Pre-release GT5:Prologue Thread Firmware 2.17 mandatory for GT5:P? (and Pictures)

[Dave A]

Well of course they're going to have subtle differences in sound. They're just limited in the range of sounds they can produce because they are V8s. My point is that no matter much you do to a internal combustion engine, it will always be a V8, V12, I4 etc. at heart. You can't change the basic sound frequencies it will produce simply because of the way the pistons fire off in sequence. You can't make a V8 sound like a V12, it's impossible.

Now if we get really complicated, some V6s can sound almost like a V12, and a V8 can sound almost like a V16, because they fire off in similar manners. Of course, the V16 would have a more substantial sound than a V8 as well, seeing as it has double the cylinders.


All I'm saying is, to make it easier on PD so they don't have to record 700+ cars, just record some examples of every engine type in the game, and get a sound guru (preferably one who worked in a submarine) to tweak the sounds of particular cars so they sound identical to their real life counterparts. Now I can see some flaws in this, the sounds would be synthesized a little, but at least a V8 would sound like a V8 instead of a leaf blower. It bugs me to no end that some of the cars in the game don't sound like cars at all, they sound like insects (the GT-One) or a vacuum cleaner. (the C5-R)

I beg to differ, the number of cylinders an engine has, does not mean it will sound remotely like another engine with the same number of cylinders. Ofcourse, the number of cylinders influences the sound, but there is so much else involved. That's like saying all cars sound the same at their core when at 3000rpm, just not true.

An AJP6 sounds vastly different to an RGIOJKSNIEH6 thing-a-me-bob they in the R34 Skyline GT-Rs

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

Few more months, not weeks

Yes weeks.

"Few" is indefinite and refers to more than two. December to March is three months... barely qualifying as "few"... so it's not a stretch to consider "few extra weeks" as a more accurate assessment, but yes, you could also technically say it's a few months as well.

... hope you enjoy that half-empty cup of coffee while you wait those "few extra months".

I can't believe that people are still surprised by PD delaying release dates!

Have you learnt nothing?

Agreed! It's not even just PD. Just about ever major title gets delayed these days. Last I heard Take 2 and Rock Star announced a roughly 6 month delay for GTA4.

Once again, as impatient as many gamers obviously are, I personally would prefer to wait for a game to be ready for release, then push developer's to release NRFPT games.

For those that think these delays are avoidable, I suggest you start your own game development company making games for a world wide market, and see for yourself why games get delayed rather than make conspiracy theories and or claim developers are lazy, and don't know what they are doing.

 

[STINGer71]

hope you enjoy that half-empty cup of coffee while you wait those "few extra months".

Yes, i will enjoy in japanese Prologue while i wait those "few extra weeks"

 

[JohnBM01]

Oh, here we go again. It's okay. I'm not worried. I don't have a PS3 or feel desperate to get one, remember? Unless PD's trying to make this available for multiple audiences for multiple audiences, then I can understand the delay. Again, some devlopers delay it too long to the point which the developers kill their own franchise. Remember Malice? Remember Duke Nukem Forever? It's going to come out, people. I'm patient. Just going to school and having my day-to-day worries. I'm in no rush. Don't even care if we get the Japanese version of Prologue for America. I came off with this as far as a Ridge Racer 7 demo had Japanese text for info on the game.

If you're a game developer or know anyone in this department, how long does it really take to make the conversions for most games?

 

[FoolKiller]

Yes, i will enjoy in japanese Prologue while i wait those "few extra weeks"

So, are you buying both versions? If so, I hope it is really, really good.

EDIT: On the upside, I just realized that this gives me a perfect excuse to break my promise of not buying any other games before Prologue. Granted I broke it once already when I bought Warhawk, but I played that up as a way to get a Bluetooth headset for my phone so I will actually talk to her while I'm driving.

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

Again, some devlopers delay it too long to the point which the developers kill their own franchise. Remember Malice? Remember Duke Nukem Forever?

Just look at all the delays EA's & Maxis' Spore has gone through and continues to have! I believe it may have already broken the record for longest delay.

It's going to come out, people. I'm patient. Just going to school and having my day-to-day worries. I'm in no rush.

👍

Besides, we will still have the free demo to play around with before then.

 

[STINGer71]

So, are you buying both versions?

