Legendary cars dealer refresh

[Famine]

Assuming that you either knew the Stealths were coming and had saved money, or that you played the game without ever backing out of events and advancing the calendar more than an optimized route.

I'm... not sure what that has to do with the fact they came 694 days in, not "early".

And how many people were forced to spend real money for 10mil credit cars? None. 10 mil, 20 mil, it makes no difference to the point that the existence of microtransactions does not force someone to use them just to get what they want.

It makes a bit of a difference when you literally can't spend real money for a thing compared to when you can - if only because it's quite hard to force, coerce, cajole, or even tempt someone to buy something that is not available to buy.


In both cases I don't really care about whatever your point was, just that you were using incorrect information about older GT games in order to advance it.

GT4's "Stealth" cars (the only ones in seven figures, if I recall correctly) didn't come at the start of the game but so far into it - days 694-700 of every 700-day cycle - that people could conceivably have completed 90% (minimum game time was 774 days) of the game. That means that the concept that "no one could afford" them at the point at which they were shown is fundamentally flawed - and it is in fact a great example of how GT7, with its high-value, early game, limited-time offer cars differs from earlier titles.

Nobody could be forced to or choose to spend real-world money on GT Sport's 20,000,000cr cars because they were simply not available to buy for real-world money. In fact nobody could spend real-world money on any cars - or any other content - in GT Sport until 30th July 2018 (which is when cars up to and including 2,000,000cr were made available), more than eight months into the game's life.

Again, this is a great example of how GT7, with its immediate, at-launch, access to microtransactions differs from earlier titles; GT6, which also launched with microtransactions, would have been a better example here, although as it featured myriad ways to earn a boatload of cash at up to 4.5-times the rate of GT7... maybe not.

 

[Wheatybic]

imagine spending all your free time since the update defending polyphony when the pre nerf cash per hour had zero affect on you lmao this guy is pathetic, why are you so bent on people wanting to buy expensive cars early in the game? lmaoooooooooo

 

[BossBattle]

And how many people were forced to spend real money for 10mil credit cars? None. 10 mil, 20 mil, it makes no difference to the point that the existence of microtransactions does not force someone to use them just to get what they want.


No, sorry, you're not entitled to that. A game with a progression system doesn't have to hand you anything in the time scale that you demand. Guess what, the cars weren't free in previous GT games either, you had to earn credits for them too. Having that earning be easier or harder does not negate that you still had to do the exact same thing, and could not inherently gain easy access to every car you wanted.

You can inherently gain easy access to every car you want though. You just need to pay for them. You can ignore this point as often as you want, but the fact that you can easily purchase every car currently available by purchasing credits completely invalidates your argument.

Also, the trite “oh you don’t have to purchase microtransactions” argument needs to die along with the “everyone wants to have everything in two weeks” nonsense.

There are tons of articles and pieces written on the predatory nature of microtransactions. Not everyone who buys microtransactions is a gambling addict, but not everyone who buys a bottle of wine is an alcoholic either. The fact of the matter is that microtransactions contribute to bad game design at best and serious societal issues at worst.

Edit:

I don’t care how long microtransactions have been in video games, but maybe this is a chance for us to draw a line where this should stop, similar to what happened with Battlefront 2.

Sorry for the late edit. The site was wigging out on me.

 

[McLaren]

You can inherently gain easy access to every car you want though. You just need to pay for them. You can ignore this point as often as you want, but the fact that you can easily purchase every car currently available by purchasing credits completely invalidates your argument.

Also, the trite “oh you don’t have to purchase microtransactions” argument needs to die along with the “everyone wants to have everything in two weeks” nonsense.

You know, I too have been seeing this a lot. But, I caught a Reddit post this morning that claims to be a screenshot of the game's description on the PSN store. The thread it was in was highlighting a sentence stating the following:

With the reintroduction of the legendary GT Simulation Mode, buy, tune, race and sell your way through a rewarding solo campaign as you unlock new cars and challenges

However, some other folks caught this:

With over 420 cars available at Brand Central and the Used Car Dealership from day one, Gran Turismo 7 recreates the look and feel of classic motors and bleeding-edge supercars alike in unparalleled detail.

