Is PCARS as Good as GT6?

[MowTin]

I've given up on the GT series. There development cycle is screwed up. They take too long to get new games out. Forza just keeps moving forward while GT stands still.

By the time GT7 comes out for the PS4 PCars 2 will be out and Forza 6 for XONE.

pCars saved me from having to buy an XBOX One and a new wheel. There were many times when I had those items in my shopping cart and almost bought them. It's $800 for just one game.

I still think GT has the best game with license tests and car and racing variety.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Sadly yes in some ways it was.

To me, it was in every way, except amount of content.

 

[rocafella1978]

I think most forget the size, $$$ power, strength and force behind PD, is actually XX times more than SMS/ WMD/ Bandai Namco. the finances, budget, equipment, network of companies and industry behind PD is light years ahead of PCars (network/ staff) but yet in my opinion PCars has overall proven that for their focus group did absolutely great, wonderful and spot on! (yes there are bugs and etc., being taken care of next few weeks months or whatever). Personally, I think PCars has shown that it has done way more than GT and Forza geneally speaking, of course different target groups involved for what all 3x companies are trying to lay the games out for, BUT all considered and SMS being a little tiny grain compared to GT and Forza...hats off to SMS!!! well done guys and keep pushing! stay calm and keep developing )))

 

[TT92]

As idiotic as this sounds, it is both better and worse than GT at the momment.

That is not "idiotic" at all. This is exactly how I feel and why I started this discussion. Pcars is just sooooooooo good BUT at the same time sooooooooo bad I found myself wondering if I preferred GT6 again. I wanted to see if others felt the way I do. At least there is one ;-)

Personally, I am delaying my final judgement until the first patch is released (for PS4).

 

[wowbaggerBR]

That is not "idiotic" at all. This is exactly how I feel and why I started this discussion. Pcars is just sooooooooo good BUT at the same time sooooooooo bad I found myself wondering if I preferred GT6 again. I wanted to see if others felt the way I do. At least there is one ;-)

Personally, I am delaying my final judgement until the first patch is released (for PS4).

I already deleted the game from my hard disk. I'm very frustrated by the bugs and shortcomings, but I never thought on going back to GT because Gran Turismo is a collecting car game. It's cool, you learn a lot of cars and such, but I'm a racer.

For now, I'm going to sit back and wait the game get finished. Then, I'll come back to pCARS.

As for GT7, man, I have made myself a promisse: I won't get hyped again.

 

[TT92]

I think most forget the size, $$$ power, strength and force behind PD, is actually XX times more than SMS/ WMD/ Bandai Namco. the finances, budget, equipment, network of companies and industry behind PD is light years ahead of PCars (network/ staff) but yet in my opinion PCars has overall proven that for their focus group did absolutely great, wonderful and spot on! (yes there are bugs and etc., being taken care of next few weeks months or whatever). Personally, I think PCars has shown that it has done way more than GT and Forza geneally speaking, of course different target groups involved for what all 3x companies are trying to lay the games out for, BUT all considered and SMS being a little tiny grain compared to GT and Forza...hats off to SMS!!! well done guys and keep pushing! stay calm and keep developing )))

Is this an opportune moment to point out that GT6 is still not finished 18months after release :-( That GT6 is really GT5.5 (That's GT5 with added DLC)

And this really needs a comment "I think most forget the size, $$$ power, strength and force behind PD..." which equals arrogance :-( Let's not forget the "Ask Kaz" forum that was set up here for interaction and how that went. Also, this is why loyal GT fans were treated with a half assed, half finished, overly buggy game at release on a *superseded platform" no less!!!

It is for this very reason that I was (am?) hoping PCARS would (will?) be a raging success. So please, anyone from SMS reading, this listen to the feedback, fix the bugs and tweak the AI and online a bit (well a lot actually) and you will have a World beater.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

Is this an opportune moment to point out that GT6 is still not finished 18months after release :-( That GT6 is really GT5.5 (That's GT5 with added DLC)

And this really needs a comment "I think most forget the size, $$$ power, strength and force behind PD..." which equals arrogance :-( Let's not forget the "Ask Kaz" forum that was set up here for interaction and how that went. Also, this is why loyal GT fans were treated with a half assed, half finished, overly buggy game at release on a *superseded platform" no less!!!

It is for this very reason that I was (am?) hoping PCARS would (will?) be a raging success. So please, anyone from SMS reading, this listen to the feedback, fix the bugs and tweak the AI and online a bit (well a lot actually) and you will have a World beater.

