GT6 Sales Discussion

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I think "worse" isn't that hard to quantify, guys. Get serious.

We've been serious we explained it to you, and you continue to act like a kid plugging his ears and yelling "la la la la la". Not much more we can do for someone who has already decided long before we made our comments.

 

[Tenacious D]

Oh, you've explained. "Sound hasn't changed one bit." Without offering one smidgin of evidence. And even though a number of discussions in a few threads indicate that your assertion isn't correct. Maybe Jordan was pulling an Obama when he said the sounds were better. Maybe he used mind control on us to trick our ears. Who knows, but evidently anything's true if it sounds negative around here.

Besides, quit acting like I insulted your mother if I don't cringe in horror like you do over the sounds, the bot A.I., or whatever. That does not equal "GT6 is paaarfect." I think you're getting way too drama queen about this.

 

[octaneblood]

I thought this thread was about sales numbers......speaking of which, does anyone have a definitive to date figure of global sales?

2 million ?

 

[mr_serious]

Have any examples which are worse?

Just looking through this thread, or looking at @Imari's post history should provide all the information you need.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Oh, you've explained. "Sound hasn't changed one bit." Without offering one smidgin of evidence. And even though a number of discussions in a few threads indicate that your assertion isn't correct. Maybe Jordan was pulling an Obama when he said the sounds were better. Maybe he used mind control on us to trick our ears. Who knows, but evidently anything's true if it sounds negative around here.

Besides, quit acting like I insulted your mother if I don't cringe in horror like you do over the sounds, the bot A.I., or whatever. That does not equal "GT6 is paaarfect." I think you're getting way too drama queen about this.

Read the below that I've bolded and it doesn't show me saying that sounds aren't either being improved or have been improved to a limited degree. Basically I'm saying that sounds have been slight tweaked but still aren't all that different from GT5, but we can expect them to be. So since I don't agree with you but am being optimistic about the future, that still isn't good enough for you. Guess since you can't win them all (or any) you have to go up in arms and throw a fuss.

I'm not acting any sort of way, and I find this comment especially funny since you direct it at me but are to afraid (perhaps purposefully neglectful) to tag or quote me so I can respond back to you. I've noticed this alot lately when people don't want this to continue on so they'll get a last word with the hopes that if they don't quote the person it will disappear and you'll "win". None of us are getting drama anything we tell you like it is you get all emotional based then you try to spin as if we are, your post history shows this, quit with the trite.

The aero didn't change and the parts in gt auto don't improve the aero, which is sad seeing as they went and made parts that should effect it like flat floors with diffusers. Tire model has change and so has suspension. Sounds have still not changed and PD have told us they are place holders trying to say otherwise to go at bat for PD isn't needed or anymore helpful than the crazy extreme that wants GT to fail.

Also the behavior of the AI hasn't really changed if you've followed the series. Is it different than GT5? Sure, to some degree it is different. Is it different than GT3/4 slingshot ability around AI or aggressive line keeping, no it isn't. Do they let you catch up from a massive gap that hasn't been seen in any other GT game? Yeah.

It's different somewhat but like the successors in the past to a new core game for a different sony model, they're still closely related and similar. (e.g. GT3 to 4 on PS2 or 1 to 2 on PSX)

I never said they were all bad, but great job taking my words out of context, the bulk of them need fixing, and if you paid attention, on all the GT6 threads that talk about the junior RB car, I've praised the sound. So....

Finally Jordan said this:

I also noticed a slightly more gritty engine sound than what I have heard in previous builds. A Sony representative confirmed that several of the cars were equipped with updated audio. Although I’m not sure if I played with one of these cars, I could sense something had changed. For those optimistic audiophiles out there, don’t get too carried away by my comments – the game still sounds much the same – but you should take comfort in knowing that it was better.

