- 3,587
I don't think I'll ever drive at madrid again after this race 
Lmes
- Thread starter MitchZ06
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Not me I'm at work tonight.
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- Space City, USA
- GTP_MPower
- JetsE36
Project 54 Racing Branching Out Too Far?
It was revealed earlier today that Project 54 has stretched itself out enough to enter the Targa Toscana Rally. Having set their foundation in GT racing only months ago, this decision seems like they are stretching themselves thin. The team has entered an ex-Works Subaru Impreza WRC99 in the tarmac classic. The team have said that it seemed like a good time for a one-time event. The team's factory supported BMW M3 GTR has showed great pace in early testing for the LMES. The LMES season kicks off in 5 weeks time at the Polyphony Digital 400km of Rome.
MitchZ06
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- Mitch_Z06
Alright in the test session I made a legitimate pass on freshseth which somehow resulted in him driving into the wall and a short debate after about the hows and whys of it. I will explain below with pictures why he ended up in the wall and what he should've done differently.
This is leading up to the corner where I was beside freshseth and was preparing to make the move.
As you can see the corner is closing and we're neck and neck down the straight leading to it.
Closing in and I'm slightly ahead, in racing terms I'm still not far enough ahead to 'own the corner'.
We are at the corner, both on the brakes and I am sufficiently far ahead to have 'taken the corner' even tho I do not have the correct line into the corner.
Still on the brakes, still ahead and the corner is 'mine' so to speak.
Coming into the corner and freshseth is turning in effectively squeezing me to the wall, I'm ahead so I keep my line being mindful not to move over to the left and make contact (which would mean the crash would be my fault).
Correctly freshseth is still braking and I have turned into the corner, I am ahead and have made the pass cleanly.
This however is what resulted. No contact was made and freshseth simply drove into the wall. He did claim to have given me space (....) and yes there is room for two cars there if I wasnt already 3/4 of a cars length in front I would've had to have slowed down and made room.
Trying to hold your line and not get passed even when the car is in front is poor race craft and a bad decision, however freshseth could've avoided this by conceding the corner as I was sufficiently past and going a bit wider which would allow him the space to turn into the corner earlier and still avoid contact.
Trying to hold your line and not get passed even when the car is in front is poor race craft and a bad decision, however freshseth could've avoided this by conceding the corner as I was sufficiently past and going a bit wider which would allow him the space to turn into the corner earlier and still avoid contact.
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- tissimo
IMO the ZR1 is in the wrong in that instance. The ZR1 didn't clear the R8 so should of left room. Now this corner there really isn't any room for 2 cars to fly into the corner, so was a fairly dirty attempted pass imo. The ZR1 should of gave the position back.
Now in the instance where the R8 hit the wall and I'm sure took damage how would the position situation on giving the spot back play out? As bad as it is, In this scenario with Heavy damage the R8 probably should of held his line and hit the ZR1, causing both the wreck and take damage negating any advantage of the ZR1 not taking damage from being clearly in the wrong.
I applaud the R8 driver though as to try to avoid the contact even though it wasn't his fault, at the result of damaging his car. This is the kind of driver I would like to race with.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=111241
Now in the instance where the R8 hit the wall and I'm sure took damage how would the position situation on giving the spot back play out? As bad as it is, In this scenario with Heavy damage the R8 probably should of held his line and hit the ZR1, causing both the wreck and take damage negating any advantage of the ZR1 not taking damage from being clearly in the wrong.
I applaud the R8 driver though as to try to avoid the contact even though it wasn't his fault, at the result of damaging his car. This is the kind of driver I would like to race with.
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MitchZ06
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- Mitch_Z06
It wasn't a dirty move, I was ahead before the corner and was making the pass. If you look at the pictures look to the left of the R8, see how much space is there? I'm not saying freshseth is a bad driver (hes actually quite clean) but a bad decision to defend a lost position resulted in him ending up in the wall.
I didnt' have to give up the position, I gave him space (as much space as you can being up against the wall...) and he tried to defend the position even tho I was ahead. I too like the fact he avoided the possible contact but shouldn't have taken the line he did and shouldn't have thrown it into the wall.
