New physics (update 1.31)
- Thread starter Dess81
- 594 comments
- 79,568 views
- 1
- United States
I just bought a PS5 3/3/23 i bought ratchet and clank as my first game . I'm like yes love this. Then I was up in the air between gt7 and nfs . I got nfs and driving the cars felt like driving on ice .. so i thought gt7 $40 why not . 27 days in got more then half the cars. 96% of the races are gold .. I fell in love with the game.. played it for the first time since the patch. And I want to smash my ps .. the death of video games are updates. I remember playing world of warcraft. it came to a point that there updates caused more issues then they fix. I don't want to go to work and think about a fat stank ass joint then get home to smoke Reggie . So I don't want to think . I'm playing a race simulator meanwhile it's more like playing cruise'n' USA.. maybe cause I'm an adult and can actually drive. But not one of these cars before this patch or after this patch feel like a real car. so where's this realness at from this patch ? are do I need a $500 vr and a $700 steering wheel setup to go along with my $600 ps5. That's a used Honda that I can actually beat on and take turn with.. Not sure about anyone but ps5 and gt7 might be the end of video games for me... It's one thing to add to a game or fix what's broken . It a whole nother thing to change the whole game mid season . It's like the design team all got Yaris's with bold tires and was told to drive in the rain. Then told every car starts off like this. There not even car guys this is way we got a van instead of a Silverado.. next patch will get minivan . Truly a waste of money well looks like I'll be letting my psn run out on Sunday
- 3,458
- Gdynia
- MroczMR
THANK YOU. I was using too much Sensitivity ( FB Torque 5 and Sens 10 to be precise) because before update those recommended settings 4/1 or 4/2 were definately too light for me.
Now after update I did notice it was too high and changed to 4/2 and I'm in love. (4/1 was still too light? something wasn't right for me) Game feels great now and very immersive. I use T300 btw.
Also another question a lot of my friends did get Logitech G29's and GT7 they are compeletly new to sim racing. Can you recommend them some good starting ffb settings for GT7 on 1.31 ? I can't relate since I have different wheel and different experience.
- 142
- Netherlands
- Airwolf303
- 142
- Netherlands
- Airwolf303
The update really makes everything so much more realistic. Stoked!
Interesting. We can check this using gt7 telemetry. If anyone has a video from 1.30 we can compare.
I agree. I went through Licences B and A all over again to get a better feel of different cars / corners / tracks. Trail braking is pretty much useless, no weight on the front tyres. There seems to be a weird "threshold" where the car stops understeering and the front suddenly bites, propelling you towards the apex or making you cut the corner. This is really evident in Licence A (I think?) Suzuka hairpin with the NSX.
0 grip until what seems to be a certain speed, then all of a sudden the car turns, trail braking or not.
The only way I was able to beat the demonstration (as gold is still piss easy for me) was to unsettle the car by suddenly releasing the brakes, yanking the wheel and slightly tapping the handbrake, only way to make the thing turn at a decent speed.
Last edited:
- 17
- United Kingdom
Yes you are the only adult here who can drive! It's a game, a simcade at best, if you want total realism play iracing
- 1,441
- They/Them
- Autumnal_Glow
- AutumnalGlow
I've never driven anything near a race car so I can't speak to its accuracy, but I think the changes are good. It's fun to drive. Slightly more challenging than before, but not absurd like day 1. TCS 1 isn't crushing my speed on every corner exit and I need to be lighter on the trigger, but grip loss doesn't feel sudden like day 1 and I can recover most of the time when I do push too hard.
It's fun. That's all I can say, and all I really want.
It's fun. That's all I can say, and all I really want.
- 584
- Brazil
- skyhightrees
these kinda posts are brought to you only by GTPlanet. All rights reserved
- 15,532
- Cairo, Egypt
- GTP_SEMS
Well, as far as I am concerned, two cheers for this update, but no cigar.
I expect a hot fix next week or further adjustments next update.
- physics seem an improvement overall, but many racecars now have bad understeer
- tire model is improvement
- traction control better overall, but jerky for high powered racecars
- interaction between suspension changes, tire model and traction control does not work well. It feels elements were developed individually, but not as a package. Poor quality control?
- AI is even more daft than before. Runs out of fuel, drives at half speed on race line etc.