Gran Turismo 7 - Exclusive PS5 & PS4 Games | PlayStation

Gran Turismo™ 7 brings you the best features from the history of the franchise. Find your line.

www.playstation.com

Now, I get the counter-point can mean to reflect the game has over 420 cars in it before DLC/updates, but the way this is worded still comes across off, based on how the game actually runs. Unless I missed something, the McLaren F1 that everyone is talking about didn't technically become available to anyone til' just now. I would assume there are other cars in the Used Car Dealer or Hagerty that still haven't come across the table yet.

Take it for what you want. That first quote however, is demonstrably false. What can you actually sell in this game?

 

[BossBattle]

You know, I too have been seeing this a lot. But, I caught a Reddit post this morning that claims to be a screenshot of the game's description on the PSN store. The thread it was in was highlighting a sentence stating the following:

However, some other folks caught this:

Gran Turismo 7 - Exclusive PS5 & PS4 Games | PlayStation

Gran Turismo™ 7 brings you the best features from the history of the franchise. Find your line.

www.playstation.com

Now, I get the counter-point can mean to reflect the game has over 420 cars in it before DLC/updates, but the way this is worded still comes across off, based on how the game actually runs. Unless I missed something, the McLaren F1 that everyone is talking about didn't technically become available to anyone til' just now. I would assume there are other cars in the Used Car Dealer or Hagerty that still haven't come across the table yet.

Take it for what you want. That first quote however, is demonstrably false. What can you actually sell in this game?

Oof, now that’s rough. Verified it on my end too:

 

[The359]

It makes a bit of a difference when you literally can't spend real money for a thing compared to when you can - if only because it's quite hard to force, coerce, cajole, or even tempt someone to buy something that is not available to buy.


In both cases I don't really care about whatever your point was, just that you were using incorrect information about older GT games in order to advance it.

GT4's "Stealth" cars (the only ones in seven figures, if I recall correctly) didn't come at the start of the game but so far into it - days 694-700 of every 700-day cycle - that people could conceivably have completed 90% (minimum game time was 774 days) of the game. That means that the concept that "no one could afford" them at the point at which they were shown is fundamentally flawed - and it is in fact a great example of how GT7, with its high-value, early game, limited-time offer cars differs from earlier titles.

Nobody could be forced to or choose to spend real-world money on GT Sport's 20,000,000cr cars because they were simply not available to buy for real-world money. In fact nobody could spend real-world money on any cars - or any other content - in GT Sport until 30th July 2018 (which is when cars up to and including 2,000,000cr were made available), more than eight months into the game's life.

Again, this is a great example of how GT7, with its immediate, at-launch, access to microtransactions differs from earlier titles; GT6, which also launched with microtransactions, would have been a better example here, although as it featured myriad ways to earn a boatload of cash at up to 4.5-times the rate of GT7... maybe not.

As you said, cars up to 10 million dollars were eventually able to be bought, none of which were necessary to "complete" the game. And certainly buying other cars up to 10 million would help someone save for 20 million cars. The point is that the existence of these microtransactions did not force anyone to buy them.

Your assumption that people would be able to afford Stealths (or any other expensive car) presumes that people hadn't spent any of the rest of their time buying and tuning other cars. Not only that but the way the day system worked, if you were in the middle of a multi-race championship you ran the risk of missing out on days 694-700, meaning you had to run through the cycle again, assuming you even knew what the cycle was (the game itself did not explain this). So how is rotating the Legends cars any different from rotating the Used Car Dealer based on in-game selection? We don't know the in-game rotation at launch or how long it will last, we don't know the prices upfront to be able to save up or grind for exactly what we need, and both can force you to miss an opportunity and have to wait, either by cheesing the system or physically waiting a period of time.

The fact that this is the third game now with microtransactions, none of which have been necessary to play or beat the game, shows exactly the misinterpretation of the intent of the microtransactions in the game.

imagine spending all your free time since the update defending polyphony when the pre nerf cash per hour had zero affect on you lmao this guy is pathetic, why are you so bent on people wanting to buy expensive cars early in the game? lmaoooooooooo

Imagine having a discussion forum where people can't discuss things.

You can inherently gain easy access to every car you want though. You just need to pay for them. You can ignore this point as often as you want, but the fact that you can easily purchase every car currently available by purchasing credits completely invalidates your argument.

Also, the trite “oh you don’t have to purchase microtransactions” argument needs to die along with the “everyone wants to have everything in two weeks” nonsense.

There are tons of articles and pieces written on the predatory nature of microtransactions. Not everyone who buys microtransactions is a gambling addict, but not everyone who buys a bottle of wine is an alcoholic either. The fact of the matter is that microtransactions contribute to bad game design at best and serious societal issues at worst.

