GT7 has failed to be Gran Turismo
- Thread starter m76
- 873 comments
- 107,962 views
- 689
- Austria
Not enough rock...way too much Lenny Bizzare ;-)
- 1,484
- United Kingdom
- evildave333
Im looking forward to the game coming good... it will, but at best its going to be the end of the year. Ive been driving other games... certainly not as good in gameplay terms, but being able to jump in pick any car and track quickly in a game like project cars / dirt 2 / wreckfest etc is a real relief, no grind, no repetition either.
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- 15,532
- Cairo, Egypt
- GTP_SEMS
GT7 is by far the worst?
Previous games that 6 cars in a race, no custom races, the PS3 games would drop frames left and right, AI was worse, Car sound was worse, a race would take ages to load, poor online connectivity, much much less customization. I could go on.
Some people here are disappointed at some aspects and I agree with them. My point was regarding the hyperbolic posts and saying this is the worst in the series is exactly the type of reaction I was talking about. Sports Mode isn't dreadful. Just you wait -- every upcoming sim will have the same feature.
PD need to fix the FFB, lobbies, add more events and content. Saying something like PD need to use their brain is hilarious given how the game is selling more and reviewing better than lots of the previous entries.
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They already do. Nothing new about scheduled ranked online races with rules.
- 40,819
GT5's AI was the most competitive PD ever managed to accomplish to that point (and was certainly better than it was in GT6) and for a while you could even race it with standing starts; so any argument in favor of GT7 in that regard is automatically null and void.
For sure that's a better use of your time than someone trying to retroactively claim the GT series was always bad for reasoning like... having course variations.
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- 27
- London
- whose_online
According to a posting on a tech forum the PS5 is approx 30 times more powerful than the PS3 and the internet was still in its infancy with far lower speeds than we can get today.
When comparing games you have to consider the technology available at the time. I played games on the Apple II in the 1980s that would be considered terrible by todays standards but were brilliant in their time.
GT3 was an excellent game when it was released and although GT7 can improve via online updates it failed to meet a lot of users expectations upon launch.
- 16,338
- Melbourne
- ScottPuss20
- CheetahsMeow
You could say this about Ridge Racer but it's still considered to be a "racing game". What else is it? An RPG? A shooter? A fighting game? A puzzle game? A platformer? I'm struggling to put in any of those categories. For all intents and purposes, GT7 is a "racing game" because you race against other competitors on a closed course. What do you think a marathon is? A time trial with other humans as roadblocks? "Oh they aren't REAL competitors, their purpose is to get in your way"
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GT7 is by far the worst game I ever come across out of the all numbered games I have played, because it lacks tracks & cars from previous numbered games.
Listen I am not comparing the latest technology to the PS3 era, what I am talking about the content from previous numbered games. Saying PD need to use their brains is the right call, because we should not have cars & tracks slowly drip fed over many many months from previous numbered games.
You say it's selling more and reviewing better than lots of the previous entries, because of better technology with the PS5 but they mostly get bored quick of playing GT7 like me, or playing a lot less than they did playing previous numbered games. Playing GT5 & GT6 online was very good compared to GT7 which is a flop online.
GT7 could be selling more and reviewing better but again they are getting sucked in, because the content from other numbered games might be coming in the future, and it never should be that way.
As I said if GT7 was a true numbered game, then we should have had all the tracks & cars from previous numbered games like from GT4, GT5, and GT6 already in the game, but it's not a GT7 game and it is more like a GT Sport type game.
I have a question for you, why should we get cars or tracks drip fed over future updates, or from the Legendary car section for GT7 from previous numbered games ?.
- 1,484
- United Kingdom
- evildave333
The gripes with GT7 are a lot about context, if GTS didn't exist this would be GOAT racing game. It seems clear that some design decisions are being made by money men, which so far has meant PD have snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. My suspicion is there will be very little new content, with most held over for a sequel, I really hope I am wrong on this. I have total faith in the game design team (they listen and react to the player base), its the corporate capitalist types I have an issue with sadly gameplay and user experience are low on their priorities list. Safest bet (like with all games now) is buy at least one year after release so you can see what you're actually getting.
