(GTOR) | [GTTCC-3] Gran Turismo Touring Car Championship S3 - xflow1390 takes back to back titles!Finished 

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Standing or Rolling starts?

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Well on the basis of TRL 's testing combined with knowing my own pace in the Volvo compared to Madbeans in practice....... I'm in the wrong car because i can go faster in the C4 than I can in the Volvo.

I have barely tried the golf but perhaps at its new spec it'll be really good for me.

Oh it's getting awkward pretty quickly.

At the end of the day, nobody is perfect at driving every car on the grid. So someone can come along and find a car that is rubbish for them and to others it may feel amazing. For example, I cannot drive an FR as well as Skeng can, so if we had the same car as each other I'd be complaining that it's too slow and needed help, when in reality the car might be ok for the majority of drivers but not suitable for me.

The only perfect solution to the whole balancing is to scrap it and run a one make series. There is no other way of actually getting it right and let's face it, one makes are okay but eventually they become boring.

In the BTCC we tried to make testing almost compulsory by offering an incentive to those that took part. We were then able to take data from each session to try and balance the cars more evenly based partly on talent.

One other solution is to carry the success penalty forward to the following round each week, so if someone wins race 3, they probably won't win race 1 the next week.

Am I happy that TRL are faster in my car? No of course not, but I'm not entirely suprised either. I'm barely a part time racer anyway.

I'm driving as well as I can with a car that to be honest I don't exactly love. I chose the Volvo because it was easy for me, I can just jump into it and drive without sorting about tuning anymore or piss arsing about. I don't love GT6 enough to want to play it anymore, I just like a few of the guys that I race against and that's why I'm here. :)

Last night I had race 3 gifted to me. Race 2 I actually struggled with my tyres a bit compared to the others and the penalty was slowing me down. In race 1 I had the best pit stop imaginable the car flew into that pit box like a good'un. :lol:
 
Ian_83
Well on the basis of TRL 's testing combined with knowing my own pace in the Volvo compared to Madbeans in practice....... I'm in the wrong car because i can go faster in the C4 than I can in the Volvo.

I have barely tried the golf but perhaps at its new spec it'll be really good for me.

Oh it's getting awkward pretty quickly.

At the end of the day, nobody is perfect at driving every car on the grid. So someone can come along and find a car that is rubbish for them and to others it may feel amazing. For example, I cannot drive an FR as well as Skeng can, so if we had the same car as each other I'd be complaining that it's too slow and needed help, when in reality the car might be ok for the majority of drivers but not suitable for me.

The only perfect solution to the whole balancing is to scrap it and run a one make series. There is no other way of actually getting it right and let's face it, one makes are okay but eventually they become boring.

In the BTCC we tried to make testing almost compulsory by offering an incentive to those that took part. We were then able to take data from each session to try and balance the cars more evenly based partly on talent.

One other solution is to carry the success penalty forward to the following round each week, so if someone wins race 3, they probably won't win race 1 the next week.

Am I happy that TRL are faster in my car? No of course not, but I'm not entirely suprised either. I'm barely a part time racer anyway.

I'm driving as well as I can with a car that to be honest I don't exactly love. I chose the Volvo because it was easy for me, I can just jump into it and drive without sorting about tuning anymore or piss arsing about. I don't love GT6 enough to want to play it anymore, I just like a few of the guys that I race against and that's why I'm here. :)

Last night I had race 3 gifted to me. Race 2 I actually struggled with my tyres a bit compared to the others and the penalty was slowing me down. In race 1 I had the best pit stop imaginable the car flew into that pit box like a good'un. :lol:
Click to expand...
These are the words from an experienced racer! Listen to him! ;)
 
:(

Right let's try sort this mess out.
I like to start testing on a short track, such as Silverstone. All cars were then speced and after an hour per car they were only 0.1 off from fastest to slowest. Took me a good few days sat there with a sore butt and headache :lol:

So next I had to move the cars onto a longer track, more technical. Any issues I spotted them and tried to deal with them.

Before this thread was open @sb360 @Storm_SP17 @alex salmon @NinjaEvo were all giving me a hand. Big thanks to them. They gave the cars a run around, gave me feedback and any changes they thought could be made. We tried it and in the end each of us was setting equal lap times with all the cars.

