Pre-release GT5:Prologue Thread Firmware 2.17 mandatory for GT5:P? (and Pictures)

[Skid Mark 33]

I have to admit I am very impressed with this video. Sure, it has the same speedometer and time display as GT4, but who cares when the A.I is that good. For the first time ever, they were not just bumping into each other untill one of them fell out of place, then grabbing the oppurtunity.

 

[fasj6418]

sorry, i love GT, but the AI is still retarded and bumper car driving didn't worked in that video because the guy playing had no clue what he was doing.

did you guys see how fast he could get to the AI drivers in turns and when braking? that's bad.

the good news is, with full online mode, screw AI, lets play online and this is a non-issue.

i'm just afraid that online mode is going to be cheesy-friendly... lets hope not

 

[McLaren]

I don't see how you can claim the AI is still retarded when it's shockingly obvious they're avoiding him, making mistakes, and willing to drive into the grass to make a move. All that's a bit more than what I've experienced from Forza 2 after being rear ended and brake checked by Rossi.

 

[Earth]

I think some people believe as long as the AI makes contact with your or other AI that makes it retarded.

They want rediculous AI like rFactor where the AI is constantly hitting the brakes to avoid any contact

I'm tired of the guys coming in this thread complaing how GT5 Ai and driving physics isn't like their precious Forza

Look, GT5 is it's own game. If it played like Forza why should they call it GT and not Forza?

From the videos I've seen it's obvious the AI isn't brutal anymore and the cars spin out much easier. Other than that it still keeps the GT feel. If you dont like go play Forza

 

[fasj6418]

I don't see how you can claim the AI is still retarded when it's shockingly obvious they're avoiding him, making mistakes, and willing to drive into the grass to make a move. All that's a bit more than what I've experienced from Forza 2 after being rear ended and brake checked by Rossi.

maybe i'm being nitpicking, but, look in his race, after the restart. his overtake over a white lancer in the first leg of the degner was just wrong. he had no line. the AI should be able to mantain his position coming out of the corner with more traction.

then few moments later he just bumps a yellow lancer off the road and overtakes. wtf?

but whatever, its just one video, so we just have to be patience. and again, with online mode this becomes a minor issue for me

 

[RedOak]

i still wonder if there's gonna be some kind of penalty system implemented... at least Yellow Flags... its a big problem in Forza2 online... too many jerks

 

[fasj6418]

I think some people believe as long as the AI makes contact with your or other AI that makes it retarded.

They want rediculous AI like rFactor where the AI is constantly hitting the brakes to avoid any contact

I'm tired of the guys coming in this thread complaing how GT5 Ai and driving physics isn't like their precious Forza

Look, GT5 is it's own game. If it played like Forza why should they call it GT and not Forza?

From the videos I've seen it's obvious the AI isn't brutal anymore and the cars spin out much easier. Other than that it still keeps the GT feel. If you dont like go play Forza

sometimes its a problem of balance. if the AI is overly agressive like in F1 CE, and has no awereness of where you are on the track, that's not smart AI, that's just wrong. in other hand, the AI in previous GTs have always been about braking too much and just following a line.

the big challenge is making the AI play like a human.

as for GT5, for me its more import to know if the driving phisics are running on 360fps like they promised. i can get over the AI

 

[Earth]

i still wonder if there's gonna be some kind of penalty system implemented... at least Yellow Flags... its a big problem in Forza2 online... too many jerks

I think the only way you can truly crack down on online racing jerks is for the game to allow the host to watch the race and have the ability to eject those he sees fit. Maybe even give him the ability to send replays of morons to PD in order for them to do what they see fit

But since this is PD's first online game I at least hope they will include things to prevent basic jerk behavior, like driving backwards

 

[Christhedude]

i still wonder if there's gonna be some kind of penalty system implemented... at least Yellow Flags... its a big problem in Forza2 online... too many jerks

yep and there should be a blue flag as well LFS style

 

[McLaren]

maybe i'm being nitpicking, but, look in his race, after the restart. his overtake over a white lancer in the first leg of the degner was just wrong. he had no line. the AI should be able to mantain his position coming out of the corner with more traction.

