NYC Bans Trans Fats At Restaurants

[FoolKiller]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,234540,00.html

NEW YORK — New Yorkers can officially farewell trans fats from the menu.

The Board of Health voted Tuesday to make New York the nation's first city to ban artery-clogging artificial trans fats at restaurants — from the corner pizzeria to high-end bakeries.

I was afraid this would pass but I can't believe it actually did. What is a reasonable argument behind this? I understand that if you think secondhand smoke is a truly harmful thing you would want smoking taken out of public gathering places (even though I disagree), but this is blatantly saying to the citizens of New York that they are too stupid to make healthy choices so the city will remove the bad choices.

How long before we remove salt and say that candy can't be made to look appealing to children? Will sugar be removed as well?

Then there is of course the fact that restaurants have to rearrange all their recipes to remove all trans fats. The restaurants have to possibly even change their menus. My question is, that small family-owned place that has the best of a certain type of food because they have been using their secret family recipe may not be so good anymore. Changing the recipes may be damaging to some places.

Then there is the entire concept of rights. A restaurant owner isn't even allowed to use an FDA approved product for their food that they sell in a restaurant of they own. Where does the government get off making this kind of invasion into private property?


OK, deep breath. I'm better.

It isn't stopping with New York either:

Chicago is discussing it, my home city of Louisville, KY is considering it, Boston is considering it, and it evens appears there is a push in Canada getting started.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we start using this stuff so we would quit using butter and lard and could eat healthier? I guess that worked well.

Why don't these health advocates and politicians say what they are really meaning, "We think the citizens of our city are too stupid to make healthy decisions for themselves." That is what they mean, because there is no other reason to do this in teh name of health unless you don't think the citizens are capable of making a healthy decision.

 

[Sage]

Oh hamburgers, that actually passed?? I thought that was some piece of joke legislation.

 

[Danoff]

I've been hearing grumblings about this for a while. I thoroughly expected a mandate from the FDA banning all use of trans-fat everywhere in America.

It's a clear invasion of government and violation of the rights of restaurant owners and consumers alike. But so is the FDA in general, so I can't get too worked up about this. We lost these rights long ago. Unlike the smoking argument, trans-fat is completely replaceable at virtually no impact to the food. It also doesn't cost a whole lot more for restaurants to stop using it - so there isn't really much of a practical argument. Granted, there's a very strong moral argument for why the government should butt out.

 

[FoolKiller]

I thiink what burns me up is statements like this:

Hansil Basin, manager of Sbarro pizza, agrees with the new laws.

"Often people don't make wise food choices even when given the option. So we have to make choices for them. It's a positive move," he said.

I thought Demolition Man was a joke, I thought 1984 was never a possible reality, but hearing someone make a comment like that and no one calling him out on it scares me.

While I am sure he didn't mean it this way, his statement makes it sound as if he wouldn't care of they came into our homes and took away everything they saw as unhealthy.

How many times will I have to hear "it is for the public good?"

 

[Danoff]

Yea I saw that quote - disgusting. The guy should have his American citizenship revoked, he obviously doesn't understand his country.

 

[FoolKiller]

Yea I saw that quote - disgusting. The guy should have his American citizenship revoked, he obviously doesn't understand his country.

If he wants it that way then I can think of a few countries that he might enjoy, but this is not (or at least should not be) one of them.

 

[Swift]

Wow...uh...hmmm...

this is just the beginning. Next they will go after sodium levels and demand that breads and cerals contain more fiber. Then they'll say the sugar level of Capn Crunch is too high and go after that.

This really scares me not because of trans-fats(I've recently cut them out of my diet voluntarily) but because it opens the door and sets precedent for them to take away more things.

 

[FoolKiller]

this is just the beginning. Next they will go after sodium levels and demand that breads and cerals contain more fiber. Then they'll say the sugar level of Capn Crunch is too high and go after that.

As long as they allow crunch berries.

This really scares me not because of trans-fats(I've recently cut them out of my diet voluntarily) but because it opens the door and sets precedent for them to take away more things.

