PURE | Flyin' Miata Super Cup | Grand Finale Results & Points Posted!

[Dr_Watson]

Personally I'd prefer it if we had to keep 2 tires on the tarmac at the neuvelle chicane. That's only cut-able because people were dying when there was a wall there.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Yeah, 2 tires on the tarmac (left side) of the rumble strip would be best.

 

[Müle]

That's how Adam did it in GT4 iirc.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

I've put way too many hours practicing Monaco, trying every setup imaginable, and this is what my car looks like now.

Just about had it. Based on what I've seen, I have to be in the 40s, but I can't get there no matter what I do.

 

[Joshua1994]

Will be on tonight for a while if anybodys up for it. Really need a tune for this track..

Could only run 41.1xx with my Spa tune, definitely agree with Car that 39s are possible with a decent tune!

But all I can say is, hands down this weekend is gonna be SC galore. Just please none of the guys at the front spin, otherwise we'll have a huge pileup, especially the sector after neuvelle..

 

[carracerptp]

Yeah, 2 tires on the tarmac (left side) of the rumble strip would be best.

Is that final?
I was using the lines I learned by watching WRS, I don't think I could get down much lower than mid 40s without using the rumble strip as road.

Will be on tonight for a while if anybodys up for it. Really need a tune for this track..

Could only run 41.1xx with my Spa tune, definitely agree with Car that 39s are possible with a decent tune!

But all I can say is, hands down this weekend is gonna be SC galore. Just please none of the guys at the front spin, otherwise we'll have a huge pileup, especially the sector after neuvelle..

Full Aero

7/13/5

10/10
12.1/9.6
5/5
5/5
3/3

2.0/0.0
-0.15/-0.50

BB at 3/4

I'm using CSLs Mazda raceway tune with the ride height set to 10/10. The damper are 5/2 - 2/5.
Not sure but I think I changed the diff.

I would like more SCs than having to run a race damaged.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Is that final?

Yes.

 

[RIP_Welsh_Don]

The two tyres on tarmac will make a significant difference to your lap time as we saw in the GT4 cup, but it is a good way to run it in my opinion 👍 Not run any laps yet, as to be honest, I'm scared to with all those walls and a car that likes to understeer

 

[Wardez]

Practicing at the moment, for a little while:

 

[CodeRedR51]

Division 1 Spa Francorchamps Update:

Litchi had 5 seconds added to his total time for the illegal tires. Results & Points updated.

 

[Litchi]

Division 1 Spa Francorchamps Update:

Litchi had 5 seconds added to his total time for the illegal tires. Results & Points updated.

Well, you all know how i totally respect the PURE series, how i'm involved in and how i respect who create them.

I never contest a penalty against me when she's justified. I'm fair. (remember my penalty for IWC Cape Ring, i said nothing cause i was totally agree with).

So, I'm not totally against this 5secs penalty, I'm against the principle here.

FMSC is a big series. A lot of messages are posted. Over 180 pages atm. I'm totally sure that some people can't read all these pages, all the days.

This tire rules is only in one post that you did. When i race in a championship, the OP is my bible. I suppose that all rules must be in. But this tire rule is strictly nowhere in the OP.

So i definitely think that why i used inter's tires isn't entirely my fault...

And one more thing, what is logic in this rule? Why can't we use inter's? Don't answer "cause that's the rules", there's no logic in this answer.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Dr_Watson]

the logic is that the sports tires are inters; the only logic to allow racing rain is that in testing the sports get dangerous > 66%

 

[CodeRedR51]

the logic is that the sports tires are inters; the only logic to allow racing rain is that in testing the sports get dangerous > 66%

That pretty much explains it.

 

[Adam41]

I know what Litchi is saying about the information being readily available though. At Spa I had practiced with the first lot of regulations, and then it changed. I had to ask a couple of times what the exact new regulations were since the information was not in the race info (had not been put up yet or was wrong) and no info was in the OP. Mayb there could be a small section in the OP in the future listing the exact regulations for the current week. I guess this will mainly be for when it's raining and we have different weather settings for quali and the race :s.

 

[carracerptp]

Outlaw and I both ran qualifying runs last night and I came to two conclusions.

One: It is extremely difficult to tell if a lap is clean by watching it live. Outlaw thought both of my laps were clean when they were in fact dirty, mind you, very close, and then when I watched Outlaw, I thought his first lap was dirty and second lap was clean, his second lap being very close to clean, but actually in fact dirty - about four inches off, depending on which measure. More on that later.