He was told some have been updated he has no idea if the car he drove was one of them but felt it could have been, but reminds people (like yourself) to not go out of control because most sounds are still the same on average and not changed. Though he says it is better they may have cleaned up existing samples, but we know that for example the M4 is a place holder in sound yet it's massively improved. You strike me as one that just read the nice parts instead of it all.

 

[Tenacious D]

No, I read that whole thing, including the last sentence, and that should be sufficient to close this discussion.

 

[Deadpool]

Hahaha... you guys don't know jack shizim about Motorsports.. If a car is superior and or dominating the field they handicap it for the remaining of the season to be more competitive, they don' make the rest of the field faster. They make the fast cars slower. This is practiced in gt3, F1 and super gt * more predominately in gt500* and countless others . I can, A make the whole field faster, or B make my car slower to race with the field. Then again in real life pack racing only occurs in the first few laps.. and nascar! Doing what we do in GT5 would be a very incredible feat in real life, if they gave us the best Damn AI ever , We would be LUCKY to finish six spots above our original position.

Ummmmm no. Very few race series employ a handicap to the faster cars and F1 is not one of them.

 

[MustangManiac]

Ummmmm no. Very few race series employ a handicap to the faster cars and F1 is not one of them.

Actually many (most?) racing series do this, it is called B.O.P (Balance Of Power) and they employ all kinds of methods to do so. You are correct though, F1 is not one of them.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Oh, you've explained. "Sound hasn't changed one bit." Without offering one smidgin of evidence. And even though a number of discussions in a few threads indicate that your assertion isn't correct. Maybe Jordan was pulling an Obama when he said the sounds were better. Maybe he used mind control on us to trick our ears. Who knows, but evidently anything's true if it sounds negative around here.

Besides, quit acting like I insulted your mother if I don't cringe in horror like you do over the sounds, the bot A.I., or whatever. That does not equal "GT6 is paaarfect." I think you're getting way too drama queen about this.

Why do you continue to bring Jordan into this, especially when it comes to sounds? We have the game now, what someone said in a very brief review before the game was released doesn't really matter now. We can listen to all the cars for ourselves. Some are better, most are the same, some are absolutely horrific like the FXX and an insult to the real car.

Keep in mind better =/= good. Going from an average of 2/10 to 3/10 is a 50% improvement but it doesn't mean the sounds are even close to good enough.

 

[Imari]

I think "worse" isn't that hard to quantify, guys. Get serious. Or you could just give yourselves net cookies all night.

Very well. If you'd like it quantified you'll have no trouble telling us the units you'd like it quantified in. Costanzas per kilogram? Chalkboard-nail-feet? Dutch-equivalent dextral nut punches?

Worse is an opinion, and I'm not about to hold mine up for you to throw fallacies at. I didn't even say what my opinion was, whether sounds/AI were better, worse or the same. You simply assumed.

 

[FiftyBelowZero]

GT has been known for each title being COMPLETELY different. By the time of GT5 the GT fanbase was MEGA. But GT5 turned out to be a disappointment. It racked up a lot of sales, being the best-selling on the PS3 of all time until GTA V came out.

I still find a similarity with GT5 and GT6 and that wasn't the case with GT3 and GT4 or GT and GT2. And with PD not listening to what fans want, GT5 blew it and Forza is far ahead now. We can also blame Sony. They're not promoting GT in any way. Then look at Microsoft. FM5 is like the top feature of the Xbox One!

 

[Lawndart]

Wow, what a debate. I think it can all be summed up with;

Yes many things have "changed", but as consumers "change" means better or worse. Rarely is change effective without recognizing an improvement or digression.

GT has constantly changed things throughout the series, but the enigma with the GT series is that despite all the change, things are exactly the same.

It's like painting your car, wow it looks so different, but after driving it awhile you sort of forget about the paint and realize the car is still exactly the same.

For so many versions of GT we get so hyped, then after some time with it most come to the conclusion it's pretty much the same... That doesn't mean nothing literally changed, it just means that the change wasn't noticeable enough to significantly move the needle closer to hyped expectation.