Of course... what can i do?

 

[Grand Prix]

I beg to differ, the number of cylinders an engine has, does not mean it will sound remotely like another engine with the same number of cylinders. Ofcourse, the number of cylinders influences the sound, but there is so much else involved. That's like saying all cars sound the same at their core when at 3000rpm, just not true.

An AJP6 sounds vastly different to an RGIOJKSNIEH6 thing-a-me-bob they in the R34 Skyline GT-Rs

For the most part, we are in agreement. Although an engine's sound overall will be different if given a different type of crank shaft even, it will still sound like a 12 cylinder. Let me rephrase that: It will be identifiable as a 12 cylinder.

If people expect PD to record every single car in the game than that's fine with me. Seems like a lot of unnecessary work though.

 

[FoolKiller]

Of course... what can i do?

Personally, I don't know if I would pay for it twice when I can either wait for my native language or by the time the English version comes out I will know the menu orientation well enough to be able to ignore the Japanese.

To each their own, I guess. I will probably just wait for it to come to the US. I still have plenty of stuff to do in GT4.

 

[DuckRacer]

So Prologue has been delayed to next Spring. Not surprised.

Looks like Spring 2009 release for GT5 is getting more and more realistic. 👎

 

[Earth]

So Prologue has been delayed to next Spring. Not surprised.

Looks like Spring 2009 release for GT5 is getting more and more realistic. 👎

Yes, even the 2 Final Fantasy games look like they will be pushed back to 2009, but, that's due to quality. I seriously doubt PD is sitting back and taking their time. I've watched a video where I believe they said PD employees work very long hours and if I'm not mistaken they have workers there 24 hours?

When they said it takes 6 months to model 1 car they weren't joking. 6 months worth of manpower but the point is GT5 is 50x more detailed than GT4 and it makes Forza 2 PGR4 etc look like nothing. And what are we expecting from PD for GT5? No less than 40 original tracks and 500+ cars. Now that these are 50x more detailed it only makes sense for development to take a year or 2 longer. Hopefully there won't be a GT6 due to time but rather 'expansion' packs.

Daytona, engines sound good!:

 

[UnoMOTO]

Does this delay make anyone think of a certain GTHD classic that was cancelled. I have a feeling that it will turn into a Japan release only and then drop GT5P to concentrate on the full game.

That seems more likely then the man power wasted on a demo of a demo!

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

I have a feeling that it will turn into a Japan release only and then drop GT5P to concentrate on the full game.

I'd wager against that happening.

 

[cudadude2]

i think its time for a 360 and forza. a few month wait to race was one thing, but now its looking like more than a year away still. Sorry Sony, but its forza time.


b

 

[Kamus]

i think its time for a 360 and forza. a few month wait to race was one thing, but now its looking like more than a year away still. Sorry Sony, but its forza time.


b

J00 Juzt Pwnd Sonee IN DA FASE! LOL, LOL, LOL!
FORZA TIME.

Seriously though, you sound very emo.

 

[land sea air]

J00 Juzt Pwnd Sonee IN DA FASE! LOL, LOL, LOL!
FORZA TIME.

Seriously though, you sound very emo.

and you sound very 10 years old...

 

[UnoMOTO]

I'd wager against that happening.

I'm not positive about this but what game other then a FULL game has been released in the U.S. Did Concept or GT4P make it in?

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

and you sound very 10 years old...

A common disease among some Forza fans.

Hopefully the same won't happen to cudadudew.... not about playing Forza 2, as it's a great game despite it's understandable short comings.. but about the drop in maturity level among certain "fans".

 

[RACECAR]

Yes, even the 2 Final Fantasy games look like they will be pushed back to 2009, but, that's due to quality. I seriously doubt PD is sitting back and taking their time. I've watched a video where I believe they said PD employees work very long hours and if I'm not mistaken they have workers there 24 hours?

I saw that too and thought "Wow, thats dedication"

When they said it takes 6 months to model 1 car they weren't joking. 6 months worth of manpower but the point is GT5 is 50x more detailed than GT4 and it makes Forza 2 PGR4 etc look like nothing. And what are we expecting from PD for GT5? No less than 40 original tracks and 500+ cars. Now that these are 50x more detailed it only makes sense for development to take a year or 2 longer.

