Guns

[justin credible]

I never suggested that plants suffer as living things since their is no research to back that up instead it's the opposite. You're are confusing me with another user, so yeah. And you weren't taking the piss out of my post since I never said what you've claimed, and my intelligence was harmed when you're ignorance to no take a second more to see who you've just responded to wasn't aptly applied.

Ah ha I got the wrong one well strap me down and whip me with nettles.
Pal no offence but chill bro take a chill pill and relax who gives a monkeys about weather there is research on plants.
I was joking granted I got the wrong poster but calling me ignorant instead of laughing and saying ha ha you Muppet you got the wrong poster comes across a bit uptight and serious, It's a thread on an internet site not a court of arbitration to save your ass.

 

[Formula1269]

To satisfy human greed? Is the pretentious bit always the tone you go for in these threads?

The irony.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The irony.

Yeah considering you responding.

Ah ha I got the wrong one well strap me down and whip me with nettles.
Pal no offence but chill bro take a chill pill and relax who gives a monkeys about weather there is research on plants.
I was joking granted I got the wrong poster but calling me ignorant instead of laughing and saying ha ha you Muppet you got the wrong poster comes across a bit uptight and serious, It's a thread on an internet site not a court of arbitration to save your ass.

Hey man if that's your thing, that's cool I wont judge.

Plenty of people care, hence the money to research it...also it's a discussion board in the OCE, about current topics that are of importance to many. No one else seemed to have got your joke, but hey whatever it takes to cop out. Still haven't answered any of my questions by the way.

 

[justin credible]

Yeah considering you responding.


Hey man if that's your thing, that's cool I wont judge.

Plenty of people care, hence the money to research it...also it's a discussion board in the OCE, about current topics that are of importance to many. No one else seemed to have got your joke, but hey whatever it takes to cop out. Still haven't answered any of my questions by the way.

Yeh right ok whatever you said dude it is an opinions thread that was my opinion on plant research .
Kop out of what exactly?
Answered your questions on what? please repeat them as I can't be bothered to search in case I get the ones from the wrong poster.

 

[FoolKiller]

I'm trying to understand how vegetarianism and guns are the same topic.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Yeh right ok whatever you said dude it is an opinions thread that was my opinion on plant research .
Kop out of what exactly?
Answered your questions on what? please repeat them as I can't be bothered to search in case I get the ones from the wrong poster.

Well I mean you needed the practice so might as well search.

I'm trying to understand how vegetarianism and guns are the same topic.

Because people who hunt and kill animals with guns, are vile to justin and just as bad as murderers, thus he sees no reason for guns in that realm. As a vegetarian has he claims to be, he doesn't see why any one need to harm animals it's barbaric.

 

[FoolKiller]

Because people who hunt and kill animals with guns, are vile to justin and just as bad as murderers, thus he sees no reason for guns in that realm. As a vegetarian has he claims to be, he doesn't see why any one need to harm animals it's barbaric.

But then it became about plants feeling pain too and research into that and whatnot. Honestly, I feel like I can pull out my Venus fly trap joke at this point.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

But then it became about plants feeling pain too and research into that and whatnot. Honestly, I feel like I can pull out my Venus fly trap joke at this point.

Well the research about pain thing I brought up cause he misquoted me, it was a passing comment nothing more. The main point I have that he hasn't answered is how hunted animals go through such agony, especially if we compared it to industrial farming for example.

 

[justin credible]

Well the research about pain thing I brought up cause he misquoted me, it was a passing comment nothing more. The main point I have that he hasn't answered is how hunted animals go through such agony, especially if we compared it to industrial farming for example.

So show me where you asked me that question? I read back and can't see it anywhere in a post to me.

Any how if you want my opinion both hunted animals and industrial farming is barbaric, If you got shot I am sure it would hurt no matter if it is pain for seconds before death occurs or obviously a lot of pain if death is dragged out. I hate to think of the pain an animal goes through when caught in traps with wires and spikes.
Industrial farming supposed to have the quickest humanist form of death like electrocuting a pigs head then slitting there throats and hanging them upside down to drip. Or shooting a cow in the head and pith it's spine to stop the nervous system causing a huge animal to kick out as it dies, nervous twitch and kick out when animals are in pain or are suffering. Doesn't sound very humane to me.
I wonder why if you have to have a dog put to sleep the lethal injection seems to send them to sleep before stopping there heart and causing death a humane way if there ever was one, why isn't this used in slaughter houses on cattle pigs etc?
Hunting for the fun of it Trophy hunting as I call it, just why go out and kill animals I can not get the jist of why in to my head.
I know Hunting is a thing which people have different views on for different reasons and I believe I have heard all the arguments for hunting yet I can't grasp why a lot of the time, I get it that people in jungles and maybe the Artic need to fish etc to live I get that dog eat dog and what a human will do to feed and protect their family.
I just don't get why people go out and shoot animals for the sake of shooting them.
I don't eat meat because mainly I don't like the taste, I don't like the way animals are bred for food as I know from what I have seen with my own eyes the animals are treated horribly from start to finish of their lives.

