GT7 has failed to be Gran Turismo

[dragonjay1126]

In GT7 you can create your own race.

Any arguments about not enough events are invalid.

Those created races payout not even a tenth of what they would pay out if there were actual career mode events for GR1 and GR2 cars, so your logic is nonsense

 

[MatskiMonk]

Those created races payout not even a tenth of what they would pay out if there were actual career mode events for GR1 and GR2 cars, so your logic is nonsense

Really appreciate that you signed up to GTP just to double post that... well done.

Quote me the bit where I talked about payouts and I might take your critical judgement of my logic seriously.

 

[m76]

No, you couldn't ignore them. You didn't have to drive them yourself (apart from the races that required you to, like the Lupo Cup) but that didn't mean you could stop them showing up in your races. The graphical difference between premium and standard was big enough to be jarring for a decent amount of people. That's a negative for the experience.

I meant ignore them as in not use them yourself obviously. As for opponents, no it wasn't a significant issue, yes it was noticable, but if that minor thing ruined your experience, WTF are you doing praising GT7, which has much larger issues? I complained about the standard def cars back in the day, but did it ruin the game? Nope. As opposed to a number of issues all of which can ruin GT7 by themselves, let alone added together.

The lack of variety in GT7 is more down to the specific cars they chose to put in the game rather than the number. 400 cars is more than enough to have a wide variety if you select well.

Only GT1 and GT3 had less cars than GT7, but disregarding that the selection of GT7 is not even good. If you complain about variations in previous games, how does it not bother you in GT7? I don't mind having a ton of GT cars, as long as street cars are well represented, but some brands have only have a few regular cars represented in GT7 opposed to a bunch of racing cars. GT was always about street cars, and I understand that they need the racing models for esports and online racing, but it shouldn't be at the detriment of street cars.

 

[Tenacious D]

Those created races payout not even a tenth of what they would pay out if there were actual career mode events

There is a distinct difference between "having races to race" and "I want monies." There are a variety of ways to make and farm credits right now, and probably more in the coming months. But most of us have been calling out for more proper payouts with created races, though I'd still do them anyhow because they're fun. And fun is the real reason to play a game. What kind of money do you make in Call Of Duty?

I would like to see an Event Maker though, a tool which we could use to create racing events in an all encompassing fashion. A tool to make events from single races as we have now, all the way up to a racing season with a championship, and points set up as we see fit. Useful in single player offline as well as online, and hopefully with a comprehensive lobby system too.

 

[Samus]

Really appreciate that you signed up to GTP just to double post that... well done.

Quote me the bit where I talked about payouts and I might take your critical judgement of my logic seriously.

You didn't, but you did say that custom races invalidates any arguments about there not being enough events. It doesn't, precisely because they don't pay enough compared to pre-made events. That alone is enough reason to make it a valid argument.

 

[m76]

Really appreciate that you signed up to GTP just to double post that... well done.

Quote me the bit where I talked about payouts and I might take your critical judgement of my logic seriously.

Your "argument" was a non sequitur to begin with. The ability of creating custom races is not a replacement for built in content.

 

[Tired Tyres]

The amount of rubber banding in create race renders it pointless.

 

[Silver Arrows]

As already mentioned, the excuse of 'custom races being enough when it comes to events' is an absolute farce considering the factors that make custom races functionally useless as a gameplay concept: no ability to save grids and course selections, no real monetary reward for doing them that makes them worthwhile, rubber banding AI that is evident everywhere that isn't the walled Menu garden...

But also, like, it's incredibly clear that throughout GT's entire history, most of the series' fun revolves around building and racing in events with set limits. And considering how little of bespoke events there are in the game, when even GT Sport managed to offer more in that front, trying to direct people to custom races when the issues plaguing that section of the game are still evident (and knowing PD, probably will never be fixed in any meaningful way) is hilarious.

There's what, 6 or 7 different event types maximum in the game in the World Circuits? And those events are only differentiated by the PP numbers, either starting points or hard limits, set by Polyphony. There's so many other different event types that Polyphony could have gone with, and in the end they completely ignored it, all to simply shove them back into the game post-launch as a cheap way to gain 'goodwill' from the player base. So by that metric, why should I bother with custom races with all that taken into account?

 

[AutumnalGlow]

I see a couple of you guys asking how the inclusion of standard models ruined the experience and how you can just ignore them if you don't want to use them.
Thing is, it's difficult to ignore when more than 70% of the field in GT5 and GT6 consisted of standards. I like playing in cockpit view, gives a great feeling of immersion. With standards, you get a blacked out cockpit with no details.
Not only that, when racing you get 2 or 3 beautiful premiums and then standing out like a sore thumb the standards.
Which other racing games had PS2 era models alongside PS3 era models?