When I test I add what I can to the cars but I do not tune. All cars are balanced according to how they are stock (with upgraded parts like suspension etc). I'm not a good tuner I don't have the ability to get the absolute best out of a car and if I could that would add another hour per car to get it to that standard. I like having the car untuned as it's a game and most people can't spend a lot of time on the game. So if everyone just jumped in a car from the go it would hold it's ground.

Now, for example. The VW and Volvo were completely equal. As they were to me on stock. However if you tuned the VW as much as possible, and the same on the Volvo. Then maybe one will be faster. To me, it's the ability to find as much as you can in a car compared to your competitors. Everyone has the same equipment and it's how they use it.

Driving style/preference is massive. Being able to drive one car quicker than the other may mean one is faster.

It's quite horrible to be told how 🤬 a job you've done. If when you signed up and expected the cars to be balanced. From data I have, and many others have given me, they are. But the main thing to point out is if people don't like it. Don't try change things for your benefit. Everyone knows where the door is.
I'm not saying it's all me, I've had help from others which I hugely appreciate it. But I haven't got 35 drivers in a series which people enjoy for running it poorly. If people weren't happy they'd go. But those who do enjoy it and find things fair, it makes it all worth while.

In mine and others hand at the time they were published specs were balanced. I don't have the time and i'm feeling like crap now. But I've put the PS on and i'm going to spend the next few hours seeing what I've got at laguna, wwhere they should all be balanced.

If I hear any more 'this car is too slow, this car too fast' I will be penalizing it. If people have issues with cars, let me know and give me data. Other than that don't mention specs if you can't back up your claims.

We have different drivers here, preferring different cars and different abilities. Bear that in mind.

If people want to pop in feel more than free. But i'm going to ask that your findings in the room are given back to me. Also if people have a solid tune they wish to give me so I can put it on each car then I can see how things go
 
You've done your best to keep things fair, and I really think they are, I'm able to keep pace with the other drivers, everyone has a fair chance to place decently no matter what car they have. People may find it hard to gel with a car but that's why you've gotta be quick to get something you can get along with, I do think maybe there could be a little more availability but I understand that is a difficult balancing act to maintain.
 
True-blue-8
:(

Right let's try sort this mess out.
I like to start testing on a short track, such as Silverstone. All cars were then speced and after an hour per car they were only 0.1 off from fastest to slowest. Took me a good few days sat there with a sore butt and headache :lol:

So next I had to move the cars onto a longer track, more technical. Any issues I spotted them and tried to deal with them.

Before this thread was open @sb360 @Storm_SP17 @alex salmon @NinjaEvo were all giving me a hand. Big thanks to them. They gave the cars a run around, gave me feedback and any changes they thought could be made. We tried it and in the end each of us was setting equal lap times with all the cars.

When I test I add what I can to the cars but I do not tune. All cars are balanced according to how they are stock (with upgraded parts like suspension etc). I'm not a good tuner I don't have the ability to get the absolute best out of a car and if I could that would add another hour per car to get it to that standard. I like having the car untuned as it's a game and most people can't spend a lot of time on the game. So if everyone just jumped in a car from the go it would hold it's ground.

Now, for example. The VW and Volvo were completely equal. As they were to me on stock. However if you tuned the VW as much as possible, and the same on the Volvo. Then maybe one will be faster. To me, it's the ability to find as much as you can in a car compared to your competitors. Everyone has the same equipment and it's how they use it.

Driving style/preference is massive. Being able to drive one car quicker than the other may mean one is faster.

It's quite horrible to be told how 🤬 a job you've done. If when you signed up and expected the cars to be balanced. From data I have, and many others have given me, they are. But the main thing to point out is if people don't like it. Don't try change things for your benefit. Everyone knows where the door is.
I'm not saying it's all me, I've had help from others which I hugely appreciate it. But I haven't got 35 drivers in a series which people enjoy for running it poorly. If people weren't happy they'd go. But those who do enjoy it and find things fair, it makes it all worth while.

In mine and others hand at the time they were published specs were balanced. I don't have the time and i'm feeling like crap now. But I've put the PS on and i'm going to spend the next few hours seeing what I've got at laguna, wwhere they should all be balanced.

If I hear any more 'this car is too slow, this car too fast' I will be penalizing it. If people have issues with cars, let me know and give me data. Other than that don't mention specs if you can't back up your claims.

We have different drivers here, preferring different cars and different abilities. Bear that in mind.