What is genuinely a bit sad, is GT7 is gathering dust on my shelf un-played since mid April. I envy folks who are new to the franchise lucky them! For long time fans the disappointment is understandable, its not unreasonable to have expected a bit more bang for the buck from the game (rather than being banged by the games' bucks ho ho).
What is genuinely a bit sad, is GT7 is gathering dust on my shelf un-played since mid April. I envy folks who are new to the franchise lucky them! For long time fans the disappointment is understandable, its not unreasonable to have expected a bit more bang for the buck from the game (rather than being banged by the games' bucks ho ho).
- 349
- Wales
Great post. But I sadly suspect one of the ‘money men’ you mention might well be Kaz. If he really didn’t want the mtx economy it’s hard to believe it’d be here in the game.
Like you, I’ve barely played for a couple of weeks, only firing it up every few days to do one 30 min money race (Tokyo or LM) to get the daily ticket out of a morbid curiosity to see if I’ll ever get an engine swap...
The overarching, major flaw (and the giveaway that everything’s designed around mtx) is the lack of selling. Of the 200-odd cars in my garage I’d like to sell at least half, which would go some way towards letting me buy some of the high-value cars I actually do want (like the 19 mil F1 in the LCD this week), and the old numbered games would have no problem with that. In fact, that was always the point in many ways. But GT7 is a game built around a totally different philosophy.
I first saw Kaz on TV back in late 2000 or early 2001, an interview with legendary broadcaster Kume Hiroshi on Asahi News Station, where he was humble and even shy, promoting the upcoming release of GT3 (they played one of the night-time Tokyo tracks). That one appearance convinced me to buy the game (and PS2 of course) and it was all based on his being so obviously a passionate, perfectionist car guy, not that much older than me, who wanted as many people as possible to share his love of cars by being able to drive them in his game. Experiencing the economy of GT7, I fear he’s become a different kind of guy over the years, as we all have, perhaps. I’m convinced Kaz 2000 would hate GT7 and Kaz 2022.
- 1,484
- United Kingdom
- evildave333
Im not so sure you can level that at Kaz, admittedly we're both just speculating. I think what is more likely is the money men are higher up the food chain, and veto creativity for money making slyness. For me the low content / game economy / MTX / dubious roulette etc... decision making reeks of greedy executive type thinking (your talking kilobytes of data transfer for currency). Kaz on the other-hand strikes me as an passionate / obsessive / creative / quirky (music rally!) type with a finely curated eye for detail. Its safe to say Kaz loves his creation, the person making the questionable capitalist design choices considerably less so.
- 349
- Wales
I’d like to think you’re right, but if he is the guy you think he is (and still the same guy I think he was) then surely he can’t be happy with GT7 as it is now, let alone at launch. Surely he has final veto power. Surely, if he insisted car selling should be possible it’d be possible.
I can’t help wonder if the money (to build up his real car collection) is now more important to him than the ‘game’. I hope not, but the signs are there.
I think Kaz 2000 would of course see 7 as ‘better’ than 3 in terms of everything the tech has allowed to advance over the years, but I’m certain he’d judge it a worse ‘game’.
- 40,819
"The entire site" isn't ranting about how the entire perception of the franchise is a sham because you don't like the newest game. GT6 was trash too, a hopeless and unnecessary money grab to fleece people who didn't want a PS4 yet built off a PR campaign that was almost entirely boldfaced lies from Kaz about what it would do to justify its existence over GT5 to rebuild the goodwill the sorry state the latter was released had lost; and that still affected nothing about the games people played in the franchise's golden years (or even GT5, which people largely continued to play while ignoring GT6 until Sony shut off its servers to try to force the issue). GT1 was unaffected by the rolling starts in GT6 with AI that slowed down to let you win years after Codemasters and ISI had done such great jobs with advancing computer controller players even though GT1 had rubberbanding AI (which, by the way, GT4 did not). GT2 was unaffected by GT5's nonsensical, deliberately-microtransaction-pushing paint chip system after competitors had already started including livery editors even though GT2 didn't let you change car colors at all. GT3 is unaffected by GT7's prize car and parts roulettes all coalescing together as part of a collaborative push to extort the player into buying microtransactions even though GT3 had a prize car roulette and was grindy compared to GT2.
