that at the end of a year's worth of modelling from the entire team, they have atleast 98 cars modelled.

 

[Lawndart]

That was very disappointing to hear that one person works on one car. Just further proves PD is really, really mismanaged.

Not at all, this is a common practice in game development.

Don't misunderstand the fact that it's still reviewed by others, but consistency in aesthetics in very important as well as 'ownership' and accountability of individuals.

Inconsistent aesthetics is where you get odd results like in the Forza series... Who outsource/farm their car and track development.

 

[Davoxx]

Not at all, this is a common practice in game development.

Don't misunderstand the fact that it's still reviewed by others, but consistency in aesthetics in very important as well as 'ownership' and accountability of individuals.

Inconsistent aesthetics is where you get odd results like in the Forza series... Who outsource/farm their car and track development.

Yes and all cars are premium !!!!!

 

[Lawndart]

Yes and all cars are premium !!!!!

Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but it's also a rather commendable fact that PD could improve so many standards considering the original assets are inferior to start with.

Sure, it's still below a standard we as consumers expect but polishing turds is not that easy... Take second to think of a real turd, then imagine your options to making it shinny... You'll be closer to understanding the actual challenge than you might think.

 

[sparkytooth]

Yes and all cars are premium !!!!!

Because unlike PD, T10 didn't port machines over from the last generation of games because they could. So they're more or less the same modelling quality.

PD could easily just get rid of the PS2 cars they haven't decided to remodel into full quality cars and keep the quality of the machines consistent like T10 does while continuing to model machines at a high level of quality like the other 412 currently present. Which is expected to be done by the time GT reaches it's fourth generation of games.

 

[Tenacious D]

The X cars, B spec/endurance racing and the Course creator are the only major items left that they have actually said are going to be apart of GT6.
Pretty much everything else is speculation and everyone should NOT expect to get any of them.

There is a massive update to the online part. Remember being able to set up your own race events, series and championships? And tools for creating and managing online leagues and clubs? It would make a lot of sense for that to be included in GT6, as PD sees what works and doesn't, what we like and want improved, as preliminary work on GT7.

So here's a question for everybody, who else had a feeling that the new track was going to be huge? In the trailer you can see at one point the car is really far away from the lake that it was driving next to earlier in the video.

The video was so panoramic and... well, freaking huge, that I expected something on the order of the Nordshleife, 10 miles or more. 27km - almost 16.8 miles - hits me right in the pleasure center. Especially since...

Thanks. At least we now know that it isn't a course maker location but an actual track (27 km, can't wait!) and that it's DLC.

Our own Wardez had pointed out:

Yeah, Kaz said in an interview that there would be custom tracks made by PD using the course creator feature tool released before the actual tool is. It's meant to serve as a sample of what's possible.

So to the people saying that this is a course creator track, and those that are saying this is just a new track, you're both half wrong (or half right, if you're an optimist).

So this has me rather tickled.

That was very disappointing to hear that one person works on one car. Just further proves PD is really, really mismanaged.

To add to what Lawndart posted, what's the difference? A car built by committee or a car built by one modeler still takes six man months. So in a year, you'll get the same number of cars. Logic FTW.

Yes and all (Forza 5) cars are premium !!!!!

Yes, and there are so many!!!!! I mean, few!!!!!

And you need to face facts. In the polls done here, the people who don't like the Standard cars are in the minority, at around 30%, and the people who actually like them are close to 40%. We like owning and driving these cars. You don't even have to look at them. Besides, there are about 400 Premium cars now as Sparkytooth says, so you have more than enough to play with, if you think F5's 150 some odd car list is so awesome.

 

[sparkytooth]

I hope modelling efficiency will improve come Gen IV of GT.

 

[Davoxx]

Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but it's also a rather commendable fact that PD could improve so many standards considering the original assets are inferior to start with.

Sure, it's still below a standard we as consumers expect but polishing turds is not that easy... Take second to think of a real turd, then imagine your options to making it shinny... You'll be closer to understanding the actual challenge than you might think.

The thing is I can't understand how nowaday you can produce a Car game with " ugly" cars and without full interiors.
I mean Cars are the most important things in this game so they have to be full detailed or nothing.
And I think you can't be disagree with these facts.
I'm playing both Gt and forza and still have fun with both of them but i'm also disappointed by both of them because they are so close to be a great great game.