I feel for you all but this debate is more about arguing symptoms than it is about the core issue. That being, GT as a game has not advanced at rate we as gamers have come to expect.

 

[Ferrari458Italia]

Sorry guys don't really want to go through 432 posts, but does anyone have the number of sales as of now?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Sorry guys don't really want to go through 432 posts, but does anyone have the number of sales as of now?

Just go to the site that many are referencing (though not the best of places) vgchartz

 

[Ferrari458Italia]

Just go to the site that everyone is referencing (though not the best of places) vgchartz

= Global 0.85m as of Dec. 7th

hoooooooly 🤬 that's terrible!!! hahahahaha
well I hope PD gets a wake up call from this

 

[TurismoBad]

2 million sales (I guess) in two weeks - I'm sure they will recoup the money and make a nice profit.

Sounds are bad - there is no point in spinning it saying "they are a bit better" - by today's standards they are simply bad.

Not only do I expect a better engine sound but I expect it to be stellar. Anything worse than Forza is a failure.

I personally expect near *real* sound with all the *real* effects like non-robotic gear change (especially in older cars!) or "poofs" from rally cars.

Why so high expectations ? (or they are simply appropriate?) Well two reasons.

First of all - they had enough time and we've waited long enough. GT5 should've had proper sounds already. Second thing - it would be great way to tell everyone "hey we're not stuck in the 90s!".

Mediocricity not allowed.

And yeah...also because quality sound with current physics model would make this game incredible.

One thing I fear is that they may use the "new engine sounds" as a playing card for GT7 marketing. I mean I'm sure they will regardless of what happens to GT6 but let's hope they don't skip GT6 to make the leap more apparent.

 

[Tenacious D]

Worse is an opinion, and I'm not about to hold mine up for you to throw fallacies at. I didn't even say what my opinion was, whether sounds/AI were better, worse or the same. You simply assumed.

Wow, did I open a can of worms here.

I have to wonder about some of you, why you get so insulted if some of us aren't fussed about the sounds. It's as if we're best buds with Kaz and are telling him over a meal of pilaf, "Don't worry about working on the sounds, they're paaarfect."

Come on, there were a number of improvements in GT5, I think more than one level if memory serves. But at least with Spec 2, there were a number of improvements in sound to a good number of cars. In GT6, we have a few more. Kaz has been quoted by members like Griffith500 that the team is working on a major revision to the sound system. While it may not make it into GT6, requiring the resources and ram of the PS4, they're seeing what they can squeeze into the PS3. They've managed to do something. Not to your satisfaction? Well, complain away.

I've never said to stop complaining. But a number of us from Griffith and Amar on down have pointed out that persuasive arguments aren't couched in rhetoric like "Nothing has changed," "These sounds all suck," "Every car sounds like a vacuum cleaner," etc.

Hopefully this puts a bookend on this side debate. And hopefully if some poor sap likes the sounds in GT6, you guys won't give him a rude awakening to what a deaf Neanderthal he is.

Sorry guys don't really want to go through 432 posts, but does anyone have the number of sales as of now?

I doubt we'll get anything solid for a month, especially with the game releasing right before Christmas. I suspect SONY is waiting till after Jan 1st to make the numbers look their best. We might get first week sales figures, but that does take a while to tabulate.

Not only do I expect a better engine sound but I expect it to be stellar. Anything worse than Forza is a failure.

Forza 4 couldn't even get all the cars to sound good. Just the focus car the camera is on. The rest have generic vacuum cleaner sounds. And I'm serious. Do a race with street cars and in particular, get close to a car of the same or similar make, and notice the difference. Watch a replay and listen to the sounds as cars round a curve. Indy Infield is a good one with high performance cars, you'll hear staccato tire chirps almost like morse code because the 360 doesn't have the ram available for all the samples required. In fact, often your car will be roaring over the entire field. I don't think that's better, but that's just me.

