Need a Break from Gran Turismo?

  • Thread starter Haitauer
  • 229 comments
  • 11,635 views
Speedster911
OP, I've owned GT5 and currently own FM4. I can assure you F4's physics are far more accurate and the driving model brings a lot more adrenaline and excitement than GT5.
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Yes I Did change to sim and and all assists of as soon as possiblo. Just abs at minimum.

Don't get me wrong FM4 is a great game. Might be my runner-up for GT6 at the moments when I want that loud action. But it still feels numb an a bit slippery in a wrong way. I just can't feel as much feedback or in control.
 
Johnnypenso
How about GTP add to the AUP that only people who own high end wheels can comment on the physics or handling model of any racing game? You do realize that controller users can be and are extremely fast, so using simple logic we can deduce that they must intimately be in tune with the underlying physics engine of GT, Forza etc?
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I'm not going to even bother trying to explain why you're wrong.
 
Hetare21
Enthusia_Professional_Racing_Coverart.png
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This is a game I never tried. A lot of people say it's a really different and worth trying. Too bad I don't have my PS2 anymore. I think I only saw it once in my local video game store MANY years ago.
 
Haitauer
Yes I Did change to sim and and all assists of as soon as possiblo. Just abs at minimum.

Don't get me wrong FM4 is a great game. Might be my runner-up for GT6 at the moments when I want that loud action. But it still feels numb an a bit slippery in a wrong way. I just can't feel as much feedback or in control.
Click to expand...

I've been playing on a controller forever. A very unbiased straightforward opinion...here's the thing with GT: the physics model is a bit linear compared to Forza, so you get away with small mistakes, it's not as unforgiving.

And the thing with Forza: the tire model alone introduces some very interesting nuisances while you're driving. You've got to pick your lines carefully, braking zones very carefully.. and master the use of throttle during turns and exits. It's the driving model that forces you to adapt and learn all these skills, rather than the other way around.

GT's grip physics are far too forgiving. I assure you race cars, or even high-end sports or exotics do not have such unbelievable grip like that IRL. You get funny ideas.. you're looking at huge repair bills.

Coming from GT, I was so pleased with Forza's model... I had a friend instantly come over to test it out, who incidentally had owned several AWD and RWD cars over more than a decade, ranging between 400 and 750 HP. He's a sim lover too, mostly likes to sim on a PC. He said T10 had nailed it very well. He got a used X360 just for Forza.

I can understand that's just personal opinion, but you really are missing out on one of the best driving games on the X360. Set your controller to normal if you want the control to be more like GT or FM3. Get a wheel for the ultimate thrill. (if you do, make sure you have the latest wheel firmware and game update).

Happy motoring mate! :D

JDM_Tuning_S3OZ
You're trying to say you know what feels more realistic when using a controller?
Get a wheel and some real life driving experience before you try to start another FM v GT war.

I've owned FM4 and I'll tell you this, GT is miles ahead of FM physics wise.
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I honestly don't think you've read any of my past posts or comments on the whole Forza vs GT physics discussion. My comments on Forza ARE based on real life driving, not comparisons with other games. You DO NOT need a wheel to understand or come to terms with a driving game's physics. Your inputs and how the car reacts is enough evidence of what's at work in the physics engine. Granted, a wheel takes that experience to the next level.

On previous gen, FM4 is king when it comes to real-world driving physics. GT is marketed very cleverly as an actual simulator, when even Kaz knows its not.

@Scaff, would you please enlighten this gentleman? I just don't have the patience to dig up any technical data at the moment!
 
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You guys made me want to play Enthusia again. Well sadly my Ps2 isn't working :(, My ps3 version is just the one after the backwards compatibility :mad: and same goes to ps4 and thing called E:censored: will be lagging to hell and with Large amount of bugs...

maybe because my PS2 slim has dirt inside so any help will be welcome.
 
ToyGTone
You guys made me want to play Enthusia again. Well sadly my Ps2 isn't working :(, My ps3 version is just the one after the backwards compatibility :mad: and same goes to ps4 and thing called E:censored: will be lagging to hell and with Large amount of bugs...

maybe because my PS2 slim has dirt inside so any help will be welcome.
Click to expand...

Just take your console to a repair shop, ask him to open it up, put the lens aside and clean all components with a blower. You should then have the lens cleaned with a damp cotton swab followed by a dry dab. That's it. It's the PS2's lens.. causes a lot of grievances and annoyances. I had to take my fat PS2 for a service every year, until it finally died. Then got a slim model and interestingly did not have to get it serviced even after 3 years. Maybe it had a better lens unit.

