Motorcycles in GT6?

[mjm23race]

Thing is there isn't anything out there as convincing as TT was in the physics department (including its flaws which illustrates how bad the other titles are I've played).
What's more, they only focus on race bikes and a particular series of racing (just like F1 2012 focusses solely on F1 obviously and can't be considered an alternative for GT5) which is another major difference compared with TT.

Imagine it the other way around, what if PD mainly released bike games from the start and only once a car-related spin-off which was mostly spot on from the start and is sorely missed.
Wouldn't you want some cars included in TT6?

Well stated, but unfortunately that is not the way some look at it. Seems there is already a preconceived notion as to what gt6 should be.

I wish everyone here could play (just for example, but take your pick, they are all similar) MotoGp 09/10. If they played it even only one time, then perhaps they could get a better understanding why so many of us want PD to have another go at bikes. Customization of rider, riding gear and bikes, track diversity, bike and class diversity, and decent physics are all things PD can and have already done well. All the things listed are missing from every single motorcycle game I have played aside from TT.

 

[Smokey Nismo]

If they do indeed decide to add bikes to Gran Turirsmo 6, then have the common decency to feature the Isle of Man circuit!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isle_of_Man_TT

 

[mjm23race]

If they do indeed decide to add bikes to Gran Turirsmo 6, then have the common decency to feature the Isle of Man circuit!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isle_of_Man_TT

Only problem is that they don't really race on isle of man. I bet that would be a huge undertaking to create that track. 37 miles or there abouts, correct?

 

[analog]

Well stated, but unfortunately that is not the way some look at it. Seems there is already a preconceived notion as to what gt6 should be.

I do notice a lot seem to be very conservative regarding what a GT-title should be, that's not necessarily criticism but mainly an observation (if all you want to do is drive and race cars, fair enough).
And if a separate TT2 title isn't possible or considered sensible businesswise due to lower overall sales, maybe 2 separate GT6 titles could be a possibility?

One offering the 'classic' GT-experience (cars, closed tracks) and one called GT6 Extra (or GTTT or whatever) offering bikes as well and possibly free roam at an extra cost (the whole game).
Maybe the total sales of a GT-game offering both cars and bikes might be far higher than a standalone TT2 title (including the additional sales of GT6) and it'll ensure the apparantly all important divide is kept firmly in place.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Isle of Man, that would be epic place to race or just driving. I can picture it now, track days with rally cars, super cars, all kinds of bikes, it would be the second Nurburgring.

 

[PAPPACLART]

Isle of Man, that would be epic place to race or just driving. I can picture it now, track days with rally cars, super cars, all kinds of bikes, it would be the second Nurburgring.

Dear god that is a dream, we can only hope and wait

 

[finnracer]

Isle of Man would be a great all round track - Racing, Touge, Drifting, Legal/Non Legal cruising (I know there's no speed limits out of the towns anyway!! ). 37 miles is a lot to model but it'd be worth it and even better if they added bikes as well.

 

[Youngun]

Just put caterham v8, Ariel atom v8 and ktm x-bow-r in the game. You wear helmets and go fastest than bikes anyway

 

[MSTER232]

Just put caterham v8, Ariel atom v8 and ktm x-bow-r in the game. You wear helmets and go fastest than bikes anyway

👍

 

[analog]

Just put caterham v8, Ariel atom v8 and ktm x-bow-r in the game. You wear helmets and go fastest than bikes anyway

Do they lean in corners? If all I cared about was being faster, the only car I'd use was the Red Bull X2010.

 

[Youngun]

Do they lean in corners? If all I cared about was being faster, the only car I'd use was the Red Bull X2010.

It was a serious.... Joke. But that's what they get compared to in real life. The 4 wheeled bikes (not a quad), after all KTM do build them also

 

[Spagetti69]

Seems there is already a preconceived notion as to what gt6 should be.

After 5 previous games I guess there should be.

 

[mjm23race]

After 5 previous games I guess there should be.

Fair enough. But then after also doing TT and showing bikes in GTHD and hearing Kaz's make mention of bikes it is also fair for others to conceive the notion of it being time to merge the two worlds and evolve into one large diverse family.

