- 5,511
- Druids Bend
- Z4E_Midnight85
I think it's mostly those who don't read the rules, just jump into the race, look at the laps and tyre choice, and go for gold.
PENALTY SYSTEM IS STILL A PIECE OF ****!!!
- Thread starter Gareth davies
- 6,543 comments
- 442,243 views
- 7,066
- Birmingham, UK
- GOTMAXPOWER
What the hell is this? A penalty for being given no space then a penalty for taking the penalty.
🤬🤬
🤬🤬
- 4,962
- Nelson, England
- GTP_ASH32
Yes this is the system, you made contact (it does not care who caused it) and then overtook them, standard (occasionally avoidable) nonsense penalty, you might have got away with it if you were able to back off straight after the contact, sometimes you can, others like this you can't. It had likely decided to give you a penalty before you even attempted to take the corner.
Second time I'd say it thinks you are brake checking but the system also hates cars that gain speed (bump drafting for instance is very bad) after contact too. Clearly an unavoidable penalty on your part, beyond stupid when this sort of thing happens but it's not uncommon either unfortunately.
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- 2,027
- Bristol, UK
- OJBrit
Chalk that first one down to Sod's Law. It punishes those on the outside over those on the inside. Unless I am on the inside where I will be punished.
- 3,262
- Canada
I dunno, reakon you sorta deserve it. YOu were too far back to take the outside line for a pass, a cut back maybe but not a pass. Then you took the penalty bang on the racing line.
My issue at Bathurst is if I get behind someone across the top, there is no clean ay to pass and I keep a safe distance, problem is I then get hit from behind relentlessly and i cop penalties for that.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Nonesense, @GOTMAXPOWER was half a car ahead before turn in and would have made the corner if the other car had left as much room as @GOTMAXPOWER left him.
The penalty is served there on a long straight, what racing line? He was hugging the side of the road to make space.
He did not deserve any of that in any way, but to make excuses for a broken penalty system and the dumb idea to serve penalties on the track. Bathurst has always been a problem with the penalty system, the track would work well without it. Plenty places to 'correct' bad behavior, that track will be much better to drive on after a period without penalties encouraging bad driving habits.
- 3,262
- Canada
As mentioned in another thread, I have watched by my estimation 7000 laps of racing around Bathurst and never seen anyone pull a move on the outside of Murrays unless lapping someone who yields. The corner is just not conducive to dual line racing at all, take the outside there and you are at the mercy of fate. He was at best line astern, was half a car ahead on turn in because he took the deeper line so could brake later.
The racing line up Mountain straight has always, always been the left side in preparation for Griffins bend.
Go to 6 minute mark in this vid, you can see I get a great run on the same bit of road and decide to yield early as I know it's not gonna work.
Then go to the 17 min mark, I take a guy through the chase and IMMEDIATELY shift defensive as I know full well the outside at murrays is fail time. He too, knows it as he immediately yields.
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- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Low chance of success doesn't mean it deserves a penalty or that the other car doesn't need to leave a car width of space at corner exit. It's a risky move, but it can be done. I've pulled it off, albeit from the back, yet with the way cars brake differently and drivers are all different, it's certainly do-able at the front as well.
As for the penalty zone, it has no business being on a narrow straight. It has no business being on the track. It wouldn't have made a difference if @GOTMAXPOWER had hugged the other side as the two coming from behind were overtaking each other. The gap nr 8 went for simply wasn't there, no matter which side max was on.
Love the track, in laps it's my most raced circuit, 6,524 laps completed in sport mode. However I don't want to deal with PDs nonsense any longer. GR.3 Bathurst races were great yet the inconsistent wall penalties, penalty zones, broken penalties in general, no more. Probably half my bad penalty gifs are from Mount Panorama
- 7,066
- Birmingham, UK
- GOTMAXPOWER
That move is quite common in game because the defending car slows itself down too much to park it on the apex on the tighter line, I got past 2 in one lap doing that move there last night, either way I don't think you can say that I forced the Aston off the road. As for the straight you don't have many options, I was far to the side as possible (it gets tight on the right too), the only other options are to stop in the middle of the road which is asking for trouble or on the grass which is even worse.
- 3,262
- Canada
I don't think you forced him off at all but by trying to force the issue two wide through there you invite contact.
Again bit nerdy here but that corner is a bit odd, the inside kerb is aggressive, the corner is off camber a little and it tends to pinch you if you take a true inside line. To me, as evidenced by thr two examples i showed above, it's a one line corner.
Agree with sven re the penalty point on mountain straight is just wrong, should be on the early part of the front straight.
Again bit nerdy here but that corner is a bit odd, the inside kerb is aggressive, the corner is off camber a little and it tends to pinch you if you take a true inside line. To me, as evidenced by thr two examples i showed above, it's a one line corner.
Agree with sven re the penalty point on mountain straight is just wrong, should be on the early part of the front straight.
Groundfish
(Banned)
- 4,363
- United States
Personally, I think trying that move at Murray’s.....
Was dumb. Looked like you thought you’d just nip in front of him in time, make apex and happy days, but his nose was there and you turned into it anyways.
