Live Stream: FIA Gran Turismo Championships New York World Tour

[Krypton78]

Maybe its only my impression, but somehow I can't get warm with Igor. How he gives himself, everything he says, its all in a contrast to the other GT players. Even they are all supertalents they are natural in their behaviour, but Igor, he is proffessional in everything he does. I don't get a feeling of honesty from him, everything feels artificial. And under pressure its like his true cold blood winning for every costs nature comes through.

Maybe thats how you survive in the brutal real Motorsport-world, I don't know. But its surely against the spirit of Gran Turismo, lived by many of this Forum members like @Tidgney , @TRL LIGHTNING and so on.

 

[Sander 001]

Don't know if some of you are ignoring this or how many times this needs repeating but

Igor did not win by that move. Hizal needed to fuel save and would have been outpaced. Ironically, Hizal letting go, resulted in Igor winning even after a penalty.

So Froga disgraced himself just for the thrill of it, he didn’t even need to drive dirty to win.

 

[kilesa4568]

They did it last time in Monza. There's no excuse to ruin someone's race on T1. Only one driver did that out of the 14, so it wasn't shenanigans at all. It was a clean start except for Igor pushing Nico.

Sorry for the late reply.

Monza T1 is totally different kettle of fish to T1 of Spa. Poker term but at least Nico had 'outs' from that one.

It's not like he could turn right into space available but you're right though. He didn't leave the small amount of room that he had at T1.

I know you're one of the quicker drivers but would you really punish him for that on Spa? That's harsh....

I really don't understand why they're not showing tire's waste and gasoline consumption. Those datas are of major importance to understand a race.

You don't see the consumption (LIGHTNING slightly less fuel than Fraga) but it's shown a few pages ago in the thread. (here) A couple of % difference at max. There was a significant lift in the the run up to the main overtaking place at Spa with a driver behind having to react to it. Gamesmanship at it its worst or best?

I would agree with you if I had overtaken him round the outside. But if I was able to stay ahead of him where he tried to have my slipstream I don't know but probably better as I wouldn't have pushed at that lap unlike where I was still behind of him. But that's just a if if situation

Man to man. Did you back off after Fraga used gamesmanship for the 2nd time to keep you from passing him? (A confidential PM if you like.)

Talent and a fantastic race craft (said the subscriber) like yours makes me a huge fan and if you say you backed off strictly to save fuel, I'll believe you, but I just can't get over your reaction going over Radillon. A proper WTF? moment and you even looked over at Fraga about it before dropping back. It shouldn't be bugging me but it really does.

Went out for a few beers this hot and sunny Bank Holiday and all I thought about was, "he didn't back off...did he?" I'm sure my family were good company but I was so distracted, I never noticed.

 

[zzz_pt]

know you're one of the quicker drivers but would you really punish him for that on Spa? That's harsh....

Yes, I'd happily give 1sec penalty for ruining another driver's race on T1 by not leaving a car's width on the outside.

But I'm one of those who thought Max should have been penalized by pushing LeClerc off on T3 around RBRing. I don't appreciate the term "hard racing" as justification for bad sportsmanship. I don't do to other drivers what I don't want to get from them, so I'd happily serve a 1sec penalty if I'd push someone off.

But I understand people have different standards.

 

[kilesa4568]

But I understand people have different standards.

I've just got leeway when the corner in question is La Source, where leaving space might cause even more problems with the multiple cars inside and behind the 'space' leaver and putting yourself on the outside of the very first corner of Spa, trusting everyone you're racing with, might be classed as adventurous anyway. The racing gods are often a fickle bunch but he served himself up on a platter.

Don't get me wrong. I had Nico in my top 5 and love the way he drives but hanging outside was a little naive. The guy's too nice and always expects the same back.

 

[bnight]

Yes, I'd happily give 1sec penalty for ruining another driver's race on T1 by not leaving a car's width on the outside.

But I'm one of those who thought Max should have been penalized by pushing LeClerc off on T3 around RBRing. I don't appreciate the term "hard racing" as justification for bad sportsmanship. I don't do to other drivers what I don't want to get from them, so I'd happily serve a 1sec penalty if I'd push someone off.

But I understand people have different standards.

I do agree with you on getting a penalty for the T1incident. However in FIA races and in F1 in general T1 incidents are looked like race incidents and not intentional moves mostly because a lot of cars try to go trough T1. For RBRing I also didn't find what Max did fair however FIA did find it a clear move so did LeClerc who few years earlier had done the same to Max.

Same for Fraga vs Hazal even if I find the lift off a clear move FIA didn't and punish it accordingly with 5 sec penalty.

