PENALTY SYSTEM IS STILL A PIECE OF ****!!!
- Thread starter Gareth davies
- 6,543 comments
- 448,726 views
- 3,385
- Las Vegas
- dawko-san
That's actually an interesting idea but I highly doubt PD would be into that. The way they see it it's already separated; lobbies are for dirty driving (and whatever other type people want) and sport mode is, well, for good-sport racing. So yeah they should start banning dirty people from sport mode, which they even did a while ago.
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
That's exactly what the SR rating ought to be doing - clean drivers in high SR races and dirty drivers in low SR races - but it doesn't
And the problem inherent in that is that all kinds of drivers have to race together for a certain period of time until the system sorts them out. If there were separate clean & dirty events, then people would naturally separate themselves out from the get go. This is exactly what happened in GT5's public lobbies after someone started the trend of running "Dirty Shuffle" rooms; when they started appearing the "Fairplay Shuffle" rooms got a whole lot cleaner as a result.
- 2,677
- UK
- Outspacer
And the problem with separate dirty and clean daily races is that PD simply are never going to do it!
OK, so imagine PD actually reworked SR into a good system. (I know, it's a dream). It needn't take dozens of races to start seeing people get filtered out; you'd probably notice some improvement within an evening. To my mind it shoudn't try to filter people too quickly - a couple of unlucky races (e.g. starting in front of a tap-tap-tapper) could drop a clean racer too quickly. Maybe aim for a week of light racing to be enough to settle on someone's rating - would that really be too long? We've suffered this for what, nine months so far, after all.
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
I don't have a crystal ball, & neither do you, so I'll refrain from making assumptions. I'm simply saying how the situation could be improved, not trying to predict what PD will or won't do. And as for the rating system in GT Sport, that was what I was referring to in my original post when I mentioned "fantastical" methods or trying to keep the peace. All these kinds of safety ratings in sim racing games end up doing is creating unrealistic races, & I'm totally against all of them, period. I don't think they can be "fixed" because the whole idea of them is broken in the first place imo.
- 2,272
- United States
- G_ASHER
I ran the Blue Moon Gr.3 this morning. I was the highest ranked player at A/A, everyone else was B/S to D/S. With the exception a schmuck that stole first place with dirty tactics, everyone from about 6th place forward ran a clean and fast race. If they did revise the penalty system last night, it worked well for us, despite the schmuck who figured out how to exploit side contact. Lots of good banter and kudos after the race. Nice to see respect being shared back and forth. Except for the schmuck.
- 2,677
- UK
- Outspacer
Fair enough, but I'll put a grand on PD not doing it!
I don't care to argue against your opinion of safety ratings, you're entitled to it - I just haven't totally given up on the dream yet.
But I'm honestly curious - what makes you say unrealistic? Mainly SR / penalties in GTS, or something else as well?
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
I agree, & bet PD won't do it either.
Right back at ya with the fair enough. 👍
They're unrealistic compared to real life. Real cars don't turn invisible & drive through each other, & that shouldn't be in a simulation seeing as it's supposed to simulate reality. Real race drivers don't get knee-jerk reaction penalties dished out by a mindless computerized system. Real race drivers get praised by their team for using a run off area to avoid an accident, sim racers get auto-penalized for doing so. I could go on all day at how reality differs from so-called simulation, but you get the point. Until we start getting real time Stewards AI in racing sims that act similarly to real life stewards things won't improve much.
- 2,677
- UK
- Outspacer
Oh, but I'm with you 100% on all those things! OK, maybe 99% because I think there might be extreme situations that wouldn't arise in real life at anything like the frequency that they do in GTS that might be best handled by ghosting - even so, only when one car threatens to take multiple others off track, so I really am talking extreme. With penalties, I think PD have amply proved just how distant in the future such ideas/code might come to fruition.
But, none of the things you mention actually directly affects who you get matched with next, only SR (with a smidge of DR) does. So my hope is limited to thinking that a good SR system could at least rank dirty and clean racers differently, even if it isn't capable of any finer distinctions. I'm certainly only talking an SR system that just quietly monitors and ranks people, and doesn't interfere in races other than when matching people. Obviously PD's system is inadequate, but I do believe that it's possible to at least have a system where SR S (and maybe also A) means 'clean'.
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
I hosted a lot of races in GT5/GT6, & found it invaluable to be able to permanently block dirty drivers & laggers by putting them on my PSN Block list (GT5 & GT6 were the only games to auto filter these people out from joining my lobbies). I wonder if it would be technically possible for GT Sport to filter out everyone from Sport Mode races who are on our PSN Block list?