I think stewards will need to watch the replays before a lap can be called clean. Unless the person is miles off the chicane. It's very hard to get a clean lap and make time. If it feels fast, it's most likely dirty.

The main reason I'm worried about this is because of how strict qualifying is (looking at Tim last week). If the chicane is done quickly, I don't think you can tell watching the replay live if it's clean or not. The only way to tell is to bring up the replay and pause when they hit the chicane. Right at the first corner of the rumbles. If it's going to go dirty, it's going to go dirty there.

Two: I asked this before and didn't get an answer. But there are two models of this track in Gran Turismo. The chicane is slightly different in both models. The model that we see when watching in real time (racing, watching a replay, walking the camera around) has the chicane slightly smaller (by about three to four inches). The model that is used when a picture is rendered in the game (the JPEG images) has the chicane slightly larger. You could run a lap cleanly according to the replay, but dirty according to the "rendered image".

Which version of the track is considered the final decision-making version?

 

[CodeRedR51]

Maybe don't try and cut the chicane so much? I've never had an issue with it unless I outbrake myself. Saving and watching the replays for every run will get tedious really quickly.

How exactly did you come to the conclusion that there's two different tracks?

 

[Adam41]

It's like that with taking pictures too. There was a PMC comp once where the theme was close finishes, or that to the same effect. On the replay the car might be a few inches behind a white line, but actually take a photo and view it and the car might be a few feet behind the white line. I think if the lap was clean on either (real time or replay) then it should be clean.

But really if you're getting that close to the chicane (even after being told the proper ruling: 2 wheels on tarmac) on both laps so that there's a difference of a few inches on the replay and real time, then you only really have yourself to blame for - if you get a penalty for your quali or most probably for the race if you took that much kerbing each lap.

 

[carracerptp]

Maybe don't try and cut the chicane so much? I've never had an issue with it unless I outbrake myself. Saving and watching the replays for every run will get tedious really quickly.

How exactly did you come to the conclusion that there's two different tracks?

But really if you're getting that close to the chicane (even after being told the proper ruling: 2 wheels on tarmac) on both laps so that there's a difference of a few inches on the replay and real time, then you only really have yourself to blame for - if you get a penalty for your quali or most probably for the race if you took that much kerbing each lap.

Considering how important the qualifying position will be here, myself and I'm sure others will be trying to get every inch out of this track. In the test session, I ran two laps very similar to each other. You can drop a measurable amount of time (X/10) on this track just by keeping it close everywhere. Thankfully, in most places, if you mess up, you hit the wall. Speaking of which, will we run the Tokyo rules here, allowing wall contact in the event of a mistake?

But like I said, even if it looks safely clean on the live view, it could be dirty, what do we use to make the call?
If the steward's in any sort of doubt, do they call it dirty? And if that's true, can we appeal the decision providing photo evidence or asking to have the replay evaluated proving we were actually clean? I think that would work well because it puts the work on the driver if they want to get close.

I think you may want to add to the OP that the rumble strip is not track. Most people use the OLR and as a reference to the track boundaries. And I have never run this track not using the rumbles.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Thankfully, in most places, if you mess up, you hit the wall. Speaking of which, will we run the Tokyo rules here, allowing wall contact in the event of a mistake?

Hitting a wall will do nothing but slow you down anyway. However, Tokyo rules should apply here.

But like I said, even if it looks safely clean on the live view, it could be dirty, what do we use to make the call?
If the steward's in any sort of doubt, do they call it dirty? And if that's true, can we appeal the decision providing photo evidence or asking to have the replay evaluated proving we were actually clean? I think that would work well because it puts the work on the driver if they want to get close.

I don't mind having to watch replays for a few drivers, but like I said before if we have to do this for every driver, then it just gets annoying. With that said, I want everyone to HOLD OFF ON QUALIFYING until I can put my car out on track tonight and look it over.

 

[Dr_Watson]

It's like that with taking pictures too. There was a PMC comp once where the theme was close finishes, or that to the same effect. On the replay the car might be a few inches behind a white line, but actually take a photo and view it and the car might be a few feet behind the white line. I think if the lap was clean on either (real time or replay) then it should be clean.