 

[anthaliscious]

blue moon is stupid

 

[Winnie847]

blue moon is stupid

I forget which race it was, but I think it was the MFG, since you were in the AMG.....but right at the start you veered to the right towards the wall and seemed to slow down, then 2 or 3 cars passed you. What happened? Was there a glitch or something? I'm sure there was more we couldn't see, it just looked like an odd start...like maybe a wheel malfunction or maybe you were pushed or something.

 

[250Cal]

blue moon is stupid

You looked so please about it during the interview, too!

Can't blame you, man. You work so hard to get to there and then they reduce it to a lottery. You almost made it until you got absolutely smashed at T1.

 

[GT6mebe]

As I wrote above. He would be in front, running fuel mode 6 from Les Combes to Stavelot where Fraga, in dirty air on harder tyres, would not be able to overtake. So, he's saving fuel and not losing time. That's why track position is important.

Thats not going to make up 6 seconds...

How hard is it to understand reality?

What you are saying is pure speculation and nothing else, it's a guess, something you made up as you post, fantasy at best.
Even if we ignore the fact that Hizal is a master of fuel and tire saving..

If Igor had played it clean then we would have known how a clean race would have ended. Purely decided by raw speed and talent. Instead we got a winner that was chosen by stewards, the stewards made the winning move...

It is the reality that some do not want to face.

P2 was 6 seconds behind. Unless you think not being in dirty air while the other guy behind you is will make up 6 seconds of lap time there's no argument on who has won the race.

So Froga disgraced himself just for the thrill of it, he didn’t even need to drive dirty to win.

Pretty much, but I don't think he knew how much fuel Hizal was on.

 

[Famine]

Froga

Fraga.

 

[Darwock]

Some of my thoughts:

I've been watching Miyazono from last year as he's top dog in my local area (Hyogo) and I had wondered why he had no world tour presence in the past. Gutted for him but he seems resilient.

About Cody's "S.Americans win by luck" comment, I think that was poor word choice and not the intent of his meaning. The question was "why are so many wins going to S.America?" so I believe he meant to say it's coincidental that both the wins went to that region, and not that they won 'by luck'. His track behaviour is another matter but I'll cut him some slack for this.

Presenters - as a viewer the awkwardness in the post-race interviews was painful, as it was for everyone but I do think the hosts made a little too much of it. That ultimately made it worse. Hosts should shield the audience a bit by attacking the interviews without fear, lol.

Mikail/Igor - penalty should have been applied during the race. Only then could we know what the result would have been.

SF-19 at BMB - an odd choice, and maybe not successful but I'm glad they do this kind of thing - without experimentation we wouldn't have had Gr.B on road courses.

 

[Ferr3t]

blue moon is stupid

With all this controversy of the final, I completely forgot about that. It seemed like a really odd choice in terms of determining who gets the last four spots. The only halfway legitimate reason I can come up with is that it's a really unpredictable combination of track and car for the race - starting position doesn't matter at all, and even halfway through the race, any driver would still be capable of winning. Basically, to put on a good show.

But as for the racing itself on there, it has to be super frustrating to drive there at an event. You can lead 99% of the race, and the smallest nudge from someone else who might also not be doing anything malicious can send you down the order. A classic crap-shoot, if you will.

Edit: And I guess since we're kind of done with the L17 incident at this point, I have to question something concerning Miyazono and the commentating at the event. Hell, even the comments here and the live chat for the VoD... Was I really the only one who knew that he would legit run an alternate strategy halfway into the race? I can understand the confusion for the first lap pitstop, but he drove a brilliantly agressive strategy when he ran the required compounds short and early to go out all guns blazing on an empty tank. You can't always win every race, but I loved that he tried something unique and believe he had an earnest shot at a podium, if not even the guaranteed spot for Monaco. Even if I am relieved and happy that Lightning made it through, Miyazono was really impressive.

 

[Auditore]

EDIT: Julia needs to go...

Wut,shes awesome

Hizal's cookies are gone,now its all about the porridge

 

[SAMHAIN85]

You don't see the consumption (LIGHTNING slightly less fuel than Fraga) but it's shown a few pages ago in the thread. (here) A couple of % difference at max.

I find it silly that PD still doesn't upload the replays to these live events, and that you have to rely on some third party means to gather any sort of data/telemetry after the fact when it comes to situations like this.

Let people enjoy watching the racing themselves to see how things actually played out, rather than only being subjected to what the spectator cam operator shows on the livestream which also doesnt show tire or fuel wear. Theres a lot of other action going on that the livestream doesnt always pick up.