 

[Nish]

I'd say the physics of said vehicles are much more important than the difference of standard/premium. If the premium physics were much better than standards I'd agree with your "fact" that standards are bad. BTW you saying "fact" does not make it so. Fact.

 

[eSZee]

Inconsistent aesthetics is where you get odd results like in the Forza series... Who outsource/farm their car and track development.

Let's not go crazy and imply GT premiums are consistent across the board.

I hope modelling efficiency will improve come Gen IV of GT.

We have no reason to believe it will change. Kaz's vision has not changed, so no reason to think the process will.

 

[Davoxx]

I'd say the physics of said vehicles are much more important than the difference of standard/premium. If the premium physics were much better than standards I'd agree with your "fact" that standards are bad. BTW you saying "fact" does not make it so. Fact.

I mean there is car with no full interior and some which look "ugly", yes it is a fact this is what I'm saying.

 

[Devil240Z]

Let's not go crazy and imply GT premiums are consistent across the board.


We have no reason to believe it will change. Kaz's vision has not changed, so no reason to think the process will.

Personally I would be happy if they modeled new cars at standard quality and then made them premium if the car was popular with the community.

 

[jackargent]

The thing is I can't understand how nowaday you can produce a Car game with " ugly" cars and without full interiors.
I mean Cars are the most important things in this game so they have to be full detailed or nothing.
And I think you can't be disagree with these facts.
I'm playing both Gt and forza and still have fun with both of them but i'm also disappointed by both of them because they are so close to be a great great game.

these are not facts. they are opinions.

 

[sparkytooth]

We have no reason to believe it will change. Kaz's vision has not changed, so no reason to think the process will.

I don't think Kaz's vision has anything to do with how they advance in terms of taking advantage of the technology at hand, better for them if they can find a more efficient way to achieve Kaz's "Vision".

 

[sems4arsenal]

So if two people model a car, then that it is no longer art?

 

[Davoxx]

these are not facts. they are opinions.

Sorry ???? yes they are facts ! The only "opinion" in my post is "I'm playing both Gt and Forza and still having fun but I'm also disappointed by both of them because they are so close to be a great great game" thats it.

 

[iainoflo85]

Sorry ???? yes they are facts ! The only "opinion" in my post is "I'm playing both Gt and Forza and still having fun but I'm also disappointed by both of them because they are so close to be a great great game" thats it.

Calling the Standard cars "ugly" is a subjective viewpoint, i.e. opinion and not fact.

 

[Nish]

You said that is the most important thing in the game. The fact that there is already more than 1 person that has already disagree'd with you should tell you that it is not the most important thing to most people. You thinking the interior and "ugly" standards are the worst thing ever does not make it fact to everyone else. The most important thing to me are the physics, could be sounds for someone else = opinions. You can't say this is what it shouldn't have because I don't like it and then call it a fact.

I will agree that it is part of making it a better overall product to have them all premium but it is about 4th on my list of things a racing game needs.

 

[Yui-san]

Kaz says a new 27Km track (most likely around Zahara and its lake, near Ronda, Spain) will be coming to GT6 soon as part of a new DLC (which will be launched sometime in February), along with two RB X2014 models:the RB X2014 Standard, and RB X2014 Fan Car. He later showed that same video we saw the other day on the live stream.

Taken from this thread: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ng-supposedly-today-1-25.300744/#post-9263504

Which was initially taken from my post in this very thread.

That was very disappointing to hear that one person works on one car. Just further proves PD is really, really mismanaged.

I actually like that, since it makes their modelling generally more consistent (as opposed to outsourcing the models, which I imagine would have serious consequences). And as Kaz said, it reflects upon the values of "craftsmanship"...and I like the sound of that.

I think the real problem is not that only one person is working on one car, but rather that there are way too little employees working at PD...I mean, most of their staff today are from the GT1 days, if I recall correctly! They ought to hire more people! I'm sure they have the money to do so. I understand that once you expand a company it no longer feels the same (I guess Kaz prefers working with familiar people), but if PD intends on keeping the GT series as big as it is today in the gaming industry , they really ought to step up their game in terms of development. because sooner or later, they are going to fall behind.

They can have all these relationships with car manufactures and GT Academy programs, but if Gran Turismo continues to fall behind in terms of graphics, its sales could drop dramatically.