Your posts, not the entire site's, are nonsense. Clueless ramblings that are so mad about the current game that you're trying to claim that all of the games in the franchise should have been treated with scorn because the signs were apparently there all along; featuring crackerjack reasoning like "GT3 had reverse tracks" being put up as arguments why GT needed to fix problems competitors have eclipsed GT7 over years before those competitors even existed. Your posts, not anyone else on the site who is mad about GT7, are the ones I'm responding to for being so negative that you're trying to push revisionist history with them on people with direct experience to the contrary.
I'm doing nothing of the sort. I'm telling you, specifically, that going outside and doing something would be a better and more healthy use of your time than pissing in the wind on a Gran Turismo forum trying to insist that the Gran Turismo series was always a mess and it should never had been given the praise it was given, especially when you parrot the argument after pushback to the people who grew up when those games were new and had direct experience with how dramatically better they were than anything else on the market at the time. For 🤬 sake, when GT1 came out the biggest franchise on the market was the wildly successful relaunch of the Test Drive franchise:
This is the game (and I won't even blind people by posting a video of Test Drive: Off Road) you're claiming PD needed to up their game against from the start? In fact, I take back one thing I said earlier. When I said this:
GT1 sounds a hell of a lot better than that; even if the NFS games started kicking it to the curb by the time III came out.
As one more thing, and not for nothing, but if you had a bit more frame of reference beyond the angry bubble you've constructed yourself you probably wouldn't blindly accuse me of telling people to leave PD alone.
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- 3,816
- London, Ontario
- voodoovaj
That depends on the way you measure it. In terms of disappointment, yes, GT& has been the most disappointing version so far. Obviously, it has many merits, but as an experience, it has many disappointing aspects
I firmly believe the game sold on promise and as each month passes, more and more people are seeing that the perception of what GT7 would be is far from what it is, and I don't think PD will do anything. They are actively focused on driving people toward spending money on credits, and everything else is a lower class issue.
We'll be lucky to have lobbies addressed by Christmas.
My "review"
Pros:
improved sense of speed
very good engine sounds
photorealistic graphics
very detailed cockpit view
decent handling and physics
nice tuning parts
nice painting and decail system
beautiful photo mode
nice cars of selection
Cons:
Inconsistent ffb even with gt dd pro
Very few new cars and circuits
Cockpit view adjustment is very limited
Ffb adjustable is very limited
No real campaign mode
Very hactic races on circuits ( some has 6 races, some has 1 WHY?).
Very few daily races
Old 1000x played circuits ( boring)
No real challenges no reason to play after short time of period
After 3 month no reason to play unless grinding credits to get more cars
Very expensive ( insanely expensive) old cars
.....
.....
Pros:
improved sense of speed
very good engine sounds
photorealistic graphics
very detailed cockpit view
decent handling and physics
nice tuning parts
nice painting and decail system
beautiful photo mode
nice cars of selection
Cons:
Inconsistent ffb even with gt dd pro
Very few new cars and circuits
Cockpit view adjustment is very limited
Ffb adjustable is very limited
No real campaign mode
Very hactic races on circuits ( some has 6 races, some has 1 WHY?).
Very few daily races
Old 1000x played circuits ( boring)
No real challenges no reason to play after short time of period
After 3 month no reason to play unless grinding credits to get more cars
Very expensive ( insanely expensive) old cars
.....
.....
- 1,565
- United Kingdom
- 166
- Equalityland
GT3>4 were still very fun because apart from forced license tests [which can be avoided by having 2 or more memory cards] there were very few forced/rigid gameplay factors. The fast progression if chosen, and having many upgrade options, many different road cars vs different types and classes of race cars. The AI should have been improved from GT3 obviously, but the AI cars in GT3&4 are fast if stupid, especially when AI is 'a baseline' fast race car.
