Should PD have let the modding slide? ... OP Updated.

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

The way I am looking at this is, PD should have given us an engine swap in the first place and this should be a huge eye opener to them.

 

[Exorcet]

I hope PD are simultaneously working on a way to patch out these kinds of external mods, as well as adding in the in-game functionality that most reasonable people are using them for: engine and drivetrain swaps, visual customisation etc.

It would be nice, but it's probably too late for GT5. I doubt they discussed this with manufacturers at all, so they probably can't or wouldn't want to try adding in the feature at all. On top of that, unless they're just going to let us swap code around without actually impacting the car, they'll need to work out exactly how all the swapping is going to work. What are the engine weights? How much does a RWD to AWD conversion hurt front weight balance? Etc.

It's all technically possible, but I don't see it happening, and I wouldn't blame PD if it did not happen.

 

[Grand Prix]

The way I am looking at this is, PD should have given us an engine swap in the first place and this should be a huge eye opener to them.

A livery editor too, and also a larger selection of wheels to choose from. Being able to remove a stock spoiler as well.

 

[eran0004]

You don't like them, you don't use them....sounds fair but it's not, since the random guy with his little hyb jumps in MY normal room. I don't know anymore what my opponents are using , legit cars or my same car but hacked with 50 more hp? In a F1 room one of them have full aero with same pp? I can play only reco and shuffle at the moment. I know that a lot of you guys have fun without annoying other players, but a good 40% (surely more) doesn't, i don't report anyone but it's not a kind of thing like "yeah whatever not my problem".
You can do everything, but when that happen in online playing on a game i paid it's pretty "important" for the company too, not simple "butthurt".

And not to forget, even if the majority have been playing the game for two years by now, there are still new copies being sold. So although a lot of people are bored, there are still other people who has just started playing.

One more point: When I buy a game which says "Polyphony Digital" on it, I expect it to be Polyphony Digital's creation. I trust their ability to design and balance a game. I agree to play the game the way PD wants to.

When gamers takes matters into their own hands to "improve the game" through illegal modding they take away not only PD's rights to decide how they want people to play their games, but also the consumer's rights to know what product they are buying. The consumer wants to play the game according to Polyphony Digital's intentions, but instead ends up with a game according to the intentions of some random anonymous bloke in Leicester.

User creations can be a great asset to a game, but those games are sold with the information that part of the content will be designed by the community and the game has been designed to deal with it in a good way. GT5 is not one of those games.

Perma-ban is the only way to go. Issue a warning, then ban everyone who doesn't comply.

 

[BayouSimDrifter]

I hope PD are simultaneously working on a way to patch out these kinds of external mods, as well as adding in the in-game functionality that most reasonable people are using them for: engine and drivetrain swaps, visual customisation etc.

I say that, because they absolutely must be working on the former (DLC "theft" is probably taken seriously...), and they must know that not everyone does it to troll online, so I just hope they don't make the mistake of closing things off and ignoring what is clearly a plea for more forms of expression in the game, and always has been.

This is probably the best post in this thread. Kudos to you sir

 

[Exorcet]

When gamers takes matters into their own hands to "improve the game" through illegal modding they take away not only PD's rights to decide how they want people to play their games.

PD has no such right and never has. Hopefully they never will either. They can keep people from altering or profiting from their games, but not from playing them as they wish. You can play the game however you want.

 

[Monatsende]

[...]You can play the game however you want.

I like to play it "Pokemon-ish", too.

 

[thelvynau]

PD has no such right and never has. Hopefully they never will either. They can keep people from altering or profiting from their games, but not from playing them as they wish. You can play the game however you want.

Then if they are allowed to play as they want does that render the terms of use useless?

 

[Exorcet]

It was the wording I was disagreeing with, I think eran had the right idea. PD can do whatever they want with the code, but the players can do whatever they want within PD's code. Players shouldn't expect to be able to manipulate the code at will, but they also shouldn't expect PD telling them that grinding the most profitable race is the wrong way to play the game, for example.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I hope PD are simultaneously working on a way to patch out these kinds of external mods, as well as adding in the in-game functionality that most reasonable people are using them for: engine and drivetrain swaps, visual customisation etc.

I say that, because they absolutely must be working on the former (DLC "theft" is probably taken seriously...), and they must know that not everyone does it to troll online, so I just hope they don't make the mistake of closing things off and ignoring what is clearly a plea for more forms of expression in the game, and always has been.

Probably a little late for the engine swaps in GT5. I'd imagine they'd have to consult interested parties, have the appropriate licensing agreements, agree on terms and limits to modifications etc. Don't count on engine/drivetrain swaps etc. being "legal" on GT5.

 

[amar212]

And not to forget, even if the majority have been playing the game for two years by now, there are still new copies being sold. So although a lot of people are bored, there are still other people who has just started playing.

One more point: When I buy a game which says "Polyphony Digital" on it, I expect it to be Polyphony Digital's creation. I trust their ability to design and balance a game. I agree to play the game the way PD wants to.