Both the PS1 and 2 were notorious for having the lens die out prematurely. Once you do get it cleaned out, make sure you cover it up properly from every angle, kind of how your electronic components come packaged in a box. This is the only way to ensure it keeps running smoothly. I do the same to my X360. Been running without a hitch since I got it (again) in early 2010.

Dust, humidity and static...bad news for these optical products.
 
PS2 slim has the lens actually visible when you open the drive to insert a disk. You can get a cotton swab and some rubbing alcohol (at least 90% if possible) and try cleaning the lens yourself to save some money. Just need a steady hand and good lighting and otherwise it's pretty easy. If the DRE is the issue that will probably fix it up.
 
Speedster911
A very unbiased straightforward opinion...here's the thing with GT: the physics model is a bit linear compared to Forza, so you get away with small mistakes, it's not as unforgiving.

And the thing with Forza: the tire model alone introduces some very interesting nuisances while you're driving. You've got to pick your lines carefully, braking zones very carefully.. and master the use of throttle during turns and exits. It's the driving model that forces you to adapt and learn all these skills, rather than the other way around.
Click to expand...

Speedster911
GT's grip physics are far too forgiving. I assure you race cars, or even high-end sports or exotics do not have such unbelievable grip like that IRL.
Click to expand...

Speedster911
On previous gen, FM4 is king when it comes to real-world driving physics. GT is marketed very cleverly as an actual simulator, when even Kaz knows its not.
Click to expand...
Not sure what GT games have been you playing.

GT6 vs FM4. Same cars, same track, no aids.


 
I think the impression that GT glosses over small details in the physics is actually often due to its ABS system.

This has been discussed to death in the past, but there's a reason I wasn't really playing the game as much when my load cell was broken.

GT's ABS adapts to the grip available on each wheel, and the direction that's applied in has a natural stabilising effect. Additionally, no ABS system acts / responds immediately, like GT's does.

So, for a better impression of the actual underlying physics (and not its controls), I recommend turning ABS off.
 
HuskyGT
This is a game I never tried. A lot of people say it's a really different and worth trying. Too bad I don't have my PS2 anymore. I think I only saw it once in my local video game store MANY years ago.
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I remember way back when I ranted this game. My fat PS2 couldn't play GT4 at all and I was so so deprassed when I couldn't play it. When I saw Enthuisa for the first time, I was like "Gran Turismo? I'LL GET IT!" So I did, but ranted it. :) During my time with it I started complaining saying how hard the game was, and wished it was as easy as GT4. However, after getting used to the physics, I actually started to have so much fun with Enthuisa that it tought me so many things on how to handle a car, and I even thanked it for being a game I can spend time with since my old PS2 couldn't play GT4 period (but now I can with a new PS2 slim I bought years ago).

There is a thread about Enthusia on this site, I can link you to it.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/board/enthusia.147/

If I remember right, there was explanation on why Enthuisa's physics was better than GT4's physics, and I actually agreed. @Hyland and @Wolfe owns Enthuisa, and I think they can give you a very good input on why the game's physics was so much better, and possibly the game overall as well. For me, the reason why Enthuisa had better physics is because the cars actually felt like real cars. In GT4 the cars felt there were on ice the whole time. I even found out I accidently left the aids on and took them off in GT4, and the cars STILL didn't felt like real cars at all to me, even in GT5 it was the same thing. No wonder I whined so much about Enthuisa being too hard. I was playing the real driving simulator this entire time in the PS2 era that possessed incredible physics on consoles at the time, and it didn't proclaimed as one either.

Overall, it's a really good game that I wish was given more attention, although its career mode is alittle...bluh. But the cars, tracks and especially physics alone is where Enthuisa REALLY shines, totally worth it! :D Check this out.


As a bonus, Enthuisa even has this car everybody loves as well. :)
 
Griffith500
I think the impression that GT glosses over small details in the physics is actually often due to its ABS system.
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Often, the claims stated are too gross to be only a matter of playing with ABS.

I think is more due to people playing the game mostly in career mode, with mandatory SRF ON and not bothering to change the default gripier tyres. Also to don't switch off completely all the less known default aids (ABS-0, grip to real, active steering off and assisted steering off). All that plus experiencing the game with a controller instead of a 900º steering wheel, missing all the extra physical feedback throught the wheel and assuming the exclusive controller buffers and permanent steering aids as a mandatory part of the GT's physical model.