By saving & reloading from memory card you only need to repeat the last race to get the car or the color, but it is obviously a stupid game design choice but it didn't reduce the fun substantially. And in GT3 if you have all upgrades on a car on a memory card you purchase, you get all the upgrades included for no extra charge! In GT4 PD removed the upgrades from the car trade option from memory card, but if you let a car drive over 100k km. in B-spec the purchase price of the car is greatly reduced and you can buy cars cheap with the color you want from memory card.
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Is it not time to acknowledge many people thoroughly enjoy GT7? That’s not to say there isn’t room for improvement & additional content. One of the most exciting aspects of modern GT’s (in fact modern gaming) is how they’re updated. Content, game modes, quality of life, graphical improvements.
We’re long past the ‘uninformed buyer’ stage. After well over 50hr’s play I’ve not had the slightest inclination to purchase credits and see absolutely no reason to do so. Normal play has delivered everything I need and I haven’t even delved into building and tuning cars, liveries, photography etc.
I only see GT7 and the Gran Turismo franchise getting bigger and better. If I didn’t believe that I wouldn’t still be posting on a forum about the game 3 months after launch.
Gran Turismo Is Special
I've recently got back into GT with 7 after playing a ton of Sport and even thought 7 isn't perfect, it's feels like a step up from every other racing series in terms of quality and feel. I've played every Forza game and love them, but GT to me always feels a bit more more special and classy...
- 16,338
- Melbourne
- ScottPuss20
- CheetahsMeow
Most consumers are very loyal to the brands they like, warts and all. GT is not perfect but it offers a lot and it's long-standing reputation has allowed it to maintain a strong following. Some say that GT4 was the peak but putting GT7 at the bottom of the heap is selling it short I think. We have dynamic weather, dynamic time, mission races, licence tests, championships, decent physics, good sounds, tuning, GT Auto, livery editor, scapes, photo mode, unmatched graphics, used car dealer, legendary car dealer, brand central, time trial, single race, custom race, drift trial, Sport Mode, lobbies, showcase and something of a career mode. It may not have the same amount of events but putting the whole game down for that reason is a bit callous if I'm honest.
Silver Arrows
(Banned)
- 4,715
- Brandon, MB
- Silver-Arrows21
lol at using Resetera as your barometer for the popularity of the GT series, a forum where you need an IP provided email address in order to post and have to go through an application process when you even register
Too bad others don't feel the same way, and that includes the very thread that you seem to be intent on using as your smoking gun evidence. And it ultimately doesn't matter if you don't feel the need to purchase micro-transactions, that others will feel the need to spend the money on micro-transactions especially when it comes to the fact that the game expects you to, at some point, spend the money for Legendary vehicles. And that Polyphony have announced increases to the Legendary vehicle prices, and considering that Polyphony have begun to crack down on Tomahawk grinding...it invariably means that they desire players to go down the road of micro-transactions, and considering they completely ignored removing micro-transactions from the game when the game initially released (which at least other developers and publishers embroiled in the same controversy have done) then it makes it crystal clear where Polyphony wants to take things.
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- 1,484
- United Kingdom
- evildave333
It is objectively sublime gameplay, but there is not enough new content which is bang out of order. Most folks on here have hundreds of hours on GTS so this game offers nothing new to experience. 50 hours in 3 months is very light weight, I hit 90 hours and 340 cars after 6 weeks, now GT7 is gathering dust on a shelf. "Uninformed buyer" doesn't play at all if you bought the game day one like many did. Its important as a consumer to get some value especially when a game is £70 these day's. GT7 will be eventually become decent, but its been little more than a GTS update thus far, that is not defensible. You're post is on a forum of largely hardcore players, who share your passion, but are a bit more invested and hence irritated right now. I can only imagine how great this game must be for someone fresh to the franchise, I truly envy them.Is it not time to acknowledge many people thoroughly enjoy GT7? That’s not to say there isn’t room for improvement & additional content. One of the most exciting aspects of modern GT’s (in fact modern gaming) is how they’re updated. Content, game modes, quality of life, graphical improvements.