Well, that's 1 mistake. That doesn't mean the AI is retarded.

then few moments later he just bumps a yellow lancer off the road and overtakes. wtf?

He doesn't bump it off the road. There's absolutely no contact, and if there was, it was nowhere near hard enough to knock the AI that far into the gravel. That's called the AI misjudging and is something you want to see.

Besides, did you bother watching the F430 and the R8 fight? Or the R33? Clear signs of AI improvement.

 

[MasterGT]

I translated some of the German:

"Erstmalig sind auch on-linewettkampfe bis zu 16 personen gleichzeitig möglich."

For the first time, it will also be possible for up to 16 persons to fight online, at the same time.

That doesn't say anything about mixing in AI nor limiting to only 8 people.
This may still be a matter of interpretation, but it isn't the same as stated above, either.

I hope someone can still ask the right questions of the right people and get clear answers.

Cheers,

MasterGT

 

[ALPHA]

Gamersyde video is up.

http://www.gamersyde.com/news_4848_en.html

Fuji Speedway confirmed.

 

[hornet_burnout]

Thanks for the news




Well the Nissan GT-R (it's not a Skyline btw) is a concept/prototype, the interior hasn't been officially displayed yet to the public, so a lack of interior was expected (to me anyway).

Right, it's not a skyline, force of habit.

But I was inclined to think that in some races, with 16 cars, you would not be able to have that view, and in other (less cars) you could.

Since you can't see the whole screen and the player's positions (1/16 or 1/8), I can't be sure.

Of course i've been wrong before...

 

[Ben Aracin]

For the folk that ask others to be carefulwhat they wish for, among a few others, that is what PROFESSIONAL MODE is for, supposedly much more realistic in handling, that includes collision detection that works against the A.I. as well as you. Along with the more realistic handling.
And to Biggles, i hadn't thought of that but being it's in Germany i bet it was KPH instead of MPH.
There still should have been a noticable movement towards the bumped A.I./other cars,(getting the back end fishtailed a bit etc).
Then i see the post with Gamespot saying the A.I. hasn't been changed much.
Oh i'm so glad this isn't the full GT5 but i'm stating to wonder.
Some folk claim that the R33 was overtaking but if watched closely, all it did after going of course was simply push itself right back on the track, right across the players field of view, then continuing on.
The yellow EVO, if it did get tapped, it should have spun out,not slide off.
Of course that depends on whether it was running on normal mode or professional mode.
If it was an A.I. error? good but it's hard to tell.
Hopefully more racing/handling detail is shown over the course of the show.

 

[MasterGT]

Gamersyde video is up.

This video more or less proves my earlier conviction that Photo Mode has a new feature - moving car and panning camera videos.

We will most likely make a starting and end point and the camera will pan with the car as it moves slowly through the location. Camera controls to manage this are also likely to be there.

Cheers,

MasterGT

 

[red7]

Note that under "features", the picture also says: "totally new physics engine with real next-generation car handling". Forget about the marketing slang, but we definitely get new physics.

YES!!👍

 

[opelgt1969]

I think the only way you can truly crack down on online racing jerks is for the game to allow the host to watch the race and have the ability to eject those he sees fit. Maybe even give him the ability to send replays of morons to PD in order for them to do what they see fit

But since this is PD's first online game I at least hope they will include things to prevent basic jerk behavior, like driving backwards

Hey lets not forget not allowing people that think that their cars need to be hybrids or gamesharks; if detected they should be banned online!

 

[V1P3R]

YES!!👍

That doesn't say much to me... I mean it could get worse. xD

 

[Biggles]

Weird that there's only that 1 second shot of Fuji...

 

[scandisk]

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/814/814720p1.html

clutch support?