Really hope they listen. The game has a huge potential, the foundations are good. The core, the driving bit, is awesome.

 

[TT92]

We're all fully aware of that. Many of us are fully aware of the GT series refusing to depart from the ways of old on issues that have absolutely nothing to do with the hardware but everything to do with Polyphony's design/game choices.

We're not comparing polygon counts, cars on track, or graphical fidelity.

Hear! Hear! Exactly why I started this discussion. Also, don't forget PD decided to release GT6 on a superseded console!

 

[jimipitbull]

It seems like many GT fans are so bored of GT6 now, they're appearing on the pCARS forum more frequent as members here type. Happens on the Forza board as well, it's natural since I was one of those 'folk' who'll always go on said board and always try to have a go on a title in order to make my title (I used to defend) look good despite its flaws. This is what happens when a developer ignores his or her fans for too long, so some will just start going to other boards and type deluded beliefs that said game is better than the other one, especially if that game becomes stale.

I don't know how to properly explain it, but it happens when a person fears at admitting another game is better than theirs.

Been there, done that. Sorry pCARS fans, it'll be for awhile until the next GT game comes out. But then that one will bore some of them and we're back to square one again. Outside this is worse though.

Some people think racing games are a team sport?

 

[FoRiZon]

Nobody seems to comparing FM5 to PCars.

Guess the burning fuel cannot be doused after all.

 

[Brend]

Forza Motorsport 6 is quite literally a title for a game we have seen nothing of right now. You can't really make any comparisons or discussions.

 

[DRJULESSTEELE]

PD can't keep using the hardware excuse since some of their problems aren't from the PS3's limitations. They're bad game design problems.

Gran Turismo is SONY's biggest game, money comes first just like every other business. No major game company isn't going to release a triple A title with a smaller install base. GT5 alone almost outsold the entire forza franchise put that into perspective.

 

[FoRiZon]

Forza Motorsport 6 is quite literally a title for a game we have seen nothing of right now. You can't really make any comparisons or discussions.

Well here we are, comparing GT6 to PCars.

Oh wait, FM5. Ive too much looking at the news.

 

[Ameer67]

Gran Turismo is SONY's biggest game, money comes first just like every other business. No major game company isn't going to release a triple A title with a smaller install base. GT5 alone almost outsold the entire forza franchise put that into perspective.

What do sales have to do with hardware and game design?

 

[OooAhh Cantona]

OP's question is rather straightforward. My answer: yes, Pcars is as good as GT6. It is now my go-to racing game on console. I haven't touched GT6 since Pcars release. Fix the bugs and Pcars can enter "better than..." territory.

 

[DRJULESSTEELE]

What do sales have to do with hardware and game design?

That's exactly why GT6 was released on the PS3 and not PS4. PS3 user install base at that time was 80mil+ the PS4 was 4mil. It all comes down to dollars and cents.

 

[Ameer67]

That's exactly why GT6 was released on the PS3 and not PS4. PS3 user install base at that time was 80mil+ the PS4 was 4mil. It all comes down to dollars and cents.

I'll try to make this as simple as possible when I talk about "bad game design":

PD: "We've been working on our 2D grass for a while now. 3 years actually. The only drawback is that it uses 60% of the PS3's RAM."
GTP: "What about the AI? Any improvements?"
PD: "Like I said before, the grass took 3 years to complete, so that took most of our time. To add to that, the 60% of RAM dedicated to the grass took a big chunk out of our ability to do things like improve the AI and such."

This is not an actual argument or anything, I know. What I'm trying to show you here is that under bad management, your plan can go from best game in the genre to absolute rubbish.

 

[Mubble]

Why not make this decision in a year's time?GT6 has had months and years of updates, dlc and improvements over the past 2 or 3 years. Projects Cars had been out for a fortnight and is v1.0.

Wait until Project Cars is a year or two down the line and then compare when the comparison is fairer.

However, IMO, Project Cars v1.0 > GT6 v1.0

 

[jimipitbull]

I'll try to make this as simple as possible when I talk about "bad game design":

PD: "We've been working on our 2D grass for a while now. 3 years actually. The only drawback is that it uses 60% of the PS3's RAM."
GTP: "What about the AI? Any improvements?"
PD: "Like I said before, the grass took 3 years to complete, so that took most of our time. To add to that, the 60% of RAM dedicated to the grass took a big chunk out of our ability to do things like improve the AI and such."

This is not an actual argument or anything, I know. What I'm trying to show you here is that under bad management, your plan can go from best game in the genre to absolute rubbish.