I'm tired of reading people playing the game and talking out loud about physics and realism that still don't knows about the effects of the grip set to "real" in the wet tracks. Or playing with racing softs to beat real track laps and complaining about the lack of realism. So figure all the GT disinformation that can still exist out there, forget about the ocasional players or the fans of other games looking for something negative to add to their list.

@super_gt, the above GT6 vid runs with comfort soft. There are still two grades less of tail-happyness available if you wan to match the real vid. In GT4 the time and handling was more accurate with comfort hards so it should be the same with GT6, as was an old car with very worn tyres due to the high speed constant sideways.
 
TokoTurismo
I remember way back when I ranted this game. My fat PS2 couldn't play GT4 at all and I was so so deprassed when I couldn't play it. When I saw Enthuisa for the first time, I was like "Gran Turismo? I'LL GET IT!" So I did, but ranted it. :) During my time with it I started complaining saying how hard the game was, and wished it was as easy as GT4. However, after getting used to the physics, I actually started to have so much fun with Enthuisa that it tought me so many things on how to handle a car, and I even thanked it for being a game I can spend time with since my old PS2 couldn't play GT4 period (but now I can with a new PS2 slim I bought years ago).

There is a thread about Enthusia on this site, I can link you to it.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/board/enthusia.147/

If I remember right, there was explanation on why Enthuisa's physics was better than GT4's physics, and I actually agreed. @Hyland and @Wolfe owns Enthuisa, and I think they can give you a very good input on why the game's physics was so much better, and possibly the game overall as well. For me, the reason why Enthuisa had better physics is because the cars actually felt like real cars. In GT4 the cars felt there were on ice the whole time. I even found out I accidently left the aids on and took them off in GT4, and the cars STILL didn't felt like real cars at all to me, even in GT5 it was the same thing. No wonder I whined so much about Enthuisa being too hard. I was playing the real driving simulator this entire time in the PS2 era that possessed incredible physics on consoles at the time, and it didn't proclaimed as one either.

Overall, it's a really good game that I wish was given more attention, although its career mode is alittle...bluh. But the cars, tracks and especially physics alone is where Enthuisa REALLY shines, totally worth it! :D Check this out.


As a bonus, Enthuisa even has this car everybody loves as well. :)
Click to expand...


OMG, I feel like I missed something big :( I'm very impressed with this game, judging it by 2004 standards. I'm pretty sure this game's physics beat GT4 by far. I'm actually intrigued by this game. It looks just like GT4 and it even sounds like Gran Turismo.

It's a shame I could never play it. And I remember I had the same problem with my fat PS2 not being able to read GT4. I was looking for a good car game that replaced it, but I eventually got my PS2 fixed and GT4 was the only thing I played.
 
Zer0
@super_gt, the above GT6 vid runs with comfort soft. There are still two grades less of tail-happyness available if you wan to match the real vid. In GT4 the time and handling was more accurate with comfort hards so it should be the same with GT6, as was an old car with very worn tyres due to the high speed constant sideways.
Click to expand...
No matter what tires you will put to this car it won't be as tail happy as the real car.
 
HuskyGT
OMG, I feel like I missed something big :( I'm very impressed with this game, judging it by 2004 standards. I'm pretty sure this game's physics beat GT4 by far. I'm actually intrigued by this game. It looks just like GT4 and it even sounds like Gran Turismo.

It's a shame I could never play it. And I remember I had the same problem with my fat PS2 not being able to read GT4. I was looking for a good car game that replaced it, but I eventually got my PS2 fixed and GT4 was the only thing I played.
Click to expand...
Sadly it's a very rare game to find nowadays. :(
 
TokoTurismo
I remember way back when I ranted this game. My fat PS2 couldn't play GT4 at all and I was so so deprassed when I couldn't play it. When I saw Enthuisa for the first time, I was like "Gran Turismo? I'LL GET IT!" So I did, but ranted it. :) During my time with it I started complaining saying how hard the game was, and wished it was as easy as GT4. However, after getting used to the physics, I actually started to have so much fun with Enthuisa that it tought me so many things on how to handle a car, and I even thanked it for being a game I can spend time with since my old PS2 couldn't play GT4 period (but now I can with a new PS2 slim I bought years ago).