I misunderstood and thought you meant base models of cars rather than higher performance versions. Yes, including PS2 models is a very bad thing, I agree, and I'm glad they're not doing that anymore. However it is strange that the old Premium models seem to be missing?

 

[Imari]

...WTF are you doing praising GT7, which has much larger issues?

If you complain about variations in previous games, how does it not bother you in GT7?

I think you may have confused me for someone else. It's kind of funny that you take me pointing out flaws in older Gran Turismos as defending GT7 though.

 

[m76]

I think you may have confused me for someone else. It's kind of funny that you take me pointing out flaws in older Gran Turismos as defending GT7 though.

You were responding to my response to someone. I assumed you were the same guy, or at least arguing on their behalf.

So you concede that GT7 has much larger issues then?

 

[Imari]

You were responding to my response to someone.

I responded to your response. Specifically, the bit that I quoted about standard models. You asked how standard models ruined the experience, and as someone who felt that the standard models ruined the experience I replied. Standard models were only in GT5 and 6, therefore my response was about GT5 and 6. Apart from a single sentence at the end regarding the variety of the cars where I opined that 400 is more than enough cars to have a good selection, but they don't because they chose their 400 cars poorly.

I assumed you were the same guy, or at least arguing on their behalf.

You know what would give that away? The username. My username is Imari. I originally replied to your response to a user named Ryan81.

As far as arguing on someone's behalf, that's just stupid and rude. I don't assume that just because some other random user posted in the same thread as you that you share their opinions unless you've actually expressed that you share their opinions. There's a reason I only responded to that one very specific part of the post.

So you concede that GT7 has much larger issues then?

Why are you trying to get me to concede an argument I never made? You can't concede the fight if you were never in the ring.

Seriously, look at my posting history and see what I think of the game. I have 12,000+ posts, you can probably bet that a few of the recent ones are about GT7. This position you're trying to ascribe to me is a 12 foot strawman in blazing tartan covered in cow bells.

 

[Ryan81]

I misunderstood and thought you meant base models of cars rather than higher performance versions. Yes, including PS2 models is a very bad thing, I agree, and I'm glad they're not doing that anymore. However it is strange that the old Premium models seem to be missing?

I wouldn't be surprised if they're just holding them back for DLC. Similar to GT Sport.

 

[m76]

I responded to your response. Specifically, the bit that I quoted about standard models. You asked how standard models ruined the experience, and as someone who felt that the standard models ruined the experience I replied. Standard models were only in GT5 and 6, therefore my response was about GT5 and 6. Apart from a single sentence at the end regarding the variety of the cars where I opined that 400 is more than enough cars to have a good selection, but they don't because they chose their 400 cars poorly.

Yes, you responded to my response, therefore I assumed you were the one I originally responded to. Is that such a hard thing to accept? What are you trying to imply? That I tried to attribute someone else's comment to you with malicious intent?

You know what would give that away? The username. My username is Imari. I originally replied to your response to a user named Ryan81.

I wish I had the perfect memory and remembered the username of everyone I ever responded to on a forum.

As far as arguing on someone's behalf, that's just stupid and rude. I don't assume that just because some other random user posted in the same thread as you that you share their opinions unless you've actually expressed that you share their opinions. There's a reason I only responded to that one very specific part of the post.

Like nobody ever cut out a part of a post and responded only to that, ignoring the inconvenient parts, that they can't even try to rebuke.

Why are you trying to get me to concede an argument I never made? You can't concede the fight if you were never in the ring.

It's a simple litmus test. If you don't agree with the original poster we can put this all behind us, I say I'm sorry that I appropriated it to you, and that's it. But if you do agree with the post I responded to that makes this whole tantrum you are making about me assuming it was you who made it, quite mute, doesn't it?

Seriously, look at my posting history and see what I think of the game. I have 12,000+ posts, you can probably bet that a few of the recent ones are about GT7. This position you're trying to ascribe to me is a 12 foot strawman in blazing tartan covered in cow bells.

Then you should have no problem conceding that GT7 has bigger problems than the standard models issue ever was.

 

[Pizzicato1985]

I wouldn't be surprised if they're just holding them back for DLC. Similar to GT Sport.