Indeed. Not something you can easily pull off in one year

Daytona, engines sound good!:

I'm loving it, man. This keeps getting better and better.

 

[Kamus]

So Prologue has been delayed to next Spring. Not surprised.

Looks like Spring 2009 release for GT5 is getting more and more realistic. 👎

Delayed? how was it delayed if a release date for the US market hadn't even been set, for neither prologue or GT5 itself?

Anyway, the way the game is looking. Which seems to be not a whole new engine, but a game that still carries some bagage from the previous GT games. (in a bad way, if you look at it from the "realisim" perspective, or a good way if you want the game to come out faster...)

I wouldn't be too surprised if it did came out in 2008, it's not a totally new engine, so that takes off a lot of the work.
I know.. it looks light years better than GT4 and GT4 was a pretty solid engine to begin with.
But you can't deny there is still a lot of bagage from the previous GT's there, Like the way they implement sounds. And i hope i'm wrong about the sounds!

I personaly wouldn't mind if the game DID come out in 2009 if it meant a whole new level of realisim, by dumping all of the old assets that are legacy to very old hardware and are obsolete, and just starting from scratch to fully take advantage of new hardware. But... it's too late for that, GT HD as originally announced should've come out months ago for that to happen.

I really thought that "Gran Turismo HD" was going to be the game to keep people entertained while they worked on a totally new engine... untill they canceled it.

"Gran Turismo HD" as it was originally announced, was pretty much GT4 in high res. More cars at the same time, better rendering quality, and online funtionality.
That game would've been out by now, and we would all be playing it online at this very moment...
But for some reason PD decided against that, and instead seems to be going for what seems to be an evolution of GT4, which looks a lot better than just GT4 in high res, but none the less still carries some of the bagage, at least from what we've seen to this point. Sounds seem to be just as bad, jury still out on the new physics engine, (is it "ALL NEW"? or is it just a higher resolution GT4 physics engine? which didn't even take tyres into the ecuation properly.) no weather effects, no damage. Etc.

But anyway, that's just my explination as to why i think it could come out in 2008, and i think it will.

Maybe PD's plan is just to patch GT5 a lot, releasing it "early" (2008), but adding new stuff incrementaly.

Which i guess is enough to keep people happy, but that aproach is nowhere near as good as simply saying "ok, enough is enough. it's time to get all the stuff that is obsolete out of the way by just starting from scratch".


On the other hand, they might not know when to stop adding new features and delay the game more instead of deciding to go the patch route. (this could very well lead to a 2009 release date, and knowing PD, it wouldn't be the least surprising.)

I think that PD, instead of spending so much time modeling the cars to make them look as awsome as they do at this point. Should have instead, made a new engine from scratch. Add weather effects, extremley realistic physics and instead of spending so many man hours on just the cars they could release "car packs" online.
I mean lets be serious here, there's thousands of different cars out there, so even if they decide to spend more time doing that it won't be enough.
It would've probalby just been better to concentrate on the barebones of the game and to leave the car quantity problem post-release.
But that's just my opinion.

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

I'm not positive about this but what game other then a FULL game has been released in the U.S. Did Concept or GT4P make it in?

There is a big difference of course, as neither of those was ever officially announced for NA... and they were both released else where, so there isn't even a precedent for PD canceling a previously announced Prologue edition in favor of just releasing a "full GT" edition.


This is exactly the point I was making a few weeks ago when there were a small handful of people claiming GT5 was "just" a demo, and like all other demos it should be free. It's fairly clear GT5 is not like any demo currently released or planned for on the PS3 or 360.

So any way, yes, I'd continue to wager confidently on GT5's release, and unlike with the PS2, even if for some reason it never gets an official release in North America, it will likely be very easy to get and play in North America. 👍

 

[Dave A]

A common disease among some Forza fans.

Hopefully the same won't happen to cudadudew.... not about playing Forza 2, as it's a great game despite it's understandable short comings.. but about the drop in maturity level among certain "fans".

Ahem . I wouldn't head into that side of the debate if I was you, not if you want to set an example of how maturity levels should be. I've seen maturity levels just as low in both camps .