Yeah, I rarely eat out, and when I do I usually ingest more liquid carbohydrates than trans fats, but for me it is the government stepping in where they do not belong.

I called this when the smoking bans started and argued vehemently with my brother about that. I just found out that he thinks this is a good idea too because (here it is) it is the best thing for the people.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

Doesn't bother me... just as long as I can still trade, I don't really care what the government wants to eliminate from my diet. Now if the headline read:

NYC Institutes Tobin Tax

Then that'd be a different story.

Other than the obvious ideological objections to this policy, why is this a problem? So far, I'm the only poster in this thread who's been affected by this...

 

[Danoff]

I just found out that he thinks this is a good idea too because (here it is) it is the best thing for the people.

I'm sorry to say it, but your brother (along with a huge portion of America) also needs to be deported to Europe.

 

[Zrow]

Oh hamburgers, that actually passed?? I thought that was some piece of joke legislation.

I think you may need a new avatar, Sage...

 

[FoolKiller]

Other than the obvious ideological objections to this policy, why is this a problem? So far, I'm the only poster in this thread who's been affected by this...

Because, just like the smokikng bans the rest of the country, or at least east of the Rockies, is waiting to see how this goes in New York.

I'm sorry to say it, but your brother (along with a huge portion of America) also needs to be deported to Europe.

He's already said that if it weren't for uprooting his entire life and leaving all his family and friends behind he would move there.

 

[Sage]

I think you may need a new avatar, Sage...

Yup, you caught me.

 

[Swift]

This is somewhat off topic, but if any of you have been following the Marvel Civil War, this is the type of legislation leading up to that. Infact, it's almost identical.

Marvel Civil War: Some young idiot heroes bite off more then they can chew with some bad guys and 600+ people, including 60 kids, die. The government then makes it mandatory that ALL people with any superhuman powers register with the state department and become a government employee. For the good of the American people. Refusal results in indefinite incarceration. The story is how some of the heroes won't except this legislation as it takes away their rights and puts their families and friends in direct line of fire.

NYC Trans Fat issue: Heart disease is the number one killing in America by far. So, the government decides to get rid of all transfats from restaurants. Refusal to comply will result in extreme fines and possibility of closing your restaurant.

I know one is fiction and one is real. But isn't it funny how life imitates art? Not to mention the previous references to Demolition man(everything not "good" for people is outlawed. Right down to sex") and 1984.

Doesn't bother me... just as long as I can still trade, I don't really care what the government wants to eliminate from my diet. Now if the headline read:

NYC Institutes Tobin Tax

Then that'd be a different story.

Other than the obvious ideological objections to this policy, why is this a problem? So far, I'm the only poster in this thread who's been affected by this...

Brian, don't' take this the wrong way. But you're views are so singular that it's scary. You have a "if it doesn't effect me directly it's OK" attitude going and that is not a very American attitude when it comes to law. Religion, sure excellent attitude, but law effects everyone sooner or later.

 

[Pupik]

I like trans fats.

I feel NYC is discriminating against me.

I will sue NYC.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

This is somewhat off topic, but if any of you have been following the Marvel Civil War, this is the type of legislation leading up to that. Infact, it's almost identical.

Marvel Civil War: Some young idiot heroes bite off more then they can chew with some bad guys and 600+ people, including 60 kids, die. The government then makes it mandatory that ALL people with any superhuman powers register with the state department and become a government employee. For the good of the American people. Refusal results in indefinite incarceration. The story is how some of the heroes won't except this legislation as it takes away their rights and puts their families and friends in direct line of fire.

NYC Trans Fat issue: Heart disease is the number one killing in America by far. So, the government decides to get rid of all transfats from restaurants. Refusal to comply will result in extreme fines and possibility of closing your restaurant.

I know one is fiction and one is real. But isn't it funny how life imitates art? Not to mention the previous references to Demolition man(everything not "good" for people is outlawed. Right down to sex") and 1984.

