NBA 2011-2012 Thread

[Brett]

The three second rule has been in place since 1936. The key was widened initially in the 1951-52 season because of George Mikan and was further widened in 1964-65 in response to Wilt Chamberlain's dominance. The three seconds rule has little to do with the decline of the true center. Wilt was still dominant after the change. Players were able to adapt to that rule change.

Other rule changes, the addition of the three point line, have had a greater impact on centers. Defending on the perimeter made playing defense as a slow guy much more difficult. Throw in the changes to how much contact is legal and being slow is a much greater liability. The job of playing center has become much more difficult on defense and a more specialized guy that is highly mobile is needed.

Throw in the fact that guys today want to emulate Michael Jordan, not guys like The Dream, and it is apparent why the game is much more perimeter oriented. Guys do not want to practice the skill set that is involved in being dominant on the low block. Tim Duncan would be a perfect guy to emulate, but because he practices the fundamentals, he is deemed boring.

There was a whole lot of hard work that went into the show that The Dream was able to put on night in and night out. You plop a guy with a skill set like The Dream into the NBA today and that guy would dominant. The Dream would make Dwight Howard look silly on both sides of the ball.

The problem is kids are not developing the skills needed in a center. Get some kids that have the size needed in a center to practice the skill set that the older centers had and you would see a resurgence in centers.

Keep in mind, there has never been a plethora of dominant centers at any one time in the league. Right now, it is overly apparent at how bad the position is, as there is a complete lack of centers after Dwight Howard and he is not even a complete player for the position. If we could combine Howard's defense with Bynum's offense and Kobe's compulsive drive to win, then we would have a dominant center.

 

[nissman]

Man Wade was something to watch in this one!

 

[sumbrownkid]

The three second rule has been in place since 1936. The key was widened initially in the 1951-52 season because of George Mikan and was further widened in 1964-65 in response to Wilt Chamberlain's dominance. The three seconds rule has little to do with the decline of the true center. Wilt was still dominant after the change. Players were able to adapt to that rule change.

Other rule changes, the addition of the three point line, have had a greater impact on centers. Defending on the perimeter made playing defense as a slow guy much more difficult. Throw in the changes to how much contact is legal and being slow is a much greater liability. The job of playing center has become much more difficult on defense and a more specialized guy that is highly mobile is needed.

Throw in the fact that guys today want to emulate Michael Jordan, not guys like The Dream, and it is apparent why the game is much more perimeter oriented. Guys do not want to practice the skill set that is involved in being dominant on the low block. Tim Duncan would be a perfect guy to emulate, but because he practices the fundamentals, he is deemed boring.

There was a whole lot of hard work that went into the show that The Dream was able to put on night in and night out. You plop a guy with a skill set like The Dream into the NBA today and that guy would dominant. The Dream would make Dwight Howard look silly on both sides of the ball.

The problem is kids are not developing the skills needed in a center. Get some kids that have the size needed in a center to practice the skill set that the older centers had and you would see a resurgence in centers.

Keep in mind, there has never been a plethora of dominant centers at any one time in the league. Right now, it is overly apparent at how bad the position is, as there is a complete lack of centers after Dwight Howard and he is not even a complete player for the position. If we could combine Howard's defense with Bynum's offense and Kobe's compulsive drive to win, then we would have a dominant center.

Bynum's work ethic is far from Kobe's. He is still a kid with a childish attitude. Howard is definitely an upgrade over Bynum.

Tim Duncan maybe boring, but that man also has four NBA rings...

Dunks bring in crowds, fundamentals win championships, no?

 

[a6m5]

Exactly why I practiced left hand layups, not dunks like the other kids. They couldn't dunk in the games anyway, but I could score from either side.

In my time following the NBA, we had the most number of elite centers in early 90's. David Robinson, Hakeem Olajuwon, Patrick Ewing, Dikembe Mutombo. Then, we still had decent centers, or one's that could still put up numbers in Rik Smits, Rony Seikaly, Mark Eaton, etc., etc. Guys like Alonzo Mourning & Shaquille "What 3-Second Rule" O'Neal were coming in, and guys like Robert Parish & Bill Laimbeer were headed out. If the Blazers could have gotten Arvydas Sabonis in 1986, when we had drafted him, landscape in the NBA would have been very, very different from the 80's to late 90's. Some even goes as far as to say that Sabonis was the best center in the world before the injury slowed him down. Even with those injuries, he was still very good with the Blazers when he finally joined his NBA team in 1995.