We’re long past the ‘uninformed buyer’ stage. After well over 50hr’s play I’ve not had the slightest inclination to purchase credits and see absolutely no reason to do so. Normal play has delivered everything I need and I haven’t even delved into building and tuning cars, liveries, photography etc.
I only see GT7 and the Gran Turismo franchise getting bigger and better. If I didn’t believe that I wouldn’t still be posting on a forum about the game 3 months after launch.
Gran Turismo Is Special
I've recently got back into GT with 7 after playing a ton of Sport and even thought 7 isn't perfect, it's feels like a step up from every other racing series in terms of quality and feel. I've played every Forza game and love them, but GT to me always feels a bit more more special and classy...www.resetera.com
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- 1,510
- Indonesia
Not blind, you said stop being mad about GT7, not about entire franchise in said reply I quoted. Which is why I replied about entire site, because you refer to GT7 there, not about the entire franchise like what you said/elaborate here.
I complained about GT3 padding the tracks with reverse tracks because one of the main complaints about GT is the car list padding with bunch of duplicates, and it's not current GT exclusive issue even if it got worse in GT5/6 (with regional merge), and separating reverse tracks with "(track name) II" and increasing the track count by it has some resemblance to it.
But fair enough in your explanations there regarding older games, as you did point out both older game's flaws and the newer game's flaws, and you seem to be going about the implementation of the money-grubbing designs (still though, GT5's color change can be ignored or used sparingly, though it'd seem as if GT still has little to no color change yet, but other games including livery editors or color change has been done earlier than GT5's era/release).
But I go outside (in fact I had plans for it soon too), and not in this site 24/7, just that when I'm visiting this site, I'd not sugarcoat what I'd say regarding this franchise, not anymore for now. Anyone who talks on this site, including badmouthing GT7 or even praising a game are also spending their time here.
Besides what I thought was about even if those games are better, doesn't mean they're perfect and flawless, so GT's faults can still be seen on their own separately from others like Test Drive 4 too. And pointing out flaws, even if a game isn't trash, is done so it has more chance to be noticed by the developer to notice and improve it. The more focus on the negative, the more chance of it being done. If the positive or merits are being brought up, it'd be potentially (or certainly in PD's case) left out as it's already seen as done well/good enough. But obviously it's unsalvageable now, because PD's design philosophy has been shaped (or being worsened) by how the players spoil them far long ago.
There are GT7 complaining about why it can't be made just like GT3/4/etc., yet those can also complain about having to wait for a car to take their turn to buy (like Used/Legend Cars). And if it's pointed out that it's something existed in past GT (not GT3), then it'd be also seen as being stuck in the past to defend a GT feature only because it existed in a past GT? Or that it's actually just one of the misguided complaints that it's more about the slow rotation of the Used/Legend Cars (likely another online-influenced crap) and the game economics instead of the Used Cars feature?
GT has always been rife with forced/rigid gameplay factors, and this thread listed them well. Sure it's about the more reviled GT6, but a bunch of it can still apply on GT3 and GT4, like default driving view (iirc), HUD configuration, auto drive in the pits, no option to buy several items together, etc.
And outside of the upgrades locked in roulette, GT7 has more upgrade options than GT3/4. GT3 has 44, GT4 has 56. GT7 has iirc 72.
And aren't wanting more different cars and its types mean wanting huge car numbers? Which is seen as wrong now to make that suggestion because it apparently means supporting PD's habit to pad out the car list with duplicates? When wanting more cars also can be about a genuine wanting for more variety, like, wanting 700 cars mean seeking for more potential diversity, than 400 cars for example.
Racing is still not merely about going fast (and rubberbanding isn't a good game design, talking about GT3 if GT4 didn't have that). Racing should have them act against the surroundings not leave them be even if they're fast.
Still would say GT7 is undeniably better regarding car color.
Currently B-spec is planned to be done with Sophy, but of course there's bunch of empty promises.
