It's really of no surprise that you took what I said out of context, and didn't consider what I said before that post, and what I said within that same post.
You'll have to inform me what's out of context, and what was ignored. I have never forced a point by saying anything that wasn't true.
By the way, both of you guys seem to go an awful long way to defending Turn 10 and Forza. You know, it is due some criticism. Things are wrong. Things are messed up. Things are broken. And it's many things. And it's every single game. And it's nothing like what's wrong with GT5.
Turn 10 is trying in every game to push the game far. Commendable. They need to do some bold things, because they basically made Gran Forizmo. But they go about it the wrong way, and they don't seem to care about the quality of the game they throw onto store shelves.
Many car models are messed up, and I don't just mean they're incorrect. I mean they have issues when you try and paint them or lay decals and vinyls. I mean there are physics flaws which players exploit.
Physics have issues. Besides the flaws which cause leaderboard wipes and patches periodically, and repatches, I will grant the guys credit who insist that there are driving aids which just won't shut off, kind of like I think it's TCS or ABS on GT 1-4 which wouldn't completely shut off. There is something fudgey with the physics. I think you Terronium had a discussion about that in the Forza section about the embedded data for the tires or something too. It's not bad. You can have a blast like any other racing game, but it's a quality that makes it feel less like a PC sim, and makes drifting too easy.
For some reason, T10 messes up coding something awful, somewhere. Like the Auction House in FM2 which if disconnected from wrongly can get you banned. Like the livery editor which has layers shifting, and drove car artists and art collectors nuts. Like the online structure in FW3 - and come on, that's a "W" in the logo, admit it.
Like the messed up file handling, and the really frooked up system of photo sharing. I wasn't exaggerating about the 4 hour ordeal I had gone through which had me throwing in the towel on the game. It was 4 am, and I STILL hadn't finished with my attempt to come up with TWO images to send through the idiotic Turn 10 gauntlet which would mess them up, to get them up on one of my hosting sites to post them here. I made a rather frustrated post on the Forza boards here, and just couldn't bring myself to go through any more of it. A major feature of the game completely broken, to the point I didn't want to touch it again, and didn't. And to get back to it, I'll have to spend up to $200 to get a decent PC capture card! Right now, I don't have the mad money to blow on that, or the inclination.
And one thing I forgot to mention is how T10 made the other cars than yours on track greatly reduced poly models, as you can see in Photo Mode if you snap pics of the other cars in a race. The lack of detail is shocking. And yet, they still only manage 8 cars per race? I'm baffled by this.
Some of these are because T10 farms out work to make their game larger. But most of it is down to two reasons:
- Turn 10 are lackluster coders
- Turn 10 has shoddy quality control
And these are not the reasons for anything anyone wants to gripe about with Gran Turismo.
In GT1, SONY made Polyphony mess with the gravity and speed, making cars faster and floatier. When we found out, we threw a fit and made SONY leave GT2 alone. But other than that, I don't recall any major issues.
In GT2, if your garage was full or close to it, and you used the Machine Test on a car, it could wipe your garage. i think that was the reason, but it definitely was due to using the tester. That was a pretty bad bug, but then the Machine Test was kind of worthless anyhow. There was the "incompletion" bug where you never reached 100% no matter what, but that was really rather insignificant.
Both games had hit and miss engine sounds, and tire sounds that had an amusing rolling loop sample, but you couldn't exactly crow about sounds in console games back then.
GT3 had the problem of a pretty darn small game for $50, after the wealth of cars and tracks in GT2. Some engine sounds were stellar, but was still a mixed bag. Race Mod was dropped, as were used cars. Other than that, no real issues that I recall.
In all three titles, front wheel drive cars handled too much like rear wheel drive, and mid-engine cars handled too much like front engine cars.
GT4: once again, some engine sounds were lame. Low speed physics took a bit of a hit, such as getting your car to spin out being amazingly hard. Race Mod was still absent. GT4 Online had to be scrapped, mostly because of the expense of setting up the network, and the incompatibility of millions of PS2s to the broadband adaptor. It would have flopped badly.
With all four games, bot A.I. was lackluster and they tended to ignore you. There were no skidmarks, reverse lights or online.
With Prologue, online play was very basic. With the first online build (Japanese import), disconnecting from a server or getting dropped could lock up the game, requiring a reboot. Physics were a good few steps towards PC sims but not quite. Some engine sounds were still lackluster. No skidmarks or reverse lights. Bot A.I. was sometimes annoying.
GT5: because of Tourist Trophy (Polyphony decision) and especially GT PSP (SONY decision), GT5 development took a critical hit. GT PSP alone could mean as much as a two year hole in GT5 development. Content production was limited, primarily the high definition high poly count models now referred to as Premium Cars. Either because Polyphony underestimated the workload requirements, or because SONY would only allow so much budget increase, only a few dozen employees were added to the team, perhaps 70 at the most. The car list was increased with lower polygon Standard Cars, and this might extend to tracks as well, ported from previous games in higher definition but not to the level of the new environments, such as Rome and Madrid. Other shortcomings will be known when the game is further unveiled and/or shipped.
Frankly, this reveals a completely different philosophy between Dan Greenawalt and Turn 10, and Kazunori Yamauchi and Polyphony Digital. You can say that there's no difference, or any meaningful difference, but I think you'd be kidding yourself.
It makes you look like an idiot to be quite honest.
and don't say that Forza3 was made in 2years. They took lots,all things from their previous games and learned from it. Just like GT.
