On par with GT5 premium cars? sure!
- Thread starter Dude27
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^^
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Dmarc_Atl
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Lol the shadows in shift 2 are quite jaggy too .. well atleast for ps3 version
They have cars but they dont have over 200 cars
Yea they started working on GT5 even before THE PS3 WAS MADE !! thats crazy last year people were saying it took 3 years to make gt5 then it went to 4 then 5 now your saying 6 give me a break ..
The cars in shift 2 are not anywhere close to gt5 a quick comparison will show you that
Shift 2 looks great but GT5 is far ahead
Im sure in those " 6 years" it took to make gt5 all they did was make cars ...
They have cars but they dont have over 200 cars
Well yeah, they don't have 800 PS2 quality cars, without interior and with bad sounds ported from past NFSs on PS2....
Also if we count all the different body-kits, different interiors, different liveries (you know, like GT5 does) then Shift 2 could easily have 800 cars! And you know what? I don't care because racing games aren't about how many different cars unsuitable for track racing you have! They are about providing a realistic racing environment (handling, sounds, AI, collisions, crashes) and Shift 2 delivers!
You mean that the Corvette posted above doesn't look as good as a GT5 car? Because I think it looks better and that it has a much better modelling (especially if we count the great damage and moving parts)!
But I will give you that the photo-mode in GT5 is better and can produce better pictures. But personally I don't care about a virtual digital camera simulator, I bought a racing game!
Dmarc_Atl
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well lets count all the other body kits for all the cars in gt5 while your at it
Well GT5 has, I don't know, 17 racing modifications?... that doesn't sound too much, unless you want to count the ludicrous spoilers too!! Because frankly I find the Aero Parts in GT5 to look awful!!
But I don't care about the number of cars! And Shift 2 is not about the number of cars and it wasn't advertised on having x cars! Shift 2 is about the racing experience and it delivers where it counts!
And neither graphics do a sim! What's your point? I am sure you would have great fun driving in a game where wheels are represented as black squares and the track has only two colors (green and grey) and no scenery...
But bad collision physics break a sim since (believe it or not) accidents are part of racing! 💡
And GT5's collision physics (as well as "landing after a jump" physics) are at best laughable and arcade since you are not punished for crashing on other cars and you can use them to steer faster!
Yet this thread is about Shift 2's and GT5's car modeling. And I still think that in the photos you posted Shift 2 looks just as good (if not better) as GT5 and much better when the car is in motion and your are driving it! And like I said before GT5 has better tools in photo mode but since I bough a racing game I prefer to have the car look good in motion when I am driving it and being able to see interesting replays where the AI puts up a fight!
Different opinions and priorities I guess...
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Dmarc_Atl
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no I dont mean racing modifications I mean body parts
So your saying that having alot of cars and advertising them is a bad thing ?
The only thing I care about in a Sim is the physics everything else can come later
If you want good AI dont over do your car
And neither graphics do a sim! What's your point? I am sure you would have great fun driving in a game where wheels are represented as black squares and the track has only two colors (green and grey) and no scenery...
But bad collision physics break a sim since (believe it or not) accident are part of racing! 💡
And GT5's collision physics are at best laughable and arcade since you are not punished for crashing on other cars and you can use them to steer faster!
How doesent graphics matter ? If your into sims your into the cars
who wants to drive blocks with black squares as wheels ?
Well cosmetic damages doesent make a sim mainly mechanical damage
Yea but speaking on technical terms GT5 graphics are way better and thats a fact
anyway I dont like comparing this game to gt5
@Dmarc_Atl
How convenient! The strong points of GT5 (high poly-count of cars, 1000 cars) are what's important in a racing game while the weak points of GT5 (collision physics, damage, sounds, AI etc) are not important!
I can never understand the logic that because the AI in GT5 is bad I should punish myself by driving a bad car so that I can have a race with the AI! That's plain stupid, the AI should adjust to your skill and car, not the other way around!
Arguing with you is pointless and off-topic.
Therefore I won't continue commenting on your posts.
How convenient! The strong points of GT5 (high poly-count of cars, 1000 cars) are what's important in a racing game while the weak points of GT5 (collision physics, damage, sounds, AI etc) are not important!
I can never understand the logic that because the AI in GT5 is bad I should punish myself by driving a bad car so that I can have a race with the AI! That's plain stupid, the AI should adjust to your skill and car, not the other way around!
Arguing with you is pointless and off-topic.
Therefore I won't continue commenting on your posts.
Dmarc_Atl
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Well ofcourse arguing with someone would be pointless if you are putting words in their mouth lol
Because I dont recall saying any of anything what you said
Who said drive a bad car ? Drive a car thats equal to theres
I said the only thing that matter was the High poly counts ? or the physics ?
The damage that matters in GT5 isnt bad which is mechanical damage
The sounds in GT5 arent horrible they arent great either
Dont comment
I prefer not to compare gt5 to shift 2 anyway ( even though you were the one to comment on me from the beginning)
seeing that they are for 2 diff audience and the only similarities are racing and cars
Because I dont recall saying any of anything what you said
Who said drive a bad car ? Drive a car thats equal to theres
I said the only thing that matter was the High poly counts ? or the physics ?