This is totally expected behavior which comes from the camera panning. When you have focus set to the car (you can set it to the track and this won't happen) the camera follows the car based on the panning mode.
Mode 1 the camera man stays still and rotates keeping the car in focus.
Mode 2 the camera stays parallel to the car and moves along a rail giving those nice panning shots on straights.
Mode 3 does both, slides the camera and rotates to keep focus.

Now if you turn the shutter speed way down the car moves quite a distance while the picture is being taken. If you want the final picture to have the same thing you see in the replay or shot-setup you need to crank the shutter speed as high as it goes and set focus to the kerb you're interested in, not the car.

 

[carracerptp]

This is totally expected behavior which comes from the camera panning. When you have focus set to the car (you can set it to the track and this won't happen) the camera follows the car based on the panning mode.
Mode 1 the camera man stays still and rotates keeping the car in focus.
Mode 2 the camera stays parallel to the car and moves along a rail giving those nice panning shots on straights.
Mode 3 does both, slides the camera and rotates to keep focus.

Now if you turn the shutter speed way down the car moves quite a distance while the picture is being taken. If you want the final picture to have the same thing you see in the replay or shot-setup you need to crank the shutter speed as high as it goes and set focus to the kerb you're interested in, not the car.

But like I said, GT5 has to different models (maps, meshes, etc). A lower resolution one that is optimized for real time viewing, and the higher resolution one for the pictures.
I will look again and see if I can somehow post a screenshot.

 

[CodeRedR51]

But like I said, GT5 has to different models (maps, meshes, etc). A lower resolution one that is optimized for real time viewing, and the higher resolution one for the pictures.
I will look again and see if I can somehow post a screenshot.

Honestly having played GT since the first one came out, this is the first I have ever heard of this. Cars I knew about (for photomode only) but not in-game.

 

[Dr_Watson]

Honestly having played GT since the first one came out, this is the first I have ever heard of this. Cars I knew about (for photomode only) but not in-game.

Yeah, same here. The only LOD changes I've ever seen in GT.* is for photo-travel. I'm going to have to turn on the ps3 tonight and play with stuff... because I'm REALLY skeptical about this.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

As carra mentioned, I thought his out lap, and one of his fliers was clean, when in fact, it was not. Worse, on the second flier, the angle at the chicane is garbage, making a call all but impossible. I'm not sure if it's because of carra's theory, or whether the angle provides a false perspective. For me, it doesn't matter. Frankly, I have no confidence in what the game is showing me at that corner, which means that all stewards may have to look at EVERY Q run on replay, and that's really something we should avoid.

I was going to propose turning penalties on, except there isn't any for Monaco, which I found rather disappointing. The only other workaround I can think of is make the curbing at the Nouvelle chicane completely off-limits for the whole weekend. Yes, I know, that's rather... extreme, but I would imagine this would make policing the track a lot easier.

 

[carracerptp]

Yeah, same here. The only LOD changes I've ever seen in GT.* is for photo-travel. I'm going to have to turn on the ps3 tonight and play with stuff... because I'm REALLY skeptical about this.

I just spend some time and found out you are right, lag or something must have messed up my first look into this. If the car is moving at any speed it seemed to cause the effect you mentioned (even at a 1/2000 shutter speed). The only thing I found different about the track was the texture filtering.
There is only 1 track.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Can you press the triangle button and zoom in like you can on replays?

 

[CodeRedR51]

So testing it for myself, I don't see the issue really. It's fairly simple to go through there without using the whole curb. Basic rule of thumb would be to make sure the right tires don't go over the back edge of the curbing. As long as you enter correctly you can get a good run out of there. Qualifying can continue with that in mind.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

So testing it for myself, I don't see the issue really. It's fairly simple to go through there without using the whole curb. Basic rule of thumb would be to make sure the right tires don't go over the back edge of the curbing. As long as you enter correctly you can get a good run out of there. Qualifying can continue with that in mind.

I don't see much choice, then. As a steward, I'll be watching everyone's Q run on replay. I'm sorry, but I don't trust what I'm seeing. 👎

(Maybe because I need new glasses, or something larger than a 40 inch TV)

 

[CodeRedR51]

The viewing angles might still be whack, I didn't test that. Just wanted to see how easy it was to get through there without going over.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

The viewing angles might still be whack, I didn't test that. Just wanted to see how easy it was to get through there without going over.

As a bumper cam driver, if I even think of touching the curbing, my testing shows that my laps are often dirty.