GT7 & PSVR2

[Matteocarlito]

No problem mate! 👍

I didn't realize you were speaking of the mura effect, it is indeed quite noticeable and more pronounced in some PSVR2 than on others.
Being used to play with the PSVR1 and its very bad screen door effect, it doesn't bother me that much, but I definitively can see it too. If you focus too much on it then you won't be able to think about anything else, at least that's what I heard, and people are more or less sensitive to it. Some people just can't go past the mura effect from what I heard on a podcast about this matter... :s

Well it's not really the mura effect, it's the general huge downgrade due to the actual technology.
1. foveated rendering - everything in the screen looks blurry unless you don't really actually watch it. I am very sensitive on this because of my job in movies
2. Oled can't refresh properly so in VR replays cars are moving so fast they actually look in a poor shape
3. Psvr2 lenses, a bit cheap

My post was just to be sure that you all look what I look, for everything else the game with a wheel and vr Is stunning (I can see your times @Papiculo64 you drive insanely fast!! )

 

[Igano]

So if I understand this correctly the mura effect is something that is present on all units and gives this bluriness in the view?

 

[Matteocarlito]

So if I understand this correctly the mura effect is something that is present on all units and gives this bluriness in the view?

I have it, yes, combined with graphics downgrade and general blurriness unless you don't focus your eyes on a particular subject.

 

[Papiculo64]

Well it's not really the mura effect, it's the general huge downgrade due to the actual technology.
1. foveated rendering - everything in the screen looks blurry unless you don't really actually watch it. I am very sensitive on this because of my job in movies
2. Oled can't refresh properly so in VR replays cars are moving so fast they actually look in a poor shape
3. Psvr2 lenses, a bit cheap

My post was just to be sure that you all look what I look, for everything else the game with a wheel and vr Is stunning (I can see your times @Papiculo64 you drive insanely fast!! )

The Fresnel lenses are indeed a downgrade compared to the lenses of the PSVR1 and not as good as the pancake lenses that apparently have a way bigger sweet spot, no god rays, etc...
Probably a choice they made for the PSVR2 not to be more expensive rhan it already is. I'd genuinely prefer to pay 50 or even 100 more dollars and have pancake lenses, but when you look at comments from people new to VR market, which represent the biggest part of Playstation playerbase, they almost all say that the PSVR2 is way too much expensive...

As for the ghosting in GT7, it's the first thing I noticed while playing it in VR and I spoke about it in my first impressions post. It is not a problem of the OLED but it's due to the game being reprojected from 60 to 120 fps. It's intended to limit motion sickness, but it gives this blurry effect in replays or when you look on the sides while driving, because you can notice the 2 different images at the same time. If you play GT sport VR on PS5, it runs at native 120 fps and you can't notice it at all, so a PS5 pro or a better optimisation could resolve this issue. You wouldn't notice it neither if the game ran at native 60fps without reprojection, but it's not going to happen since Sony forces VR games to run at least at 90 fps. The best thing to hope is that the game would run at native 90fps or 120fps in the future, either on PS5, PS5 pro or PS6. You don't have any ghosting effect on native 90fps and 120fps games, even in super fast games like Runner 👍

Anyway, the PSVR2 is not exploited to its full potential right now and is still limited by PS5 hardware. As you say it's still stunning, but the best is yet to come in terms of visuals

But if they announced a pro version with pancake lenses, I'd be more than happy to resale my actual unit and get one! xD

So if I understand this correctly the mura effect is something that is present on all units and gives this bluriness in the view?

It's present on all units at different levels. It's not responsible of the bluriness, but it gives a grain to the image.

Bluriness is due to the lenses themselves, a bad positioning of the headset, the lenses being dirty, or the game optimisation (e.g. the backgrounds in GT7 having a poor definition due to downgraded models. You can notice texture popping on almost every single element of the track or concurrent cars. It's not a limitation of the headset, just an optimisation made to have the game running smoothly in VR on the PS5).

 

[Nathan88]

It’s not immediately obvious what is the best way to fit the headset. I get the impression some are resting it on the bridge of their nose. Or just have the headset tilted too far forward.