The damage that matters in GT5 isnt bad which is mechanical damage
The sounds in GT5 arent horrible they arent great either
Dont comment
I prefer not to compare gt5 to shift 2 anyway ( even though you were the one to comment on me from the beginning)
seeing that they are for 2 diff audience and the only similarities are racing and cars
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Yea they started working on GT5 even before THE PS3 WAS MADE !! thats crazy last year people were saying it took 3 years to make gt5 then it went to 4 then 5 now your saying 6 give me a break ..
Actually that's pretty much how it was... Kaz said that as soon as GT4 released they were already working on the next project and you don't have to have final hardware to start working on games - how do you think launch titles get made? In fact GT5 was supposed to be a launch title at one point for the PS3.
If you recall there was GT Vision and GTHD that were already working prototypes for the GT5 project.
GT5 has been in the works for quite a while.
There is some debate over whether time was lost working on GTPSP, but so many assets from GTPSP are used in GT5 that I don't think you can really argue the time was lost... at worst split with GTPSP for a year but in terms of calendar dates, yes close to 6 years.
I am not sure where you got that 3 year number... GT5P is over 3 years old as it is... clearly work started well before that.
- 563
Don't imagine things.
GT5 in 2010, GTPSP 2009 GT5P 2008 then some updates. GTHD was released after PS3 of course which was 2006-2007.
Dmarc_Atl
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Wait so 6 years after 2005 = 2010 ?
gtpsp IS what cause the extra year wait
I seriously doubt they started working on gt5 immediately after gt4
just because they released gthd dont mean that they were working on gt5
they release 2 games between the gt3 and gt4 wait too
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^ GT4 was released Dec 2004, GT5 Nov 2010, that's pretty much 6 years...
You think the assets from GTHD weren't part of the work on GT5? And Kaz mentioned GT6 is already in development before GT5 was released, so why couldn't that be the same for GT5?
Just in case you want to argue that, here's a link for proof:
http://au.gamespot.com/ps3/driving/granturismo52/news.html?sid=6283528
Why are you being so defensive (and poorly)? You said a couple of posts up that you "don't want to compare Shift 2 and GT5 anyway", but that's exactly what you've been doing the whole time.
From reading through them it doesn't even seem to me that you've played Shift 2 at all yet?
The PC ver of Shift 2 is miles above GT5 in graphic quality (I'm not including photo mode because that's essentially 'Photoshop' for GT5, which of course we have actual Photoshop on PC and can apply the same/better filters etc...), it's just bad luck for GT5 that it's limited to one console
You think the assets from GTHD weren't part of the work on GT5? And Kaz mentioned GT6 is already in development before GT5 was released, so why couldn't that be the same for GT5?
Just in case you want to argue that, here's a link for proof:
http://au.gamespot.com/ps3/driving/granturismo52/news.html?sid=6283528
Why are you being so defensive (and poorly)? You said a couple of posts up that you "don't want to compare Shift 2 and GT5 anyway", but that's exactly what you've been doing the whole time.
From reading through them it doesn't even seem to me that you've played Shift 2 at all yet?
The PC ver of Shift 2 is miles above GT5 in graphic quality (I'm not including photo mode because that's essentially 'Photoshop' for GT5, which of course we have actual Photoshop on PC and can apply the same/better filters etc...), it's just bad luck for GT5 that it's limited to one console
Dmarc_Atl
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^ GT4 was released Dec 2004, GT5 Nov 2010, that's pretty much 6 years...
You think the assets from GTHD weren't part of the work on GT5? And Kaz mentioned GT6 is already in development before GT5 was released, so why couldn't that be the same for GT5?
Just in case you want to argue that, here's a link for proof:
http://au.gamespot.com/ps3/driving/granturismo52/news.html?sid=6283528
Why are you being so defensive (and poorly)? You said a couple of posts up that you "don't want to compare Shift 2 and GT5 anyway", but that's exactly what you've been doing the whole time.
From reading through them it doesn't even seem to me that you've played Shift 2 at all yet?
The PC ver of Shift 2 is miles above GT5 in graphic quality (I'm not including photo mode because that's essentially 'Photoshop' for GT5, which of course we have actual Photoshop on PC and can apply the same/better filters etc...), it's just bad luck for GT5 that it's limited to one console
Yea it was released dec 04 for japan only .. the rest of the world how ever 2005
The only time im comparing gt5 to shift is when I reply someone else is comparing it.
I think you need to re-read my post because it doesnt seem defensive at all
You cant reply here with an opposing opinion without sounding defensive lol
photomode is photoshop for gt5 ?
wow thats a 1st lol
Can you post some screen grabs from the PC version ?
- 4,323
I believe the one imaginging would be you...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gran_Turismo_5_Prologue
GT5P released in 2007. Sure it was later in other regions due to licensing and localiztion but it was a released product in 2007.