 

[Blood Eagle]

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/food-ethics-poll.336068/

 

[Michael88]

I just don't get why people go out and shoot animals for the sake of shooting them.

Well, going out there and hunt game is a satisfying thing for a lot of people because doing what people are meant to do creates the feeling of satisfaction. Sex, eating, sports etc. the body releases endorphins to reward us for doing whats good for our survival and well being. Being in the woods and hunting prey is no different, a lot of people feel good when they do that, and you can't blame them for it because thats what humankind did in the past 5.000.000 years and it was hugely important for our evolution and survival. Evolution made us to like hunting.

Hunting may not be crucial for our survival anymore, at least for us for us Westerners, but this does not mean its all of a sudden bad and disgusting and its only about running around in the woods and shooting animals to death - hunting has always been an important pillar of mankind and its something completely natural.

I love animals, since I was a little kid I have owned 10 pets, I hugely value life, I'm no hunter myself but I can totally imagine the thrill of a successful hunt, but only when the meat is used - thats an important part of the process. Trophy hunting for the sake of killing is idiotic and completely unnatural.

Also hunting is important tom keep the ecosystem healthy and running, I think thats a good motivation to hunt too.

 

[justin credible]

Well, going out there and hunt game is a satisfying thing for a lot of people because doing what people are meant to do creates the feeling of satisfaction. Sex, eating, sports etc. the body releases endorphins to reward us for doing whats good for our survival and well being. Being in the woods and hunting prey is no different, a lot of people feel good when they do that, and you can't blame them for it because thats what humankind did in the past 5.000.000 years and it was hugely important for our evolution and survival. Evolution made us to like hunting.

Hunting may not be crucial for our survival anymore, at least for us for us Westerners, but this does not mean its all of a sudden bad and disgusting and its only about running around in the woods and shooting animals to death - hunting has always been an important pillar of mankind and its something completely natural.

I love animals, since I was a little kid I have owned 10 pets, I hugely value life, I'm no hunter myself but I can totally imagine the thrill of a successful hunt, but only when the meat is used - thats an important part of the process. Trophy hunting for the sake of killing is idiotic and completely unnatural.

I can't buy the feeling of satisfaction like sex eating sports as the only feeling I get from seeing hunting is sadness it certainly doesn't make me feel better wow if I run over a rabbit I feel guilty as hell for weeks.
I agree as I said hunting to survive I can accept but like you said in the western world is it really necessary with everything we require to feed our faces available maybe full of additives but still available.

Yes the human race has hunted for years and years we have done other things for years which are acceptable in modern society and others which are no longer acceptable?
There is always going to be the for and against debate on hunting I guess like other things controversial like keeping pets in cages it is the way of humans even if I don't agree.

Trophy hunting is barbaric cruel and in my opinion should be illegal as where does it stop? endangered species hunted animals killed for there ivory and skins. What the so called trophy hunters going to be targeting in a few years from now? Humans as the ultimate prize like they see elephants or male lions now.
Guns are ok in there right place it is just the debate of what is there correct place in society? I doubt we will all ever agree.

 

[Parker]

I'm the one who brought up plants being slaughtered as a joke. I assume @justin credible knew it was a joke because of his response to my post, apologies if anyone took it serious and derailed the thread.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

What the hell? Screams in agony while dying from a gun shot? If you have no clue what you're talking about instead of going for hyperbole, just educate yourself prior.

@justin credible where here is an instance where I asked. It wasn't a post just to scratch my head and asking to clarify what the hell is going on with thought, rather how exactly is this so. How is this the case, when industrial livestock farming is much more harmful.

 

[justin credible]

@justin credible where here is an instance where I asked. It wasn't a post just to scratch my head and asking to clarify what the hell is going on with thought, rather how exactly is this so. How is this the case, when industrial livestock farming is much more harmful.

That's no more the question than your the king of Egypt. Educate yourself you posted in reply to an obvious joke.
Give me a break that's the question.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

That's no more the question than your the king of Egypt. Educate yourself you posted in reply to an obvious joke.
Give me a break that's the question.

K then

 

[A2K78]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...n-law-as-munich-killer-buys-glock-9mm-on-dar/


Talk about a gift to criminals and terrorist as this will just lead to more guns flooding the black market

 

[stonesfan129]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...n-law-as-munich-killer-buys-glock-9mm-on-dar/


Talk about a gift to criminals and terrorist as this will just lead to more guns flooding the black market

Here's the thing. None of these laws, anywhere in the world, have proactively stopped anyone with bad intentions.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Here's the thing. None of these laws, anywhere in the world, have proactively stopped anyone with bad intentions.