If PD is dumb enough to hold back completed content at this point they deserve to fail. Even people outside of sim racing are dunking on GT7 for being an EA/Activision-esque cash grab. Even heard Asmongold, a World of Warcraft streamer, was talking **** about GT7, lol. The longer they leave the game in this pitiful state the more people will associate Gran Turismo with 🦮💩

@m76 I'd be absolutely thrilled to have the "problem" of standard cars in this game. "Oh no, generic interiors! How could I possibly play the game!" At least we'd have a lot of awesome cars to drive... Couldn't care less if they have more polygons. If one is staring at their car while driving, they're probably a pretty **** racer, lol

 

[Imari]

Yes, you responded to my response, therefore I assumed you were the one I originally responded to. Is that such a hard thing to accept? What are you trying to imply? That I tried to attribute someone else's comment to you with malicious intent?

I wish I had the perfect memory and remembered the username of everyone I ever responded to on a forum.

So you made a mistake. No big deal. That's why I said "I think you've confused me for someone else". Most people would just take that and say "sorry, I messed up, my bad". All the bits that are then clearly you assuming that I'm someone I'm not become nothing, because you're not talking to who you thought you were.

But if you actually made a mistake, it's real weird that you're continuing to try and follow through on your mistake by asking me to concede an argument that I never made. It does raise the question of what the intent is in pursuing me for something someone else said.

It's a simple litmus test. If you don't agree with the original poster we can put this all behind us, I say I'm sorry that I appropriated it to you, and that's it. But if you do agree with the post I responded to that makes this whole tantrum you are making about me assuming it was you who made it, quite mute, doesn't it?

Then you should have no problem conceding that GT7 has bigger problems than the standard models issue ever was.

Lol. A tantrum, eh?

Who are you to be testing me? Why should I be conceding to you for something I never said? And thats your condition for apologising for assuming that I'm someone else, something that you've already admitted was a mistake?

Pull your power plays on someone else, internet tough guy. I don't need your apology, you're bits on the internet. I've done nothing wrong. I explained why to some people the standard models were a significant problem after you said you didn't know how they ruined the experience. That's it. Whatever opinions about GT7 you want to project, please project them onto someone else.

 

[steve30x]

The only thing GT7 is missing in my opinion is the campaign mode. What we got in the menus in the CAFE isn't a proper campaign like we used to get.

 

[equalitus]

I wish GT Café would be more like a bonus feature for people who like to collect. Change the name to Collector’s Hall and have a large menu book with various orders that you can complete in any order. Completing them then rewards exclusive cars within that category or large sums of money. Ranking up your collector level gives you permanent car invitations with more expensive cars the higher your level is.

Especially if PD would include all the single player campaign for GTS. Then GT Cafe would be an overall a feature not a bug because the single player content is obviously lacking.

In GT7 you can create your own race.

Any arguments about not enough events are invalid.

Do you not know the difference between a campaign mode and a single race, as if it was in arcade mode? We cannot create own events i.e. similar to GTS events or GT cafe, which is what we're debating here, except you are doing excessive category error!

Ah, hyperbole, the cornerstone of any delicious, nutritious reply. Context of thread - GT7 "Failed...", reason - "Lack of freedom to do as you will"...

I point out that the game offers almost unprecedented levels of freedom (for GT) when it comes to racing... but yeah, straw man, I guess.

Totally wrong, since GT6 [which is kinda decent] there has been much more lack of freedom in single player mode since there is tyre limit and PP limit, which makes the game much less fun than GT3/4/5.

 

[Rodion Raskol]

The only thing GT7 is missing in my opinion is the campaign mode. What we got in the menus in the CAFE isn't a proper campaign like we used to get.

Agreed, from over the water. Love coming over for real roads racing.

bíodh lá maith agat

 

[equalitus]

The only thing GT7 is missing in my opinion is the campaign mode. What we got in the menus in the CAFE isn't a proper campaign like we used to get.

GT7 is also missing a few options in single player like PP limits and tyre choice. Ridiculous that PD limits fun with limitations on player options.

 

[Pizzicato1985]

The only thing GT7 is missing in my opinion is the campaign mode. What we got in the menus in the CAFE isn't a proper campaign like we used to get.

True, but I wouldn't really word it as "only". That makes it sound like the game is mostly complete when in reality we have the tutorial (cafe) and about a dozen races. Still no International A/B or Super license content, which has always been the "meat" of the franchise. PP system is still woefully broken. Car/track list is essentially a carbon-copy of Sport, which means the better part of a decade of race and road cars aren't in the game. Economy is getting better but I might only be thinking that because I afk'd my way into almost all of the legendary cars; for those that didn't I'm sure it's still very tight.