I'm sure some of the content creator guys like Tidgney would enjoy doing a breakdown of the races where they would have full reign of camera control and playback options.

You added in-game replay sharing PD, use it!

 

[HellzFire]

Fraga is the only competitor paid by PD, the event organizer, in fact. So yeah, there's that.

Need to clarify that no driver is paid to attend world tours. Your sentence might sound a bit disingenuous.

PD sponsor him on his real live racing, not for the virtual stuff, which for me is not an issue at all. Their goal with this is to show to the world that playing GT can help you be a real racing driver. This can be a great catalyst for them and Igor is the perfect poster boy. Im sure they would do the same if lets say Cody or Hizal were real racing drivers.

Igor won't attend next Nations Cup, so no drama there.

 

[zzz_pt]

Need to clarify that no driver is paid to attend world tours. Your sentence might sound a bit disingenuous.

PD sponsor him on his real live racing, not for the virtual stuff, which for me is not an issue at all. Their goal with this is to show to the world that playing GT can help you be a real racing driver. This can be a great catalyst for them and Igor is the perfect poster boy. Im sure they would do the same if lets say Cody or Hizal were real racing drivers.

Igor won't attend next Nations Cup, so no drama there.

It's not disingenuous because I had written about it in more than a sentence in previous posts. No competitor needs to spend money to attent live events. But only one is sponsored by PD, the event organizer, in their private life, outside the esports competition.

If you have PD giving money to one driver to improve his racing craft and have more chances to race in real life, that's an advantage other competitors don't have. I bet everyone would like to get money from PD to participate in a racing series, howhever cheap it would be. But I know why only Igor got it. Because he had experience and he's a great formula driver. So he deserves any help he can get and I appreciate the fact that PD is one of his sponsors.

But if one driver gets money to gather experience from real life (that directly translate to virtual racing in all sorts of ways, including dealing with pressure, mental games, etc) and others don't, he's at an advanatage. He already was before when PD wasn't a sponsor, but that's not anyone's fault. It's Igor's accomplishment. The moment the event organizer also sponsors Igor, it stops being a transparent and fair competition for all, including Igor, who then has the added pressure of having to look good in front of PD.

Igor could have a nice role in the event, associated with PD. All paid, travels, accomodation, etc. Like Ordóñez is and was since he got signed by Nissan and sponsored by PD. It wouldn't make sense for Ordóñez to keep coming back to GTAcademy or any other esports competition from that moment on.

 

[HellzFire]

It's not disingenuous because I had written about it in more than a sentence in previous posts. No competitor needs to spend money to attent live events. But only one is sponsored by PD, the event organizer, in their private life, outside the esports competition.

If you have PD giving money to one driver to improve his racing craft and have more chances to race in real life, that's an advantage other competitors don't have. I bet everyone would like to get money from PD to participate in a racing series, howhever cheap it would be. But I know why only Igor got it. Because he had experience and he's a great formula driver. So he deserves any help he can get and I appreciate the fact that PD is one of his sponsors.

But if one driver gets money to gather experience from real life (that directly translate to virtual racing in all sorts of ways, including dealing with pressure, mental games, etc) and others don't, he's at an advanatage. He already was before when PD wasn't a sponsor, but that's not anyone's fault. It's Igor's accomplishment. The moment the event organizer also sponsors Igor, it stops being a transparent and fair competition for all, including Igor, who then has the added pressure of having to look good in front of PD.

Igor could have a nice role in the event, associated with PD. All paid, travels, accomodation, etc. Like Ordóñez is and was since he got signed by Nissan and sponsored by PD. It wouldn't make sense for Ordóñez to keep coming back to GTAcademy or any other esports competition from that moment on.

Well in that specific post it might sound. I didn't read all posts from you but if you say you mentioned I'll believe on you.

I don't see as an advantage for Igor to have more real races and that help him in the game. In fact, he would probably improve more if he was always practicing in the game itself.

I can see people having issues with it, I don't. I wouldn't if it was any other driver, so please don't use the nationality card on me. PD is trying their best to make GT look like a game that can give you a real racing driver career.

 

[schnick]

About Cody's "S.Americans win by luck" comment, I think that was poor word choice and not the intent of his meaning. The question was "why are so many wins going to S.America?" so I believe he meant to say it's coincidental that both the wins went to that region, and not that they won 'by luck'. His track behaviour is another matter but I'll cut him some slack for this.