Bad analogy. All it really shows is that you think the AI programmers are the same people that model grass.

 

[Ameer67]

Bad analogy. All it really shows is that you think the AI programmers are the same people that model grass.

My situation I posted above is not literal.

 

[Imari]

To me, it was in every way, except amount of content.

I agree completely. Size aside, it's the best designed game in the GT series.

 

[DRJULESSTEELE]

My situation I posted above is not literal.

The PS3 architecture is far more complex than the PS4, it's much harder to design games for hence why SONY went forward with a X86 pc architecture but no one is even going to mention the real nits and bits. The PS4 will dawn the same magic that the PS1/PS2 captured with GT. The PS3 specs compared to the PS4 are downright pathetic. Hardware limtations create issues with computation. Project Cars should be compared against Forza 5 on a current gen system. GT6 being on last gen and still being compared to current gen games should be an indicator how strong GT really is.

 

[jimipitbull]

My situation I posted above is not literal.

The 'simple as possible' disclaimer sets the tone for literal context.

 

[Johnnypenso]

The 'simple as possible' disclaimer sets the tone for literal context.

Actually no, "this is not an actual argument", sets the context indicating it's not literal, as in "not actual".

 

[Ameer67]

The PS3 architecture is far more complex than the PS4, it's much harder to design games for hence why SONY went forward with a X86 pc architecture but no one is even going to mention the real nits and bits. The PS4 will dawn the same magic that the PS1/PS2 captured with GT. The PS3 specs compared to the PS4 are downright pathetic.

If PD can get GT back to its glory days on the PS4 then that would be great, no doubt. My point still stands though: hardware limitations are not an excuse all the time. It's PD's choice on how they optimize their 8 year old hardware. They can have too much of feature X (let's say graphics) and too little of feature Y (AI). Nobody is forcing PD to make their game look pretty other than PD themselves. Vice versa for the AI. If the graphics are beautiful but the AI can't even bother to race you, it's not the hardware's fault. It all comes down to resource optimization/management.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

GT apologists are jumping on this subforum indeed.

Is there something wrong, I wonder?

 

[gtracedriver1]

It seems like many GT fans are so bored of GT6 now, they're appearing on the pCARS forum more frequent as members here type. Happens on the Forza board as well, it's natural since I was one of those 'folk' who'll always go on said board and always try to have a go on a title in order to make my title (I used to defend) look good despite its flaws. This is what happens when a developer ignores his or her fans for too long, so some will just start going to other boards and type deluded beliefs that said game is better than the other one, especially if that game becomes stale.

I don't know how to properly explain it, but it happens when a person fears at admitting another game is better than theirs.

Been there, done that. Sorry pCARS fans, it'll be for awhile until the next GT game comes out. But then that one will bore some of them and we're back to square one again. Outside this is worse though.

There are not many racing games or any sort of racing sim on PS4. That is the main reason. Pcars is also little different and people who like driving games can be excited about it. Pcars has nice track list and variable condition to race with many cars.

I am sure when GT7 gets released on PS4 it is going to be huge. Will you then say people dumped Pcars or Forza for GT7

 

[jimipitbull]

Actually no, "this is not an actual argument", sets the context indicating it's not literal, as in "not actual".

"this is not an argument, or anything. " does not set context for the previous paragraph and has no bearing on literal application, or anything.

 

[Tornado]

The PS3 architecture is far more complex than the PS4, it's much harder to design games for hence why SONY went forward with a X86 pc architecture but no one is even going to mention the real nits and bits. The PS4 will dawn the same magic that the PS1/PS2 captured with GT. The PS3 specs compared to the PS4 are downright pathetic. Hardware limtations create issues with computation. Project Cars should be compared against Forza 5 on a current gen system. GT6 being on last gen and still being compared to current gen games should be an indicator how strong GT really is.

I have to imagine if you knew what any of the things in that chart meant, you wouldn't have posted it. It doesn't even get the size of Xbox game DVDs correct.

 

[Ameer67]

"this is not an argument, or anything. " does not set context for the previous paragraph and has no bearing on literal application, or anything.

You see this? This is used only for purposes of giving a metaphorical example. That's it. That's why I'm saying "this is not an actual argument or anything".

PD: "We've been working on our 2D grass for a while now. 3 years actually. The only drawback is that it uses 60% of the PS3's RAM."
GTP: "What about the AI? Any improvements?"
PD: "Like I said before, the grass took 3 years to complete, so that took most of our time. To add to that, the 60% of RAM dedicated to the grass took a big chunk out of our ability to do things like improve the AI and such."