 

[Davoxx]

You said that is the most important thing in the game. The fact that there is already more than 1 person that has already disagree'd with you should tell you that it is not the most important thing to most people. You thinking the interior and "ugly" standards are the worst thing ever does not make it fact to everyone else. The most important thing to me are the physics, could be sounds for someone else = opinions. You can't say this is what it shouldn't have because I don't like it and then call it a fact.

I will agree that it is part of making it a better overall product to have them all premium but it is about 4th on my list of things a racing game needs.

I'm waisting my time now, sorry. We have a different way to think. I can't understand how can approve the mediocrity.
When you attempt to do something , you must to do it completely and provide the best you can this is how I was educate.

 

[Nish]

When is the second presentation supposed to happen? I believe I calculated that it would happen around 12am EST earlier but I lost track of where I saw the second parts time.

 

[Lawndart]

The thing is I can't understand how nowaday you can produce a Car game with " ugly" cars and without full interiors.
I mean Cars are the most important things in this game so they have to be full detailed or nothing.
And I think you can't be disagree with these facts.
I'm playing both Gt and forza and still have fun with both of them but i'm also disappointed by both of them because they are so close to be a great great game.

I hear ya, and don't really disagree but that is a different argument about quality vs quantity. What they build vs how they build is a bit different.

In the racing games space, claiming to have SO much as a marketing point can outweigh the minority that takes issue...

 

[Lawndart]

Let's not go crazy and imply GT premiums are consistent across the board.


We have no reason to believe it will change. Kaz's vision has not changed, so no reason to think the process will.

Let's not confuse the issue by turning a statement about dev process into the premium vs standards argument... Totally different topics.

 

[sparkytooth]

I'm waisting my time now, sorry. We have a different way to think. I can't understand how can approve the mediocrity.
When you attempt to do something , you must to do it completely and provide the best you can this is how I was educate.

The standard cars are simply port overs from the Gen II era of GT games, they're almost virtually unchanged except where it matters, which is in how the dynamics simulation treats those cars, which is equivalent to how the Gen III machines are treated within the simulation. I wouldn't call it mediocrity other than that their presence affects some of the overall quality of the game with the disparity between them and the 412 machines modeled for Gen III and the future. They're more or less extras.

 

[Nurburgthing.]

Personally I would be happy if they modeled new cars at standard quality and then made then premium if the car was popular with the community.

I like this idea.

We could watch the cars evolve in 3 or 4 stages.

Standard model with final physics model attached.
Semi premium exterior.
Premium exterior.
Fully moddeled interior added.

It gives us the chance to drive the car and tune it withou having to wait an age to get anything new (car wise).

 

[Crispy]

TTo add to what Lawndart posted, what's the difference? A car built by committee or a car built by one modeler still takes six man months. So in a year, you'll get the same number of cars. Logic FTW.

Yeah except six man months divided up amongst a team of people takes considerably less time than six man months divided by one person. Math FTW.

Consistency can be provided with a team of people working on cars. What you're saying is that if person A works on one car, and person B helps, then the quality will go down and the consistency will be ruined. Using that logic then any car person B works on will be horribly disfigured considering as soon as he helps with person A's car things stop adding up correctly.

Hell they don't even need to outsource, but at least use a team to model a car. What next, they're hiring cats to produce tracks? (But it can't be a litter of kittens, cause that'd bring the quality down.)

 

[Lawndart]

If I was asked to foresee the PD's plan for car development I would guess that over time relevant cars will be upgraded while certain cars disappear all together. It would be a long term plan but one that enables them to keep their numbers but more practically align their labor load...

Segregating them like GT 5 works ONLY if you're higher quality work is more numerous to the lower quality. And eventually it will work out, relegating the remaining standard as simply bonus cars or extras... Over time. GT 7 is likely that time and I wouldn't be surprised if many cars get cut (based on analytics) just to make standards the minority to the premiums.

 

[NICKname]

Yeah except six man months divided up amongst a team of people takes considerably less time than six man months divided by one person. Math FTW.

Consistency can be provided with a team of people working on cars. What you're saying is that if person A works on one car, and person B helps, then the quality will go down and the consistency will be ruined. Using that logic then any car person B works on will be horribly disfigured considering as soon as he helps with person A's car things stop adding up correctly.

Hell they don't even need to outsource, but at least use a team to model a car. What next, they're hiring cats to produce tracks? (But it can't be a litter of kittens, cause that'd bring the quality down.)

I think he means 6 people working on 1 car for 1 month and 6 people working on 6 cars for 6 months.