PENALTY SYSTEM IS STILL A PIECE OF ****!!!

Race C is so unbelievably dirty. The standing start was a really bad idea on a new track and a turn one with no track limits. I started second got punted into turn one. Second lap made my way back to 8th while coming back onto the track after turn one some dude wouldn't let me back on track then he brakes so hard and early into turn 2 that I rear end him and am threatened with disqualification. Next lap I'm flying I pass some dude who rear ends me as I'm turning hard into turn 2 spinning me. I get turned around and justice he goes off. Then I'm racing up behind someone no contact but I'm setting it up to draft down the straight and suddenly I'm disconnected for too many incidents. I'm not even mad. Kudos to PD I have a feeling this will be working in my favour more than not. Thats a great function a long time coming. Bravo PD!
 
Oswald07
Yes I did report him. There was a lot more. Unfortunately I was not his only victim. I saw him do the same to anyone that got near him.
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He must be playing with just one goal...

Getting the record for SR acumulated penalization in just one race...for him... and for the rest of all players on the same race...

WHAT AN IDIOT! HE MUST HAVE THE MENTAL AGE OF A 3, OR LESS, YEARS OLD KID!
 
rex1825
I know that... it is man talking to a wall... :)
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I made a suggestion to an alternate way to determine SR on the official playstation blog discussing the new penalty system. (When the harsh penalties were introduced). That post got deleted lol. At least GT Planet lets us talk about the inner workings of the failing penalty system :gtplanet: 👍

I'm already down to SR.B from Blue moon bay while driving carefully, not swerving, steady lines, haven't pushed anyone into a wall, not crashed anyone, not hit any walls myself, had some great races with fair players, all red ratings and a couple 🤬 penalties.

I'll put this here as well.

5 sec penalty for a car getting pushed into me in T2 that then disconnects. That's new! Maybe he got DQ as he was bumping people all race.
(It looks like a result of bumping the early lift of 3rd place in T3, yet frame by frame the penalty shows before contact happens with P3. That bump seemed to have no effect penalty wise)
 
its a joke.in withing 4 days got twice dr and sr reseted because of i.iots hitting me nonstop from everywhere and getting penalties for basicaly nothing.i had DR A and SR S then for no reason got into D E .in 4 days making my way very hard up almost been end of B and S and just now again.drop in between retardsss

and btw i won a race at this oval and got -2000 points with 0 sek .penalties.how can somebody explain this
 
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I managed to capture a DQ. I was in first, got (draft) bumped a few times, then got bumped into the wall in T1 and got disqualified in lap 4.


Broken is too kind a word for this game as it is right now.
Daily A is missing track limits completely, the road is merely there as a suggestion.
Daily B is completely messed up, getting penalized for getting hit from behind.
1 in 4 races never start, straight back to the race select screen, restart ps4 or it will persist.
As a results rooms are never full anymore, 3 people or more never make it in each race.

To make matters worse, the next race starts with the DQ warning. Driving super careful is not enough, just this and DQ again.
wbnRtyB.gif

Pretty much any car that comes near you, brake, give them the position. Yet don't brake or the car behind you could run into you and DQ you. :banghead:
 
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It's as if the penalty system on Race B is reversed. It's ruining some good races, and 9/10 the aggressor comes out smelling of roses; perfect for gamers!

Not a good week for PD at all!!
 
Sven Jurgens
I managed to capture a DQ. I was in first, got (draft) bumped a few times, then got bumped into the wall in T1 and got disqualified in lap 4” :banghead:
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They probably already know (and might not even care) but surely someone at Polyphony would be interested in seeing this video. It’s simply not right to be punished for something you have absolutely no control over. At this rate no one will want to be leading - or even infront of another car at that track.

I’ve avoided that race all week even though I quite like the oval races just because of what I have read and seen on here
 
HatMarris
They probably already know (and might not even care) but surely someone at Polyphony would be interested in seeing this video. It’s simply not right to be punished for something you have absolutely no control over.
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Is PD's twitter feed flooded with gifs of bad penalties? I don't use twitter but I just assumed it would be, given the nature of the internet. If it isn't, it should be. The best channels to communicate these issues would be a twitter campaign, the Sony message boards, or call whatever customer support number you can find in the manual and enter a complaint as if it's a bug ticket.