Interesting analogy. Makes sense...

Brian, don't' take this the wrong way. But you're views are so singular that it's scary. You have a "if it doesn't effect me directly it's OK" attitude going and that is not a very American attitude when it comes to law. Religion, sure excellent attitude, but law effects everyone sooner or later.

Fair point... I just don't see how this is cause for alarm (that doesn't mean that I approve of it). It's not like they banned trans fat from our diets entirely. It's just not allowed to be served in restaurants or the like. Laws like this can always be overturned anyway if they're that unpopular. I don't hear anyone coming up with any reasons why trans fats should be allowed in restaurants...

I was expecting more of a "trans fats can be consumed as part of healthy diet"-type response from posters. Instead, we're getting "this opens the door to more government regulation"-type posts... hence my response.

Which brings me back to my original question... aside from the obvious ideological objections (government regulation), does anyone have any opinions as to why this is a bad thing?

 

[Danoff]

Which brings me back to my original question... aside from the obvious ideological objections (government regulation), does anyone have any opinions as to why this is a bad thing?

From a practical point of view, I don't think this is a big deal. But brushing aside the ideological objectis shouldn't be done lightly. It's about like saying:

"Aside from the killing of the jews, were the Nazis really so bad?"

Even if the answer is no (not likely, but stay with me here) - that doesn't change the fact that the question is silly. The ideological objections are the whole point.

 

[MrktMkr1986]

From a practical point of view, I don't think this is a big deal. But brushing aside the ideological objectis shouldn't be done lightly. It's about like saying:

"Aside from the killing of the jews, were the Nazis really so bad?"

Even if the answer is no (not likely, but stay with me here) - that doesn't change the fact that the question is silly. The ideological objections are the whole point.

Point taken. I wasn't trying to brush aside the ideological implications -- which I recognize are important. I just wanted to see if anyone else had anything else to say. Apparently not... back to the charts.

 

[///M-Spec]

Other than the obvious ideological objections to this policy, why is this a problem? So far, I'm the only poster in this thread who's been affected by this...

I'm affected by it. I eat in NYC at least once a month.

I think the law sucks deleterious polyunsaturated pork right out of a barrel. Nothing happens in that town unless someone stands to make a buck.

Sometime this week, I intend to excersise my constitutional right to eat tasty crap that will kill you at the nearby KFC. On the other (my) side of the Hudson.

Long live Colonel Sanders' Original Recipe.


M

 

[Sage]

Didn’t KFC recently change their ingredients so that they don’t use trans fats anymore?

[edit]: Ah, they’ll be phasing it in Spring 2007 – so you still have time to get the good stuff!

 

[Gabkicks]

this just means that fat people wont feel so guilty about eating so much fastfood and they'll eat even more

 

[ledhed]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,234540,00.html



I was afraid this would pass but I can't believe it actually did. What is a reasonable argument behind this? I understand that if you think secondhand smoke is a truly harmful thing you would want smoking taken out of public gathering places (even though I disagree), but this is blatantly saying to the citizens of New York that they are too stupid to make healthy choices so the city will remove the bad choices.

How long before we remove salt and say that candy can't be made to look appealing to children? Will sugar be removed as well?

Then there is of course the fact that restaurants have to rearrange all their recipes to remove all trans fats. The restaurants have to possibly even change their menus. My question is, that small family-owned place that has the best of a certain type of food because they have been using their secret family recipe may not be so good anymore. Changing the recipes may be damaging to some places.

Then there is the entire concept of rights. A restaurant owner isn't even allowed to use an FDA approved product for their food that they sell in a restaurant of they own. Where does the government get off making this kind of invasion into private property?


OK, deep breath. I'm better.

It isn't stopping with New York either:

Chicago is discussing it, my home city of Louisville, KY is considering it, Boston is considering it, and it evens appears there is a push in Canada getting started.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't we start using this stuff so we would quit using butter and lard and could eat healthier? I guess that worked well.