If you're going to play "the real driving simulator," Sony's spread at the German Games Convention is definitely the way to go. Several flat-screens are playing the game on the show floor, and in front of each TV is a Logitech steering wheel, bucket seat and a set of shiny gas, brake and clutch pedals.

thats a good start... keep em coming PD

 

[slackbladder]

Nice to read there's a London City circuit and that it's in Prologue.👍

As for the AI, until you play it for yourself it's hard to tell. They did seem to be racing each other more, going offline to overtake etc. In GT4 it felt too much like a procession at times. I hope they get rid of that "one car running away from the field" stupidity from GT4 too. And with 16 cars there'll be qualifying for sure. Something Forza 2 should have had.

I also hope in GT5 the AI cars run without aids. I like driving without TCS etc but the AI cars always use them. The same thing goes for Forza 2 - they all drive with TCS, STM and ABS. It's really annoying and makes racing against AI frustrating. If GT5/Prologue doesn't make that mistake I'll be very, very happy!

Edit: Oh, and IGN seem to be suggesting that GT5 will support the clutch on the G25 - last line of article. Just a figure of speech or what?

 

[TheMoose]

if the AI is overly agressive like in F1 CE, and has no awereness of where you are on the track, that's not smart AI, that's just wrong.

But that's how Hamilton drives in F1 so the AI in F1 CE is actually right on!

 

[Adam West]

I think some people believe as long as the AI makes contact with your or other AI that makes it retarded.

They want rediculous AI like rFactor where the AI is constantly hitting the brakes to avoid any contact

I'm tired of the guys coming in this thread complaing how GT5 Ai and driving physics isn't like their precious Forza

Look, GT5 is it's own game. If it played like Forza why should they call it GT and not Forza?

From the videos I've seen it's obvious the AI isn't brutal anymore and the cars spin out much easier. Other than that it still keeps the GT feel. If you dont like go play Forza

GT has never had a proper AI. The cars were never even aware that there were other cars on the track. The physics and AI in GT isn't like Forza in the sense that Forza has both these things. It's got REAL physics and decent AI - this is something GT SHOULD have so long as it calls itself a console SIM.

By the way, i'm looking for a part-time job myself. How much does Sony pay to market their games online?

PM me please,
thanks in advance.

 

[Duphman]

NOW THATS WHAT I CALL A SOUND ENGINE. I thought PD was yanking my chain with Type-A, but those babies are still howling like there's no tomorrow.
I also liked the beginning Ridge Racer jazz. It seems as if GT signature tunes are getting just a little more classy as opposed to the Forza butt-rock (this is not an insult to GT former tunes, they were just something you'd expect to be played in your local Publix). Any who I hope the actual game allows for custom music so I can play both WipeOut's and R4's soundtracks. Cant wait for the damage engine PD (maybe thats why the Xanavi Z and Bandai SC are sadly absent from this video; maybe they'll have a full Autobacs Super GT grid in the demo) Im really rambling now time to shut up.

 

[Quiet_Storm]

The video looks great. Still disappointed in a few little details that PD has left out but hopefully this will be dealt with in the final release. I highly doubt it but I'm still going to keep hoping.

One thing I haven't noticed anyone asking and that is the car sounds? The video had too much music playing so I couldn't hear anything coming from the game itself. I would love to hear what the sounds in the game is like, especially the engine/exhaust and I'm praying to god that PD re-did the tire screeching sounds!

Judging from the video, the game looks beautiful and the AI does seem to have improved greatly. One thing I noticed that I do not think has only been slightly improved is the overall handling and collision physics. Hope my mind will be changed when I play Prologue with the G25. I'm just happy that they implemented the clutch pedal into the game. Now the only question is how realistic is it? I want the engine to kill if I let the clutch out without giving it any gas.

 

[Stevisiov]

Weird that there's only that 1 second shot of Fuji...

Because PD like to tease the fans with little snipets of information. Remember the type-B trailer? we only saw 16 cars on track a few seconds from the end. Until that point every part showed us 6 cars on track at max, this wasn't by chance, it was carefully setup so we would see the killer new info at the last second, just to make it look that bit more special.