Still a good meme, especially combined with his on track behaviour and how he conducts himself after the cameras are off.

blue moon is stupid

Yep I think you got that across in the interview it was great.
PD's thinking "hurhur let's have an indycar oval race in NY"

Again on the Igor lift, I'm fine with a little lift, it's a legit tactic as long as it's not "dangerous" (I know we are talking about an esport but still applies). Unfortunately he lifted a bit too much and caused contact and now a lot of people think he's a dirty driver. It was a dirty incident but I don't think he's a dirty driver. To be honest I probably would have tried the same thing if I were in the same situation, the competitor in me would try anything legal to get the win if I couldn't on speed alone. The way slipstream, fuel usage and dirty air are implemented all play a part in determining what tactics you use. I'm not saying they're broken, but use it to your advantage. People do that online all the time. Outright speed doesn't win all the time, you have to be smart and tactical and not drive every lap like it's your last.

Personally I am not sick of the Red Bull car used for the grand final. I know it's a bit unrealistic but it's the ultimate test of skill within GT Sport so what better way to determine the best driver.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Still a good meme, especially combined with his on track behaviour and how he conducts himself after the cameras are off.


Yep I think you got that across in the interview it was great.
PD's thinking "hurhur let's have an indycar oval race in NY"

Again on the Igor lift, I'm fine with a little lift, it's a legit tactic as long as it's not "dangerous" (I know we are talking about an esport but still applies). Unfortunately he lifted a bit too much and caused contact and now a lot of people think he's a dirty driver. It was a dirty incident but I don't think he's a dirty driver. To be honest I probably would have tried the same thing if I were in the same situation, the competitor in me would try anything legal to get the win if I couldn't on speed alone. The way slipstream, fuel usage and dirty air are implemented all play a part in determining what tactics you use. I'm not saying they're broken, but use it to your advantage. People do that online all the time. Outright speed doesn't win all the time, you have to be smart and tactical and not drive every lap like it's your last.

Personally I am not sick of the Red Bull car used for the grand final. I know it's a bit unrealistic but it's the ultimate test of skill within GT Sport so what better way to determine the best driver.

Use the SF19 as the final car.

 

[schnick]

Use the SF19 as the final car.

I still prefer the Red Bull, brings back memories of how hard the Red Bull challenge was in GT5. Mind you the x2019 competition doesn't have the fan like the old one. If they brought back the Formula Gran Turismo then I would be on board for using that. If anything, the Merc F1 is a greater test of skill compared to the Super Formula.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I still prefer the Red Bull, brings back memories of how hard the Red Bull challenge was in GT5. Mind you the x2019 competition doesn't have the fan like the old one. If they brought back the Formula Gran Turismo then I would be on board for using that. If anything, the Merc F1 is a greater test of skill compared to the Super Formula.

But they can't put liveries on the Merc F1. SF19 is the best option for premiere racing. Formula racing is meant to be the pinnacle of motorsport right? Let's use a real car that people can actually relate to.

 

[schnick]

But they can't put liveries on the Merc F1. SF19 is the best option for premiere racing. Formula racing is meant to be the pinnacle of motorsport right? Let's use a real car that people can actually relate to.

I understand the whole livery thing, that's obviously why it isn't used for the grand final. Formula racing is the pinnacle of motorsport IRL. The Red Bull cars are the pinnacle of Gran Turismo. While they are trying to emulate real life as much as possible, I don't think they need to emulate every single little thing exactly like real life which is also pretty much impossible (unless you count the proprietary simulators of F1 teams). We're in the GT world so I don't mind it if there's going to be a fantasy element. It's not linked to an official racing series, even if it is FIA sanctioned. This is the Gran Turismo Championship so anything in the GT world can be used.

 

[Winnie847]

Haters gonna hate, and some of y’all are so pissed off it has reached comical levels for me. Thanks.

 

[MIE1992]

Maybe its only my impression, but somehow I can't get warm with Igor. How he gives himself, everything he says, its all in a contrast to the other GT players. Even they are all supertalents they are natural in their behaviour, but Igor, he is proffessional in everything he does. I don't get a feeling of honesty from him, everything feels artificial. And under pressure its like his true cold blood winning for every costs nature comes through.

Maybe thats how you survive in the brutal real Motorsport-world, I don't know. But its surely against the spirit of Gran Turismo, lived by many of this Forum members like @Tidgney , @TRL LIGHTNING and so on.

It's almost like letting people who are already established in motorsports, let alone Formula 3, into a semi-amateur competition centered around a videogame makes said competition un-fun and seemingly hopeless for anybody else to win. More evidence that eSports in general is a joke - a stupid meme at best - and Gran Turismo ate the bait.

