Several explosions on London Underground

  • Thread starter DQuaN
  • 616 comments
  • 21,171 views

What Do You Think Of The Situation?

  • Terrorist Actions Are Wrong

    Votes: 80 92.0%

  • Terrorist Actions Can Be Justified

    Votes: 7 8.0%
  • Total voters
    87
Viper Zero
Right.

I don't know about immigration laws, since most of the terrorists involved in the London bombings were British citizens, but cracking down on radical groups who promote murdering civilians and terrorism should be a priority.

Seems like Britons are elite hackers:

MI5 Hacking Al Qaeda

Over the past fortnight Israeli intelligence agents have noticed something distinctly odd happening on the internet. One by one, Al-Qaeda’s affiliated websites have vanished until only a handful remain, write Uzi Mahnaimi and Alex Pell. Someone has cut the line of communication between the spiritual leaders of international terrorism and their supporters. Since 9/11 the websites have been the main links to disseminate propaganda and information.

The Israelis detect the hand of British intelligence, determined to torpedo the websites after the London attacks of July 7.


(Notice: factual statements posted with links that back up those statements)
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Actually I was tring to follow up the last on topic post . It seems that the British used to let radical muslims into the country on a regular basis even though when they got there they immediatly started preaching the downfall of western society by all means possible . I guess it seemed like a good idea at the time .
 
Viper Zero
I don't know about immigration laws, since most of the terrorists involved in the London bombings were British citizens, but cracking down on radical groups who promote murdering civilians and terrorism should be a priority.
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I'd give it about a fortnight for them to polish all the semantics of the new "civil protection laws" (even sounds like civil rights); or until the next major "event."

Viper Zero
Seems like Britons are elite hackers:

The Israelis [ well known for their highly factual statements] detect the hand of British intelligence, determined to torpedo the websites after the London attacks of July 7.


(Notice: factual statements posted with links that back up those statements)
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If you and the Israeli's say so, it must be true.
 
rk
I'd give it about a fortnight for them to polish all the semantics of the new "civil protection laws" (even sounds like civil rights); or until the next major "event."
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I'm not aware of any plans to change the law regarding what people can put on website, or what they say in their church/temple.

Have you got a bug in the Home Office? :)

We are very tolerant here. What people publish on a website, is only words and someone's opinion, even if it is twisted. The target of their hate will not read the website anyway, so it really does no harm.

It is only when people like hook hand, start encouraging others to commit acts of violence against their target of hate that the police feel the need to do something.

If we had an epidemic of attacks, the law might be reviewed.
ID cards are useless...it won't be compulsory to carry it at all times... :crazy:

It will only be effective in catching benefit fraudsters and failed asylum seekers. Hardly the most wanted!

Moving towards a police state, with stop and search, even door to door searches won't be tolerated by the voting public.
It would cost the government its majority.
In any case Brussels would most likely over rule any change in the law that infringed our human rights.

The European court has the final say over the House of Lords. I'm not suggesting for a minute that the European court would base its decisions on politics, and not the facts, but they love to overturn us on any human rights issues
 
I heard on a TV show that Canadians who frequent crossing the border to and from the US are now required to carry RFID cards.

I noted that the commentator referred to being in a police state. How is that being in a police state? It's just another card in my wallet that identifies who I am and nothing more.
 
Viper Zero
I noted that the commentator referred to being in a police state. How is that being in a police state? It's just another card in my wallet that identifies who I am and nothing more.
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Did you mean me ;)

If you did, I didn't mean that ID cards alone would create a police state.
Any increase in powers that the police might gain, that legally allowed them to stop and search anyone, or search your house at will, would start to contribute towards a police state.
 
Tacet_Blue
Did you mean me ;)

If you did, I didn't mean that ID cards alone would create a police state.
Any increase in powers that the police might gain, that legally allowed them to stop and search anyone, or search your house at will, would start to contribute towards a police state.
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Tracking your movments with RFID would go a big step toward that. "Let's see, here is a Canadian who has made three trips in the past month to a neighborhood where a residence is under suspicion for marijuana trafficking, we'll have to make it a point to search his car next time through."

And if the people become convinced that the only way to stop the "home grown bombers" is to do door-ro-door searches, you better believe they will consent, for the good of the people. any resisters will be portrayed as terrorist sympathizers.
 
Tacet_Blue
Did you mean me ;)
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No, no. The commentator on the TV show referred to it being in a police state.

If you did, I didn't mean that ID cards alone would create a police state.
Any increase in powers that the police might gain, that legally allowed them to stop and search anyone, or search your house at will, would start to contribute towards a police state.
Click to expand...

These RFID cards only say that you are the person you say your are, that's it. So, using RFID is not enforcing a police state, no searching, no digging through your car or house, nothing. Now, I see that the commentator was only spilling rhetoric.
 
