Russian Invasion of Ukraine

[Rage Racer]

Probably a civilian replica, like the popular AR rifles here in the States.

Check out the ammo type.

Some people say that these bullets are 7.62x39 (M43) cartridge, not the one MG42 uses.
But if the caliber is not the 7.92x57 Mauser, it also may be the MG3, using the 7.62x51 NATO cartridge.
And I heard of some MG42 replicas converted to the 7.62x39 ammo.
What do you think?

 

[Dotini]

Check out the ammo type.

Some people say that these bullets are 7.62x39 (M43) cartridge, not the one MG42 uses.
But if the caliber is not the 7.92x57 Mauser, it also may be the MG3, using the 7.62x51 NATO cartridge.
And I heard of some MG42 replicas converted to the 7.62x39 ammo.
What do you think?

Looks a lot like the 7.62x39 I am currently holding in my hand.

 

[Jordan]

Here's an interesting article I came upon, which covers something I hadn't given much thought - the logistics of actually "switching countries". Banking, property, healthcare services, shipping, currency, drivers licenses, laws, all of it changed nearly overnight:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/22/w...sia-life-in-crimea-grows-chaotic.html?hp&_r=0

 

[Rage Racer]

@Dotini
Looks like LifeNews is talking BS again. No, the attack could have actually taken place, but the MG42, dollars and Yarosh's calling card (we're moving on the mission, don't forget the boss' calling card, lol) were probably put by the reporters, to create a brighter image. "Right Sector! American money! Nazi MG42 - they use the guns of their teachers!" - this is what I heard from the TV.

@Jordan

Drug addicts, political activists, gays and even Ukrainian priests — all censured by either the government or the Russian Orthodox Church — are among the most obvious groups fearing life under a far less tolerant government.

This sounds unreasonable. Why Ukrainian priests should be afraid? What, Ukrainian clergy is banned in Russia? I don't get it.
Drug addicts - yes, it'll be harder for them to find dope from now on, but excuse me, is this bad?
Political activists should be fearing Ukraine more, where the president candidate, Oleg Tsarev, was attacked, undressed and beaten up by some Maidan mob, and prosecuted by the Ukrainian attorney.
Gays. Well, they might have heard the myth about Russian law enforcers searching for gays and putting them to concentration camps. BTW, gay marriage was never legal in Ukraine, too. There won't be much difference for them.

Regarding the driving licenses, there's nothing too bad. Ukrainian licenses aren't invalid in RF. And there's no need to hurry with plates changing, too. Some people were driving with old Soviet plates all this time.

This article contains some sort of truth (switching the country so quickly is not that easy, sure there will be problems), McDonald's are really closed (there were just three of them on the whole peninsula), but damn, they're exaggerating IMO. I have a friend who has relatives in Simferopol. It's easy for me to check what this article says.
Anyway, these are temporary complications, I don't think Crimeans will regret the reuniting with RF 5 years later. Some comments of this article say "Crimea will be starving to death". Loooool.

 

[Keef]

Check out the ammo type.
Some people say that these bullets are 7.62x39 (M43) cartridge, not the one MG42 uses.
But if the caliber is not the 7.92x57 Mauser, it also may be the MG3, using the 7.62x51 NATO cartridge.
And I heard of some MG42 replicas converted to the 7.62x39 ammo.
What do you think?

Probably a conversion because the modern ammo type is much more common, cheaper, and interchangeable with their other weapons. They would need to change the barrel, receiver, and some of the parts within.

 

[Furinkazen]

Just dropping Private Eye's view of things here:

 

[Rage Racer]

Just dropping Private Eye's view of things here:

RF TROOPS WON'T CROSS THE BORDER OF UKRAINE
THEY WILL MOVE IT WITHOUT CROSSING IT

 

[JMoney]

I think it's funny how the new Ukraine government is now launching "counter-terrorist" actions against the pro-russians, who are protesting the government in the exact same manner as the people currently in the new government protested the old government.

 

[Dotini]

I think it's funny how the new Ukraine government is now launching "counter-terrorist" actions against the pro-russians, who are protesting the government in the exact same manner as the people currently in the new government protested the old government.

Exactly funny. The damn fools. It's easy enough to start a revolution, but once underway, tough to stop!

 

[Rage Racer]

I think it's funny how the new Ukraine government is now launching "counter-terrorist" actions against the pro-russians, who are protesting the government in the exact same manner as the people currently in the new government protested the old government.

Yes. Double standards.
Victoria Nuland also said something like "the Maidan occupies the buldings and streets because they have a permission", lol. It sounds like "we paid $5 billions, so they have a license for that! We want to get it done, and not to give it up! Or, return our money, please!", haha.
Russian gov-t and media sympathize the Donetsk rebels, too, but don't support so openly.