The last one might seem petty, to call up a customer support line to complain about a penalty system but typically customer support cases are collected and funneled back to QA and development. Sometimes quality of life suggestions would even come in through CS and gradually make their way into the games (to my surprise) when I worked at a Publisher.

That being said, given the nature of QA Testers, I highly doubt that PD are not aware of these issues. Exploitive gameplay is always being discovered in the testing environment because when people have to contractually play a video game for 8 hours a day they tend to hunt for the most efficient way to get through it. That observation honestly makes the overall situation more disconcerting if PD is fully aware of the long term problems (like rewarding dive bombing) that their system has and they're still unable to fix them.
 
I am sure it’s been mentioned but I think that an algorithm is unable to assign blame in any consistent or coherent manner and gamers will always find ways to take advantage of any weaknesses in the system so the only way to do it is to penalize all involved in contact equally and implement heavy damage so it begins to be ingrained into people that it’s not worth taking unnecessary risks or driving abusively.
 
Hello
I never did any online racing till about 4 years ago in GT6, so I'm no expert. I could be wrong about this but I don't remember the penalty system being a problem in GT6.

I honestly appreciate PD for trying to separate the good, the bad and the ugly drivers in GTS. What's mind-boggling to me is, how can a company that's been developing racing games for 20 years, come up with such a screwed-up penalty system that seems to be getting worse. Like taking penalties for getting rammed from behind now on BMB.

So what I'm wondering is
1. Is it neglect on their part, or just very very poor execution?
2. Does PD read any of the complaints on this form?
3. Do other big-name racing titles have lousy and totally frustrating penalty systems too?
4. I'm sure all games have their problems. But is there another one geared towards online racing, without the never ending penalty problems PD offers us?
 
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Whitey093
I am sure it’s been mentioned but I think that an algorithm is unable to assign blame in any consistent or coherent manner and gamers will always find ways to take advantage of any weaknesses in the system so the only way to do it is to penalize all involved in contact equally and implement heavy damage so it begins to be ingrained into people that it’s not worth taking unnecessary risks or driving abusively.
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That is still unproved... Impossible is simply what has not been tempted with a real intent to be achieved...

I will have something more to say after ACC online gaming is implemented... as I think that Kunos has something to say about such impossibility... (I hope)
 
How to go from a possible 3rd or 4th to a lowly 11th due to a stupid penalty system! I had a 3.99 second penalty after being side rammed into a wall earlier in the race. The final straight I dropped down to the apron to slow down and deplete my penalty, but the German player, also with a penalty decides to push me to the wall and then keep me there, whilst draining their penalty. I get a 4 second penalty just as I cross the line. At no point did I initiate contact, yet I am penalised!

 
Mirror_man
That is still unproved... Impossible is simply what has not been tempted with a real intent to be achieved...

I will have something more to say after ACC online gaming is implemented... as I think that Kunos has something to say about such impossibility... (I hope)
Click to expand...

I can play AAA titles on my PC, but I can create Excel data macros and reference functions that could easily bog it down without intentionally trying to do so. Data processing can be more intensive than most people presume. It's definitely a challenge to mine metrics in real time, assess them, and then to loop consequences back to the user and then the other players.

When the game engine is already pushing the console to it's limits you can see why basic penalty structures (like iRacing) are so appealing. I really do hope there is a key design break through here though, because I've been spoiled by semi clean racing and I can't imagine going back now.
 
gapper59
Hello
I never did any online racing till about 4 years ago in GT6, so I'm no expert. I could be wrong about this but I don't remember the penalty system being a problem in GT6.

I honestly appreciate PD for trying to separate the good, the bad and the ugly drivers in GTS. What's mind-boggling to me is, how can a company that's been developing racing games for 20 years, come up with such a screwed-up penalty system that seems to be getting worse. Like taking penalties for getting rammed from behind now on BMB.

So what I'm wondering is
1. Is it neglect on their part, or just very very poor execution?
2. Does PD read any of the complaints on this form?
3. Do other big-name racing titles have lousy and totally frustrating penalty systems too?
4. I'm sure all games have their problems. But is there another one geared towards online racing, without the never ending penalty problems PD offers us?
Click to expand...