Imo hardly a case to be outraged by receiving a penalty, especially considering round the outside there just isn’t a thing in any way shape or form.
I agree with @NevilleNobody
I saw that when it went up and thought about criticizing it, but held off.
There’s been a bit more of this “super late round the outside” arcade game pass that’s been being tried lately by several aliens...
I think it’s just this, just understand your race is now no longer in your control...
Was dumb. Looked like you thought you’d just nip in front of him in time, make apex and happy days, but his nose was there and you turned into it anyways.
Imo hardly a case to be outraged by receiving a penalty, especially considering round the outside there just isn’t a thing in any way shape or form.
I agree with @NevilleNobody
I saw that when it went up and thought about criticizing it, but held off.
There’s been a bit more of this “super late round the outside” arcade game pass that’s been being tried lately by several aliens...
I think it’s just this, just understand your race is now no longer in your control...
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- 3,262
- Canada
To be fair the guy could have left a touch more space but barely seemed in control. But yeah, around outside is frought with danger.
- 7,066
- Birmingham, UK
- GOTMAXPOWER
It is legitimate overtaking opportunity, more through positioning your car on the outside compromises the defending cars corner so they can't carry the same speed and have less traction on the tighter exit. The penalty is forcing another car off the track which obviously didn't happen, overtaking on the outside is risk free in that aspect because you're not going to wipe anybody else out if you go wide. As far as I can see the only contact is in the braking zone when I'm squeezed onto the grass.
@Groundfish I don't think I would've made that apex ahead of the Aston with the brakes and steering of a Tomahawk
Groundfish
(Banned)
- 4,363
- United States
I mean you can end up in lots of weird places trying things in GTS, especially when softs are in play,
for me though, it’s a grey area move, it failed, you got penalized after contact, what’s to complain about?
I’ve seen outrageously stupid pens all the time but THAT one?
I mean if I’m the Aston and I know you, or you’ve been racin good but never met NOWAY would I exit normal there, but all this is the stuff we don’t know...If you turned into me or touched my car or I didn’t like you I’d off you lol.
On my screen here looks like at a couple frames there you turned into him...I almost said something before, but held off...It’s a game after all we’re not sending rockets to Mars
Cheers
for me though, it’s a grey area move, it failed, you got penalized after contact, what’s to complain about?
I’ve seen outrageously stupid pens all the time but THAT one?
I mean if I’m the Aston and I know you, or you’ve been racin good but never met NOWAY would I exit normal there, but all this is the stuff we don’t know...If you turned into me or touched my car or I didn’t like you I’d off you lol.
On my screen here looks like at a couple frames there you turned into him...I almost said something before, but held off...It’s a game after all we’re not sending rockets to Mars
Cheers
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- 7,066
- Birmingham, UK
- GOTMAXPOWER
Yeah, I've definitely seen worse penalties than that one, it was just a bit stupid to get a penalty for safely serving the first one. I mostly left that one in for context, as you said the first one is pretty standard GTSport. As for turning in that was the car driving not meI mean you can end up in lots of weird places trying things in GTS, especially when softs are in play,
for me though, it’s a grey area move, it failed, you got penalized after contact, what’s to complain about?
I’ve seen outrageously stupid pens all the time but THAT one?
I mean if I’m the Aston and I know you, or you’ve been racin good but never met NOWAY would I exit normal there, but all this is the stuff we don’t know...If you turned into me or touched my car or I didn’t like you I’d off you lol.
On my screen here looks like at a couple frames there you turned into him...I almost said something before, but held off...It’s a game after all we’re not sending rockets to Mars
Cheers
the back right was touching the grass ever so slightly so as soon as I touched the brakes it loses grip and heads to the left.
- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
Imo it shouldn't be there at all. Right after the corner invites trouble for cars coming out the corner side by side, in the middle causes trouble (does so as well at the straight at the end) and right before a corner like at Tokyo creates plenty chaos as well. And even if there's plenty room like on the Nordschleife, people will try to steal your momentum by swerving in front of you.
Anyway I agree with max, it's no so much an overtaking opportunity (Murrays) more forcing the car ahead to slow down and get a compromised corner exit, setting up possibilities for a follow up pass. If you defend the inside, expect a car on your outside. And that inside kerb is a great tool to slow your opponent down, unless they simply drive the corner like you're not there.
It should be a tactical racing game, not a penalty avoiding game
Imo there is no such thing as a one line corner, the penalty system creates those. I've gone through the bus stop 2 wide without issues. (Although 9 out of 10 times, issues and penalties )
- 415
- North Bohemia
What I just can't wrap my head around is the placement of the penalty zones. There are tracks where a 1s penalty costs you upwards of 3s. And then there are tracks where a 3s penalty costs you 1.5s tops. The perfect examples being the middle of the Mulsanne straight at Le Mans and JUST BEFORE a HARD BRAKING ZONE at Tokyo (East Outer Loop I think). Who the 🤬 comes up with these?? The janitor at PD?? Someone's kid?? The penalty zones are not a completely terrible idea but the execution is beyond incompetent. They really hadn't thought it through before they implemented it. Good old PD.