I expect a hot fix next week or further adjustments next update.
Last edited:
- 698
- Didcot, Oxfordshire
- danardif1
It strikes me that a lot of the talk around 'understeer' and such is connected mainly to two things, one is a change and one is a carry over that is impacting the other changes...
1. People driving Gr3s with BOP Fixed setups. These setups are absolute junk. This is why there are 'meta' cars for certain tracks because PD applies the same setup perimeters to ALL Gr3 cars, meaning that it will suit some cars everywhere and some nowhere. They put a lot of built-in understeer to make them 'safe', so when the other physics changes come in that have affected the next thing I'll mention, they make them even worse in that regard...
One of two things can be done to address this. Petition PD to update the setups, or petition them to remove the suspension/downforce figures etc from the BOP calculation and make it a weight/bhp thing, opening up those perimeters to driver adjustment. I've mostly stopped racing Daily Races because of this, and the league racing I do on GT7 we use the bhp/weight BOP figures with open setups for everything else (it's a shame there's no way to apply this within the game, so we operate on a trust-based system for this).
2. The aerodynamics seem to work much more realistically. Downforce bleeds off the car when the speed lowers, so if your car is mechanically setup for more understeer, as soon as the mechanical grip becomes more important, this will be where you feel this. If you experience understeer in medium or higher speed corners, this is a problem with your aero balance. You might need to reduce your rear wing levels.
1. People driving Gr3s with BOP Fixed setups. These setups are absolute junk. This is why there are 'meta' cars for certain tracks because PD applies the same setup perimeters to ALL Gr3 cars, meaning that it will suit some cars everywhere and some nowhere. They put a lot of built-in understeer to make them 'safe', so when the other physics changes come in that have affected the next thing I'll mention, they make them even worse in that regard...
One of two things can be done to address this. Petition PD to update the setups, or petition them to remove the suspension/downforce figures etc from the BOP calculation and make it a weight/bhp thing, opening up those perimeters to driver adjustment. I've mostly stopped racing Daily Races because of this, and the league racing I do on GT7 we use the bhp/weight BOP figures with open setups for everything else (it's a shame there's no way to apply this within the game, so we operate on a trust-based system for this).
2. The aerodynamics seem to work much more realistically. Downforce bleeds off the car when the speed lowers, so if your car is mechanically setup for more understeer, as soon as the mechanical grip becomes more important, this will be where you feel this. If you experience understeer in medium or higher speed corners, this is a problem with your aero balance. You might need to reduce your rear wing levels.
Last edited:
- 16
- Spain
I've already posted on undocumented changes thread, I found that you can't apply gas and brakes at the same time in the 918 Spyder, can anyone confirm that? It only happens with that car.
- 181
You just can't abuse the ABS anymore for trail braking. You can still do it, but need to give about 50% brake pressure while turn in. I got gold the second try with trail braking. When entering the hairpin, right before turn in, you can load the brakes at 100% then while you turn in, lift off to about 40-50% and you can maneuver to the apex and accelerate out. It's pretty easy. The game is just more strict now with the traction circle with using ABS.
- 698
- United States
Finally was able to make time to play last night and the results are overwhelmingly positive. Still have only put about two hours into things since 1.31, but here are my thoughts so far. For reference I play on a T300RS 599XX on PSVR2.
There are so many things to talk about! My T300 feels smoother and there is a ton more road feel that comes through, and most important of all... managing opposite lock IS A THING NOW!
Tires are markedly different from each other. Cars feel like they put much more weight on them, sidewalls have clear differences in pliability/flex depending on tire selection, and all this can be picked up through new communication through the wheel. Going from CS-SH-RS on a DC Integra presents stark differences in feel and the limit with which you can push into them before understeer. A race-suspended road car properly tuned on slicks provides a TON more steering weight and awesome load building as you find more and more grip that isn't present in road tires. My T300 did not need any adjustment for me from before, and the range in load from a CS to an RS is HUGE (LOTS of load on wheel when really pushing a slick for low speed grip, very light overall with a CS). The overall range and delicacy of the wheel is very much improved. When a slick is combined with stiff, well sorted suspension, there is so much communication coming through. It's amazing.