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- tissimo
You were ahead into the corner, but you have not cleared him and still the attacking driver. He was taking the proper racing line through the corner. He didn't leave a lot of room for you (as is his right) but there is room.
It wasn't your position to give up, as I said before you did not clear the R8, and left ZERO room on the exit for his car. You were the cause of the wreck.
MitchZ06
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- Mitch_Z06
By give up the position I mean the position I got when I passed him not give up the position in the pass.
Even better than a picture I'm going to put up a video showing what happened.
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- 3,587
wait apparently I missed a lot. (reading through)
EDIT: yep. staying out of this one.
I think both you guys are decent drivers, especially given lap times. Just an honest mistake.
EDIT: yep. staying out of this one.
I think both you guys are decent drivers, especially given lap times. Just an honest mistake.
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MitchZ06
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- Mitch_Z06
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- Sephy71
- Dr Sephy S
Pretty tough call. One thing to take into account is that is the fastest part of that track. If I were freshseth I probably would have backed off just for the sake of avoiding a collision but he had the line into the corner.
- 3,587
I mean I hate to get involved in a domestic dispute
j/k
But seriously I think to me this seems similar to the wreck between 908 and Audi at Sebring where the wreck was more or less caused by both cars going super hard on a bumpy corner and on tight circuit racing it's bound to happen now or then. I don't think either of you meant to screw the other over, and I wouldn't call the pass shady or anything. It looked really like neither wanted to give up the line they had entering the corner and as a result of hard driving a mistake occurred. As for official rules of passing I don't know how to respond, I don't have enough experience in that area. Just observing it seemed like it could and most likely will happen once or twice during a long race on a track like Madrid.
j/k
But seriously I think to me this seems similar to the wreck between 908 and Audi at Sebring where the wreck was more or less caused by both cars going super hard on a bumpy corner and on tight circuit racing it's bound to happen now or then. I don't think either of you meant to screw the other over, and I wouldn't call the pass shady or anything. It looked really like neither wanted to give up the line they had entering the corner and as a result of hard driving a mistake occurred. As for official rules of passing I don't know how to respond, I don't have enough experience in that area. Just observing it seemed like it could and most likely will happen once or twice during a long race on a track like Madrid.
- 3,587
Hey folks. How's everyone coming along on race day? Excited? Last minute tweaks?
- 9,765
- OrlandoFL GMT-5
- GTP__Jav
Alright in the test session I made a legitimate pass on freshseth which somehow resulted in him driving into the wall and a short debate after about the hows and whys of it. I will explain below with pictures why he ended up in the wall and what he should've done differently.
This is leading up to the corner where I was beside freshseth and was preparing to make the move.
As you can see the corner is closing and we're neck and neck down the straight leading to it.
Closing in and I'm slightly ahead, in racing terms I'm still not far enough ahead to 'own the corner'.
We are at the corner, both on the brakes and I am sufficiently far ahead to have 'taken the corner' even tho I do not have the correct line into the corner.
Still on the brakes, still ahead and the corner is 'mine' so to speak.
Coming into the corner and freshseth is turning in effectively squeezing me to the wall, I'm ahead so I keep my line being mindful not to move over to the left and make contact (which would mean the crash would be my fault).
Correctly freshseth is still braking and I have turned into the corner, I am ahead and have made the pass cleanly.
This however is what resulted. No contact was made and freshseth simply drove into the wall. He did claim to have given me space (....) and yes there is room for two cars there if I wasnt already 3/4 of a cars length in front I would've had to have slowed down and made room.
Trying to hold your line and not get passed even when the car is in front is poor race craft and a bad decision, however freshseth could've avoided this by conceding the corner as I was sufficiently past and going a bit wider which would allow him the space to turn into the corner earlier and still avoid contact.
Guys this is just pre-season testing and we should focus on the real purpose of pre-season testing. There's always something to be learned from every experience, no such thing as a bad experience in life, an experience is always a lesson. Perhaps we should take another look at this season's tracks, the confined spaces of street circuits will always led to this type of incidents, on top of that the mental and physical fatigue from a prolonged stint plus a huge speed diferential between classes will indeed be a tough challenge, maybe too tough for many.
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