When gamers takes matters into their own hands to "improve the game" through illegal modding they take away not only PD's rights to decide how they want people to play their games, but also the consumer's rights to know what product they are buying. The consumer wants to play the game according to Polyphony Digital's intentions, but instead ends up with a game according to the intentions of some random anonymous bloke in Leicester.

User creations can be a great asset to a game, but those games are sold with the information that part of the content will be designed by the community and the game has been designed to deal with it in a good way. GT5 is not one of those games.

Perma-ban is the only way to go. Issue a warning, then ban everyone who doesn't comply.

I agree 100%

 

[BayouSimDrifter]

I rather them focus their efforts on GT6 to make it better then what gt5 was. It has been 2 years since them game has been out and we(gamers) have had a lot of complaints about this game from the the get go i.e too many of the same dlc car or too many of the same car, not enough of single player play, not enough modding, not enough of this or that. Well we(gamers) have found a way to get at least one of those. I dont really seeing it taking anything really from the game. If those who do not like the modding then please if you see it being done in your lobby kick them. you dont want them in your racing leagues kick them.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

I rather them focus their efforts on GT6 to make it better then what gt5 was. It has been 2 years since them game has been out and we(gamers) have had a lot of complaints about this game from the the get go i.e too many of the same dlc car or too many of the same car, not enough of single player play, not enough modding, not enough of this or that. Well we(gamers) have found a way to get at least one of those. I dont really seeing it taking anything really from the game. If those who do not like the modding then please if you see it being done in your lobby kick them. you dont want them in your racing leagues kick them.

Except it's not always easy to tell that hybrids are being used: a league can only kick that which it knows about.

Besides, PD does need to address this, one way or the other, lest the same thing happen from Day 1 with GT6. There's already a lot of similarities to how hybrids are made now, and how they were in GT3. A different, more secure, checks-based system is needed.

 

[Wankelhead]

The problem is that a lot of people lack decency and fairplay, so they bring the hybrids online just to cheat their way to 1st place.
But, there are also a whole lot of people who own hybrids to give something fresh to the game, and use them solely for offline runs, for fun.

I am one of those people. I made some realistic-ish hybrids like a 20b RX-8 with Grand Am specs, a V12 engine Ferrari F1, and a Formula Mazda out of a Formula GT with a renesis engine. Still, I only use them on Practice and Arcade mode offline, and free runs online.

I'm not saying it's correct or legal, but, some people are only trying to get the most fun out of a game (which was expensive for an incomplete game that lacked features PD were ment to add, which would give it more replay value) that has become boring them.
And I believe those people shouldn't be punished for the other idiots ruining the online mode.

Just my two cents...

 

[MoLiEG]

I rather them focus their efforts on GT6 to make it better then what gt5 was. It has been 2 years since them game has been out and we(gamers) have had a lot of complaints about this game from the the get go i.e too many of the same dlc car or too many of the same car, not enough of single player play, not enough modding, not enough of this or that. Well we(gamers) have found a way to get at least one of those. I dont really seeing it taking anything really from the game. If those who do not like the modding then please if you see it being done in your lobby kick them. you dont want them in your racing leagues kick them.

I agree. They had their shoot at creating the best racing game ever with GT5. They missed it. Then they missed the chance of making it better... Double miss...

Just let this thing flow freely and let's hope PD get's the job done right with GT6...

 

[Bounkazz]

I agree. They had their shoot at creating the best racing game ever with GT5. They missed it. Then they missed the chance of making it better... Double miss...

Just let this thing flow freely and let's hope PD get's the job done right with GT6...

Thanks you. 👍

 

[BayouSimDrifter]

I agree. They had their shoot at creating the best racing game ever with GT5. They missed it. Then they missed the chance of making it better... Double miss...

Just let this thing flow freely and let's hope PD get's the job done right with GT6...

agreed. i also hope they are learning from these hybrids(good and bad)

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

I hope PD are simultaneously working on a way to patch out these kinds of external mods, as well as adding in the in-game functionality that most reasonable people are using them for: engine and drivetrain swaps, visual customisation etc.

I say that, because they absolutely must be working on the former (DLC "theft" is probably taken seriously...), and they must know that not everyone does it to troll online, so I just hope they don't make the mistake of closing things off and ignoring what is clearly a plea for more forms of expression in the game, and always has been.

This would be great..
They had better not take away the engine swapping all together.

 

[thomasjknight]

I think the changes made by a few people are bad for the game. These people have know Idea what they are doing to the game. I think your level of skill should do the talking. I don't need a 3000 hp anything to leave these hybrids or modded whatever, in the dust. It's bout knowing racing lines and smooth braking. Even if u get 20 mil a race you can only buy 6 cars per race. The people at PD know what they are doing. These cars are licensed and trademarked material we aren't spending any real money modifying these cars. Keep it up and they will take them away and give us something like the cars from gta. I know that PD is going to fix this problem and hence fix the people with these hybrids. Thank you for having this thread, I know I'm gonna lose by saying this but I wouldn't be me. To the people who don't mod look me up I'm always on.