Ever walk along the train tracks and notice those little plastic boxes, about 3" by 3/4", riveted to the cars? Those are RFID devices, and they are used to track the movements of the individual cars. How about those aerial horns over the highway, just before truck scales? They are RFID transcevers, and they track the movement and identity of the trucks that are so equipped. If you start carrying a chip card, it will amount to the same thing as what Martha Stewart wears, except it will be less obvious that your movements can be tracked.
 
First thing I would do is give it to a stray dog . If I want someone to know where I am I'll send a post card .
 
thought I'd post this here...if anyone else could help me confirm its true I would appreciate it .

Subject: Fw: New computer virus - REAL

Status: Real.

Confirmed at:

http://www.snopes.com/computer/virus/osama.asp
Warning

Emails with pictures of Osama Bin-Laden hanged are being sent and the moment that you open these emails your computer will crash and you will not be able to fix it!!!

This e-mail is being distributed through countries around the globe, but mainly in the US and Israel

Origins: There are few headlines that would grab the attention of more computer users around the world than "Osama bin Laden Captured," and that's exactly what whoever created this lure was counting on to snare unsuspecting victims who use Microsoft platforms.

"Osama bin Laden Captured" isn't a virus in itself; it's the text of a message that includes a link to a file called EXPLOIT.EXE. When a message recipient clicks on this link to view what he thinks are pictures of Osama bin Laden's capture, he can end up downloading an executable trojan known as Backdoor-AZU, BKDR_LARSLP.A, Download.Trojan, TrojanProxy.Win32.Small.b, or Win32.Slarp.


Clicking the embedded link in the "Osama bin Laden Captured" message auto-executes a file called "EXPLOIT.EXE," which exploits a known security hole to download the trojan. According to McAfee Security:

The trojan opens a random port on the victim's machine. It sends the port information to a webpage at IP address 66.139.77.145. The trojan listens on the open port for instructions and redirects traffic to other IP addresses.

Spammers and hackers can take advantage of compromised systems by using the infected computer as a middleman, allowing them to pass information through it and remain anonymous.


Is this a common scare tactic ? After looking around some I see that this particular virus is a low risk one thats more like spyware..IMO....Its like someone is trying to link Bin Laden with computer terrorism or some other bull...is'nt friggin Bin laden kind of busy blowing crap up and ducking missles to be messing with this crap ?????
seems like more propaganda and very deliberate at that .

"There are scam artists who must spend all their time thinking up ways to scare people. If you have a good virus protection program - like McAffee or Norton with a firewall you should be protected. Of course don't open attachments to your mail unless you are directly expecting it. If you get an attachment from a friend, don't open it. e-mail the friend and ask if they sent you an attachment. If they did, open it. Hackers can now add viruses to e-mail from people on your mailing list. Spybot is a free program and is excellent. It will further protect you. "
 
ledhed
First thing I would do is give it to a stray dog . If I want someone to know where I am I'll send a post card .
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:lol: I am totally with you on this one.

In reply to your most recent post: I had read in The Oregonian that "The Terrorists" would be attempting an act of digital terrorism, an email trojan seems amusingly simplistic (too much so). Norton and similar programs routinely scan for executables in email, that's what they are marketed for. A much more insidious attack would be a hijack through port scanning. Another could be a ping flood (pinging is similar to what submarines do with sonar, hence the name) it could cause a DNS (denial of service) which could cripple comunications, like bank transactions or VOIp, but there are protective measures for these also.
Perhaps the "leete hax0r" could be more specific, I am by no means an expert.

Viper Zero
These RFID cards can only track for 12 feet...
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The range of RFID is generally controlled by the sensitivity of the receiver:
RFID (radio frequency identification) is a technology that incorporates the use of electromagnetic or electrostatic coupling in the radio frequency (RF) portion of the electromagnetic spectrum to uniquely identify an object, animal, or person. RFID is coming into increasing use in industry as an alternative to the bar code. The advantage of RFID is that it does not require direct contact or line-of-sight scanning. An RFID system consists of three components: an antenna and transceiver (often combined into one reader) and a transponder (the tag). The antenna uses radio frequency waves to transmit a signal that activates the transponder. When activated, the tag transmits data back to the antenna. The data is used to notify a programmable logic controller that an action should occur. The action could be as simple as raising an access gate or as complicated as interfacing with a database to carry out a monetary transaction. Low-frequency RFID systems (30 KHz to 500 KHz) have short transmission ranges (generally less than six feet). High-frequency RFID systems (850 MHz to 950 MHz and 2.4 GHz to 2.5 GHz) offer longer transmission ranges (more than 90 feet). In general, the higher the frequency, the more expensive the system.http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid7_gci805987,00.html
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There was a popular system in the ski industry called the "RECO" device which used a technology similar to RFID. It was a passive transcever, about the size of an artists eraser (1") that was sewn into parkas or embedded in ski boots. The idea was that when a person became lost or buried in an avalanche, rescuers in an airplane could use the appropriate RECO locating device to find the victim. The transmitter would send out EM pulses that would power the circuitry in the buried RECO, it would in turn transmit a tracking signal. However, not enough people were lost and rescued to make the system popular and commercially sucessful.
 
to amend human rights laws to make deportations more straightforward
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The better part of the world welcomes the latest exclusive community:ENGLAND!