4WD cars no longer feel like RWD cars on corner exit. Before they would still oversteer on throttle even when pointed "straight", instead of it pulling you out with the fronts like in reality. Now you can play with the balance between trail-braking into a corner, loading the fronts and then exploiting all the traction available on exit with realistic on-throttle understeer/oversteer. Balance is important to avoid understeer, but it is so satisfying to finally have the ability to pull out of corners like an AWD car should. Really looking forward to tuning some oversteer into some 4WD cars.
I built my IRL RX7 in game and it was never really satisfying to drive. The same goes for a stock FD, they were WAY too unstable, super twitchy in oversteer, nearly impossible to hold opposite lock, slide at triple-digit speeds with little input etc., but now it is so much more manageable, much more planted, communicative, and more like its real life attitude. Now, you can safely push them into oversteer, find lock, hold it there with the throttle, and then power out while bleeding off steering angle and waiting for the tires to regain traction. Oversteer isn't just a time sucking, drop-throttle catch-game anymore! It's a fluid, realistic, exploitable trait now. This goes for just about any RWD car in game, and was truly one of the most broken characteristics of GT7 prior to 1.31. This is an amazing revelation in the model, and this one thing makes the whole update a win.
Porsches are much easier to drive, which leads to them being much more capable, if not a little less fun. The 930 Turbo is (broken record) much more stable, very prone to on-throttle understeer, but the rear-engine nature is still fully exploitable. The 997 GT3 is much the same, but amplified. It's a little bit of a learning curve to find my "center" with them again, but it's so much fun to do so.
I've only driven one race car so far, the GR3 SC430 at the new Nurburgring 800, and I'm having a hard time finding the same "understeer" argument many are coming up with. Firstly, the tire temps play a huge role in traction, and there is a marked grip increase when you've put some heat in them, so don't go wild or get judgy about driving a car fresh out of the pits. The cars definitely do not turn in on the brakes in the way they did before, but I don't find it in any way unusual, or hard to deal with, and they can be pushed far into their traction limits with satisfying load increases through the wheel. While I notice some extension in braking (which is also me likely being overly cautious), the car still felt very planted, capable, and exploitable. With tire-wear at 10x, it still had much left in its set of RHs at the end of the race, and despite needing to save fuel on the last lap, still beat 2nd by over 37 seconds with zero pre-race practice. It was a super fun race.
I also made some time to run the new TT with the Toyota Alphard and it was WAY more fun than I thought it would be. Got gold on lap three and had enough fun to keep on pushing for a few more laps. Got down to a 1:28.2XX, and there is still much more in that big ol' fridge. Very surprising how fun it is to drive!
All in all, I'm 100% enjoying this update. It is several orders of magnitude better than what we had before, and while still not perfect, it is so much closer to mimicking real-world car attitudes and abilities. The power-oversteer thing for me is such a huge thing, and means a lot for the tire model and driving realism. I can't wait to put more miles on everything.
I really don't understand the people saying that this "ruined" the game, complaining about too-much understeer, or the various other negative things that have been said. I know I can't speak for controller users, so some of these things might be selective, but if you have a decent wheel, there should be nothing but positives from 1.31 as far as I can see. The balance between under/over steer is definitely more delicate. You can no longer just stand on ABS and turn in like before. Trail braking is done with a progressive release of steering angle and brakes, and it still works just fine. If you have a wheel, this communication is right-there telling you exactly where you are with traction and when you've exceeded it. For some, simply slowing down and recalibrating your style may be necessary to find your balance again.
There are so many things to talk about! My T300 feels smoother and there is a ton more road feel that comes through, and most important of all... managing opposite lock IS A THING NOW!
Tires are markedly different from each other. Cars feel like they put much more weight on them, sidewalls have clear differences in pliability/flex depending on tire selection, and all this can be picked up through new communication through the wheel. Going from CS-SH-RS on a DC Integra presents stark differences in feel and the limit with which you can push into them before understeer. A race-suspended road car properly tuned on slicks provides a TON more steering weight and awesome load building as you find more and more grip that isn't present in road tires. My T300 did not need any adjustment for me from before, and the range in load from a CS to an RS is HUGE (LOTS of load on wheel when really pushing a slick for low speed grip, very light overall with a CS). The overall range and delicacy of the wheel is very much improved. When a slick is combined with stiff, well sorted suspension, there is so much communication coming through. It's amazing.