It's easy enough to start a revolution, but once underway, tough to stop!

Almost any revolution has a moment when the new leaders forget what they were fighting for, and start enjoying the power, eliminating their rivals and doing stupid things without thinking of concequences (exactly what Yatsenyuk & Co are doing right now). Revolution devours its own children...

I used to sympathize the protests when they just begun (because Yanukovich was a real bastard and people really distrusted him, they had a point), but looking at what's happening now, I see the country running only deeper into 🤬.

 

[JMoney]

I don't agree with the methods the protestors from both sides have used. They have used violent tactics that only make Ukraine look worse as a whole. Ukraine is a mess right now, and I'm sure the only way it can be fixed is by the help of another country. As an American I don't want my government to throw tax dollars toward a country in Eastern Europe, even if they do provide energy for us. The EU's economy is even worse than ours, so I say let Russia fix Ukraine.

Russia is only America's enemy if we make it our enemy, and it would be better to be allies.

 

[TenEightyOne]

As an American I don't want my government to throw tax dollars toward a country in Eastern Europe, even if they do provide energy for us. The EU's economy is even worse than ours, so I say let Russia fix Ukraine.

I hate to say it... but if America wants to police the world (and she certainly seems to) then she has to take some other responsibility too. You can't just take

I'm not sure that the overall EU economy is better or worse, there are some countries in drought/bankruptcy just as there are some US states in similar predicaments, that doesn't mean that overall the picture is any gloomier on average here than it is across the world. The US economy has extra strength as $13 trillion is actually Chinese government owned, that's helped the US economy to have an image of strength when the political situation has been desperately fractured. China won't let them go down the drain.

 

[Dotini]

China won't let them go down the drain.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Sad but true, America's financial situation is pretty complicated, especially now China have discovered how nice capitalism is

 

[VolkswagenX]

Almost any revolution has a moment when the new leaders forget what they were fighting for, and start enjoying the power, eliminating their rivals and doing stupid things without thinking of concequences (exactly what Yatsenyuk & Co are doing right now). Revolution devours its own children...

I used to sympathize the protests when they just begun (because Yanukovich was a real bastard and people really distrusted him, they had a point), but looking at what's happening now, I see the country running only deeper into 🤬.

I don't think that leaders in those revolutions we've had in recent years simply "forget" what the were fighting for. These people usually have a plan and that plan doesn't include the man power that got them to their position.

A lot of people had warned long before the opposition in Ukraine got any power, that they would be just as bad as Yanukovich and in some cases even worse. these people would get silenced by the mainstream media by being called communists or being on Putins payroll.

This all looks typical of a foreign backed revolution. The "opposition" now has controll so they can now get rid of the useful idiots.

 

[Rage Racer]

Another ammo pic (shell comparision). Looks like it is an MG3 (7.62x51).

Meanwhile: the Ukrainian governmental forces started the active phase of the "counter-terrorist op" again. Reports of a few KIAs. The civil war continues...

^SBU troops

EDIT: a huge convoy of Russian army vehicles moving towards the Ukrainan border, from Rostov.
**** is getting hot.

Edit 2: ^this^ is an exercise. No invasion yet.

Hey, there's the real reason why the army attacked the checkpoints of Sloviansk.
Turn the subs on (language warning!) and loool!

"Turchinov, feed your troops, ***********!"

 

[eran0004]

McDonald's are really closed (there were just three of them on the whole peninsula), but damn, they're exaggerating IMO.

Reminds me of my hometown some 20 years ago. It was a hotspot for militant veganism, in the end it forced McDonald's to close here. We (not that I was part of it, I was only 7 or 8 years old at the time) took great pride in being one of the few towns that had forced McDonald's to close

Back to topic: It seems like a team from OSCE (including a Swedish officer) has been abducted by armed separatists in Sloviansk.

http://www.svt.se/nyheter/varlden/separatister-haller-osse-representanter-i-ukraina (Swedish)

 

[SMfan]

Back to topic: It seems like a team from OSCE (including a Swedish officer) has been abducted by armed separatists in Sloviansk.