You may as well have a competitive Battlefield tournament where every match is a free-for-all, and one of the contestants is a member of Seal Team 6 who's in it for giggles. Fraga doesn't even have anything to gain by winning the FIAGTC - he can just do what he wants since he's established in F3. It seems to me that Fraga's doing the FIAGTC just in it to swing his pecker around. I can hardly wait to see him be the winner of the Nations Cup every year for the next five years. eSports and ranked multiplayer are each a cancer that drain the fun out of every game they touch! No time to make friends and experiment with game mechanics when there's a meta to follow, and numbers to crunch.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I understand the whole livery thing, that's obviously why it isn't used for the grand final. Formula racing is the pinnacle of motorsport IRL. The Red Bull cars are the pinnacle of Gran Turismo. While they are trying to emulate real life as much as possible, I don't think they need to emulate every single little thing exactly like real life which is also pretty much impossible (unless you count the proprietary simulators of F1 teams). We're in the GT world so I don't mind it if there's going to be a fantasy element. It's not linked to an official racing series, even if it is FIA sanctioned. This is the Gran Turismo Championship so anything in the GT world can be used.

I wouldn't consider the car selection a "little thing"

 

[schnick]

It's almost like letting people who are already established in motorsports, let alone Formula 3, into a semi-amateur competition centered around a videogame makes said competition un-fun and seemingly hopeless for anybody else to win. More evidence that eSports in general is a joke - a stupid meme at best - and Gran Turismo ate the bait.

You may as well have a competitive Battlefield tournament where every match is a free-for-all, and one of the contestants is a member of Seal Team 6 who's in it for giggles. Fraga doesn't even have anything to gain by winning the FIAGTC - he can just do what he wants since he's established in F3. It seems to me that Fraga's doing the FIAGTC just in it to swing his pecker around. I can hardly wait to see him be the winner of the Nations Cup every year for the next five years. eSports and ranked multiplayer are each a cancer that drain the fun out of every game they touch! No time to make friends and experiment with game mechanics when there's a meta to follow, and numbers to crunch.

Does that mean Matt Simmons and Nick McMillen were there to swing their peckers around too when instead they should be chasing a real drive instead? (Not saying that they aren't, I imagine they are still trying and may have something in the works) What about Bernal Valverde who runs in the Costa Rican Touring Car Championship? Unfortunately we have elements of other esports like the whole meta thing but that's how they've implemented it so agree to use it or don't compete at all.

I wouldn't consider the car selection a "little thing"

It's an expression.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Then don't use it because it doesn't apply

 

[Timlour]

My word, what an amazing experience I had at New York! Unfortunately I wasn't able to meet up with @Jordan and the others, but I did get to meet a couple of GTP'ers - @DesertPenguin and @potvinsuks, the former of which I watched the races with. Being in the presence of people like Jimmy Broadbent and Matt Gallagher was surreal, and the 60fps race recordings were great to see.

Regarding the Hizal/Fraga incident; If the X2019 can get through Eau Rouge & Raidillon flat out, than it makes sense that Hizal was not expecting to get to Fraga's bumper that quickly. The contact that could have resulted from Fraga lifting would've caused controversy for sure, so it doesn't surprise me that Fraga was penalized. I do think it was unfortunate that Fraga was penalized post-race rather than mid-race - it's not easy to ignore the negative stigma that comes from a post-race penalty, even if the result doesn't affect the outcome.

Afterwards, I was fortunate enough to catch Kaz and get my Gran Turismo Sport steelbook signed by him.

I also got to meet Daniel Solis (@Dodge Lamb) in person which was awesome.

I got invited to do a random interview after the races, and I remember being asked if I'd attend one of these events again. "In a heartbeat," I said, and I really meant it. It's such a shame the PlayStation Theater is being closed down at the end of the year, because I would've loved to attend this again next year (guess I have no choice but to qualify now ). In any case, I'll never forget this experience. 👍

 

[MIE1992]

Does that mean Matt Simmons and Nick McMillen were there to swing their peckers around too when instead they should be chasing a real drive instead? (Not saying that they aren't, I imagine they are still trying and may have something in the works) What about Bernal Valverde who runs in the Costa Rican Touring Car Championship? Unfortunately we have elements of other esports like the whole meta thing but that's how they've implemented it so agree to use it or don't compete at all.

Maybe! If they already have a career in motorsports, what the hell are they doing as top competitors in the FIAGTC?! They could be out racing, in real cars, for real money! Maybe they’re not all that great in real motorsport, so they take on a bunch of amateurs in a videogame because it’s where they can give themselves pats on the back, by easily beating a bunch of people who’ve never driven an actual racecar! Maybe eSports & ranked multiplayer were mistakes that drain the fun out of every game they touch! I’m so sorry that I play videogames TO HAVE FUN!