If people want to pop in feel more than free. But i'm going to ask that your findings in the room are given back to me. Also if people have a solid tune they wish to give me so I can put it on each car then I can see how things go
Click to expand...
Another factor to mention on my (and most likely most others, too) parts, is that certain cars suit certain tracks. Like we've been saying for ages that some tracks are FF "Power" tracks and others are FR "cornering" tracks. Just because your car, say a Nissan, is slow at one circuit, doesn't mean it's slow everywhere else. My Nissan is slow around Laguna Seca, where @Ian_83 just takes off from me in his Volvo, but I can easily keep up with him at Monaco in the same cars, in fact at the right place I could overtake him.

See my point?
 
Mikey24
Another factor to mention on my (and most likely most others, too) parts, is that certain cars suit certain tracks. Like we've been saying for ages that some tracks are FF "Power" tracks and others are FR "cornering" tracks. Just because your car, say a Nissan, is slow at one circuit, doesn't mean it's slow everywhere else. My Nissan is slow around Laguna Seca, where @Ian_83 just takes off from me in his Volvo, but I can easily keep up with him at Monaco in the same cars, in fact at the right place I could overtake him.

See my point?
Click to expand...
Knew I missed one out :lol: 👍

I took @Ian_83 last night. I know his car is quicker on the traight, so I took him where I knew I could and pulled away after that, making sure he couldn't get me again on the straight
 
I somehow feel that this is directed to me? I never said you done a 🤬 job, its impossible to predict how people tune vs stock.
 
RacingLine
I somehow feel that this is directed to me? I never said you done a 🤬 job, its impossible to predict how people tune vs stock.
Click to expand...
not at all mate. It was just to everyone.

I've read how people expected more and how it was 'a joke and funny'

sb360
In all honesty @True-blue-8 I wouldn't bother trying to rebalance, I attempted it with my tuning and I was just nowhere near, I found the Volvo the slowest of all and you know how much I wanted to make the Volvo work. There is too much variation in track/driver/tune/driving style/star-sign/shoe-size/hair-colour/etc-etc to get them any closer than they already are.
Click to expand...
All i'm doing is giving them a run down and showing what I found
 
sb360
In all honesty @True-blue-8 I wouldn't bother trying to rebalance, I attempted it with my tuning and I was just nowhere near, I found the Volvo the slowest of all and you know how much I wanted to make the Volvo work. There is too much variation in track/driver/tune/driving style/star-sign/shoe-size/hair-colour/etc-etc to get them any closer than they already are.
Click to expand...
That's right, like I said earlier @True-blue-8, you've done everything you can. No multi-car series' on GTP have perfect balance, there will be differences in cars at different tracks. No way around it. Your best bet is to keep the cars as they are! :)
 
ok so 2 cars done

Stock suspension / LSD
Citroen - 34.1
BMW - 34.2

Tuned
BMW - 33.7
Citroen - 33.8



Going to do the Volvo / VW now. If anything I think it's the VW off the pace. If anyone is testing over the weekend. If you can also try the Volvo/VW and let me know what you find (laptimes please) it would be a great help 👍
 
True-blue-8
ok so 2 cars done

Stock suspension / LSD
Citroen - 34.1
BMW - 34.2

Tuned
BMW - 33.7
Citroen - 33.8



Going to do the Volvo / VW now. If anything I think it's the VW off the pace. If anyone is testing over the weekend. If you can also try the Volvo/VW and let me know what you find (laptimes please) it would be a great help 👍
Click to expand...
 
True-blue-8
ok so 2 cars done

Stock suspension / LSD
Citroen - 34.1
BMW - 34.2

Tuned
BMW - 33.7
Citroen - 33.8



Going to do the Volvo / VW now. If anything I think it's the VW off the pace. If anyone is testing over the weekend. If you can also try the Volvo/VW and let me know what you find (laptimes please) it would be a great help 👍
Click to expand...
i be testing tomorrow and all weekend i go on diffrent tracks and gather some times together i let you know how i get on when i tested cars at the start i was getting similar times with all of them. i will do stock set up & a tune set up m8
 
john sweet
i be testing tomorrow and all weekend i go on diffrent tracks and gather some times together i let you know how i get on when i tested cars at the start i was getting similar times with all of them. i will do stock set up & a tune set up m8
Click to expand...
much appreciated mate :cheers:
 
sb360
Yeah, if we can get enough people up for it we will do the following:

No penalties.
15 min Quali
Rolling start
Heavy Damage
Fast Tyre Wear
Any strategy you like except you must run both SS and SM tyres
1 hour timed race

Or at least that is the current plan.
Click to expand...
I'm definitely up for this! :)
 
sb360
Yeah, if we can get enough people up for it we will do the following:

No penalties.
15 min Quali
Rolling start
Heavy Damage
Fast Tyre Wear
Any strategy you like except you must run both SS and SM tyres
1 hour timed race

Or at least that is the current plan.
Click to expand...