And that is exactly what is happening here.

 

[Earth]

I'm going to break this video down since it seems alot of people claim it shows retarded AI

4:11 white car doesn't use entire road and body slam you
4:07 grey car misses apex and runs wide
4:00 car goes into grass the driver loses control
3:30 driver bumps car infront, there is very noticeable movement in the back of the car he bumped
3:26 car on the inside does use the whole track and run you off the course like they do in GT4 at that very turn
3:13 white car hits brakes to avoid getting nosed chopped off by car in front
3:08 white car is given room
3:06 driver gets into dark car slightly, hardly any movement
3:03 on apex the dark car gives the driver room and does not try to use the whole track
2:40 contact with the wall spins the car a bit
2:31-2:20 yellow car does not use the entire track and leaves the driver room
1:59 the driver spooks the yellow car and the yellow car makes a mistake and goes off track. no contact is made
1:23 contact with white car spins the driver sideways
1:22 when the car hits the barrier it does not simply stop like GT4, but it bounces off the barriers and does a 360 degree spin
1:03 onwards. The AI gives eachother plenty of room as they race sideby side without swapping paint
:57 The silver car moves out the way to give you room, the best example of improved AI

He goes out in the grass again and spins quickly

If you ask me the only thing retarded in the video was the human driver


My final thoughts are this. PD created a very aggressive AI for GT5. Some mistake this for stupid AI

The guys at gamespot probably think they should be able to put their car in any situation and dive bomb anybody and the AI shouldn't make contact with them. In real life there would be contact. That's why there is hardly any side by side racing and passing in real life. The risk of a collision is too great.

Realistic AI would get into single file after the first 2 turns and then run single file parade laps for the rest of the race with maybe 2-3 passes. The reason why they dont try to pass and race double so much is because it would result in collisions and spins, like you see in GT5.

PD is shooting for tense, 2-wide racing, not realistic boring racing.

And I'm sticking to my guns, the trademark of GT is the possibility to trade paint and rub with other cars and not spin out. If you want to spin out realisticly go play a PC sim. And if you prefer Forza's collision physics go play Forza.

I just don't see why how easy it is to spin another car out is so important considering it was near impossible to spin another car out in the first 4 GT games. I'm not going to lose 1 second of sleep over it.

Think of GT as a character. It has character flaws that make it different. Special. Unique. That's what makes it Gran Turismo. Take away these flaws and add what people in this thread want and you got a Forza clone. I don't want that.

 

[Kent]

I wouldn't be suprised to see people get banned for cheating. There is already confirmation that abusive members in the "home" will be banned, I don't see why Sony would act differently about a game.

Also, that video looked good, nice interiors, nice cars, nice graphics, etc etc... However, I didn't see much to show the power of the AI.
Don't get me wrong, there were definately a few spots where the AI went side by side instead of directly into the driver. Problem is, the driver in that video seemed like a bad player and basing judgements of a GT game on a bad player's example seems like a bad idea to me.

All in all the game looks great though and I'm looking forward to playing it some time soon (now I've just got to decide on a PS3 or X360).

 

[solinent]

YES!!👍

Don't get too excited, it's what they said for GT:HD too. It's an ever-evolving engine.

HOLY CRAP at the videos though. Man, October 21 can't come sooner (THE SAME DAY I GO FOR MY LICENCE TEST TOO! and by birthday is the 19th).



Also -- I've played GTR2 and that's it, but I didn't see what was wrong with the AI in Gran Turismo, except for being dumbasses when it came to you. In b-spec mode there were plenty of passes on equal games. I'm sure this is just an extension of that in GT4 cars overshot their turns also. All those cars WEREN'T always on the racing line though, so that's a nice improvement.

What I don't want is the AI to be dicks. I'll deal with dicks online.

 

[drew259]

did anyone notice the tire smoke? looks alot more realistic when the car spins towards the end it leaves a little cloud of smoke.

and im not sure but i don't think all cars have the in car view, watch the player switch the views at the end it never goes to the inside view.