Official OSCE Twitter says captured people not from OSCE:

"1/4 Comms with military observers in Donetsk region lost.Team not OSCE monitors but sent by States under Vienna Doc on military transparency
2/4 All members of the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission and OSCE/ODIHR election observers are safe and accounted for
3/4 Military verification team - led by Germans – and composed of 8 members – 4 Germans, 1 Czech, 1 Danish, 1 Polish, 1 Swedish
4/4 Military verification team sent following invitation from Ukraine under terms of Vienna Document 2011"

https://twitter.com/OSCE/status/459747578297716736

 

[eran0004]

Official OSCE Twitter says captured people not from OSCE:

"1/4 Comms with military observers in Donetsk region lost.Team not OSCE monitors but sent by States under Vienna Doc on military transparency
2/4 All members of the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission and OSCE/ODIHR election observers are safe and accounted for
3/4 Military verification team - led by Germans – and composed of 8 members – 4 Germans, 1 Czech, 1 Danish, 1 Polish, 1 Swedish
4/4 Military verification team sent following invitation from Ukraine under terms of Vienna Document 2011"

https://twitter.com/OSCE/status/459747578297716736

Alright, it seems a bit unclear on exactly what organization they're representing. Let's just say it's officers from various EU member states.

 

[VolkswagenX]

Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov has dismissed as “not serious” reports of Russian agents captured in Ukraine. He accused US politicians of distorting facts and wrongfully interpreting the Geneva agreement on de-escalation.

Lavrov lashed out at western politicians while speaking at a young diplomats’ forum in Moscow. The minister accused his counterparts in the EU and the US of making unsubstantiated statements.

"Kerry has many times mentioned that Ukrainian intelligence captured Russian agents,” Lavrov said. “So, show them to the people, have them on TV. Kerry says they don’t want to disclose the identities of those people who are engaged in the captures. This is not serious.”

While the west is accusing Russia of not following through on the Geneva agreement, Lavrov believes the attitude stems from misinterpretation of the de-escalation agreement.

“Representatives of the US State Department, Victoria Nuland in particular, claim that in Geneva we agreed upon ‘separatists’ leaving the occupied buildings,” Lavrov said. “This is a lie, this could not have been written, because we were promoting the approach that ensures the simultaneity of processes and equal responsibilities of the sides when it comes to vacating illegally occupied buildings and disarming illegal groups.”

Lavrov said that Russia would not allow the distortion of the text of the Geneva agreement. He also questioned assertions made by John Kerry a day earlier concerning Kiev’s full compliance with the Geneva agreement. Kerry said authorities in the Ukrainian capital were “removing the barricades in the Maidan and cleaning up the square.”

“Instead of tires, they are now setting up concrete blocks there,” Lavrov said. “No one is going to clear the place.”

Lavrov complained that his western counterparts were not abandoning the language of slogans, even in one-on-one telephone conversations.

“If you think that when John Kerry, William Hague or Laurent Fabius call me, they speak differently in those personal contacts and say something you don’t know from their public speeches, you are mistaken,” Lavrov said, adding that he was still making attempts to have a real constructive dialogue with the officials he mentioned.

All kinds of sanctions against Russia are a sign of Western states having “got lost in their own game,” he said.

“The West generally wants – and the whole thing started with that – to capture Ukraine, with the intention being solely based on geopolitical ambition, not on the interests of the Ukrainian people.”

When the West realized it couldn’t get it its own way, it grew frustrated, Lavrov said. The frustration has been revealed in the “hard efforts on the sanctions trackway.”

http://www.rt.com/news/154832-russian-agents-ukraine-lavrov/

 

[R.S]

Too many hot head idiots in power/media, on all sides, Russia, Ukraine, West, Militias....


Remove all army, remove all guns, remove all of 1000's of APC's and let the people vote. If the country ends up split in half, well so be it.

No, no of course not, instead we want to place 10000's of soldiers on the border and completely unsettle an already confused country so that a vote is not even possible. Push the country and people to smash to pieces so we can swoop in pick whatever is left.

Screw your guns, screw your "he did this she did that"... that has no part in deciding what country/nationality a people will identify as. Grow up.

 

[Rage Racer]

I read something in a newspaper: the Ukrainian nuclear power stations, which were using Russian nuclear fuel all this time, are going to switch to American fuel. Those stations are Soviet-built, and they are not designed to work with other types of fuel elements (the American are different in shape and something more). They say, it can possibly result in a new Chernobyl, somewhere in Rivne or Khmelnitsky.

BTW, today is 28 years since that disaster.

 

[JMoney]

I read something in a newspaper: the Ukrainian nuclear power stations, which were using Russian nuclear fuel all this time, are going to switch to American fuel. Those stations are Soviet-built, and they are not designed to work with other types of fuel elements (the American are different in shape and something more). They say, it can possibly result in a new Chernobyl, somewhere in Rivne or Khmelnitsky.

BTW, today is 28 years since that disaster.