Cars?
 
If this helps, here is my times:
All tuned. But not set up. All set to specs and gears set to 149mph.

Laguna seca.
Vw 1.36.197
Nissan 1.35.602
Honda 1.35.973
Bmw 1.34.996
Citroen 1.34.662
Toyota 1.35.570
Volvo batteries died.

Raceway. Gears at 149mph.
Vw 1.23.794
Nissan 1.23.857
Honda 1.23.278
Bmw 1.22.816
Citroen 1.23.202
Toyota 1.23.277
Volvo 1.24.859

Taskuba 137mph gears.
VW 1.01.625
Nissan 1.01.281
Honda 1.00.976
BMW 1.00.926
Citroen 1.00.672
Toyota 1.00.950
Volvo 1.02.309

For me the Volvo is fast. Just not in my hands with my style. I like a pointy front end. The Volvo is just heavy. Lol.

Hope that helps.
 
FaithlessEmo
If this helps, here is my times:
All tuned. But not set up. All set to specs and gears set to 149mph.

Laguna seca.
Vw 1.36.197
Nissan 1.35.602
Honda 1.35.973
Bmw 1.34.996
Citroen 1.34.662
Toyota 1.35.570
Volvo batteries died.

Raceway. Gears at 149mph.
Vw 1.23.794
Nissan 1.23.857
Honda 1.23.278
Bmw 1.22.816
Citroen 1.23.202
Toyota 1.23.277
Volvo 1.24.859

Taskuba 137mph gears.
VW 1.01.625
Nissan 1.01.281
Honda 1.00.976
BMW 1.00.926
Citroen 1.00.672
Toyota 1.00.950
Volvo 1.02.309

For me the Volvo is fast. Just not in my hands with my style. I like a pointy front end. The Volvo is just heavy. Lol.

Hope that helps.
Click to expand...
Thanks mate 👍

Ok, I've spent 5 hours solid testing and sorting out. Thanks @NinjaEvo for coming in and helping.

So, The Citroen, BMW, Ford, Toyota and Honda are all fine. Setting equal lap times in mine and ninja's hands. Also with others who have been trying cars out for me.
The Volvo is fine. If wanted an additional 20kg is there, to give it a bit better handling
the vw will stay at 270
its been requested the Nissan plays with its weight. 290bhp 1420kg is proposed.


the specs are fine. i'm fed up now people saying it was meant to be sorted. it is. if you don't like it you know where the door is


deadline is now monday
 
Most cars I can safely get into the low 34's at Laguna Seca, and after analysing xflow the other day in the Golf going 33.308, I took note of just his gear change and usage through corners... and was then able to pull 33.5's with a (consistently) poor last sector. I'm consistently 0.1-0.2 seconds quicker leading into the last two corners, where I tend to lose 0.4 over xflow's fastest lap on Tuesday, mainly on the last turn. Only reason my car is 0.6+ faster is because I'm dedicating more of my effort and time constantly refining the tune...

Gearing to suit how you drive is key too guys. I'd have been in the 1:29's with my new gearing tune last night had I the clear run and decent few corners I needed to break into that time band. Before that I struggled to find 30.3's, yet I could get 1:30.1's from even some pretty sloppy laps.

Just want to apologise for lag and incompatibility issues in the lobby last night, I know it ruined Race 1 for buck and Agro :( ... that is why I retired from the other two races. That, and the issue that arose about not being able to see me from a few players.

Anyone who cannot see cars on track runs the risk of being blown away by an unseen force, and anyone that can't be seen has to be extra careful about who cannot see you and where they will likely position themselves in the scenario of you not being there. I've had issues with people like this before, and even my own teammate/RL friend in an endurance race. Luckily, with it being my RL friend and access to Skype, we remedied this by me telling him where I was in relation to his car whenever we were battling for position, so that he knew to give me space. Such a luxury is not available in a full lobby of 16 where mics are off to improve race quality.
 

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