I agree with you on GT5's release being far more likely to happen than not. As for all these people moaning that GT5 looks to be a year away, well whats new. All we did know is that it was expected in Japan, some time next year, that could mean a December release, in Japan. That might still happen, but I wouldn't put my cash on that one. As for the realse date, I never expected it to release in Japan early-mid next year in the first place, I always expected it to be late. So GT5's release in Feb-March still gives you a lot of time before GT5's release.

 

[Digital-Nitrate]

Ahem . I wouldn't head into that side of the debate if I was you, not if you want to set an example of how maturity levels should be. I've seen maturity levels just as low in both camps.

You'll get no argument from me on that. That's why I made sure to add the ''

No "format", be it Mac VS PC, Blu-ray VS HD DVD, PS3 VS 360, GT VS Forza, etc is devoid of fans that put their emotions ahead of common sense, and who have a hard time distinguishing the difference between expressing an opinion and stating a fact, and who allow their biased enthusiasim get in the way of recognizing objective facts. 👎

 

[UnoMOTO]

There is a big difference of course, as neither of those was ever officially announced for NA... and they were both released else where, so there isn't even a precedent for PD canceling a previously announced Prologue edition in favor of just releasing a "full GT" edition.


This is exactly the point I was making a few weeks ago when there were a small handful of people claiming GT5 was "just" a demo, and like all other demos it should be free. It's fairly clear GT5 is not like any demo currently released or planned for on the PS3 or 360.

So any way, yes, I'd continue to wager confidently on GT5's release, and unlike with the PS2, even if for some reason it never gets an official release in North America, it will likely be very easy to get and play in North America. 👍

I'm just jaded by now. It's hardly worth discussing when the information given to us changes month to month.

 

[Quiet_Storm]

Daytona, engines sound good!:

Maybe I don't have my speakers cranked up to ear drum blowing decibals but I did not really hear any engine sounds at all in this video. You can hear a little of it at first but nothing that I haven't heard in GT4. The Japanese guy who was talking did have a pretty sexy voice, though.



2008 M3 Challenge. I'm hoping that GT5 will have enging sounds like this or better in the final GT5 and if it has this kind of physics, I'd be one very happy camper! I don't even go camping.



This is why it's fun to have smoke and tire tracks. Although, this game could've used a little more smoke effect. It's still pretty good because they stay on the screen for awhile. Physics of the game looks pretty good the way the car looked as it was burning out and doing donuts.


Here is another video of 2008 M3 Challenge. The initial start up in the garage sounded amazing! The game is for PC and fully supports the G25 wheel. w00t!

 

[Tenacious D]

If you want to compare gt4's or gt hd's physics to a far more worthy console competitor, just go play Enthusia.

I do own Enthusia, and I also disagree with you on how realistic Enthusia is. It's nothing like the opening Miata cinema. It would help if it had anything resembling realistic tire sounds, much to Wolfe's chagrin I insist this is true. At some point I'm going to go out with my bro's camcorder and see how similar Enthusia is to real life, compared to GT4 and Forza. I've played it enough to know it captures certain aspects of driving dynamics, and for the fans that's great, but there are also threads detailing how it gets things quite wrong too. I think in the realism department, you'll just have to leave it at the fact that you prefer Enthusia. I prefer GT4 because it sits me behind a wheel like no other game I've ever played before, and equips me to understand what my car is doing and how it feels about it.

I haven't played Ferrari 355 Challenge for years because I found the cockpit view to be crap, as it is on most games, but I might give it a whirl for the heck of it this fall.

I was also going to make that very comment about using a hand controller to control a car in real life. Physics is one thing, but being able to control a car properly and make a judgment from that, I think you're exaggerating a scouche.

By the way, I am adamantly not a drifter.

As for Prologue's delay, it irks me, though I feared as much. But there is a good thing about a delay. The Japanese release will be missing a few elements intended for the full Prologue build, such as voice chat, multiple online play modes and other things. A delay gives Kas and the lads time to finish up Prologue a bit more, so our release should be a more satisfying one.

 

[Earth]

Don't expect engine sound to change until they at least change the tire screeching sound. Just a month ago GT5 was using GT4's HUD, the shadows were jaggy, and the mirrors looked like a 8 bit game. Look how far they came in 1 month.

GT5 is still 10+ months away so let's give them time shall we? Besides, I don't think GT's engine sounds are as bad as some make them out to be. Sure, other games do a much better job but GT is no slouch.