4WD cars no longer feel like RWD cars on corner exit. Before they would still oversteer on throttle even when pointed "straight", instead of it pulling you out with the fronts like in reality. Now you can play with the balance between trail-braking into a corner, loading the fronts and then exploiting all the traction available on exit with realistic on-throttle understeer/oversteer. Balance is important to avoid understeer, but it is so satisfying to finally have the ability to pull out of corners like an AWD car should. Really looking forward to tuning some oversteer into some 4WD cars.
I built my IRL RX7 in game and it was never really satisfying to drive. The same goes for a stock FD, they were WAY too unstable, super twitchy in oversteer, nearly impossible to hold opposite lock, slide at triple-digit speeds with little input etc., but now it is so much more manageable, much more planted, communicative, and more like its real life attitude. Now, you can safely push them into oversteer, find lock, hold it there with the throttle, and then power out while bleeding off steering angle and waiting for the tires to regain traction. Oversteer isn't just a time sucking, drop-throttle catch-game anymore! It's a fluid, realistic, exploitable trait now. This goes for just about any RWD car in game, and was truly one of the most broken characteristics of GT7 prior to 1.31. This is an amazing revelation in the model, and this one thing makes the whole update a win.
Porsches are much easier to drive, which leads to them being much more capable, if not a little less fun. The 930 Turbo is (broken record) much more stable, very prone to on-throttle understeer, but the rear-engine nature is still fully exploitable. The 997 GT3 is much the same, but amplified. It's a little bit of a learning curve to find my "center" with them again, but it's so much fun to do so.
I've only driven one race car so far, the GR3 SC430 at the new Nurburgring 800, and I'm having a hard time finding the same "understeer" argument many are coming up with. Firstly, the tire temps play a huge role in traction, and there is a marked grip increase when you've put some heat in them, so don't go wild or get judgy about driving a car fresh out of the pits. The cars definitely do not turn in on the brakes in the way they did before, but I don't find it in any way unusual, or hard to deal with, and they can be pushed far into their traction limits with satisfying load increases through the wheel. While I notice some extension in braking (which is also me likely being overly cautious), the car still felt very planted, capable, and exploitable. With tire-wear at 10x, it still had much left in its set of RHs at the end of the race, and despite needing to save fuel on the last lap, still beat 2nd by over 37 seconds with zero pre-race practice. It was a super fun race.
I also made some time to run the new TT with the Toyota Alphard and it was WAY more fun than I thought it would be. Got gold on lap three and had enough fun to keep on pushing for a few more laps. Got down to a 1:28.2XX, and there is still much more in that big ol' fridge. Very surprising how fun it is to drive!
All in all, I'm 100% enjoying this update. It is several orders of magnitude better than what we had before, and while still not perfect, it is so much closer to mimicking real-world car attitudes and abilities. The power-oversteer thing for me is such a huge thing, and means a lot for the tire model and driving realism. I can't wait to put more miles on everything.
I really don't understand the people saying that this "ruined" the game, complaining about too-much understeer, or the various other negative things that have been said. I know I can't speak for controller users, so some of these things might be selective, but if you have a decent wheel, there should be nothing but positives from 1.31 as far as I can see. The balance between under/over steer is definitely more delicate. You can no longer just stand on ABS and turn in like before. Trail braking is done with a progressive release of steering angle and brakes, and it still works just fine. If you have a wheel, this communication is right-there telling you exactly where you are with traction and when you've exceeded it. For some, simply slowing down and recalibrating your style may be necessary to find your balance again.
Just had to quote this for the hilarious hypocrisy of it. Many people here, myself included, have a lot of spirited/track IRL seat time in cars and love the new update. Tidgeny, Super GT, Kie, Igor Fraga and many other talented sim/IRL drivers think this is a huge step in the right direction. So, why is it that an "adult" such as yourself is struggling with it so much, while us "children" see how good it is and are having such a good time? I'm all for discussion and disagreement, but calling others children while acting like a child isn't going to do you any favors.
Try it yourself, it really turns much better than you can.
- 354
- Pennsylvania
- Umber1911
- Fire Yoshi
Oh absolutely.