- 1,565
- United Kingdom
- 3,816
- London, Ontario
- voodoovaj
I undoubtedly believe that you are in the minority.
What, exactly, are you enjoying about this game? I am sure many on this forum would like to know. You seem to be "thoroughly enjoying" single player, which is (through the chili pepper races) only slightly more interesting that GTSport, which is not saying much. There is thread, upon thread, upon thread, on how dissatisfied people are with single player.
Lobbies are diminished massively, so that isn't a source of enjoyment. Again, thread upon thread of dissatisfaction.
Please enlighten us. I recommend, for entertainment sake, that you start a thread about how thoroughly enjoyable the single player experience is.
No we aren't. They completely hid the microtransaction aspect from reviewers, so if you go seek out a review, you'll see nothing about how punishing the economy is. There's also nothing about the lobbies, because of assumptions.
There are plenty of revised reviews post launch, but those won't show up.
It's a rare occurrence when reviewers feel the need to step up and retract what they said about a game, to declare it worse than they first stated.
Are you new???? like is this your first GT?I only see GT7 and the Gran Turismo franchise getting bigger and better. If I didn’t believe that I wouldn’t still be posting on a forum about the game 3 months after launch.
Gran Turismo Is Special
I've recently got back into GT with 7 after playing a ton of Sport and even thought 7 isn't perfect, it's feels like a step up from every other racing series in terms of quality and feel. I've played every Forza game and love them, but GT to me always feels a bit more more special and classy...
Posting years after launch is normal here. 3-4 years later, we're still active. 3 months?
Seriously, go make that thread. Do it. I think it will either be an eye opener for you and those supporting the single player, or it will be an eye opener for those of us who are disappointed.
I have zero faith in this. B-Spec would quickly become the most popular game mode as a source of farming credits, and they won't do that for a LONG LONG LONG time, if ever.
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I've lost hope in PD and GT, it's just not going to be as good as we want, it's done. It's been done since the GT5 disappointment. And it's always the same excuse "PS2 not powerfull enough for proper AI and damage" then the PS3 " hard to program for", now "Because it's held back by PS4". But they got me, I bought the game and have played it 2 times before realising it was botched.
Truth is, PD doesn't care, they don't communicate with us, never have. GT Sport was like a dead cat bounce, I thought the game was an amazing improvement from the previous games, maybe because it was the first time they actively tried to collect feedback.....And now it's gone.
Forget about GT guys....It's never going to be good again, and I'm sad to say it
Edit : If we are being honest, if PD was not a Japanese studio, Sony would have sold them or closed them already. Evolution Studio wasn't given half the tolerance that PD gets before being closed. Sony closed the wrong studio
Truth is, PD doesn't care, they don't communicate with us, never have. GT Sport was like a dead cat bounce, I thought the game was an amazing improvement from the previous games, maybe because it was the first time they actively tried to collect feedback.....And now it's gone.
Forget about GT guys....It's never going to be good again, and I'm sad to say it
Edit : If we are being honest, if PD was not a Japanese studio, Sony would have sold them or closed them already. Evolution Studio wasn't given half the tolerance that PD gets before being closed. Sony closed the wrong studio
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- 13,888
- Adelaide
- Neomone
It's far from the worst game in the series. I think that when any new game in a series comes out the hope is that it will be solidly better than all that has come before it, after all the developers have all the tools and experience they had before and then some.
GT7 does fine, but there are fair arguments for other entries in the series, even fairly old ones, being better games . The fact that online play is only available in GT7 and GTS notwithstanding I suppose, although who knows how long GTS will last. I dislike that GT5 and GT6 had developed into pretty respectable games by end of life, but the way Polyphony chose to shut down the servers gutted them.
GT as a franchise hasn't been growing since the early 2000s. Each entry hovers around 10 million units sold, mostly. It's both respectable enough that it's not going anywhere soon but also it's not growing. Microtransactions are not going to help, not in a full price game. GT7 is another entry that is just enough to keep the series going, it's not going to kill it but it's not going to be it's breakout revival either.
- 90
- United States
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