There is a thread about Enthusia on this site, I can link you to it.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/board/enthusia.147/

If I remember right, there was explanation on why Enthuisa's physics was better than GT4's physics, and I actually agreed. @Hyland and @Wolfe owns Enthuisa, and I think they can give you a very good input on why the game's physics was so much better, and possibly the game overall as well. For me, the reason why Enthuisa had better physics is because the cars actually felt like real cars. In GT4 the cars felt there were on ice the whole time. I even found out I accidently left the aids on and took them off in GT4, and the cars STILL didn't felt like real cars at all to me, even in GT5 it was the same thing. No wonder I whined so much about Enthuisa being too hard. I was playing the real driving simulator this entire time in the PS2 era that possessed incredible physics on consoles at the time, and it didn't proclaimed as one either.

Overall, it's a really good game that I wish was given more attention, although its career mode is alittle...bluh. But the cars, tracks and especially physics alone is where Enthuisa REALLY shines, totally worth it! :D Check this out.


As a bonus, Enthuisa even has this car everybody loves as well. :)
Click to expand...




In this video you can see that the cars have better quality than in GT4, especially the rims and the headlights, it's a great game.
 
You guys are really making me wish I hadn't sold my PS2. I'd get Enthusia just to experience the physics if I had it to this day.

The thing with GT is ... the hype they've created over the years.. and thanks to the graphics, GT academy events and replays.. I could think of more but don't really care to... has sold very well. It's this hype and the share track/car count that bring people back to GT.

Those of us avid simmers out there who prefer the driving to lean more towards actual driving always go with something like Forza and PC sims.

GT is a good timekill, or rather was for me. That's it, the game falls flat from there on. GT7 is a very good opportunity for them to redeem their franchise and show to us all what a great sim they can have. Man o man...FM5's out.. PCARS is coming.. Drive Club is all set... I don't know what strategy Kaz has to keep up with these giants.. but it better be a realistic one.
 
TokoTurismo
Sadly it's a very rare game to find nowadays. :(
Click to expand...
This

I've only ever seen it twice, and both times I bought it, as I stupidly sold it the first time not realising it's rarity.

My god, what an amazing game. The cars, the tracks, the physics which put gt4 to shame.

It failed because it was too hard, but of course only the most awesome people get this games beauty anyway ;)

You see this in the shop? BUY IT

Already have it? NEVER let it go :cool:
 
Off topic: Konami needs to be more active this generation.. they had a Batman game on the SNES that was absolutely brilliant. Silent Hill on previous gen wasn't bad either.

Two devs I want to see this generation make really good racing games: Konami and Bizarre Studios.

ToyGTone
I'm actually Cleaned my ps2 which was very dirty inside and now i'm enjoying playing Enthuisa.
Thanks to who tried to help me (@Tornado and @Speedster911) and everyone who made me want to play it again.
Click to expand...

Hey, that's fantastic, I know the feeling! :D

Happy lapping! :cheers:

Post some shots when you get around to it.
 
Sorry guys, I guess I didn't help matters by collecting three copies of Enthusia for myself. :embarrassed: But if you have an operable PS2, you can find it at online retailers, as GTP_CargoRatt pointed out:
GTP_CargoRatt
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006IIPUS/?tag=gtplanet-20

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=videogames&field-keywords=Enthusia Professional Racing - PlayStation 2
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I have a badly scratched copy I'm using first (which reads perfectly on my new(er) refurbished PS2), a copy that's half as bad, and a clean copy, to forestall the search for another copy if disc failure occurs. I also bought the BradyGames strategy guide, years after the fact, just to collect it. :) It actually has some neat & useful stuff the game doesn't tell you, like the weight of every car for each weight reduction level, how many points each car needs to advance to the next tuning level, and which cars are eligible for specific Enthusia Life events.

To touch (briefly!) on the GT vs FM topic above, I left GT4 for Enthusia, then bought an Xbox 360 and followed the Forza series. But even FM4's driving experience doesn't satisfy the way Enthusia does, which is why I still play it when I get tired of any newer racing game. Every race is a treat, and each car feels unique.
 
Well GT6's HSR never works on my PS3 so I cant do the sunday cup, but I do a few laps of Nurburgring in my Focus ST each day and then go onto either GTA or any of my old PS2 games, currently I'm on Underground 2, start of Stage 2, with a Hummer, 240SX, and Hyundai.
 

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