Edit:

I don’t care how long microtransactions have been in video games, but maybe this is a chance for us to draw a line where this should stop, similar to what happened with Battlefront 2.

Sorry for the late edit. The site was wigging out on me.

How does having the ability to be lazy and just cheese your way to a car collection negate my argument? Imagine what you people would be complaining about if the game not only had no microtransactions, but also the same economy of scale. What would your complaint be then? Because that's pretty much the way GT Sport started out. I'm discussing the economy of the game and the limited release schedules for certain cars. If "You don't need to purchase microtransactions to enjoy the game" is an inconvenience for you, then maybe you need to reevaluate your argument.

I'm sorry but, "microtransactions contributed to bad game design" is an assumption on your part, you are mistaking it for a statement of fact. If people think is a predatory game design, I have news for some of you.

 

[Famine]

Your assumption that

Nope.

I'm only saying one thing in both cases: it's wrong to say "why show the Stealths early in the Used Car Dealer that no one could afford", when they appeared so far into the game you could have 90% completion and the supposition that "no one could afford" them (with access to high-value races) at that point is not sound; and it's wrong to suggest that people could buy the 20m credit cars in GT Sport for real money when they couldn't.

Whatever your point is, I'm sure it can stand up without having to use two pieces of incorrect information.

 

[The359]

Nope.

I'm only saying one thing in both cases: it's wrong to say "why show the Stealths early in the Used Car Dealer that no one could afford", when they appeared so far into the game you could have 90% completion and the supposition that "no one could afford" them (with access to high-value races) at that point is not sound, and it's wrong to suggest that people could buy the 20m credit cars in GT Sport for real money when they couldn't.

Whatever your point is, I'm sure it can stand up without having to use two pieces of incorrect information.

Running races forwards the days and means that you have limited time (races) to get enough credits to buy what you want. Which, again, is very similar to the situation we have now. Again, unless you specifically knew they were coming, this was not available information in the game.

And even if you ignore the Stealths since this is clearly a GT4 v GT5 difference, there were many JGTC and race cars available in the GT5 UCD days from the start of the game that you would likely have never been able to conceivably afford it. Toyota 7 appeared on Day 52 worth 4 Million credits. Subaru Impreza Super Touring Car for half a million on Day 8. '99 Pennzoil GT-R for 733k Credits on Day 11. Who could afford those then?

 

[Famine]

Running races forwards the days and means that you have limited time (races) to get enough credits to buy what you want. Which, again, is very similar to the situation we have now. Again, unless you specifically knew they were coming, this was not available information in the game.

Yep. But again, not really caring here. Only pointing out that the only seven-figure cars in the GT4 UCD, the "Stealths", didn't appear "early" in the game, which is what you claimed.

Again, I'm sure that, whatever the point you were making was, you can make it without relying on information that isn't true.

And even if you ignore the Stealths since this is clearly a GT4 v GT5 difference, there were many JGTC and race cars available in the GT5 UCD days from the start of the game that you would likely have never been able to conceivably afford it. Toyota 7 appeared on Day 52 worth 4 Million credits. Subaru Impreza Super Touring Car for half a million on Day 8. '99 Pennzoil GT-R for 733k Credits on Day 11. Who could afford those then?

Yeeeeeah, that one's not true either. Although it could also be true, it is not necessarily true.

Everyone - or at least almost everyone - had a different GT5 UCD. As far as we could ascertain, players started on the UCD at a point in time determined by a combination of their console ID and GT user ID, clustered around one of two points in the UCD cycle separated by a good chunk of time (I don't recall how much; it was at least hundreds of days), and progressed along it at the rate of six new cars a day on a pre-determined list of 4.6 billion days. I recall we did find a couple of players overlapping by half a day on their start, but nobody with identical start points.

That could mean you had a Subaru Impreza Super Touring Car for 500,000cr on Day 8 as you say... or you might not see it at all for a thousand game days. I know one of my accounts had the Formula GT really early on, while another never saw the car, ever - which was a real pisser as it was a vehicle required to complete the game.

GT5 also had the car level system, so even if you could afford it, unless you were at least the right level to drive it (23 or 24, I recall, for the F1 cars and the FGT) you still couldn't buy it.

This was remedied with the Online Car Dealership, which kept such cars in stock far more regularly, and level gift tickets which contained vehicles of the appropriate rank and could be gifted to other players so they could pull a Lv23/24 car without being the right level to buy one.