I really have no opinion on the 3-second rule. Like Shaq, to him, it was "what 3-second rule". That was one of the rules that NBA & Stern deemed did not apply to their money maker center. He'd stand there for five seconds, catch the pass, knock down his defender like a bowling pin, then just dunked the ball. Greatest center my ass. He did become a very good passer towards the end, but his skill level was a joke compared to that of guys like Hakeem & Duncan(he's a center, not a forward).

3-second rule? We don't even play that in half court games

I called them. At least I used to when I played. I was a slasher, and I didn't need those dumb bigs in the way.

 

[Stavingo]

I called them. At least I used to when I played. I was a slasher, and I didn't need those dumb bigs in the way.

Luckily when I play with my friend when it's 2v3, he's always marked by the big man

 

[a6m5]

Luckily when I play with my friend when it's 2v3, he's always marked by the big man

Oh, yeah. That's why I always did my best to pretend like I'm disinterested in scoring the basket, then fake a move or two, BAM!

San Antonio Mayor Julian Castro trolls the living daylights out of Charles Barkley

The San Antonio Spurs have somehow become ironically cool. Or cooly ironic. Or something. I get confused on the meaning of both of those concepts at this point. But whereas the Spurs used to be boring and slow, now they're fast and wide open. Whereas Tim Duncan used to be robotic and soulless, now he's funny and iconic. Manu Ginobili used to just be a flopper. Now he's a flopper who knocks bats out of the air. Even Gregg Popovich is cool.

But one person who does not think the city the Spurs are from is cool is Charles Barkley, who notoriously has publicly mocked San Antonio and its Riverwalk specifically on TNT's "Inside the NBA." It's an ongoing joke about how much Chuck hates the Alamo City. But for once, the city is fighting back with something more than "you suck" chants. San Antonio Mayor Julián Castro published this video Friday as a message to Barkley:



Pulling out the "RINGZ" argument. Strong move, Mayor. Score one for the River City.

The Western Conference Finals begin Sunday on TNT.

link to the original story at CBS Sports

I didn't even know about this, but apparently, Sir Charles's been busy yacking again. A shocker.

 

[JohnBM01]

Winner gets Miami in the Eastern Conference Finals- it's the 76ers at the Celtics tonight. Boston is apparently 4-0 following a loss in this postseason. Tell it, GTPlanet... Philadelphia or Boston winning tonight?

 

[a6m5]

I wanna say the Sixers, but so much still going for Boston. I'd want who ever matches up better against Miami.

 

[Brett]

I think Boston wins tonight.

 

[Paulie]

I still hope Philly wins but the two have been taking turns in winning during this series so it looks like Boston's up. I seriously have no idea who it will be though.

 

[a6m5]

That Kevin Garnett, what an 🤬 Go Sixers!

 

[JohnBM01]

Heat vs. Celtics for the Eastern Conference Finals. The Celtics won 85-75, 86'ing the 76ers from the playoffs.

 

[a6m5]

God, I hate Garnett so much, I am very close to rooting for Miami Heat.

 

[Stavingo]

I missed the game, what did KG do that was so bad lol

 

[Omnis]

Hate Boston.

 

[a6m5]

I missed the game, what did KG do that was so bad lol

Just the usual crap that he does, which has nothing to do at all with basketball, trying his best to get under the skin of Elton Brand.

What I wish for Kevin Garnett, I can't say on this website. You know what, I am rooting for the Heat in the Eastern Conference Finals. As long as Boston lose, I don't care what happens this year.

 

[Stavingo]

Haha I just wanna see the Heat match up against OKC or Spurs to make it a good finals series.

 

[a6m5]

Damn. Westbrook is sucking it up, and they are still virtually tied 77-76 San Antonio with 5:42 left in the fourth.

Go Spurs!

Edit: Classic Manu. Very happy for Stephen Jackson, big fourth quarter for him, offensively & defensively. OK, maybe not big, but couple of key plays there.

 

[McLaren]

San Antonio showing the young bloods how it's done. Even when they're down, they remain calm & almost won by 10 points again. And Duncan said they weren't even playing that well.

 

[Paulie]

Manu was a beast, and you kind of expect the technically correct Spurs to win the first one. Maybe the Thunder will get some back when they settle in to a rhythm against the Spurs and can really use that athleticism of theirs.