 

[TheDabbinDave]

The operative word, of course, is "change". Not "improve". The bots will now turn into grandmas if you're still way behind coming into the final laps; I've watched them add a solid 10 seconds to their lap times so that I could win. And yep, that was with a massive self-handicap (a very-lightly tuned Demio versus an Integra Type R). I just did the Rainmasters race at Spa and found two hilarious new AI behaviours; I exited Eau Rouge intentionally slowly and saw three AI close the gap on the straight afterwards, only to all cut the throttle when they got near me to avoid passing. A few turns later, I was back to a 2 second lead, and stuck my Viper in 6th to cruise through turns, braking early and only using part throttle. It took them until the back straight to catch up, and I needed to nearly leave the track to get one to pass.

If they made all of the AI with the same protocol as the Kart AI, this game would be unplayable (or at least not enjoyable) for 90% of people who play it. I'm typically a Silver driver when it comes to license tests and Seasonals in GT6. Until I buckle down and barely crack into Gold with my absolute best lap, which is still way off pace of some of my extremely talented friends. The Red Bull Kart race is ridiculous!!! Based on what people are saying, I haven't done the Kart races in Career other than the lowest event. It's a nightmare I don't want to deal with.

So for some to say that the game hasn't been improved is just silly. People around here say, "the sounds have not been improved!!!". That's not true, SOME sounds have absolutely been improved!

@SlipZtrEm this post is not singling you out. A lot of the arguments here may be because people may think that just because they are being quoted that the entire reply is targeting or attacking them directly.

After 2 weeks of GT6 being for sale, what are the global sales numbers? What is the percentage of GT6 vs the PS3 install base? Chances were very likely that most of the people who bought a PS4 would've bought GT6 if it was available. Just my opinion, based on the lack of a [serious] racing game at launch. Apparently, limiting GT6 to PS3 for the simple reason of 70-80 million install base was a mistake.

 

[mcfizzle]

= Global 0.85m as of Dec. 7th

hoooooooly 🤬 that's terrible!!! hahahahaha
well I hope PD gets a wake up call from this

In what video game world do you actually live in where incomplete and probably inaccurate numbers totaling almost 1 million in 2 days is terrible?

Can we please wait for official numbers from Sony before making comments ignorant comments like this.

 

[TurismoBad]

Forza 4 couldn't even get all the cars to sound good. Just the focus car the camera is on. The rest have generic vacuum cleaner sounds. And I'm serious. Do a race with street cars and in particular, get close to a car of the same or similar make, and notice the difference. Watch a replay and listen to the sounds as cars round a curve. Indy Infield is a good one with high performance cars, you'll hear staccato tire chirps almost like morse code because the 360 doesn't have the ram available for all the samples required. In fact, often your car will be roaring over the entire field. I don't think that's better, but that's just me.

I'm talking about the engine sound only - which is much better in Forza.

Obviously I don't want Forza 4 technical issues and shortcomings to be implemented in GT franchise.

You take a Ferrari 458 from Forza 4 and compare it to a Ferrari 458 from GT6 - the winner is clear as crystal and that's what I meant when I wrote "Anything worse than Forza is a failure."

I was referring to a single element not the whole package.

 

[hardvibes]

Because casual players (the majority of buyers) found GT5 boring...so they didn't bother with 6.

 

[GeeBaby]

Never a post that stays on topic

 

[fizzer]

Here's the latest I've found via google: http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly/41616/Global/

1st week sales don't seem to be too bad. Sure its less than GT5, but I'm sure the PS4 release has something to do with that. I know I never buy a playstation until there's a GT release on it, but I imagine a lot of gamers buy the system before GT.

I also imagine the installed base of PS3s went down as many were traded in for 4s. GT6 may never reach GT5 sales numbers unless its available later on the PS4 as a streaming title.

 

[Tenacious D]

I was referring to a single element not the whole package.