GT5 was a ****ing mess.

 

[SeaNorris]

Nice to see another car in the Legendary Dealer today that can be obtained with a little bit of a grind...

 

[TetsuKobura]

Porsche 917K is 18,000,000. Good luck no lifing the game

 

[JoaoSilva]

Porsche 917 K for 18 million credits LOL

EDIT: Another LOL

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

I would grind for the 917K but I'm pretty sure the keys are already in my unopened 1 star daily workout ticket. 🙏

 

[awildo]

OMFG this ****ing KAZ, you can sense he really needs money...
better sell himself to escort services if he wants that much money.

 

[GTjedi99]

I mean we all knew the most expensive cars were going to show up right after that update so I guess we shouldn't be too surprised

 

[Cosbuster]

Kaz is just trolling at this point.

 

[icenl]

Has there been any statement from hagerty how they are calculating those prices? they are probably just paying for the advertising space but the prices are supposedly based on there numbers, but it seems they just use the dollar price and replace $ with credits: https://www.hagerty.com/media/car-profiles/1970-porsche-917k-rm-le-mans-monterey-2021/

 

[ebadevil]

And how many people were forced to spend real money for 10mil credit cars? None. 10 mil, 20 mil, it makes no difference to the point that the existence of microtransactions does not force someone to use them just to get what they want.

So I guess I'm curious where your draw the line about what we're "entitled" to? I paid $90 for the game itself and I will have to pay a monthly fee for as long as I want to play it. Am I entitled to anything? Do I get ANYTHING for my money? It surely seems like what you're saying is we're not entitled to anything at all. So then what exactly did I pay $90 + $5/mo for? Really not asking for a handout, but just trying to understand what in your mind $90 buys you now... if you're saying I'm not entitled to anything, it would stand to reason that PD isn't entitled to my money either.

 

[McLaren]

Has there been any statement from hagerty how they are calculating those prices? they are probably just paying for the advertising space but the prices are supposedly based on there numbers, but it seems they just use the dollar price and replace $ with credits: https://www.hagerty.com/media/car-profiles/1970-porsche-917k-rm-le-mans-monterey-2021/

Yes, they calculate the prices based on real world values. The $16-18.5m estimation comes from RM Sotheby's predicted outcome, which is influenced by the reserve price which was likely the $16m on the low-end. Those values are also predicted based up on the last 917k that sold for $14m four years ago. The car did not meet $16-18.5m threshold, but it did high bid at $15m none-the-less.

For the most part from what I've witnessed, the Hagerty pricing in the game is actually pretty conservative for what a few cars are actually valued at.

 

[Terronium-12]

Two cars you literally cannot purchase at the same time without buying credits with real money. LOL.

I'll own neither and I'm in no rush to change that. I'll play other games (cough Forza cough) that respects my time and allows me to actually own the cars I love without needing to dedicate work hours to grinding mundane races with pitiful payouts.

I'm real close to uninstalling the game at this point. What reason is there to keep playing? It's utter foolishness.

 

[Grimm6Jack]

Porsche 917k for 18 million + McLaren F1 for 18.5 million.

Two absolute fan favourite cars appearing on the 3-4 day time limited dealership at the same time, only for a mere 36.5 million credits.

GG

 

[lxmmy]

No, sorry, you're not entitled to that. A game with a progression system doesn't have to hand you anything in the time scale that you demand. Guess what, the cars weren't free in previous GT games either, you had to earn credits for them too. Having that earning be easier or harder does not negate that you still had to do the exact same thing, and could not inherently gain easy access to every car you wanted.

You're treading on thin territory here, if you believe one who pays for the game and is 'not entitled' to a system or source whom can play and gain a good return of in game credits or funds for the time spent in order to gain access to an in game item no matter what the car is because it has no value outside the game then this is obviously a classic tactic paving the way inevitably users to take the microtransaction route.... as you know people have occupations and don't have the willingness to play over weeks on end for just one car.

Yes, cars weren't free in previous titles but the current title has inflated the prices of many cars to coincide with their real life pricing should be a good reason to PD to implement a greater progression system with substantial pay-outs and bonuses but instead do the unnecessary slashing of pay-outs of events without implementing other sources of ways to earn credits so they dwarf the economy is pathetic.

And as I write this. Another 18,000,000 car has been added. 917K '70....