Bad intentions don't make criminals, laws make criminals. A rapist isn't deterred by law, neither is a thief or murderer. What's at fault, the person or the law?

 

[Zenith]

Bad intentions don't make criminals, laws make criminals. A rapist isn't deterred by law, neither is a thief or murderer. What's at fault, the person or the law?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but by definition a criminal is one who breaks the law. Law is an attempt to put into no uncertain terms that an action is immoral.

If the law is just, something like murder, then the person is at fault.

If the law is unjust, something like smoking marijuana, then the law is at fault.

 

[stonesfan129]

Bad intentions don't make criminals, laws make criminals. A rapist isn't deterred by law, neither is a thief or murderer. What's at fault, the person or the law?

My point is that there shouldn't be a law that prevents people from defense against those things.

 

[Danoff]

Since these kinds of self-defense stories don't get a lot of press, I figured I'd leave it here:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/27/us/oklahoma-three-dead-home-burglary/

The fact that it was an AR-15 used might draw a bigger audience in this case.

 

[Com Fox]

Brining this back up again.

At my Job Centre program for work skills, we experimented with debating and the topic was Gun laws. We were assigned a side, I was assigned to be against Guns being banned.

I must say, it gave me a new perspective. Granted I still think the ownership of guns should be somewhat restricted so no amateur can hold it, but Guns actually do serve some sort of self-defense if used properly as I researched. Even Australia experienced more crime right after the gun ban even though we're one of the best examples of guns being banned and even then, it kind of unfair to use Australia as an example whose location makes it difficult to import illegal weapons.

I also discovered how the gun violence numbers doesn't tell the whole story as a giant number also counts suicides which are still gun violence, doesn't give any evidence to gun crime especially when suicide would unfortunately still happen anyway without guns.

Too bad during the debate the person "listening" to us clearly had a bias and kept saying "well gun culture is different in [insert non-North American country]" and "thats because of gangs in chicago (even though that just makes it more evident that removing of guns would be pointless)" yet accepting an argument of simply "I can just go bang bang at you guys right now" without any real substance and still used Australia against us even though she just denied outside american countries as different gun countries.

Even still, I do think there should be control of guns BUT not as strict as what I used to think.

 

[stonesfan129]

I'm fine with the restrictions we have in Wisconsin. No stupid assault weapon bans. You want a firearm, you go to a licensed dealer and buy one, do the background check and if it comes back clean, you can walk out with your stuff same day. You wanna carry, you either open carry or you go to the class and get a concealed carry permit if you have a clean record. We don't have record levels of crimes committed with firearms.

 

[BobK]

I'm fine with the restrictions we have in Wisconsin. No stupid assault weapon bans. You want a firearm, you go to a licensed dealer and buy one, do the background check and if it comes back clean, you can walk out with your stuff same day. You wanna carry, you either open carry or you go to the class and get a concealed carry permit if you have a clean record. We don't have record levels of crimes committed with firearms.

 

[stonesfan129]

View attachment 643120

Darn right. And every time somebody tells me that "more gun control" is the answer, I just ask myself that if gun control is the answer, why don't we have record gun crime in Wisconsin where there are very lax gun laws.

 

[Northstar]

why don't we have record gun crime in Wisconsin where there are very lax gun laws.

Simple, everyone in Wisconsin is too drunk to aim straight.

 

[stonesfan129]

Simple, everyone in Wisconsin is too drunk to aim straight.

I'm surprised no one has proposed car control since Wisconsin leads the country in drunk driving fatalities. But my point is still valid. We don't have strong gun control laws in Wisconsin. Our crime rate isn't out of control compared to other states with very tough gun laws, such as California or New York. I don't think guns or access to them is really the problem.

 

[Lizard]

Ok. I am a lefty British guy so you know my view on guns but that isn't what I came to debate.


What is everyone's opinion on things like hollow point ammunition and other stuff that is legal for US citizens to buy but illegal* in war?

*I know international law isn't binding but states generally follow the rules on the basis that their soldiers will be given the same respect.

 

[Com Fox]

Ok. I am a lefty British guy so you know my view on guns but that isn't what I came to debate.

According to the compass I am a lefty Australian, so what you are doesn't determine all of your political opinions.

What is everyone's opinion on things like hollow point ammunition and other stuff that is legal for US citizens to buy but illegal* in war?

I think hollow point is a little overkill of the allowance, I know there is a thing called self defense but reasonable force is a thing that comes to self defense.