 

[a6m5]

You just can't afford to turn down your level of play against the Thunder though. They say Spurs have better execution, more experience, Westbrook's not very steady, but Thunder, one thing they do for sure, you give them an inch of opening, and they will bust the door open.

 

[hellnback]

I actually believe until Westbrook knows who the real star is and actually accepts his role and that he is the 'beta-dog' they won't reach their potential...

 

[Stavingo]

Wow, Westbrook was 7-21 in FG.

Brick.

 

[a6m5]

Oh, yeah, and it wasn't just his shooting either. Very erratic.

I have to disagree with the assessment that he needs to take backseat to Durant, necessarily. Those two definitely must learn to play together, but Westbrook is the wildcard. He is the one that can get the OKC over the top. We already know how good Durant is, and as good as he is, it won't be enough. At least not against the Spurs this year, or the Heat. Westbrook must be pretty much a equal to Durant on the offensive end if Thunder wants to win with the team they have this year.

Edit: I didn't realize this until just now, but In recent games, Thunder has been the team that dominated the fourth quarter. I hope this Game 1 was a trend to come in this series, as the role was totally reversed for the Thunder. They had sizable lead, then Spurs just shut them down while going on a run. As a result, as McLaren noted, Spurs were up by ten at one point near the end.

I'm not getting my hopes up just yet though. Westbrook didn't even show up, and Thunder was still in the game. It should be a good series.

Edit2:

Harden.... you rookie. You don't know who you are 🤬 with. Manu, my boy! <--- this is meant to be a joke



Edit3:

I very much appreciate the Sixth Man talk by Marv Albert? *it wasn't Marv, I don't recognize the other guy's voice.

 

[McLaren]

I think Durant knows how to play with everyone & he knows when he has to take control as the clutch. It's just a matter of whether he can get himself into a rhythm quickly enough.

Westbrook is one of those guys who either stays hot or he stays cold. It's a somewhat similar relationship to Dirk/Terry (& probably several other guys in the league). The issue with Westbrook is that he seems to have a habit of trying to become the clutch when he & Durant aren't doing well. And sometimes he succeeds.
But when the game is getting rough & the other team has just made a comeback to lead, he looks like he gets frustrated. He's trying to become the clutch & put them back up by himself and the fouls come, he gets angry esp. if the other player retaliates. Although, he seemed pretty calm last night & kept trying.

To be honest though, I've never cared much for Westbrook. When he makes a tough shot & the other team calls a timeout, he gets over-dramatic. It's not like Durant. When he made that lucky shot over Dallas to win or the dagger-3 against LA, he came back to his bench, high-five'd everyone, & waited for the next play. He obviously doesn't like to lose games, but he stays calm & he admits his poor performance.

Westbrook just likes the spotlight sometimes I guess. He just has too much of an ego & I think that's what gets him in trouble with fouls. Plus, the guy's postgame fashion is terrible. I don't know if he's trying to troll the media or not, but it's not very professional, to be honest.

Edit* On the note of Manu for a second, he really threw OKC off guard. They have never seen him play this season, so they had no idea how to stop his clutch ability. That pass that threw off Durant on the drive; that's experience for you. Durant's good, but Manu knew he wasn't expecting a fake pass.

 

[a6m5]

That fake pass was a routine for me when I used to play. It only works if you have the killer first step, and are explosive to the basket. Having said that, there was nobody where Manu faked pass to, so Durant got punk'd badly on that one.



I agree on Westbrook's ego. He's very green. He might mature, he might not. But it was that ego I was counting on for him to leave OKC. He signed an extension with the team instead.

Edit: 15,000 post! Amazing!

 

[McLaren]

NBA Yahoo had a good article today on Game 1, and the one thing I noticed is that Harden had a hard time posting up against Ginobli is because he's a lefty too, so naturally that's what he's going to defend against. It seemed OKC's defense wasn't ready themselves for a Harden-esque attacker either.

 

[a6m5]

Harden is physically more gifted, but Manu, at least he used to be so much better talent. He used to be my (current)favorite player for a reason.

I hate the lefties. Damn those lefties. Brandon Roy was the worst kind of lefty you could imagine. I remember reading that Roy, while he was left-handed, was either just as comfortable, or had stronger finish with the right. What the 🤬

 

[Omnis]

Heet.

 

[McLaren]

Heet.

That was a good game in the first half. Looked like the Heat really wanted it more, though. Wasn't as physical as I thought it might be, either.