Parents Not Letting Their Kids Learn Manual

[Jet Badger]

All of which are parenting issues that need to be tackled as the kid grows.

Same goes for driving a car. My point is that the automatic to manual transition isn't the holy grail of the learning curve. There are a lot of ways you can simplify the learning process while still using a manual car, for example - a diesel car, where you can start off only using the clutch. All learning should start from the basics, in my opinion first thing a person should know about manuals is atleast the raw principle of how clutch and the gearbox works to get the idea of what one should and shouldn't do while driving. Second thing - a controlled environment such as a lot meant for driver's practice - starting, going forwards and backwards around a tight corner, parking and other basic maneouvers. Only after feeling comfortable with the controls should you go to the traffic. If you jump straight onto the streets on your first time ever driving a manual or even a car itself, you can only expect it to end in a disaster.

I agree. Optimally it is fostered. Optimally learning to drive is done in stages of increasing difficulty. I intend, for example, to force my daughter to drive on a frozen pond as part of her driving education.

Fully agree.

Preferably when you tell them they're not good enough, you also call them ugly.

And commies, don't forget to call them commies.

I have no idea who you're talking to now.

That was just a rethorical question not targeted at anyone.

 

[Danoff]

Same goes for driving a car. My point is that the automatic to manual transition isn't the holy grail of the learning curve. There are a lot of ways you can simplify the learning process while still using a manual car, for example - a diesel car, where you can start off only using the clutch. All learning should start from the basics, in my opinion first thing a person should know about manuals is atleast the raw principle of how clutch and the gearbox works to get the idea of what one should and shouldn't do while driving. Second thing - a controlled environment such as a lot meant for driver's practice - starting, going forwards and backwards around a tight corner, parking and other basic maneouvers. Only after feeling comfortable with the controls should you go to the traffic. If you jump straight onto the streets on your first time ever driving a manual or even a car itself, you can only expect it to end in a disaster.

I don't think there is anything wrong with any of that. However, even if said student had learned how to work the clutch in a parking lot and was fairly familiar, I would still start that student off with an automatic for traffic.

 

[Jet Badger]

I'm not sure what's the situation where you live but here all driver's ed cars have pedals installed in the passenger's footwell aswell for the instructor to intervene when needed. If it wasn't for that, I would agree with you as nobody wants a panicking teenager screw up with the controls and cause an accident. But then the same could happen with an automatic.

Personally, when learning to drive my instructor told me to drive off to the traffic on the second lesson. It was dark, raining, the street was busy and I had little idea of what I was doing. That moment I was truly scared. Though what I was scared of had nothing to do with the car being a manual.

 

[Rossell2]

Learnt manual in the beginning, I'll admit I'm not a most fantastic driver but its the only way I'd drive. No auto for me, manual is a way of life.

Something I must observe here that I haven't seen mentioned. I've seen a couple of times where people with automatics try to drive up hills in snowy weather. Of course the auto box always kicks ups a gear losing the revs which means the car gets nowhere. Something you don't get in a manual - if you need an excuse Americans of the forum, I think that might qualify.

 

[Jet Badger]

Learnt manual in the beginning, I'll admit I'm not a most fantastic driver but its the only way I'd drive. No auto for me, manual is a way of life.

Something I must observe here that I haven't seen mentioned. I've seen a couple of times where people with automatics try to drive up hills in snowy weather. Of course the auto box always kicks ups a gear losing the revs which means the car gets nowhere. Something you don't get in a manual - if you need an excuse Americans of the forum, I think that might qualify.

You can put an auto in low gear for that purpose, then it won't shift higher than 2nd gear, atleast that goes for the most traditional autos. Some allow you to lock it in 1st, some have other options. There's a living hell of variety of automatic transmission designs and variations. Manuals on the other hand, pretty much all follow the same scheme and principle.