 

[Griffith500]

If they do indeed decide to add bikes to Gran Turirsmo 6, then have the common decency to feature the Isle of Man circuit!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isle_of_Man_TT

It is a long circuit, although there is one guy over in the GPL community who has been working on a full-length version since 2005 (he's already made an "abridged" version to fit in the old circuit length limits, before it was patched) - a video here. It is possible PD could reproduce it, but maybe a course creator theme would cover it.

Which reminds me: in a very similar vein, and not quite so long at 7.4 miles, there's Dundrod. The Ulster Grand Prix is a fairly prestigious bike race, and Dundrod also held sports car races (called the RAC Tourist Trophy ) once upon a time. Or Charade - it's sadly not really in one piece any more, but what a circuit it was! (How it is today; the old circuit diverges at 0:15 and rejoins at 1:10 in the first video.)

As such, for the Isle of Man TT, there's always the Clypse Course, or similar, if the full Mountain Course is too much. Best not to get carried away, though (I already have GPL, but there are no bikes in that either...)

 

[MSTER232]

Do they lean in corners? If all I cared about was being faster, the only car I'd use was the Red Bull X2010.

Technically they do from weight transfer, but not what a motorcyclist would call 'leaning'.

 

[arora]

After watching some videos of tt at the ring and also various other real life bike stuff. Me and Rooby have decided that bikes in gt6 is not such a bad idea. I still say they don't belong but weighing the possibility of a tt2 vs seeing them in gt6, well.......

 

[Grand Prix]

After watching some videos of tt at the ring and also various other real life bike stuff. Me and Rooby have decided that bikes in gt6 is not such a bad idea. I still say they don't belong but weighing the possibility of a tt2 vs seeing them in gt6, well.......

But on the condition PD includes the Moto Guzzi 500cc V8 bike.

 

[BobbyBRAKEaNek]

Yes, motorcycles in GT6. Please add them Pd.

This guy is smart. :-)

 

[180bandit]

Does this count as a motorcycle? Would GT fans be OK with this racing against cars?

Yeh it counts as a motorcycle, just not respected as a true motorcycle by kneedragging enthusiast like myself.

 

[mjm23race]

After watching some videos of tt at the ring and also various other real life bike stuff. Me and Rooby have decided that bikes in gt6 is not such a bad idea. I still say they don't belong but weighing the possibility of a tt2 vs seeing them in gt6, well.......

Welcome to the dark side lol.

 

[analog]

But on the condition PD includes the Moto Guzzi 500cc V8 bike.

Yes, yes, yes!!!

 

[TheBlueHusky]

Drives bike with T500RS, no thank you!
It's Gran Turismo not Gran Sport Biko

 

[CJDA9]

Such a stupid idea in my opinion its a CAR game grand turismo gt not anything else, if they put bikes in the next gt i would be pissed they should spend that time on a proper tire model and physics.......

 

[Griffith500]

Yes, yes, yes!!!

Both versions; the original with the flat-plane and the later cross-plane engine.

EDIT:

Drives bike with T500RS, no thank you!
It's Gran Turismo not Gran Sport Biko

Why would you even try to control a bike with a wheel and pedals, except maybe for a laugh?
Gran Turismo just means Grand Touring; there are many Grand Touring bikes. Maybe you shouldn't get too hung up on a name. If you don't like bikes, that's fine.

Such a stupid idea in my opinion its a CAR game grand turismo gt not anything else, if they put bikes in the next gt i would be pissed they should spend that time on a proper tire model and physics.......

How would bikes take time away from a new tyre model? Adding bikes would require changes to the physics that would actually benefit the simulation of cars!

 

[daus26]

They don't have to be that lazy though, for example many of the tracks in GT5 aren't amazingly suited to bikes so if they made a standalone bike game again after GT6 they could and should put more time into it and make it actually a bike game and not GT5 with the cars deleted and bikes added.

You see, that's the problem. Would people rather have PD focus on TWO different ambitions, with them already having enough work as it is with one franchise? Making unique bike tracks takes LOTS of time, let alone resources. The only way it can work is if they make all the tracks their original. Otherwise, TT2 will only be a "lazy" copy of the cars version like Tourist Trophy was to GT4.

Not only that, at one point they'll probably have to eventually get to developing the "portable" version. With that in the works and Tourist Trophy 2, 5 plus years between two GT franchises will become the norm.