I found the most comfortable fitment is to push the headband way down. So there’s next to no pressure on your face/nose. Then push the lenses as close as possible to your eyes. This gives you some flexibility for fine adjustments (up/down/left/right) which I use when looking at text to get perfect sharpness.

I’ve also read one final adjustment, specifically for GT7, is to turn headset brightness down to 70%. The HDR in GT7 is so bright it can cause additional blur. So dialling this down can help. Anyone got experience with this?

 

[Matteocarlito]

Probably a choice they made for the PSVR2 not to be more expensive rhan it already is. I'd genuinely prefer to pay 50 or even 100 more dollars and have pancake lenses, but when you look at comments from people new to VR market, which represent the biggest part of Playstation playerbase, they almost all say that the PSVR2 is way too much expensive...

But if they announced a pro version with pancake lenses, I'd be more than happy to resale my actual unit and get one! xD

I just want them to take my money, why don't they allow me to do it
Seriously, I still stick to the "Steve Jobs" approach, even if it was not without flaws:
"Let's pursue the best. If you can afford it, ok, if you can't, save money until you can".
The best would be better lenses, 8K Display, better construction and not really cheap plastic.
Sony, once, was like this.
I know, it's consumer, it's mainly for kids. But why not doing a "pro" version of the VR lenses?

 

[BigSarj]

I read that the reason they went with fresnel lenses is because pancake lenses don't work with HDR. If that's the case, then I'm glad they stuck with fresnel lenses.

Anyway, I've had a bit more time and so far, I still have no complaints, really. Only that GT7's sweet spot is so tiny. Sometimes I find it right away and other times it will take me a minute or two.

When in the sweet spot, things in the foreground look to be 1080p. About as good as, if not better than ACC on console.

@Matteocarlito when you find your sweet spot, how does your steering wheel look? Can you read the text on them when in a race car?

 

[Matteocarlito]

I read that the reason they went with fresnel lenses is because pancake lenses don't work with HDR. If that's the case, then I'm glad they stuck with fresnel lenses.

Anyway, I've had a bit more time and so far, I still have no complaints, really. Only that GT7's sweet spot is so tiny. Sometimes I find it right away and other times it will take me a minute or two.

When in the sweet spot, things in the foreground look to be 1080p. About as good as, if not better than ACC on console.

@Matteocarlito when you find your sweet spot, how does your steering wheel look? Can you read the text on them when in a race car?

Hi! My steering wheel looks not exactly in the same position of my set up but the feeling is just great as well . No complaint about that (and pretty sure Pd will fix this easily)
My complaints are in regard of YouTubers no one of them excluding Kireth told the truth.
Including digital foundry and this was a huge surprise.
You can’t show a video and tell people that this is what you will get.

 

[BigSarj]

Hi! My steering wheel looks not exactly in the same position of my set up but the feeling is just great as well . No complaint about that (and pretty sure Pd will fix this easily)
My complaints are in regard of YouTubers no one of them excluding Kireth told the truth.
Including digital foundry and this was a huge surprise.
You can’t show a video and tell people that this is what you will get.

But can you read the text on the wheel of a race car? The steering wheel should be very clear because it's right in front of you. If the wheel is blurry, then it may be that you haven't found the sweet spot or it's your headset.

 

[Papiculo64]

I just want them to take my money, why don't they allow me to do it
Seriously, I still stick to the "Steve Jobs" approach, even if it was not without flaws:
"Let's pursue the best. If you can afford it, ok, if you can't, save money until you can".
The best would be better lenses, 8K Display, better construction and not really cheap plastic.
Sony, once, was like this.
I know, it's consumer, it's mainly for kids. But why not doing a "pro" version of the VR lenses?

I'd definitively buy a pro version too and sell mine to somebody who cannot afford it at full price!

But I have close to zero interest in the hypothetical 3000$ Apple headset, even if this price is probably a rumor spread by Apple to make a more realistic 1500-2000$ seem like a good deal to their fanbase. Even with the best possible display, it would still need an expensive PC to be fully exploitable, and it wouldn't have GT7 😅

PSVR2 is far from perfect, but it's the only VR solution for us console players and a solid alternative to way more expensive PCVR headsets requiring at least 3000$ configs to get a similar rendering, and with all the problems inherent to PC like game optimization. With PSVR2 the games are optimized for a single device, which makes it way easier for developpers to take full advantage of it, so we should see some great things once they get used to it, and even more with a PS5 pro or PS6.
Unreal Engine 5 should also help getting some great visuals.
I tried many cool games already and I'm really satisfied with it so far. Can't wait to see what's coming next!