 

[Parker]

I grew up on a farm driving manual tractors and trucks since I was old enough to reach the pedals, and I would sit on my grandfathers lap and steer before that. I was completely comfortable driving a manual transmission before I was a teenager and although I really don't think it is a necessary skill these days, I will be teaching my son how to drive a manual tranny and I see no reason why someone who wishes to learn wouldn't be granted the opportunity.

That being said, if your parents for some reason are against it then get a job, buy a car with a manual and teach yourself. If you understand the basic concept you can teach yourself in an empty parking lot, there are plenty of online tools at your disposal and I'm sure there are local mechanics around you that wouldn't have a problem teaching you stick if you brought your own car.

 

[Rossell2]

Thanks Jet. Having never driven an auto before, its nice to learn. I personally think manual transmission will always be the best way in my book. Thats just me, if you wanna go auto, go auto, but if you think that stick is hard to learn, just remember....


...I learnt how to do it. That means you can by default.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

One thing about autos that I found disconcerting was the lack of engine braking. My first time on the motorway was in an automatic, and I'd been driving a manual previously. I found myself doing 15 MPH over the speed limit at one point because I expected the car's speed as dictated by the engine and transmission to be more sensitive to throttle position. I could argue that learning on a manual made me more in tune with the mechanical aspect of the car, but I can't say for sure. I can say that going to an auto was almost distracting in itself because of how unintuitive it could be compared to a manual, which does exactly what you tell it to.

 

[sems4arsenal]

Here in Egypt it makes absolutely zero sense to buy a Manual car, so people don't teach manual driving, heck I got my license and the only Manual driving I've done is short start a car drive in a straight and stop drives when I was 14.

 

[Joey D]

I love how these threads bring out all the elitist jerks who think people who drive automatics are peasants. Buy what you want, drive what you want, just don't be a d-bag about it.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

I love how these threads bring out all the elitist jerks who think people who drive automatics are peasants. Buy what you want, drive what you want, just don't be a d-bag about it.

I'm not coming across that way, am I?

 

[Wolfe]

@Joey D -- There are elitist jerk d-bags on both sides of this neverending debate. One thinks the other side are lazy/incompetent, and the other thinks the first side are luddites or wannabe racecar drivers.

 

[niky]

I know you can get distracted when driving. But, if having a stick coming out of the floor distracts you to the point where it is considered lethal, that person has no place on the road ever.

As @Danoff says, everything is a distraction to the novice driver. I'm neutral on whether kids should learn stick before or after learning to drive on the open road, but they should not try to learn both at the same time.

I see too many Driving Instructors taking students out on the road that barely know how to shift or clutch. (our Driver's Ed is not integrated into the HS curriculum) Very dangerous. That's how I learned, too. And personally, if I were teaching my teenage self, I would have done it differently.

One thing about autos that I found disconcerting was the lack of engine braking. My first time on the motorway was in an automatic, and I'd been driving a manual previously. I found myself doing 15 MPH over the speed limit at one point because I expected the car's speed as dictated by the engine and transmission to be more sensitive to throttle position. I could argue that learning on a manual made me more in tune with the mechanical aspect of the car, but I can't say for sure. I can say that going to an auto was almost distracting in itself because of how unintuitive it could be compared to a manual, which does exactly what you tell it to.

All about expectations. With an AT, you just have to let off earlier.

Then again, I see a lot of people doing the brakelight tango with ATs, so I guess this is far from intuitive for people with heavier feet than mine.

 

[nissman]

Never imagined that parents wouldn't let their kids learn manual. Usually we don't have these discussions with parents in Europe.

 

[Pupik]

How can parents let their kids learn something they didn't know in the first place?

[/moment of zen]

 

[Beeblebrox237]

As @Danoff says, everything is a distraction to the novice driver. I'm neutral on whether kids should learn stick before or after learning to drive on the open road, but they should not try to learn both at the same time.

I say auto or manual, you should start out in a nice open car park and get a feel for it. Don't just jump in and go out on the open road, even with an auto there's a lot to get used to.