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
There wouldn't be anyone left to race with
I used to block dirty drivers so I could at least see at the start of a race who to watch out for by checking the players met list. Yet it became too depressing to see 3 or more people blocked in the room every time so I rather not know in advance. Now I report them after the race instead.
Blocking does nothing, reporting does nothing. I don't think PD cares. SR system needs improvement to separate the yoyos from the steady high SR group.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
I don't even need to make a gif for this one, I think it's self explanatory
Car behind me turns into me, hits me on my rear left bumper while I'm already going too far inside trying to avoid him. SR Down, -7 SR for the race, 3 sec contact penalty plus 5.3 sec shortcut penalty. Thanks PD. Oh he stayed on the road, no positions changed. I lost a couple positions at the finish.
Next race, car on the outside turns in too sharp for traffic
Minor bump, no one off road, I get SR Down, -6 SR for the race, 10 sec penalty.
Be the one that doesn't slow down in time and drive like there's no one there and you get the benefit of the doubt....
It looks like this i heading to a repeat of last weekend, another DR reset incoming if this keeps up. One hit per race, 7 SR lost per race. Soon I'll be out of the 'clean' racing (pretty much all penalties and over half red ratings) into the actual dirty racing.
To top it off, just now matchmaking puts me in a room of DR.C to DR.D since my SR is down to 83. I inadvertently bump someone off, a DR.C that hit the brakes unexpectedly and too much for a slight left. He goes off road, and I don't get a penalty. That's where I should have gotten one. (Although if it was a DR.A it would have been a brake check) Instead +6 SR for the race, Finished 4th and got called a cheat. PD fix this ****.
Car behind me turns into me, hits me on my rear left bumper while I'm already going too far inside trying to avoid him. SR Down, -7 SR for the race, 3 sec contact penalty plus 5.3 sec shortcut penalty. Thanks PD. Oh he stayed on the road, no positions changed. I lost a couple positions at the finish.
Next race, car on the outside turns in too sharp for traffic
Minor bump, no one off road, I get SR Down, -6 SR for the race, 10 sec penalty.
Be the one that doesn't slow down in time and drive like there's no one there and you get the benefit of the doubt....
It looks like this i heading to a repeat of last weekend, another DR reset incoming if this keeps up. One hit per race, 7 SR lost per race. Soon I'll be out of the 'clean' racing (pretty much all penalties and over half red ratings) into the actual dirty racing.
To top it off, just now matchmaking puts me in a room of DR.C to DR.D since my SR is down to 83. I inadvertently bump someone off, a DR.C that hit the brakes unexpectedly and too much for a slight left. He goes off road, and I don't get a penalty. That's where I should have gotten one. (Although if it was a DR.A it would have been a brake check) Instead +6 SR for the race, Finished 4th and got called a cheat. PD fix this ****.
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Don’t really race in Sport mode because of the people racing in it.
But just fired it up and my god these penalties are insane. Sorry PD but you continue to ruin Sport mode with insane time penalties.
Try and avoid idiots spinning out in front of you, end up cutting a corner 5+ second penalty.
Get brake checked by the guy in front, 10+ second penalty...
Back to lobbies I go, **** me
But just fired it up and my god these penalties are insane. Sorry PD but you continue to ruin Sport mode with insane time penalties.
Try and avoid idiots spinning out in front of you, end up cutting a corner 5+ second penalty.
Get brake checked by the guy in front, 10+ second penalty...
Back to lobbies I go, **** me
- 116
- Switzerland
I had the same experience dropped down from Dr. high B to D
The penalty system before and after the update is really a shame. I'm so glad that my SR. Is still on S because the last few races I had were horrible.
Balwerk
Premium
- 783
- Bali
- Baliwa27
Well I dunno, the system just right and wrong to me. It happen only 1 race in Interlagos, another reminder I not a clean driver I just bit passive aggressive driver.
Here's mine, I admit mine should be take be some more lesser speed to avoid that thing. Nah I thought he will attack into the corner so there's pure my fault.
In this video let me explain: he slow down in racing line so I take inner side to pass and attempting turn while preparing to turn I try keep in 6K RPM. Plus if I go run away too inner I get more penalty so I try keep it clean. But that's what I got get pitted problem now he doesn't get any penalty. Yes I think he should get because of that.
Again, miss the chicane is my fault cause not paying attention the marker or brake signal but yeah, partly that wasn't my fault it cause I just try make it out and entering chicane from outside but he do something like that. It consider as brakechecking and if I too late move or randomly brake behind him I just will hit him and get penalty. Yes he doesn't get any penalty and I get for "cut" the chicane
Here's mine, I admit mine should be take be some more lesser speed to avoid that thing. Nah I thought he will attack into the corner so there's pure my fault.