GT5 released in late 2010. That's a 3 year gap give or take a month or two.
GTHD and GT Vision were both parts of the GT5 product devlopment process regardless of the fact much of there content was scrapped or redone for the final product.
Wait so 6 years after 2005 = 2010 ?
gtpsp IS what cause the extra year wait
There is opinion not fact.
If you look at how many assets are shared between GTPSP and GT5 (ie many all of the better looking standard cars and pretty much all of the description errors for example) you can see why it's not really fair to say that it's development stopped GT5's development.
I can see how it slowed down GT5's development compared to if there had been no GTPSP at all, but to say it stopped it entirely is almost certainly a misnomer.
Think of it similar to Toyota making a new Camry, then also deciding along the way to create a Scion that shares lots of parts with the Camry. It's not necessary for Toyota to stop working on Camry to work on Scion, however arguably work on the Camry might have been slightly faster had it been the only focus.
Kaz said that he always knows that there will be more things he wishes he could have done or added to a product when he finally releases it however when they finished GT4 he simply moved PD directly into working on the next GT.
GTHD and GT Vision were the culmination of those early steps towards the ultimate product GT5. Early Alpha builds or concept tests if you will.
GT is a series and basically all work that occurse between two iterations of that series are the dev time for the next iteration. So everything (including ideas that got scrapped or content that got later removed) after GT4 that was worked on for PS3 was working on GT5. Sort of like a car company working on it's next model revision. It might show a few concepts in the process that ultimately don't look much like the final product, but that's all development time for the final product.
Yes that was about 6 years.
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how can people defend GT5 ?
- 563
I think you have no clue about software development.
Planning, requirment analysis are the first stages which happen really early most games do this same goes for shift2, right now as we speak some people might be thinking about next gen already. GT5P Japanese version had less content. It was released in 2008 with more content. If you think about it over the years they have done more things than other racing games since the release of PS3 which was 2006.
What you say about concept of GTHD carried over is the same for everyone. All COD games, NFS games and so on do the same. They don't start from scratch they just improve what they already have.
Also stop derailing this thread.
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Strange, I have actually been to school for programming and written a few programs myself, nothing like GT5 obviously but I would think I have some idea how software devlopment works.
GT5P was had additional content added and re released multiple times. It doesn't mean it wasn't released originally.
The difference between my point of view and yours is mine is based on Kaz actually saying they started work on the next GT as soon as they shipped GT4... just like work has already started on GT6.
You are just making assumptions basedon on most favorable information to your point of view.
And you will note I was responding to a comment already made... the topic was already going that way and if anything you derailed it more than I did by adding onto the chain of people discussing this issue.
Shall I be the pot or the kettle?
Dmarc_Atl
(Banned)
- 1,463
Well if your counting all of that you should add another 6 months to a year to the development time for every game
If they start working on the next iteration immediately after they finish the game
killzone 2 would have taken 5 years
GOW 3 would have taken 3 years
I can keep going
just because PD are 1 of the few devs that announce they or working on a new project the moment they put the pen on the paper dont mean thats what everyone else do
Most devs announce a new project well after they have started it
by started it I mean prototypes research etc. not betas
not to mention gt5 have more content ( not races ) then any other racing game this gen
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I would only if the dev leader specifically said that's what they did or there was some other kind of info leading to believe that.
It's entirely possible the development house takes a break between games or a sequal is not inevitable.
In the case of GT5 we have Kaz saying that's how it happened, we have the fact it was an inevitable sequal so it's not like it was even in question and the fact they are repeating the process with GT6 already underway before GT5 released.
So if anything, based on how PD and Kaz work, it would seem prudent to say GT5 has been in development even LONGER than 6 years as their MO is to start on the next project while still working on the current.
The problem with everyone saying it didn't take 6 years is you are all relying on comparative and analogous similarity to other assumed dev times for other projects.
I am talking specifically about what Kaz has said and how he has said PD operates, not assuming. Maybe any number of things happened... maybe Kaz put everything on hold for 3 years and took the entire PD staff to the Bahamas for an extended vacation on PD. But realistically all we can say with any hind of accuracy is based on what Kaz has told us or has otherwise been directly witnessed and reported about how PD functions.
As for how long other companies work on something, that's true, I am not speaking to that point, it's something you brought up on your own here.
And getting into counting what GT5 has others don't is a massive derailment of the topic beyond where it has gone already and, as has been shown by many threads already, it's not a winnable or proveable debate due to the fact that how each feature is weighted or works in conjunction with other features makes creating a metric for how much "content" a game has virtually impossible.
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That's a very nice collection of photos you've got there, Dude.
The PC version looks spectacular by comparison to the PS3.
The PC version looks spectacular by comparison to the PS3.
- 563
Without derailing this thread any further I will just say you are wrong in so many levels. They keep working on the game and when they feel it is time to release they will. Things like time and money is none of our business it is upto PD, Sony to manage. Kaz admits they are already working on next project where as most devs release info very late in the development of game. But the procedure is same for everyone.
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