Why don't these health advocates and politicians say what they are really meaning, "We think the citizens of our city are too stupid to make healthy decisions for themselves." That is what they mean, because there is no other reason to do this in teh name of health unless you don't think the citizens are capable of making a healthy decision.

MORONS

 

[Sakiale]

Wtf? Man now I'm ashamed to be a New Yorker.

If you dont want trans fats, then dont @#$%ing eat trans fats! Its not as if theyre a bad influence and will make all kids gorge on fast food and become obese, or the person sitting next to you eating trans fats will give you obesity.

 

[TopHat]

As a New Yorker, I am thoroughly dissapointed in NYC. All of the reasons for bieng fat, is eating, we know that, but banning a certain ingredients WILL NOT MAKE US HEALTHIER.

 

[Danoff]

As far as I know...

Trans fats do not make you fat... and they don't make the food tastier. They're high in cholesterol and it's cheap for restaurants. Alternatives are not significantly more expensive, and have little to no impact on taste but contain less cholesterol.

That's the situation as I understand it. I'm not a doctor, though, obviously.

Clearly this is an invasion of government, but I don't think in this case that anyone will be harmed... only freedom eroded from the point of view of principle.

 

[OZZYGT]

What are you guys talking about???!!? Mat, Long Island is NOT the same as New York City ok buddy? you should know that.

I live here and to be honest, it's not much of a deal if you ask everybody here. We still eat food, we're not crazy for trans fat anyway.

The news says this:

New York City, long known for clogged arteries during rush hour

Ok, do you know how much time do most people here get for lunch? Rarely more than half hour, and if you are not that type of person who makes his lunch in his house and then takes it to work, then you're like the majority here, you get out of the building, take a look around, decide whether you want Chinese, Mexican, Italian, Dominican or Deli food. We have almost NO time to decide if the fried chicken wings and pork fried rice from across the street has the proper nutrients for a good healthy choice....What are you nuts???
People want to eat fast, talk while eating, do something else after they eat, pick up your kids, relax or even sleep. This is a favor that they're doing to us, and even though I know the price might increase, I really don't see why should complain for something like this...I really can't believe it, people complaining about it..pffsss,

And you know what? I used to be a very healthy guy, had a decent body, you know I never worried about gaining weight or anything like that. Now that I'm here, I can't even spare 30 minutes of my time to do some exercise until the weekend. The only time that I feel my body working out a little bit, is when I run across the street, take the N subway to 30th ave and eat at subways(the restaurant)...and of course, I don't do this everyday. All of a sudden, I gained 20 pounds! now I have a nasty little tummy I wanna get rid of!. Thousands of people like me, decide to pay huge amounts of money on gyms that you can only attend during the weekend because they open at 9 am in the morning and you happen to enter work at that same exact time, and if you finally find one that is affordable and opens between 5 and 6, you realize it's located 20 blocks away from your work or house. That's why I said "they
re doing us a favor".

I don't know about what the pace of a city in Maryland is like, or Kentucky or California or Florida...etc, what's in those states anyway?? J/K. But here....it's different.

Now, if you had a small business selling hot fried food and you know that this is going to affect the taste of your food and ending up getting a lesser profit, then too bad. Just like that, too bad.

And NO, I'm not saying "if it doesn't affects me, then I don't care!", We heard the news, we talked about it, in a matter of days the topic should go away....people will get used to it and honestly, if you complaint about this new law, what don't you complain about?!

I'm not saying this will resolve New Yorkers bad eating habits, but it sure helps. What do we loose? a dollar or two on lunch?









Ciao!

 

[Danoff]

What do we loose? a dollar or two on lunch?

Freedom.

 

[ledhed]

Another Freedom.

 

[OZZYGT]

Yeah you know what guys, you're right. We don't have food with trans fat anymore, America's freedom is doomed....

But anyway, keep moaning 'till July 2007, which is when the new rule is going to start being applied.





Ciao!

 

[Sakiale]

Here's a preliminary +rep since i cant rep you right now.