I honestly think they only started full development, with the full team, like 18-24mo ago. We should be getting paid to be QA testers since this is clearly a beta

 

[Grimm6Jack]

Read some posts regarding the "standart" and "premium" models, and agree with the people who were disgusted by them. IMO those were the lowest points of both GT5 and GT6, because in terms of content, they actually weren't bad.

It was eye tearing seeing those low quality square like cars alongside premium HD cars. Not just about the graphics themselves, but the cars themselves had no detail into their sounds or how they behaved unlike most of the premiums. Literally copy pasted from PS2.

I am glad GT7 did away with that type of stuff. Attention to detail is supposed to be one of GTs strengths, those standart cars absolutely destroyed that.

 

[Team THRT Drift]

The only thing GT7 is missing in my opinion is the campaign mode. What we got in the menus in the CAFE isn't a proper campaign like we used to get.

And a bunch of manufacturers that we're sorely missing.

 

[queleuleu]

Why so few events in career mode? Game after game, less and less events. Adding three random events each month won't change my view, I don't know if I'm still a GT fan. Still the same weekly races, no seasonal events, no basic options for a a 2022 game. I'm just not interested like I used to be for each GT.

 

[Techlet]

While GT7 doesn't have bogus "standard" cars, the fact that half the VGT cars PD seem so proud of still don't have an interior view in 2022 is embarrassing.

If they insist on bloating the car list with identical copies of VGTs shoehorned into different groups using the exact same models (like what is the actual visual difference between the McLaren VGT and the McLaren Grp 1 VGT? Or the 2 Bugatti VGTs), the least they could do is fully model the cars...

 

[Silver Arrows]

While GT7 doesn't have bogus "standard" cars, the fact that half the VGT cars PD seem so proud of still don't have an interior view in 2022 is embarrassing.

If they insist on bloating the car list with identical copies of VGTs shoehorned into different groups using the exact same models (like what is the actual visual difference between the McLaren VGT and the McLaren Grp 1 VGT? Or the 2 Bugatti VGTs), the least they could do is fully model the cars...

That, or the fact that so many of the Gr.4 and 3 cars are simply models that could easily be replaced with actual, real world GT cars if Polyphony cared to do so.

 

[Techlet]

It's easy to make up 400 cars with this much content recycling, plus all the Gr 3 "road cars."

Honestly, the car list is a head scratcher. We have two nearly identical EK9 Civics but no EP3?? But hey at least the 97 and 98 Civics have different bumpers...

 

[Ryan81]

If PD is dumb enough to hold back completed content at this point they deserve to fail. Even people outside of sim racing are dunking on GT7 for being an EA/Activision-esque cash grab. Even heard Asmongold, a World of Warcraft streamer, was talking **** about GT7, lol. The longer they leave the game in this pitiful state the more people will associate Gran Turismo with 🦮💩

@m76 I'd be absolutely thrilled to have the "problem" of standard cars in this game. "Oh no, generic interiors! How could I possibly play the game!" At least we'd have a lot of awesome cars to drive... Couldn't care less if they have more polygons. If one is staring at their car while driving, they're probably a pretty **** racer, lol

Alright bro, it's not that bad, surely? 🤣 Particularly if you don't need to pay anything extra.

As for Asmongold, who he?

For me, I prefer quality over quantity. If it means less variety, so be it. Better that than some half-assed attempt to increase the car count.
GT has always prided itself on it's attention to detail. No need for that to go to **** with low quality models.

 

[Imari]

I honestly think they only started full development, with the full team, like 18-24mo ago.

Given GTS as a base to work from, it's hard to see how a well-structured and competent team couldn't do better than this in a couple of years. Looking at what other similar developers can do with established franchises it seems hard to see where all that extra time goes for Polyphony.

If Polyphony and Sony want more money, they should probably release more often instead of every five years or so. The games were better back when they released every couple of years.

 

[calvooo]

I completely agree with OP!

GT7 failed to be Gran Turismo on so many levels I cannot describe..
The lack of proper career mode is beyond me.. how, why, who..? And main focus of so called career is collecting cars through Cafe.
Not to mention that you can complete Menu book just by buying certain cars with credits. And you barely need to buy new car for certain type of race, because you get them as gift for next Menu book. Bravo..
I miss good old days when you have to carefully chose which car to buy and you have way more restrictions before entering race or cup. In GT7 there are barely any restrictions, and PP is almost pointless.

Dont get me wrong, the game is good and have so much potential to be the best GT.