From what I'm seeing in this thread, people are finding features that their favorite racing game does well, whether it be burnouts, damage, collisions, engine sound, and then they're demanding Gran Turimso 5 to at least match the particular feature.

 

[Biggles]

With regard to engine sounds:

one thing that Gt4 does very well that nobody seems to have mentioned is the relative volume & positioning of engine sounds when racing with other cars. Forza, Forza 2 & EPR serve up a cacophony of sound in which you can barely distinguish your own car from the cars around, in front & behind you.

In practice this is more important than the "accuracy" of the engine sounds since it has more effect on your ability to race.

 

[JohnBM01]

The way I see it, maybe this delay was to make a proper "GT5: Prologue" for America and other English-speaking nations. Maybe this delay was needed to make a real GT5P some of us English-speaking folk can like. At best, it could probably take no less than a month to translate everything into English. Now as I said in my previous post, perhaps translating to other languages may be the deal. I, too, am a person who doesn't think GT's taking their gingerly time. In fact, I usually NEVER think that. Only way I'd think about such a deal is if PD just makes a lackluster product. We're basically getting to the point in which an essential demo or light version of a game can be just as anticipated as the forthcoming retail product. I can kind of think in the Duke Nukem 3D days how there were people looking to download the popular Lame Duke deal which was somewhat of a light version of the amazing Duke Nukem 3D.

Again, I'm not going to make excuses or take shots at PD. I'm a patient fellow. I'll keep playing GTHD and enjoy the menu music and the 10 cars available and the one track. At least I'm playing something good from PD while GT5P is in the works. And oh yeah, I'm not going to make stupid jokes about a seemingly forever-taking game which in realistic terms, may be released within perhaps 1 to 3 years. You may have some regional codes, potential hackers, all of which to screw up release dates even more. If I'm not mistaken, even Forza 1 had to be delayed. I know GT's been around much longer than Forza, but come on. The wait isn't excruciating. It's only a long wait for people who perceive and believe it to be long. Think about it in a positive mindset- at least you'll get to have a better idea of what the final product will be like. It's only not coming if PD completely cancels GT5. So exercise patience. We did this with GT4, why not this one as well? You got nothing to do with your life (generalization/sarcasm). So hope for the best from PD.

 

[Tenacious D]

From what I'm seeing in this thread, people are finding features that their favorite racing game does well, whether it be burnouts, damage, collisions, engine sound, and then they're demanding Gran Turimso 5 to at least match the particular feature.

Every gripe thread is like that. "I can't do donuts like Infusia" or "It doesn't have damage or drifting like Fordza" or "The cars feel nothing like in Die For Speed..." so on so forth. Because racing game building is as much art as science, people find something in a certain game that hits them right in the pleasure center. If Gran Turismo doesn't give them "that," suddenly the game is oyster poo. Never mind that none of the other games give them "that" either.

I've tried all those other games. "That" isn't doing donuts or drifting, as I've never used a donut to win a race, except as a joke. It isn't super loud annoying engine sounds. It isn't damage. "That" to me is making me feel like I'm part of the car, that when I give gas, brake and wheel a command, that it translates into something much like I expect a real car to do. "That" is having a car communicate with me like a real car does, and giving me a lifelike view of the track so I can drive it properly. Gran Turismo has always done this better than any other game, and I've played most of them. And it goes the extra mile in allowing me to collect most of the cars I'd love to own myself, modify and race them. It also gives me a wealth of tracks. I think only Toca has more.

Forza is a great stand in, but it's only a stand in, and at some point I'll have to return to GT4 since Prologue is being delayed.

I agree that all this prejudging a game before the prelude is even released is strange, but that's human nature. If you're frustrated about something, grouch, even if it's about something you know nothing or next to nothing about.

one thing that GT4 does very well that nobody seems to have mentioned is the relative volume & positioning of engine sounds when racing with other cars. Forza, Forza 2 & EPR serve up a cacophony of sound in which you can barely distinguish your own car from the cars around, in front & behind you.

I keep forgetting that, but that is a major gripe of mine at Forza. Having an opponent as much as 30 car lengths behind you and sounding like he's about to pass you is the most annoying situation in the world, especially if it's one of those irritating Cadillac, Vette or Mustang race cars. If you're in a pack, good luck hearing your car sounds over the others. GAH.