Hopefully it won't come to that level of stupid.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

http://www.rt.com/news/154832-russian-agents-ukraine-lavrov/

As ridiculous as this sounds, the rhetoric isn't unexpected. The Russians might have been backing the separatists to begin with, but we might be at the point where they are beyond Russia's ability to control. The group who abducted the observers are apparently demanding that the EU repeal economic and diplomatic sanctions against Moscow in exchange for the observers' safe return. Aside from being a Hollywood B-movie demand, it doesn't tally with what Moscow have been doing so far. I very much doubt that they are directly behind this incident, and in light of the masses storming the second regional government building overnight, it doesn't look like the Russians can do much. Even if they meet all of their obligations from Geneva, I doubt much on the ground will change.

And the ridiculous rhetoric is hardly one-sided. The Ukrainian Prime Minister is not helping things by accusing the Kremlin of wanting to start a third World War.

 

[Dotini]

The Ukrainian Prime Minister is not helping things by accusing the Kremlin of wanting to start a third World War.

Would a third world war really be all that bad?

I remember back in the day, doing the "duck-and-cover" drills in school, adults said it was "better to be dead than red".

I interpreted this to mean it was better that everyone on the surface of the planet should die rather than communism should triumph over capitalism; and adults always knew best. A policy of "mutually assured destruction" was formally accepted doctrine by the nuclear powers, all the while cleverly assuring survival of elite male and female warriors in deep underground bunkers at Cheyenne Mountain and elsewhere.

Additionally, we now know that radiation from Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Chernobyl and Fukushima has meant little or nothing in terms of long term human health issues. A thousand times nothing is still nothing.

So let your hair get mussed a bit. Ours is the fury; the pride, the wrath, the righteousness of truth, justice and the American way! Loose the dogs of war and let the bombs fly if that is what it takes to put the Commy scumbags in their graves! So help me John McCain.

 

[Rage Racer]

View attachment 148789

Hopefully it won't come to that level of stupid.

I'm not a specialist in nuclear energy, but they say they're different in shape and something more.

As ridiculous as this sounds, the rhetoric isn't unexpected. The Russians might have been backing the separatists to begin with,

There are no proofs that Moscow supports or sponsors those rebels. I like how some Western politicians say "They're carrying Russian guns, they're supported by Russia!". Lol, do they have an idea that AK-74 is one of the most common firearms around the world?

The group who abducted the observers are apparently demanding that the EU repeal economic and diplomatic sanctions against Moscow in exchange for the observers' safe return.

Lol, who told you that? The DR officials never said anything like that.
More reasonable explanations are:
1. To prove the involvement of Western agents in the military actions against DR;
2. To prevent the Ukrainian army from attacking. Turchinov won't give an order if he knows that some officers of his sponsors may turn out in danger, in the place he's going to attack.

P.S. Meanwhile, the mayor of Kharkiv, Hennady Kernes, who was friendly to the old regime, was shot by a sniper recently. He survived and taken to a hospital.
Oleg Tsarev, the president candidate from Yanukovich's fraction (Party of Regions), refused to take part in the president election because he's afraid for his life (he was already attacked several times). The president race is getting just dangerous here.
Earlier, Vitaly "Dr. Ironfist" Klitschko refused to run for the president chair, too.

It looks like not the one who wins the election will be the president. It'll be the one who survives. Wow, such democracy, so freedom...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Lol, who told you that? The DR officials never said anything like that.

I'm just going by what is on the news.

And "Dr. Ironfist" sounds like a 1960s Bond villain. Instead of running for president, he's been busy knocking out Australian-Samoan title contenders. Although judging by the way he handled the guy who interrupted the press conference and weigh-in ahead of the bout, he probably wouldn't be too bad at international diplomacy.

 

[Dotini]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27222023#
Ukraine's acting President Olexander Turchynov has admitted his forces are "helpless" to quell unrest driven by pro-Russian activists in the eastern regions of Donetsk and Luhansk.
------------
Mr Turchynov added: "Our task is to stop the spread of the terrorist threat first of all in the Kharkiv and Odessa regions."

My advice to Mr. Turchynov would be to forget the east, and rush all available resources to Odessa. Without access to the Black Sea, Kiev's aspirations are much diminished.

 

[Rage Racer]

I'm just going by what is on the news.

Idiotic news, considering the fact that Lavrov called the DR command to release the observers.

 

[Rage Racer]

🤬 is getting hot again. Assault was started today, the army seized some checkpoints and a TV center in Sloviansk. But the DPR militants took down three enemy choppers (some report of a fourth one came recently), one survived pilot is captured (or, rather, rescued) by the militia.
For now, I see reports of 38 KIAs in total.

My advice to Mr. Turchynov would be to forget the east, and rush all available resources to Odessa. Without access to the Black Sea, Kiev's aspirations are much diminished.

Odessa is now in riots. Some bralws occured between the local nationalists and pro-Russians. At least 31 dead confirmed.

Edit:
Humvees in the Ukrainian army. The American support goes beyond the cookies...