It's not even ramming.
KfyWUtt.gif

The car behind me slightly bumps me then brushes the wall. The game thinks, contact, other car went off track, 3 sec penalty. Chance of wining gone. It could have simply been lag or maybe he tried to bump draft then got too close to the wall. Yet if you want to disable first, this is a way to do it.

We've gone full circle. Remember when people were complaining getting a 5 or 10 sec penalty for the slightest bumper contact with the car in front. Now it's reversed, Slightest contact from behind, penalty! With bump drafting, a couple of months ago the car doing the bumping got the red rating. Now the car receiving the bumping is getting the red rating or even DQ.

It's not just BMB, it's on all tracks, BMB simply highlights the problem due to the nature of oval racing. It was the same last week on RBR, however since that was a daily C you had a lot more points to squander before getting a red rating and penalties were easily scrubbed in T2.

It seems PD is just trying different things hoping something works eventually. However the system is far too simple to figure out who is at fault and penalizing both drivers will never achieve the goal of separating the different driving styles from each other.
 
@Mirror_man

It is impossible period. There is absolutely no room for argument here. Even in league racing with human stewards reviewing replays from all angles after the fact it can be very difficult to assess blame in many situations due to the many variables and the fact that both drivers usually share some level of responsibility for allowing the incident to be possible let alone happen.

I have also raced in real life many times and it is most often the case that if there is contact all involved parties are penalized. At the local short tracks if one car spins another they both go to the back for the restart. In 24 hours of lemons, if you have contact with another car or drag a tire off the track for any reason you get black flagged and hit with severe and often hilarious but embarrassing penalties. My last lemons race one teams penalty was they couldn’t return to the track until they created an entirely new livery with a theme for the car. It took hours, race over. And that was just for an off, no contact.

My point is assessing blame is so difficult that most real life racing series don’t even attempt they just penalize everyone equally to discourage the kind of driving that leads to problems. People whine and moan about that too but it is the best way possible. How do you expect a generic computer algorithm to figure it out? And do you really think the dirty drivers won’t find a way to game any other penalty system that is rolled out? They have gamed every other system immediately.
 
D
Whitey093
@Mirror_man

It is impossible period. There is absolutely no room for argument here. Even in league racing with human stewards reviewing replays from all angles after the fact it can be very difficult to assess blame in many situations due to the many variables and the fact that both drivers usually share some level of responsibility for allowing the incident to be possible let alone happen.

I have also raced in real life many times and it is most often the case that if there is contact all involved parties are penalized. At the local short tracks if one car spins another they both go to the back for the restart. In 24 hours of lemons, if you have contact with another car or drag a tire off the track for any reason you get black flagged and hit with severe and often hilarious but embarrassing penalties. My last lemons race one teams penalty was they couldn’t return to the track until they created an entirely new livery with a theme for the car. It took hours, race over. And that was just for an off, no contact.

My point is assessing blame is so difficult that most real life racing series don’t even attempt they just penalize everyone equally to discourage the kind of driving that leads to problems. People whine and moan about that too but it is the best way possible. How do you expect a generic computer algorithm to figure it out? And do you really think the dirty drivers won’t find a way to game any other penalty system that is rolled out? They have gamed every other system immediately.
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Duhh!
The software wont have to work out whose to blame in every situation but it has to deal correctly the obvious ones!!

And we all know a lot of them included in this category!

That is the only correct way of doing!

Not ignoring everything but dealing with the obvious!

Between a 0 and a 100 I would be very happy with something above 30 or 40 (%) of situations... and I beleive we all would!
 
By now, I honestly believe, PD are testing this system for data gathering. That's it.

Dialing in sensitivity with bumps, near misses, track limits, internet connections, as sive drivers aggressive drivers. They're observing it all.

Think about it. The game is 60 bucks. Realise PD don't look at what other games do(Kaz said so). Their first time putting all these features together. The way THEY want to do it. Hopefully, future improvements make GT one of the best online/esports experiences ever.
 
GT has always had crap penalty systems.
Understeer on turn 1 on spa, get a penalty even though the understeering screwed you.
AI turns into you, you get penalty, AI shunts you they don't get one.
 
Another moaning time for me again!

Is anyone else sick of getting bumped from the rear either by someone who cannot brake for corners or they just bump you from drafting and cannot go around, why do I loose SR because of this! It annoys me more that I give space to people but still get negative SR when they run into the back of me.

Come on GT sort the penalty / SR system out...
 

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