 

[Matteocarlito]

But can you read the text on the wheel of a race car? The steering wheel should be very clear because it's right in front of you. If the wheel is blurry, then it may be that you haven't found the sweet spot or it's your headset.

Definitively I can, it looks not so bad and also a good resolution

I'd definitively buy a pro version too and sell mine to somebody who cannot afford it at full price!

But I have close to zero interest in the hypothetical 3000$ Apple headset, even if this price is probably a rumor spread by Apple to make a more realistic 1500-2000$ seem like a good deal to their fanbase. Even with the best possible display, it would still need an expensive PC to be fully exploitable, and it wouldn't have GT7 😅

PSVR2 is far from perfect, but it's the only VR solution for us console players and a solid alternative to way more expensive PCVR headsets requiring at least 3000$ configs to get a similar rendering, and with all the problems inherent to PC like game optimization. With PSVR2 the games are optimized for a single device, which makes it way easier for developpers to take full advantage of it, so we should see some great things once they get used to it, and even more with a PS5 pro or PS6.
Unreal Engine 5 should also help getting some great visuals.
I tried many cool games already and I'm really satisfied of it so far. Can't wait to see what's coming next!

Zero comma zero trust in Apple post Steve Jobs, in the good and the bad he was always looking for the best, far from mediocrity.

 

[djolliea]

This is what I do for optimal image quality everytime I start my sessions:

First I wipe the lenses with a microfibre cloth. Then I position the headset so that the lenses are as close to my eyes as possible and the headband is under the back of my head and tight enough. Then I adjust the IPD scroll wheel with each eye individually so that text right in front of me is sharp. When I'm in a car for a first time I re-adjust the IPD wheel if necessary so that I can read my speedometer, dashboard and track signs clearly. After that I'm good to go. All this takes less than a minute and I'm more than satisfied with the image.

It's great that PSVR 2 works without restarting the game or adjusting any game settings. A simple plug-and-play. So easy and convinient.

As a side note: My VR lap times are now pretty much the same as flat. Won every Sophy race on expert and set my current fastest time on Barcelona-Catalunya TT with GT-R '18 in VR. (1:41.148). I'm sure I can go under 41.

I highly recommend trying Suzuki VGT Gr.3 for Daily C or just cruising GWH. What a beast of machine that thing is and so fun to drive. Did not realize that until I tried in VR. Awesome sounds and great visibility too with open top. Short shift before 11,000 rpm for best performance.

 

[luv2drive]

I read that the reason they went with fresnel lenses is because pancake lenses don't work with HDR. If that's the case, then I'm glad they stuck with fresnel lenses.

Anyway, I've had a bit more time and so far, I still have no complaints, really. Only that GT7's sweet spot is so tiny. Sometimes I find it right away and other times it will take me a minute or two.

When in the sweet spot, things in the foreground look to be 1080p. About as good as, if not better than ACC on console.

@Matteocarlito when you find your sweet spot, how does your steering wheel look? Can you read the text on them when in a race car?

I agree. I have no complaints with GT7 in PSVR2. I definitely had to figure out how to fit the headset properly for optimal viewing, and I understand that things in the distance are a bit blurry, intentionally, but it I am not obsessing over that and it isn't distracting from the awesome immersive experience (for me).

When you say "ACC on console", what are you comparing to? To my knowledge ACC on console doesn't run in VR, but please correct me if I'm wrong.

I have run ACC on PC (with a 1080Ti which admittedly is "older" technology in 2023), and PSVR2 is considerably better than this in terms of graphics quality.

 

[BigSarj]

I agree. I have no complaints with GT7 in PSVR2. I definitely had to figure out how to fit the headset properly for optimal viewing, and I understand that things in the distance are a bit blurry, intentionally, but it I am not obsessing over that and it isn't distracting from the awesome immersive experience (for me).