 

[Slash]

I love how these threads bring out all the elitist jerks who think people who drive automatics are peasants. Buy what you want, drive what you want, just don't be a d-bag about it.

At least I'm not the only on who noticed

 

[niky]

I say auto or manual, you should start out in a nice open car park and get a feel for it. Don't just jump in and go out on the open road, even with an auto there's a lot to get used to.

Thinking back, I might actually have to agree with Danoff's idea. Personally, I'd have the kid practice manual shifting the car and driving around a parking lot for a week or two before going out on the road. If you let them learn on an automatic (basically start, stop, turn), you can shorten the time before exposing them to the real world, where they will gain more experience on dealing with real world situations.

Then again, I would like for my daughters to understand the dynamics of trail-braking and snap-oversteer before putting them out on the road. Otherwise, I'd have to force them to carry an open cup of coffee in the dash cupholder all the time. But that's just me.

 

[White & Nerdy]

How unfortunate, looks like a nice little fast car.

Careful saying that on GTP. The Cruze is automatically the better car because interior quality.

(I myself agree with you though).

 

[niky]

Do we need to get into your hangups in every single thread you post in?

Cruze Manual Diesel Station Wagon. Argument invalid.

Oh, there's no SS variant yet, but I don't doubt they'll eventually get to it.

The Focus is still better than either. And the ST over any incoming SS. Simply because Chevy's manual boxes suck.

 

[Mustangmiha]

Cruze Manual Diesel Station Wagon

I'd drive that only if I was a grandad.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

Careful saying that on GTP. The Cruze is automatically the better car because interior quality.

(I myself agree with you though).

Right, because we're all idiots and have no taste. For what it's worth, I agree with you on this one. I don't like the Cruze much, but it is at least tolerable which is more than can be said for GM's previous small cars. The Cobalt SS, however, has a properly sorted chassis. I think I could put up with that awful interior and bland styling for 260 bhp and that handling.

 

[Izzyracer97]

Do you guys think it's wrong for parents to not let their kids learn manual (stick shift)? I'm one of these kids, as my parents say that driving a manual is too complicated for me (my dad knows how to drive stick, but won't let me learn).

WHAT! driving manual is stupidly simple! just press the clutch pedal in put it into first (or reverse) and gradually press the accelerator pedal while letting off of the clutch pedal. When you feel the car start to roll you can release the clutch pedal. to shift simply press the clutch and let off the gas, shift into the next gear and release the clutch and reapply your foot to the gas pedal. I learned how when I was only 12 years old I'm 17 now and probably the fastest shifter in my racing series.

 

[CinnamonOD]

It is pretty simple to drive manual, I only struggle with accelerating from 0km/h on steep roads

 

[ProjectWHaT]

The only thing I'm worried about manuals is when to downshift. Unlike upshifting, there's nothing indicating when.

 

[Slash]

Unlike upshifting, there's nothing indicating when.

Wrong. It's like the opposite of up-shifting. When the RPM's get low-ish from braking, you down shift.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

The only thing I'm worried about manuals is when to downshift. Unlike upshifting, there's nothing indicating when.

You really only downshift when the rpms are below ~1500 or you need more acceleration. Slowing to a stop, I often take the car out of gear, since I'm on the brakes and will eventually want first.

 

[Slash]

Why put it in neutral? Just leave it in first.

 

[Harry6784]

You really only downshift when the rpms are below ~1500 or you need more acceleration. Slowing to a stop, I often take the car out of gear, since I'm on the brakes and will eventually want first.

1500RPM for your car maybe but it may be higher or lower depending on the type of motor. In my car I can cruise on the highway in 6th doing 1100RPM. But in my Accord I cruise at 1800RPM. Generally, if you step on the gas but don't gain speed, you're lugging the motor, which means its time to downshift.

 

[Wolfe]

Why put it in neutral? Just leave it in first.

Sitting at a stop in first gear with the clutch in will shorten the life of the throwout bearing.