 

[Furinkazen]

Hex editing, removing body panels, 1 gazillion horsepower, engine swaps... the GT universe is becoming much different and to be honest worst for it. I am surprised PD have not done more other than there updated Seasonal Event with selected cars to combat this. How long do you think it will be until PD (hopefully) stop the hacking?

 

[Giygas]

As someone who hacks myself, it's starting to get a bit boring. Going a gorillian miles an hour was exciting for a little while, but later on (provided it isnt halted)i think its going to be more about painting unpaintable cars, switching internal parts and other small things.

As for online racing, i think the hacks are much faster at much higher PP levels due to the PP calculation faults and the fact that every car above 700PP bar the GT-R TC has massive amounts of downforce. If someone were to throw 1100 HP in a Mazda Furai, it would sit somewhere around 730PP, which is about the same as an 830HP Bentley Speed 8. The Toyota 7 and Gillet Vertigo might rise in popularity because the 7 caps off @740ish PP, and more horsepower just lowers it dramatically. Same with the Vertigo but on a lesser scale.

So yes, with time i think online racing will slowly deteriorate into madness. The main thing i think that's slowing that down is the lack of a win/loss record, so there's absolutely no point of using a hacked car outside of winning or entertainment.

 

[CodeRedR51]

No offense man, but I think this could have continued in this thread.

 

[Furinkazen]

Ahh I didn;t notice that, mod's feel free to lock / merge / delete if needed 👍

 

[Aquarelle]

Ahh I didn;t notice that, mod's feel free to lock / merge / delete if needed 👍

Because they need your permission

I'll put my 10 cents in here since it will likely get merged; PD will stop the hacking when they can, it's as simple as that really.

There's no reason for them to intentionally hold off on fixing it if they know how to.

However, with GT6 on the horizon.. who knows. The tools could work indefinitely.

Time will tell I suppose.

 

[Eks]

I think they will soon. I give it a month or two.
To be honest, (and as Giygas said) it's boring now.
Plus, it's just the sheer number of people doing it. It's a little outta control.
Okay, the 1000hp Supras I'm okay with but it is only a matter of time (If PD doesn't fix it) until people go mad with million horsepower cars.

 

[hobanator24]

I don't know if this is part of the hacking & I apologise if it's already been mentioned, but I have been seeing pictures in the Photo Stream of cars missing their spoilers. As far as I know, there is no way to remove the stock spoiler from your car in GT5. I know because I really wanted to remove the spoiler from the Mustang SVT Cobra R but couldn't. Is this part of the hack?

 

[Aaron1795]

At first I was like cool, now i'm like noooooo. Honestly its going to mess up the game. But hey something you guys never noticed, there are sleeper games like Test Drive Unlimited 2 that don't get updated anymore.... Use The Hex Editor To Make That Better. Or unlock the cars on the disk that were never released like the racing bikes, Koneigsegg Agera R, bugatti galiber, mazaradi, and lamborgini brands or edit the horse power of the ferarris because you can't performance upgrade them.... Ok imma just be real someone help me make TDU2 better lol. I mean you got Roll Races, A casino to take friends money, and 2 islands that takes hours to drive from top to bottom. Wanna get away from GT5 to relax this is the way to do it.

 

[eran0004]

PD has no such right and never has. Hopefully they never will either. They can keep people from altering or profiting from their games, but not from playing them as they wish. You can play the game however you want.

What I meant was that PD sets up the frame for how Gran Turismo can be played. You're of course free to play it the way you want within that frame but the code doesn't allow you to go outside of it. When a game is being hacked, it allows for people to modify the frame, expand and distort it. In an online context they don't just distort their own frame, but also everyone else's. Everyone have the right to play the game the way they want it, but they don't have the right to change the game and say "this is the frame in which everyone will play it from now on." The only one who have that right is Polyphony Digital.

This is not only sensible in terms of the game being PD's property, but also due to the fact that it is PD who is selling the game. When they make a poor design choise, their brand will suffer from it. When an anonymous hacker makes a poor design choise he don't give a **** because he's not making any money from it anyway. All he cares about is the lols.

In the best of worlds he actually cares about the game, and will try to fix it - but only if he can be arsed to. There's actually no consequences if he doesn't. When Polyphony Digital can't be arsed to fix something, it actually hurts them.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

All I can say is that engine swapping and the massive array of other things we can do with this game has brought light back to Gran Turismo 5 for me..

I have made an AMS Alpha 12 Exact replica, an Underground Racing Twin Turbo Gallardo (1500hp) replica as well as an Aventador stage 1 (1200hp) today and they've been massive fun for me. Having this much variation within cars online like we have no is just a delight. Certainly more fun than seeing who can tune their Viper to launch the best.

 

[GT787B]

To each their own.