When you say "ACC on console", what are you comparing to? To my knowledge ACC on console doesn't run in VR, but please correct me if I'm wrong.

I have run ACC on PC (with a 1080Ti which admittedly is "older" technology in 2023), and PSVR2 is considerably better than this in terms of graphics quality.

I was comparing it to ACC flat screen on console. Maybe it's a bit worse on a 4K tv than on a 1080. But I had an equally hard time reading some of the number boards in ACC as I do now in PSVR2.

 

[optical10]

People are playing that way on motion simulators and there is no problem. You will have natural head shakes due to car/rig movement and that is all.

unfortunately I can confirm that with low slung cars like the Gr.1 Prototype Series, (used the Mazda LM55 VGT] and the violent pitching when breaking and accelerating, but mainly breaking and going downhill, like the first right hander turn of the new Grand Valley - Highway 1 that is major loss of tracking even when you turn backspace backspace the effects of pitch breaking down to lower levels, I think it's the combination of going downhill but I'm not sure, more testing needs to be done.
If anybody's does know a permanent fix please let me know👍.
In the meantime I'm using this per car and per race trick "Gran Turismo 7 PSVR2 tips...How to change seating position"

 

[Papiculo64]

I was a little dizzy after a quite intensive session on RE8 so I just played GT7 on flat screen for the first time in 2 weeks... and man, it feels so weird! XD

I played in cockpit mode, like I used to do before the VR update, but the other cars look so small! Even while playing at 1.5 meter in front if my 55' TV they looked like toys cars.
The whole thing looks so flat that it's really difficult to read the track and it took me many laps just to drive correctly even if I knew the track by heart.
No way I'm ever going back to this! 😝

unfortunately I can confirm that with low slung cars like the Gr.1 Prototype Series, (used the Mazda LM55 VGT] and the violent pitching when breaking and accelerating, but mainly breaking and going downhill, like the first right hander turn of the new Grand Valley - Highway 1 that is major loss of tracking even when you turn backspace backspace the effects of pitch breaking down to lower levels, I think it's the combination of going downhill but I'm not sure, more testing needs to be done.
If anybody's does know a permanent fix please let me know👍.
In the meantime I'm using this per car and per race trick "Gran Turismo 7 PSVR2 tips...How to change seating position"

Did you try to turn on the tracking assist?
Also, the only time I experienced tracking issues was because of my room lights being too strong. The PSVR2 doesn't seem to appreciate direct lighting sources. Made them weaker and never had the issue again.

 

[ZDX]

Those that have it how long is the USB C cable to connect to the PS5?

It is 4.5m. I added 5m extensions to both the Type C and Type A cables to open up more play area options.

Without a screen a modest rig can fit into a closet - out of sight. Just open the door climb in and fire it up.

 

[Matteocarlito]

AFTER ONE WEEK
SOOOOOOOO:


1. Are you faster or slower with VR?
2. Do you prefer VR or flat TV?

 

[DC5Remy]

AFTER ONE WEEK
SOOOOOOOO:


1. Are you faster or slower with VR?
2. Do you prefer VR or flat TV?

Faster.

Can’t go back to flat screen.

 

[Papiculo64]

AFTER ONE WEEK
SOOOOOOOO:


1. Are you faster or slower with VR?
2. Do you prefer VR or flat TV?

Same as above! 😁

 

[luv2drive]

unfortunately I can confirm that with low slung cars like the Gr.1 Prototype Series, (used the Mazda LM55 VGT] and the violent pitching when breaking and accelerating, but mainly breaking and going downhill, like the first right hander turn of the new Grand Valley - Highway 1 that is major loss of tracking even when you turn backspace backspace the effects of pitch breaking down to lower levels, I think it's the combination of going downhill but I'm not sure, more testing needs to be done.
If anybody's does know a permanent fix please let me know👍.
In the meantime I'm using this per car and per race trick "Gran Turismo 7 PSVR2 tips...How to change seating position"

I ran the 950pp event at Grand Valley yesterday with a great tune by the maestro, @praiano63, and it looked fine to me in VR. (Tune is here if you want to try it: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/praianos-tunes-settings-for-gt7.404868/post-13963502)

I love the interior of this car in VR! Check out how they did the tach and speedo - very cool. Only issue - no rear view mirrors! LOL. Wonder if that was an oversight?