In this video let me explain: he slow down in racing line so I take inner side to pass and attempting turn while preparing to turn I try keep in 6K RPM. Plus if I go run away too inner I get more penalty so I try keep it clean. But that's what I got get pitted
problem now he doesn't get any penalty. Yes I think he should get because of that.Again, miss the chicane is my fault cause not paying attention the marker or brake signal but yeah, partly that wasn't my fault it cause I just try make it out and entering chicane from outside but he do something like that. It consider as brakechecking and if I too late move or randomly brake behind him I just will hit him and get penalty. Yes he doesn't get any penalty and I get for "cut" the chicane
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In this video, I can get more penalty it literally just like 1st video I put gas too much then system say no. At this point I can say this system only acknowledged light body hit in traffic as penalty not in battle 1-1 or 3 ways battle, in battle system just acknowledged big hit or if we come from non racing line then he hit me I can get penalty too (get this 2 times after update)
In the end the system is good to me rank up to A for lesser nonsense penalty, but in same time it pretty dangerous to other and me too if lower SR abuse it. That's from me, feel free give me critic about how I drive btw
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Well that's odd. Last race I was B/S, finished with a blue S, now I'm starting as B/A. How is that possible.
It gave me 2 wins after (decided to qualify for 1 lap to escape the dirty back only to be met with the dirty front) so thanks PD for dropping my SR randomly!
It gave me 2 wins after (decided to qualify for 1 lap to escape the dirty back only to be met with the dirty front) so thanks PD for dropping my SR randomly!
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- 2,272
- United States
- G_ASHER
I've noticed that too. Sometimes my SR number is down quite a bit too.
I got my DR to A finally, after a lot of work, as well as getting lucky more than a few times. I have a nice cushion between A and B, but have pretty much stopped racing in sport mode on that profile since I don't want to go through all that work again should I get a DR drop. I'm racing with another profile but my DR is getting closer to A. I guess I'd better start dropping to the back of the field.
I would like to believe that the way sport mode has turned out in reality was nothing like Kaz had imagined. He should have studied the "rule of unintended consequences".
I'm for turning back the penalties to like it was in the beginning. It felt like I was not as much of a victim to others issues, and I had a decent amount of control over when and where I served penalties. One thing for sure, almost no one stopped in the middle of a straight to run down their penalties.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Ugh every time I get with the max SR crowd again someone turns in on me and gives me a penalty while they get ahead anyway. I guess I just need to drive 0.5 sec behind at all times and only pass wrecks. Can't race with this system.
Driving behind works, just wait until the person in front crashes or the two in front take each other out. 2 more wins, yet next race back with the max SR.S crowd...
And sure enough 10 sec penalty for nothing. Got boxed in, front side back, miraculously we all made the corner fine, yet there was a little rubbing, no positions changed, 10 sec penalty and 8 SR down. I don't get it, I see people drive others off the road with impunity, while the slightest contact in a corner can still lead to 10 sec. It seems the smaller the contact the bigger the penalty!
I am driving around as A/S again in between B/S, so perhaps this promise of DR.A getting the same treatment as DR.B was a lie. I had only 1 contact while all the DR.B drivers around me had a lot more pushing and shoving and all ended up with blue S. They did all get penalties though, finish line was the usual parking lot.
Driving behind works, just wait until the person in front crashes or the two in front take each other out. 2 more wins, yet next race back with the max SR.S crowd...
And sure enough 10 sec penalty for nothing. Got boxed in, front side back, miraculously we all made the corner fine, yet there was a little rubbing, no positions changed, 10 sec penalty and 8 SR down. I don't get it, I see people drive others off the road with impunity, while the slightest contact in a corner can still lead to 10 sec. It seems the smaller the contact the bigger the penalty!
I am driving around as A/S again in between B/S, so perhaps this promise of DR.A getting the same treatment as DR.B was a lie. I had only 1 contact while all the DR.B drivers around me had a lot more pushing and shoving and all ended up with blue S. They did all get penalties though, finish line was the usual parking lot.