That's very convenient, when you have a racing game in which only the car the camera is on is making a proper sound, and the rest sound like ghosts, vacuum cleaners or some generic race car. You have to include the whole package, or all you have is a single car time trial, and how fun is that for more than a few days?

In any case, I think this discussion can now safely go back to the other sound complaining threads.

 

[watermelon punch]

• Those who say the sounds haven't changed are incorrect.
• Those who say the bot A.I. haven't changed are incorrect.

Hopefully this helps.

👍

Yes, there's no doubt that there have been changes.

Not that anyone cares, but my spouse is NOT as enthusiastic about GT6 as I am, despite the fact that my spouse was the one that got me into GT4 4 years ago!
But he did decide to start career mode in GT6, just to check it out, and because it's here, after all.

The very first things he noticed & noted were:

1) the sound effects are noticeably different
(he said, "at least now when you hit something or go in the gravel the sound is realistically dramatic and not sounding like bumping bubble wrap like it's no big deal")
2) the AI drivers are more aggressive somehow
(he said he'd rather semi-dirty and even clumsy AI, and even rubber banding, over AI that adhere to the driving line like they're on rails most of the time)

The first thing I noticed was the extra axis of movement in the handling of the cars. But then that's my big thing, the handling of the cars. It's the big draw for me, so naturally that seemed the most notable to me.
My spouse did notice the change in physics too, but mostly only after he got out of the Fit & started using some other cars. Probably because he never really drove cars like the Fit in GT5, and I have driven the Fit quite a bit in GT5 and GT4. So the change in the Fit alone was enough for me to immediately notice a difference.

Now whether anybody cares about these changes, whether they think the changes are improvements, or whether they think the improvements are "good enough" for them... that's another matter, and open to opinion, perspective, and personal taste.
But I don't think there's any way to deny there have been changes, or to minimize them to the point of saying it's not changed much at all.

But frankly I hardly think the particulars regarding sounds & AI were the driving forces behind most GT6 purchases. If that's all you care about, then there are plenty of racing type games on various platforms, to choose from.

 

[Imari]

Wow, did I open a can of worms here.

I have to wonder about some of you, why you get so insulted if some of us aren't fussed about the sounds. It's as if we're best buds with Kaz and are telling him over a meal of pilaf, "Don't worry about working on the sounds, they're paaarfect."

You're still assuming that you know what my opinion on the sound is, and then you're extrapolating from that what I think of YOUR opinion on what the sounds is.

I'm not insulted by what you think of the sounds. Think whatever you like. You seem to be enjoying them, and that can only be a good thing. I'm insulted that you pigeonhole me as though I think that every car in GT6 is a perfect rendition of vacuum cleaners/pencil sharpeners/ducks farting. I'll thank you not to be putting words in my mouth.

 

[IROC89CAMARO]

Trust me guys the sounds are ok but not raspy in your face! OMG.... they could be better but isn't a make or break situation, i know plenty of games that have great sounds but the game is trash see where i'm going with this? However if your playing GT for it's sounds your playing the wrong game.

And about them sales you don't worry about that, it will still sell millions of copies, and GT will live on doing what it does best.

 

[Tenacious D]

I'm insulted that you pigeonhole me as though I think that every car in GT6 is a perfect rendition of vacuum cleaners/pencil sharpeners/ducks farting. I'll thank you not to be putting words in my mouth.

Yeah, I did neglect to pay more attention to what you said, but to be honest, sometimes like maybe above, you're about as unambiguous as a politician.

 

[Imari]

Yeah, I did neglect to pay more attention to what you said, but to be honest, sometimes like maybe above, you're about as unambiguous as a politician.

It's not ambiguous. I simply haven't stated my view, and I've been pretty clear that I haven't stated it.

You're just pissed that I'm not giving you targets to knock down. Go find someone else to pick on for being negative.

 

[Lawndart]

Damit! Now I have ducks farting in my head when I play! Arg! As if all the other spot on references weren't enough...