I can already imagine the war between Bike fans and Car enthusiasts if PD did decide to make each franchise its own league.

I maybe race in a public lounge perhaps once a month, and only when my friends are not online. I have about 60 guys added to my lounges and we race privately pretty much most of the time. If kids think it is fun sending riders 50 feet in the air, then those that want to ride bikes with cars can simply do it amonge friends and privately. This has always been the most effective solution to avoiding the current idiots we find online from time to time.

At the moment we have kids in Veyrons and Xwings driving backwards and ruining players races. knocking riders off bikes (assuming pd would allow it) might be a novelty at first but eventually will be no more or less common as the current douchebags we have already online.

Exluding bikes becuase people will ram them is almost as bad as say not including cars in GT5 for the same reason.

Its a game that is the beuaty

Honestly, I'm not sure where you're getting here.

 

[CJDA9]

No it wont make it better for cars just bikes it makes no sense to take time to add bikes in a game that they are NOT meant for. You don't see sims like lfs with cars AND bikes in them do you??? I want the most realistic experience possible, not another hack job with bikes added to it sorry that just my opinion. They need to put a lot of time into the new tire model and physics for the CARS, don't get me wrong tt is a good game but it should stay separate from GT.

 

[Griffith500]

No it wont make it better for cars just bikes it makes no sense to take time to add bikes in a game that they are NOT meant for. You don't see sims like lfs with cars AND bikes in them do you??? I want the most realistic experience possible, not another hack job with bikes added to it sorry that just my opinion. They need to put a lot of time into the new tire model and physics for the CARS, don't get me wrong tt is a good game but it should stay separate from GT.

Except that physics are physics (which I won't keep repeating much more).

There are forces that are very important on bikes, but can be "neglected" for cars; however, introducing those forces into the car simulation adds nuance and extra realism, because they tangibly have an effect on the feel, even if they don't necessarily on lap times. The tyre model is another area that would be mutually beneficial, and adding bikes doesn't stop them from improving it at all, and may highlight weaknesses that allow for overall improvements (tyres are tyres.)

Basically, it would benefit the overall simulation if PD moved to a system that allows for arbitrary objects to be simulated; that way the widest possible range of cars and bikes (and whatever else) can be simulated without nasty hacks. At the moment, GT is excellent at conveying the feel of road cars, but it's race cars are a bit iffy.

 

[Exorcet]

No it wont make it better for cars just bikes it makes no sense to take time to add bikes in a game that they are NOT meant for. You don't see sims like lfs with cars AND bikes in them do you??? I want the most realistic experience possible, not another hack job with bikes added to it sorry that just my opinion. They need to put a lot of time into the new tire model and physics for the CARS, don't get me wrong tt is a good game but it should stay separate from GT.

Then a physics engine capable of handling bikes is a good thing for you.

 

[daus26]

I can't believe we are back to talking about the physics engine. It's one of the first thing that was discussed on the FIRST page.

 

[MrTrt]

Except that physics are physics (which I won't keep repeating much more).

There are forces that are very important on bikes, but can be "neglected" for cars; however, introducing those forces into the car simulation adds nuance and extra realism, because they tangibly have an effect on the feel, even if they don't necessarily on lap times. The tyre model is another area that would be mutually beneficial, and adding bikes doesn't stop them from improving it at all, and may highlight weaknesses that allow for overall improvements (tyres are tyres.)

Basically, it would benefit the overall simulation if PD moved to a system that allows for arbitrary objects to be simulated; that way the widest possible range of cars and bikes (and whatever else) can be simulated without nasty hacks. At the moment, GT is excellent at conveying the feel of road cars, but it's race cars are a bit iffy.

Now tell me how long it would take. I think not less than 15 years, if it's even possible with today's hardware. The point is that you simply cannot use the same physics for cars and for bikes (unless you're making a very arcade game; I guess we wouldn't like it) because it would be very unoptimized for both car and bikes.

As everyone can easily see, the behavior of a car is quite different than the behavior of a bike. Do you think that is really neccesary to represent (and calculate), for example, the wear of the two halfs of a tire for a car? It wouldn't be more realistic, would it?

I feel sorry, I don't now how to explain my thinkings about this properly, but I hope you'll understand the main idea of my post.