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- 2,027
- Bristol, UK
- OJBrit
Just like his other documented mishap this week he found a move that worked for him. He tried it again and it failed this time. Realistically it's not an easy move and probably relies on the other driver being Hans Moleman to make it work. The fact he had to escape the grass costing him seconds should be punishment enough.
- 4,962
- Nelson, England
- GTP_ASH32
Yes I don't even know why it thought you did something penalty worthy there because it does give the laggy dutch driver a penalty for the incident. Maybe it was for the second contact where they hit the (now out of control) french driver again as I think you may brush sides with the dutch driver before that happens. Silly penalty in any case.
- 7,066
- Birmingham, UK
- GOTMAXPOWER
- 281
- Malawi
- crusselz
Yes I don't even know why it thought you did something penalty worthy there because it does give the laggy dutch driver a penalty for the incident. Maybe it was for the second contact where they hit the (now out of control) french driver again as I think you may brush sides with the dutch driver before that happens. Silly penalty in any case.
I actually got off the throttle enough, to make no contact as the car swerved off, in front of me. But maybe. Somehow, the game blamed the entire incident on the side contact with the car that was beside me.
Sony should ban you for that
Absolute filth on my part
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- 4,962
- Nelson, England
- GTP_ASH32
Yes that's what I was trying to say, it's the only thing I can think of. At first it gets the right driver for the punt, it's only later that it gets you so it must be for something (can only be the side contact) the happened afterwards.
This sort of thing is what the penalty system does all the time and it spoils racing from the back because you are bound to come across incidents like this and even when you are careful you still get penalties.
- 5,662
- Ulricehamn
Maybe they don't want us to race from the back?? Penalty System is probably designed for qualifying and racing people with similar speed...
- 1,174
- Phoenix, AZ
- MonyB
I've had that thought myself but if that's really the case they should create a separate lobby for non-qualifiers rather than placing them at the back of a regular lobby.
- 976
- Indiana USA
- tmsheehan
- ToroSports
- 1,174
- Phoenix, AZ
- MonyB
I doubt it. But if they really don't want people racing from the back (and I don't know if they really care or not) they should do something along those lines to discourage people from doing it.
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- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
What I just can't wrap my head around is the placement of the penalty zones. There are tracks where a 1s penalty costs you upwards of 3s. And then there are tracks where a 3s penalty costs you 1.5s tops. The perfect examples being the middle of the Mulsanne straight at Le Mans and JUST BEFORE a HARD BRAKING ZONE at Tokyo (East Outer Loop I think). Who the 🤬 comes up with these?? The janitor at PD?? Someone's kid?? The penalty zones are not a completely terrible idea but the execution is beyond incompetent. They really hadn't thought it through before they implemented it. Good old PD.
Ha, it's inconsistent on Sarthe's 3 penalty zones. The first one costs you tons, the second one very little (but dangerous right after the corner with hybrids sprinting out the corner), the last one just brakes for you. It's also inconsistent with different cars, they can't even get that scaled right. ANd inconsistent with the time given. 1.5 to 2.5 sec penalties being the worst, to anything above 3 seconds making little difference.
I started racing from the back because the system sucked too much with qualifying. From the back I could avoid T1 penalties (getting hit from behind penalties) and my overall DR increased by 30%! That was when you still got 10 sec for a tap from behind in high DR.A, basically race over in T1 if the car behind touched you.
But true, if everyone has similar speed, no overtakes, no penalties! The system is designed not to pass. GT Parade, GT Formation lap simulator.
Like simply not letting you enter without a qualifying time
They could so easily tighten it up, requiring a minimum qualifying time for different competition levels. And if you dog your qualifying time, your fastest lap will be your selection criteria for the next race.So I don't think they care. Too many easy solutions and fixes that have been ignored for too long.
- 415
- North Bohemia
This one is easy. The Aston made contact with you just before it got taken out by the out-of-control Corvette. We all can see that you had absolutely nothing to do with it and every human being would see that as well but unfortunately that's not how the penalty system sees things. This system apparently doesn't register (or maybe intentionally ignores) out-of-control cars. For some unknown (to us) reason, it just didn't see the Corvette being the culprit. So, it saw side contact between the Aston and you and then him leaving the track. BAM. Here, have a penalty, good sir.
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- 6,764
- Ontario
- SvennoJ
- SvenZ
This one is easy. The Aston made contact with you just before it got taken out by the out-of-control Corvette. We all can see that you had absolutely nothing to do with it and every living being would see that as well but unfortunately that's not how the penalty system sees things. This system apparently doesn't register out-of-control cars being out of control. So, it saw side contact between the Aston and you and then him leaving the track. BAM. Here, have a penalty, good sir.
The system has always assumed that the survivor is the perpetrator. Hence the more control you have over your car, the more likely it is you end up with false penalties. Indeed all it sees is, contact, wait until positions change, blame the one that didn't lose position or gained position or simply gained speed. No gain, no pain. (short term that is, getting launched into a sand trap is also seen as a beneficial thus punishable speed gain
)
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