Still, a very fun ride on Grand Valley in VR.

 

[05XR8]

Another visit to the VR Showroom.

Stealth Gr.3 RX-Vision looks meanacing in the Japan studio.


Flipping the headlights on and off, in the C4 ZR-1, Mitsubishi GTO, Mazda TC, AE86, MR-2

Doing my normal spectating thing instead of hoping for a glitch.

Having more appreciation for all the WTC events. WTC800 at Fuji and Tokyo. Plus, the WTC800 Championship. Can’t help mentioning, over and over, how this is a new game with the VR experience. It really is for me.

 

[HadOne2Many]

This is what I do for optimal image quality everytime I start my sessions:

First I wipe the lenses with a microfibre cloth. Then I position the headset so that the lenses are as close to my eyes as possible and the headband is under the back of my head and tight enough. Then I adjust the IPD scroll wheel with each eye individually so that text right in front of me is sharp. When I'm in a car for a first time I re-adjust the IPD wheel if necessary so that I can read my speedometer, dashboard and track signs clearly. After that I'm good to go. All this takes less than a minute and I'm more than satisfied with the image.

It's great that PSVR 2 works without restarting the game or adjusting any game settings. A simple plug-and-play. So easy and convinient.

As a side note: My VR lap times are now pretty much the same as flat. Won every Sophy race on expert and set my current fastest time on Barcelona-Catalunya TT with GT-R '18 in VR. (1:41.148). I'm sure I can go under 41.

I highly recommend trying Suzuki VGT Gr.3 for Daily C or just cruising GWH. What a beast of machine that thing is and so fun to drive. Did not realize that until I tried in VR. Awesome sounds and great visibility too with open top. Short shift before 11,000 rpm for best performance.

Nice time on Catalunya. 5 laps so far in a 911 and best I've done is a low 1:44. Getting faster every lap but I'm going to need to watch a few replays and turn on some ghosts to get a gold.

 

[rsspyder21]

AFTER ONE WEEK
SOOOOOOOO:


1. Are you faster or slower with VR?
2. Do you prefer VR or flat TV?

Is this even a serious question? 😂

Having more appreciation for all the WTC events. WTC800 at Fuji and Tokyo. Plus, the WTC800 Championship. Can’t help mentioning, over and over, how this is a new game with the VR experience. It really is for me.

Agree, it's not even the same game to me. VR makes its lifespan infinite in my opinion. I'd be happy enough with it even if ALL I could ever do is hot lap. Whenever I get time to get on it, I truly do not want to have to stop. I could spend hours just driving and looking for faster lap times. Old pancake mode, after an hour or so I'd be good to quit and go do something else. This thing has me wishing there were another four or five hours in the day.

 

[Papiculo64]

Another visit to the VR Showroom.

Stealth Gr.3 RX-Vision looks meanacing in the Japan studio.


Flipping the headlights on and off, in the C4 ZR-1, Mitsubishi GTO, Mazda TC, AE86, MR-2

Doing my normal spectating thing instead of hoping for a glitch.

Having more appreciation for all the WTC events. WTC800 at Fuji and Tokyo. Plus, the WTC800 Championship. Can’t help mentioning, over and over, how this is a new game with the VR experience. It really is for me.

My favorite are the headlights of the Corvette C2, but there's also all the Ferrari's (308GTB, 288GTO, F40, F50), the Lancia Stratos, NSX Type-R, Supra 3.0GT Turbo, etc... All those cars motorized headlights are so cool in VR showroom! 😁

 

[regnar]

Another video on dealing with blurriness, interesting prescription lens inserts

 

[MroczMR]

Faster.

Can’t go back to flat screen.

 

[Matteocarlito]

Same as above! 😁

So we just need to understand why big streamers still stick to flat

 

[mad4pancakes]

So we just need to understand why big streamers still stick to flat

I imagine the most important reason is to interact with the audience. If they can't read the audience chat and react to it, the streams are a little boring. A secondary reason might be the lack of some UI info in VR mode.

 

[DC5Remy]

So we just need to understand why big streamers still stick to flat

Rich people don’t change things if they don’t have to.