 

[ebadevil]

Porsche 917k for 18 million + McLaren F1 for 18.5 million.

Two absolute fan favourite cars appearing on the 3-4 day time limited dealership at the same time, only for a mere 36.5 million credits.

GG

For the low price of $400 with tax you can own both

Seriously, for a few more $$, you can buy a racing wheel and a cockpit.

Or honestly for not much more, you can actually buy a real car that you could drive places in real life

 

[Wheatybic]

at the end of the day kaz said we will add content with better payouts to make the grind easier but that is just bad game design, I never thought I'd say gt7 was rushed given the timeframe but that pretty much solidifies it. having content unobtainable by 99% of the player base until the game actually becomes a game (from added events etc) is hilarious

 

[lxmmy]

having content unobtainable by 99% of the player base until the game actually becomes a game (from added events etc) is hilarious

In some other aspects, they call that good business decision making. Enticing the user to click on Top-up on Playstation Store

Not like Kaz in the statement 3 days ago... "In GT7 I would like to have users enjoy lots of cars and races even without microtransactions."... so now how do we obtain the 917K Kaz?

 

[HyperSpeeder]

The 250 GTO's price actually exceeds 20 million. I wonder if the car will only be available by paying real money.

Honestly, even for people who grind, it's impossible to get these cars unless you camp Fisherman's for 5 hours a day, for 5 days. Pre-patch it was easier, but still difficult.

Two cars you literally cannot purchase at the same time without buying credits with real money. LOL.

I'll own neither and I'm in no rush to change that. I'll play other games (cough Forza cough) that respects my time and allows me to actually own the cars I love without needing to dedicate work hours to grinding mundane races with pitiful payouts.

I'm real close to uninstalling the game at this point. What reason is there to keep playing? It's utter foolishness.

All the things you now see in Gran Turismo came straight from the "other game that respects your time and allows you to actually own the cars I love without needing to dedicate work hours to grinding mundane races with pitiful payouts".

How much is an AE86 in Forza again? That is, if you can find one being auctioned. Please remind me. And, even in the event it does appear in a seasonal, it still requires doing mundane chores anyway. This is a car GT7 gives you for free and you can buy dozens of them in the UCD right now.

Even if there were no MTX, the system would still suck. As it does in Forza.

 

[Gerarghini]

at the end of the day kaz said we will add content with better payouts to make the grind easier but that is just bad game design, I never thought I'd say gt7 was rushed given the timeframe but that pretty much solidifies it. having content unobtainable by 99% of the player base until the game actually becomes a game (from added events etc) is hilarious

What's funny is that they delayed the game and I'm just wondering what for? The hell have PD been doing for the past 9 years if we're to believe this was made in conjunction with Sport, especially when Kaz was on record saying that GT Sport was not a traditional GT and a proper sequel to 6 was in the works?

Like I'd believe it was rushed if they weren't lolligagging for the past 9 years getting in bed with Hagerty and saying it adds value to the game because its, "realistic."

 

[McLaren]

The 250 GTO's price actually exceeds 20 million. I wonder if the car will only be available by paying real money.

It'll be capped at 20 million credits at best. For as much I as continually wonder what PD is thinking with recent decisions, I don't believe they would put a car in the game that can't be purchased without buying additional MXTs on top of your own credits.

The backlash would be absolutely monumental at such a decision.

 

[NotThePrez]

Porsche 917K is 18,000,000. Good luck no lifing the game

Again,...

Yes, I am enjoying this wayyyyy more than I probably should, because it's majorly depressing otherwise.

As @Terronium-12 has stated, there are now 2 time-limited cars that are literally impossible to buy at the same time without dipping into microtransactions. And if for whatever reason you're at the max cap of 20M "free" credits (which is such a diabolically stupid thing to have), you would need to spend an additional $200 to have enough credits for the F1 and 917. Or, grind out 40+ hours of Fishermans Ranch in a 5-day period.

Again, PD and Sony have lost their goddamn minds. Only way this could be worse (and honestly funnier) is if the next car is actually a 20M credit car.

 

[Samus]

It'll be capped at 20 million credits at best. For as much I as continually wonder what PD is thinking with recent decisions, I don't believe they would put a car in the game that can't be purchased without buying additional MXTs on top of your own credits.

The backlash would be absolutely monumental at such a decision.

Maybe they'll introduce instalment payments. Put 20M down to reserve the car, earn another 20M within 7 days for the second instalment and it's all yours!