Non-beautiful people need not apply. "Go to the Americas, yer riff-raff."
 
rk
The better part of the world welcomes the latest exclusive community:ENGLAND!
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And Scotland. And Wales. And Northern Ireland...

I'm in two minds about this. On one hand, anyone should have the right to say and think whatever they want - it's when they DO things that it crosses into indecency. On the other hand, I'm not radiant with happiness at the thought of paying people to come into my country and tell me how much they hate me and want me dead.
 
Famine


I'm in two minds about this. On one hand, anyone should have the right to say and think whatever they want - it's when they DO things that it crosses into indecency. On the other hand, I'm not radiant with happiness at the thought of paying people to come into my country and tell me how much they hate me and want me dead.
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It is a totally understandable sentiment and I , for one, can't blame you for your feelings. I just want to express that changes always happen gradually, and usually with the "benignest" of intents. It is the future permutations that concern me; especially when the changes are in the interpretation of "human rights laws."
If, for example, the position of the "impending police state" conspiracy advocates is to be considered, there likely never would have been a "department of homeland security" without the impetus of 9/11 and subsequent events. It may one day devolve that talk like this may get a person a room in the new Denver airport.
"Instead of being at the mercy of wild beasts, earthquakes, landslides, and inundations, modern man is battered by the elemental forces of his own psyche. This is the World Power that vastly exceeds all other powers on earth. The Age of Enlightenment, which stripped nature and human institutions of gods, overlooked the God of Terror who dwells in the human soul."
Carl Jung (1875–1961), Swiss psychiatrist. The Development of Personality
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raft of plans to extend powers to deport or exclude foreigners who encourage terrorism.
The UK can already exclude or deport those who pose a threat to security and Mr Blair said he also wanted to clamp down on those who advocated terror.

The prime minister said he was prepared to amend human rights laws to make deportations more straightforward................etc.
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This isnt bad ...almost sounds like common sense...
 
ledhed
This isnt bad ...almost sounds like common sense...
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That is what is so deviously beautiful about the plan. Then, once we're used to the concept, it will get a little more restrictive, then more, then more...
 
rk
That is what is so deviously beautiful about the plan. Then, once we're used to the concept, it will get a little more restrictive, then more, then more...
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Deport the lot.

Anybody who comes over here and starts inciting religious hatred and inciting people to violence, cause explosions etc should be locked up then deported.
I know we live in a liberal democratic society but that society has a duty to protect its subjects(we're a monarchy).

Imagine going to the middle east, opening a church and then telling your congregation how much you hate muslims and that they all should be blown up cos they dont read the bible etc.
You'd get ******g lynched.​
 
Indeed - but is that because we're too tolerant or because they're too intolerant?
 
As difficult as the situation has been for Londoners and especially the families of the victims, I have to say that I applaud Ken Livingston for this courageous statement

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4220836.stm

As has been demonstrated in recent weeks, the families and communities from which the bombers on July 7th came from have been equally shocked, disgusted and appalled by the actions of their relatives who committed these crimes... therefore, with the consent and agreement of the relatives of those who died on July 7th, the families of the bombers should also be allowed to attend the memorial service to pay their respects...

If only in the spirit of reconciliation, I agree with Ken on this one. In my view, this demonstrates the difference between we, the peace loving and tolerant, and those who are completely intolerant of others and other peoples views. The bombers chose to murder and maim because they couldn't find a civilised or humane way of demonstrating their point, and yet, through reconciliatory actions such as allowing their families to show their empathy and sorrow, it maybe possible to bridge the gap and deter possible future suicide bombers from inflciting their own personal hate and grief upon more innocents...

I know many people may strongly disagree, but it takes a clear and brave voice like that of Ken Livingstone's to be that voice of reconciliation...
 
He was acting erratically and said he had a bomb. Then he tried to make a run for it. I think they did the right thing.
 
Its sad, but stuff like this will happen from time to time. The air marshals did what they had to do; they can't take any chances in this day and age.
 
danoff
Looks like it's America's turn to shoot an innocent guy suspecting a terrorist. This kind of thing is going to keep happening. It has been made clear that we can't take chances with potential terrorism threats.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/12/08/airplane.gunshot/index.html
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I honestly think you can make a separate thread for this Danoff. Though it's all terrorism, it's a totally seperate subject.

But anyway, I hate the fact that the man was killed but I'm glad the Marshall's were right on top of the situation.
 
I would rather the marshalls have shot the guy than they stop to listen to his wife while he runs into the terminal to blow himself, and countless others, up.
 
FoolKiller
I would rather the marshalls have shot the guy than they stop to listen to his wife while he runs into the terminal to blow himself, and countless others, up.
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There you go. EVERYONE knows about 9/11 if they have access to TV, newspaper or internet over the past 4 years. So that's totally on him. Besides, Bi-polar wouldn't make you scream "I have a bomb" It may put him in a bad mood or excited mood, but not scream "I have a bomb"
 

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