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- 71
- Lincolnshire
- Beevster
Well, hello bitch whine to GTsport time... They did a good patch last one back, now they say they're goin to allow door rubbing and no penalty difference for ranks etc etc... No, what they did is blow all that, just give 10 second penalties for any random ****, any tom dick or harry who manages to door rub, cut the slightest corner I played at S for long enough to know what decent racing looks like, now all I see is races ruined by ****ing penalties, And that don't mean I'm losing out in my race, it means the guy I'm in the most intense battle with has to drop back because of a stupid nudge, then I'm on my own doing qually laps for fun after 8 euphoric laps of him up my ass!, Im thinking what am I here for!? ,,!,,, maybe too slap a bitch from PD on my ass, call that a decal you ****ers!... As for the B O P! wow too the T O P PD, you really made that megane smile, why even have a BOP! just have a megane cup! get it done..
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PD needs to replace Sport Mode daily races, with online fortnightly Time Trials and and Drift Events and leaderboard for the events. These Events that I have mention will be fairer for everyone and you will enjoy it, and you will not have Dirty drivers ruining your race.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
It does feel a bit like fortnight 
Yet I'm starting to see a pattern, on the outside in a corner is bad, inside driver pushing the outside driver anywhere, outside driver either goes off road or gets a penalty. I just had it twice in my last race, a car coming from behind tapping me on my inside rear panel, I get 5 and 2 sec penalty. The only other choice I have is running myself off road, what's up with that.
It's no race ruining contact, no positions lost or gained at the time, yet with the faulty unnecessary penalties I did obviously did lose positions. The first car wasn't even his fault as he got bumped from behind into me, and I get the penalty.... The second though, already ran me off a previous race, so this time I held my line and got a penalty instead....
Drive on the inside line I guess, forget about the racing line or having corner rights when ahead.
And sometimes dirty drivers take care of themselves, 2 rage quit after ramming each other off, and two others left with a red A and B, rest of the room blue S. A broken clock is still right twice a day! Although I could be wrong about the one leaving with the red B, he was in the back, didn't see him drive. The other 3, deserved.
Yet I'm starting to see a pattern, on the outside in a corner is bad, inside driver pushing the outside driver anywhere, outside driver either goes off road or gets a penalty. I just had it twice in my last race, a car coming from behind tapping me on my inside rear panel, I get 5 and 2 sec penalty. The only other choice I have is running myself off road, what's up with that.
It's no race ruining contact, no positions lost or gained at the time, yet with the faulty unnecessary penalties I did obviously did lose positions. The first car wasn't even his fault as he got bumped from behind into me, and I get the penalty.... The second though, already ran me off a previous race, so this time I held my line and got a penalty instead....
Drive on the inside line I guess, forget about the racing line or having corner rights when ahead.
And sometimes dirty drivers take care of themselves, 2 rage quit after ramming each other off, and two others left with a red A and B, rest of the room blue S. A broken clock is still right twice a day! Although I could be wrong about the one leaving with the red B, he was in the back, didn't see him drive. The other 3, deserved.
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- 1,443
- Conquerer13
lmao at the new time penalty for going a bit wide in turn 4 at Interlagos... You're already losing time by going wide in the first place and then you're slapped a 1-1.5 second penalty on top of that? Insulting... Imagine if racing drivers were penalized every time they went wide. PD just has no clue.
- 71
- Lincolnshire
- Beevster
Better still, get tapped from the back and run wide, dirty den getsup a position and your slapped with a 10 second penalty.
Game over, it's just not fun anymore watching bad drivers sail off with your position, because they worked out how to play pd pathetically bad system.
Game over, it's just not fun anymore watching bad drivers sail off with your position, because they worked out how to play pd pathetically bad system.
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
There wouldn't be anyone left to race with
Joking aside, they'd be plenty of drivers left to race with, & they'd mostly be the clean guys who are left over.
At the moment, obviously. But if they were filtered out from our Sport Mode experience, eventually it would.
- 3,954
- Laguna
- Alpha_Cipher1
- 3,555
- Theresa, Wisconsin
What is going on with the penalty system? I thought PD relaxed it a little. I had 3 10 second penalties until last Thursday or Friday for 500 races, now I got 3 in 1 day. 1 was for barely bumping the rear of someone parking in the brake zone and 2 were cars turning down on me mid corner but they hit my front end. I was maintaining the lowest inside lane possible, I saved and rewatched the replays, I did not push up and they clearly turned in too far
- 155
- United States
I logged on today to ask the same question. What is going on? I thought they fixed this? I slow down at Maggiore yesterday to not bump the slower traffic in front of me at the "S" curves and I get hit from behind and both sides, and ended up with 9 seconds worth of penalties!! Then I get dive bombed and made contact and get another 5 seconds. And then it happened again for the next race at the same curve! I had to rage quit there.....and I am afraid to see what my SR looks like now.
- 1,521
- Seixal
- zefthebestofcour