I have been steering with the D-Pad in Gran Turismo games for years and it has always felt manageable because of the way PD implements them. It's not as simple as moving my thumb slightly to the right like what's being suggested by others. If it were that simple then I would have done so years and years ago. If the left analog stick's position were to be swapped with the D-Pad, then I would absolutely drive with the left stick.
Of course, I'm no Igor Fraga, but I consider myself fairly quick for someone that steers with the D-Pad, as I can hang with some pretty decent drivers.
Unlike what some of the remarks to my comment are stating, D-Pad steering isn't as 'on-off' as it seems. It's hard to explain, but it's like PD implemented some sort of directional 'acceleration' mechanic where holding down left or right will slowly turn the wheel around instead of just going from neutral to fully turned in an instant, and the speed at which the wheel rotates depends on how long you hold it down, as well the value you have the steering sensitivity set to. If you were to switch to the cockpit cam and try steering with the D-Pad (Pre 1.31), you'll notice that it's a lot smoother looking than you think. Some turns require quick taps in succession, some require slower, more drawn out ones etc. It all comes down to muscle memory, and any driver who has mastered D-Pad steering will know exactly when I'm talking about.
For me, steering with the D-Pad has always felt smooth and manageable in every Gran Turismo game because PD did a good job programming how it works in their games. Even in 7 it felt good until this most recent update.
Like you mentioned, just the slightest tap of the D-Pad feels like you are going from neutral to a half turned wheel in an instant, even at -2, which is really tough to manage. It's comical watching my car twitch back and forth on a straightway because I'm desperately trying to keep my car in a straight line.
I'm really, really hoping that this was actually a mistake or an oversight by PD, and that they will correct this in a future hotfix. Hopefully they can fix this without modifying how the physics work on a steering wheel, because most wheel users seem to like the new physics. However, because we D-Pad users are so small in numbers, I feel like our cries for help will go unnoticed. I pray that I'm wrong though.
The fact is, PD has given us the option to steer with the D-Pad in pretty much every game they have ever made, and it has always worked well. I don't think it's too outlandish to expect a long time feature like this to work properly in a game I paid full price for.
It truly is a shame, because I grind for credits in this game all the time (I primarily play offline, but I will hop on Multiplayer mode and jump around random lobbies on occasion) in which I have fun doing so, and I'm very close to owning at least one copy of every car in the game.
Now my mood for playing this game has dwindled away, so my grinding and car collecting will have to be put on hold in hopes that PD is able to do something about this. Again, I know I'm in the small minority when it comes to how I control my car, and I don't mean to sound like a spoiled brat. I hate complaining about a game and series that I really love and want to continue enjoying, but this is genuinely very disappointing and frustrating for someone like me who has been driving this way for so, so long.
My apologies for the tl;dr.
- 698
- Didcot, Oxfordshire
- danardif1
Bang on with all of that. I want to echo the comment on the Porsches, especially the expected behaviours of the power understeer and lift off oversteer. Both are markedly more present and are actually things you can subtly induce in the car if you want them to occur. They may be easier to drive than before but they drive far more as they are supposed to. Difficult doesn't equal a high level of simulation.
The tight feeling I'd often feel in the steering on lots of cars is mostly gone or can be made to go with readjustment of the setup on some of the cars too. I still feel like I need to re-find the sweet spot with both the ingame and Fanatec settings, but with the settings carried over from before everything is still better.
- 389
- United States
I'm a controller user (analog stick for steering). This update was a huge step forward for me as well. The new haptics are also helping me in understanding the limits. The biggest difference was addition of two new traction control settings below the old TC1. It has narrowed down my gap to wheel users considerably.
Trail braking got confusing with this update though. Not sure if it is less effective or is just not working.
I've been racing with keyboard for 20 years. Less than a year ago, I bought Playstation for first time and since then have switched to analog stick for steering. I can attest to you when you say that D-pad steering is not really binary. Folks who raced me in past could never tell that I was using keyboard. Almost every racing game has implemented keyboard/D-pad perfectly. Sad to know that this update has broken D-pad steering. Hope they listen and revert this.
Similar threads
Latest Posts
-
-
Intelligence: Genetic inheritance or function of effort?- Latest: HenrySwanson
-
Gran Turismo 7’s Invitation System Is Broken: Here’s How We’d Fix It- Latest: Scuderia Paul
-
